The Liverpool post-punk scene.

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I listened recently to some of Janice Long's disappointing series on Radio 2 called "Liverpool: the New Wave". This potted history gave little insight into what was special about the music produced in Liverpool in the late 70s and early 80s. A more eccentric summary of the era can be found in Julian Cope's "Head-On" and in Bill Drummond's "45" book. To refresh my memory of this music I listened to the 1982 Zoo compilation "To the Shores of Lake Placid" and I really enjoyed it. I especially liked the dreamy pop of Lori and the Chameleons' "Lonely Spy".

So what do you all think of the music of the Liverpool post-punk scene? Did it have any characteristic features? If so, how did the music of Liverpool differ from that of other British cities?

― Mark Dixon, Sunday, 24 February 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I loved Cope's books ("Head-On" and "Repossessed"), but I found Drummond's "45" to be frustratingly non-linear (nevermind the fact that both books take needless potshots at Killing Joke. Yes, sports fans, it IS all about them for me). Beyond that, it strikes me that the music that came out of Liverpool was endearingly detatched from that which came out of the more celebrated scenes...thus it had a more organic, natural character to it. To my ears, the Bunnymen are still the finest to emerge from there.

― Alex in NYC, Sunday, 24 February 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

You know what, I've never actually heard Wild Swans "Revolutionary Spirit". I know where I can get a copy for £7.00. Should I?

― Dr.C, Sunday, 24 February 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Dr. C - I recommend "Revolutionary Spirit". It's a great track.

It's a pity that very little Zoo material is available on c.d. at the moment. There is a Wild Swans track on a compilation called "Unearthed: Liverpool Cult Classics Volume 1". I haven't heard this album though. Does anyone know if it is worth getting?

― Mark Dixon, Sunday, 24 February 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Yes yes yes, get as many Wild Swans tracks as you can... "Revolutionary spirit" sounds like it was recorded down a toilet but it still a great track, and so is the b-side. And the Peel Session EP is superb if you can track it down. I saw the reformed Wild Swans in 1988 and they played "Revolutionary spirit" as their set closer - very intense and very good and I seemed to be the only person who recognised it. Shame.

As to post punk Liverpool, a diverse collecton of geniuses (genii?) who made some incredible music. The only characteristic I can think of is diversity - there wasn't really a 'Liverpool sound', they just existed in a seperate universe from anyone else. I've got the Lori and the Chameleons "Lonely Spy" / "Touch" single and I play it regularly - the future looked bright then. 8-)

― Rob M, Sunday, 24 February 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Just as interestingly, why did it die out? At what point did all Liverpool bands start sounding like inferior versions of the La's. (except Clinic). At least Oasis added distortion to their Beatle copies. 'Revolutionary Spirit' is great too, as fey as a noisy song can get.

― Snotty Moore, Monday, 25 February 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I think the initial Liverpool post-punk scene died out around 1983, because several of the main players left the city (such as Cope and Holly Johnson). The Zoo label ended and the other important local indie company Inevitable was bought by Virgin Records. The Bunnymen gained international acclaim, but many less successful bands such as the Wild Swans split up.

Whilst Frankie Goes to Hollywood were enjoying their New Pop success in London, a new breed of earnest guitar band was developing in Liverpool. The High Five and the Farm were associated with the Picket venue which is part of the Merseyside Trade Union Community and Unemployment Resource Centre. I wouldn't knock the political commitment of those involved with the Picket, but I find a lot of the music linked with the venue to be extremely dull. When the La's emerged from this scene in the mid-Eighties, their retro sound was an expression of their "authentic" roots. Quirky bands such as Clinic seem to be rare in Liverpool.

― Mark Dixon, Wednesday, 27 February 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

one year passes...

If you're looking for related curios, try to hear "Liverpool Scene 1979" by the Unconscious Collective. ("Unconscious Collective"! Boom boom!) which came out a couple of years ago, which kind of swpies the sound, and samples "Bouncing Babies" amongst other things.

― Tim (Tim), Friday, 16 January 2004 10:27 (twenty-one years ago)

"Quirky bands such as Clinic seem to be rare in Liverpool"

Huh? You haven't been listening to what's happening in Liverpool nowadays. Ambulance, The Laze, Tramp Attack, Lovecraft, Stig, Kling Klang, Ladytron even.

― Jim Robinson (Original Miscreant), Friday, 16 January 2004 16:54 (twenty-one years ago)

its all about Ormskirk, nowadays.

― Jarlr'mai (jarlrmai), Friday, 16 January 2004 16:56 (twenty-one years ago)

Re. the Wild Swans: I ought to point out that there's an excellent 2CD compilation out now called Incandescent which includes "Revolutionary Spirit" and much else besides. Love that song - it was one of the songs which brought Laura and I together way back when...

― Phoebe Dinsmore, Friday, 16 January 2004 16:58 (twenty-one years ago)

It's funny that I find it so touching that Ormskirk, and Edge Hill College indirectly, gets a mention on this board...

...so, apart from Monkey Steals The Drum, what good bands are there in Ormskirk then?

― Jim Robinson (Original Miscreant), Sunday, 18 January 2004 20:12 (twenty-one years ago)

Wah! Heat don't get the same attention as the Teardrops and The Bunnymen but they were just as brill.

― LondonLee (LondonLee), Sunday, 18 January 2004 21:10 (twenty-one years ago)

Pink Military's _Do Animals Believe In God?_ is my favorite obscure Liverpool postpunk. Totally up there with early Teardrop or Echo.

― mike a, Monday, 19 January 2004 03:52 (twenty-one years ago)

two years pass...

the Wild Swans: I ought to point out that there's an excellent 2CD compilation out now called Incandescent which includes "Revolutionary Spirit" and much else besides.

Found it today, for cheapish. Been looking forward to finally hearing this!

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 18 November 2006 21:52 (nineteen years ago)

Revolutionary Spirit was indeed very good, as was the b-side, however I sympathise with whoever said it sounded like it was recorded in a toilet! I do dearly wish they had managed to release a full-length back then in '82 rather than much later on when they had signed to a major. I bought Bringing Home The Ashes, but they'd got this slicker sound, and none of it made any impression on me. The Trouser Press Record Guide tells me their next album Space Flower with Ian Broudie at the helm may have been better, but I had lost interest by that time. Haven't heard the Peel Session though. That is probably well worth hearing.

For me they were the only bright spot in what I consider a surprisingly lackluster Liverpool post-punk scene.

― Umpire Teen (Bimble...), Saturday, 18 November 2006 23:00 (nineteen years ago)

I should qualify that though, because I recall one Liverpool band on one of the Messthetics compilations I particularly liked. They were called Teenage & The Wildlife and their song was called "Colours". I think the other side of the single may have been called "Get The Hell Out Of Here". This was '82, and the liner notes tell me this was their only single. Pity.

― Umpire Teen (Bimble...), Saturday, 18 November 2006 23:04 (nineteen years ago)

one month passes...

And I'm listening to Incandescent and thinking that the three radio sessions the Wild Swans did essentially is the great UK post-punk album that never was. So this comp becomes it, by default. (Anyone who loves anything about Orange Juice, the Sound and the Comsats really needs this.)

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 6 January 2007 04:27 (eighteen years ago)

What year are those sessions from Ned? (right now it's easier for me to ask you directly than look it up)

― Good Warlock of the West (Bimble...), Saturday, 6 January 2007 04:31 (eighteen years ago)

1982 and, for the third of the three, 1986 (which while not the 'classic' sound was still something v. good).

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 6 January 2007 04:32 (eighteen years ago)

Well fuck me, I shouldn't have ignored that comp. then! I would guess that at least those sessions don't sound as much like they're "recorded in a toilet" like Revolutionary Spirit does.

― Good Warlock of the West (Bimble...), Saturday, 6 January 2007 04:34 (eighteen years ago)

No indeed, MUCH cleaner sounding.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 6 January 2007 04:37 (eighteen years ago)

Cool, well I can tell you I will definitely be investigating this!

― Good Warlock of the West (Bimble...), Saturday, 6 January 2007 05:12 (eighteen years ago)

Oh by all means get that Wild Swans comp. If they had ever released an LP it would easily rate up there with the better known classics of the time. It's too bad Zoo never tried to foster a local scene like Factory. I know, I know, totally different agendas for Drummond and Wilson.

― Ice Cream Electric (Ice Cream Electric), Saturday, 6 January 2007 13:10 (eighteen years ago)

Yeah you know the story right? Wilson had talked it out with these blokes from the 'pool and driven there, and the plan had been to have a joint Liverpool/Manchester double 7" single and Wilson drove back to Manc at night and thought "fuck it! We can do it ourselves!" And ladies and gentlemen, the first Factory record was born.

― Good Warlock of the West (Bimble...), Saturday, 6 January 2007 14:37 (eighteen years ago)

Or let me be a bit more specific since I've got the page in the book in front of me now:

It was Roger Eagle he had been talking to, who ran the Eric's nightclub in Liverpool and the quote from Wilson is exactly this:

"I'd taken some illegal substances and gone over to see my drummer, Chris Joyce. And he had, over in the corner of the room, a Santana 'Abraxas' album from Singapore, or somewhere. The typical far eastern album...in those days you'd print your UK/American glossy sleeve on tissue paper, then cover it, seal it with some kind of crappy piece of plastic. Just messing with this record I was fascinated by how the thing felt. So I drove over to Liverpool thinking, great. If you're going to put out a four band sampler, which Roger & I were planning to do ...why don't we do a double 7" because nobody's done a double 7" since the Beatles' Magical Mystery Tour. So I get there and we spend three hours arguing about doing an ordinary 12" single in a bag, or, what we wanted to do. I'd already figured out a way of sealing the plastic and paper and stuff. We disagreed about this for three hours, quite pleasantly. I got in my car, drove back down the M62, and thought 'Fuck it! We can do it ourselves.'"

That's from p. 173-174 "Shake Rattle & Rain: Popular Music Making in Manchester 1955-1995" by C.P. Lee

― Good Warlock of the West (Bimble...), Saturday, 6 January 2007 14:48 (eighteen years ago)

But I digress.

Yes I shall get the Wild Swans comp. I promise you that!

― Good Warlock of the West (Bimble...), Saturday, 6 January 2007 14:48 (eighteen years ago)

Wah Heat! - Better Scream...best song ever! I did a playlist on Viva Radio you may want to check out w/ Wah, Wild Swans and other faves, called Nightshift...

http://www.viva-radio.com/pyjamarama

― Dan Selzer (Dan Selzer), Saturday, 6 January 2007 14:52 (eighteen years ago)

Aww...that's so cute! I love radio! Good old fashioned radio. Before KEXP ruined my life.

― Good Warlock of the West (Bimble...), Saturday, 6 January 2007 15:10 (eighteen years ago)

And there was the infamous Zoo meets Factory Half Way concerts at Leigh Fac 15. The roster seems legendary now, but I guess it was so badly promoted that no one showed up! Joy Division, Echo and the Bunnymen, OMS, Distractions, Teardrop Explodes, and A Certain Ratio sounds like post-punk bliss, but of course no one knew that at the time.

Here's an interesting link: http://www.cerysmaticfactory.info/forum/view_post.php?thread=100

As usual what really happened and the legend are quite different. Go historical revisionism.

― Ice Cream Electric (Ice Cream Electric), Saturday, 6 January 2007 16:34 (eighteen years ago)

fifteen years pass...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DCq-GMIJW_0

― MaresNest, Sunday, 1 January 2023 18:42 (two years ago)

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