Am I the only one who doesn't get Justice?

thats exactly what i love their 'human after all' remix for, the relentless overeggedness (see also mr oizos and jacksons recent output)

I don't like Mr Oizo or Jackson either really a great deal, I agree with Jess's post about them on the blog to be honest, feels sort of like IDM to me.

have you noticed how they use that bass sound on EVERY ONE of their remixes?

Yep.

I liked everything I've heard up till now. the Scenario Rock - 'Skitzo Dancer' remix is good clean fun too. That's what they do really, lighten things up when the chinstroking gets too intense. ;)

x3. tho it's sort've made me listen to their other tracks more than I would have - they lack any of the same magic, I think (or, at least, the things they remix that I wanna listen to have been remixed by people I'm generally more fond of).

Ronan, if "the terrace" has been ruling my universe for the past few years, what other linus loves should I listen to?

their other remix mode is more in the 'never be alone' / 'skitzo dancer' style, which can be good when it sounds like they've actually spent a bit of time on it (cf: the above two, 'ny excuse') but they also seem to pump out stuff like the britney, NERD and mystery jets remixes which are totally awful cookie-cutter stuff. the mystery jets one is just an indie song with that distort-o-bass sound underneath, not much of a remix really!

'never be alone' and 'skitzo dancer' are still great though. best taken in small doses, perhaps?

Guess this isn't a style for the ilx 'aficionados'.

lil' merzbow, I suggest you listen to One_Minute_To_Midnight, then you might discover that your cookie-cutter formula is a lazy generalization.

i don't know why i always feel the need to defend justice. it seems deeper than just the fact that i do genuinely like their music, and have from the very first note of the very first tune of theirs i heard. i think that when i try to defend justice i'm really trying to defend producers and dj's my age-ish (i'm 24), and arguing for the, ahem, old guard to give some young kids the time to learn to breathe before letting them suffocate in their pillows.

our priorities may be a little different from, ahem (again), yours. inevitably though, as history gets longer, the things that the new kids draw from disperses from whatever 'purity' the 'originals' identified with. seemingly unrelated pop culture resources inform our tastes in ways 'we' can't avoid, and that there's very little likelihood that 'you' would understand. i don't need to explicate this sort of split any further, because it's been done to death.

but the area where justice, the ed banger crew, baile, modern commercial hip hop, re-appropriations of classic house stuff, the decent stuff that emerged from electroclash, post-post-post-post-pospunk, mashups, fashion, haircuts, drugs and myspace converge into some sort of new-not-new zeitgeist, seems to be the very beginning of something (that i'm sure is cyclic and has come and gone many times) which promises to make a lot of really interesting culture.

there's of course the simple issue of just plain not liking the way that justice sound. but i think it is deeper than that for some people. i think that many people don't like what justice means because to them it sounds like a trend. the get physical sound or the bpitch sound or the kompakt sound is so much more studied and reverential to the elders (not a bad thing, imo), and it's easier to relate to for people who have cultivated an appreciation for the "classics".

i found the classics much later than i found the new stuff, certainly much later after electroclash. so for me, these newer things represented a trapdoor out of the room that was steadily drowning me in a pool of aphex beats and autechre algorithms. not only that, there was (at least superficially) attractive people who were a part of it, it's seductive and enticing. of course the momentum didn't last because there was absolutely no substance to it, and there wasn't much in the way of community because there was no personal signifiers in the music.

i'm still looking for those signifiers in this new crop of stuff, but i think what i relate to most immediately is the 'newness' of it. the fact that so much of it doesn't seem to rely upon what's come before it, or at the very least, the older things that it's drawing from seem more or less unrelated to the typical canon.

sorry for the rambling. i've said enough for now, but hopefully someone finds something to respond to.

DON'T LIKE IT ? THEY DO :
2 MANY DJ'S, EROL ALKAN, LAURENT GARNIER, TREVOR JACKSON, OPTIMO, MR OIZO, TIEFSCHWARZ, JAMES HOLDEN, CASSIUS, MSTRKRFT, BENNY BENASSI, DJ HELL, DJ FUNK, TIGA ...

i love it, but i'm pretty sure stir doesn't, unless he's had a change of heart. or was just being nice with his feedback.

How how is this album "Cross"? Anyone heard it? It's been pretty hyped.

have fun -> Justice - † Pretentious symbol = french dance?

haha, I guess not.

their stuff seems so uninspired to me. also, i don't like the way it sounds--there's sort of a sharp, tinny, empty quality to it, even when i hear it on a big sound system. it sounds like music created specifically to be made into mp3s to put on mp3 blogs!
-- geeta (geeta), Tuesday, April 18, 2006 12:08 AM (1 year ago) Bookmark Link

when did 'blog house' happen?

I've been listening to that Justice essential mix, and it's cool, actually, although it gets tough on the ears after a while

1) Anyone who thinks this isn't something new(ish) or fresh is, er, wrong. Which doesn't make it good, but does make it worth a listen.

2) with that vibe of deliberately flirting with crap/cheese-ness that means for every two great tracks there's always something up next that's completely amateur night & disposable that makes you feel ashamed to be dancing to it, ashamed of the music generally From the Fidgit house thread, but also otm as regards to this mix.

3) IDM comparisons also on the money - reminds me of Kid606 in approach in places, but obv MUCH more populist. There is not only a layer of bit recuction over EVERYTHING, but also moments when Ableton or whatever they are using to loop and pitchshift stuff can't cope and is stuttering, so like the skipping CD, it's making an aesthetic of technological failings.

4) There's some review somewhere of Bomb Squad PE productions where it talks about whole songs being used as riffs. The mix reminded me of that, and the Don't You Want Me bit works that way, not in a playing the same old tracks everyone but students with crazy hair probably sick of by now (Don't You Want Me) way.

5) I went to Fabric for the first time in about a year on Friday and DANCE was great, came on in the set just before Joakim's live band, which was also fab.

6) Blog House is such a crap name. Lets call it Glitch Disco or something, (Bitloss Disco? Bitcrusher Plus?), or just call it New Rave and call the Klaxons something else.

Lossylectro

death to false blog house

UDM (unintelligent dance music)?

origin of the name

how about dance music for short?

This is hilarious to me. A little term I made up to sort of diss how stagnant and predictable it has become has now been appropriated by those who play it. They takin' it back! It's like when gay dudes call each other fags.

does al still read that forum?

Right, can someone please confirm the story that Justice are trying to sell out a 17,000 capacity arena in America please? Because that's a whole new level of retardation if true.

i'm sure there are 17,000 retards in american, dom.

fuck haters

ripping off Daft Punk's Homework is ok, i guess

ripping off Daft Punk's Alive 2007 tour? NAH BRAH.

I'm guessing the 17,000 thing might be Coachella? if so, "Justice trying to sell it out" would be a disingenous term, since this would leave out the "sharing the bill with a lot of other more popular acts" thing (targeted to whoever told Dom this.)

That said, I wouldn't really call it retarded at all anyway you slice it.

The venue is Madison Square Garden, not Coachella, according to Resident Advisor.

Could be possible in NY. Who knows?

only 17,000 people bought tickets to see justice that night, but every one of them went out and started a blog

But Black Sabbath is VERY danceable!!! </chuck eddy>

(luvs to you, chuck)

Ed Banger = SHIT

Giorgio Moroder + Black Sabbath

this looks SO AWESOME though....very little Ed Banger has really approached this level.

I mean maybe I'm begging the question by calling them "electro" rather than "dance". You could be justified in asking, then, what's the point of "electro" if you can't dance to it? But then, what's the point of any music that you can't dance to? I don't think they're getting over on their amazing grooves for dancing to - I think it's more like: Hey this rocks out! And the synth sounds are kind of cool! Catchy riffs too!

ed banger is terrible

yeah i cant really think of much by them ive liked

i will rep for 90% of that SMD album tho for real

yeah i don't believe in that distinction at all...Justice is music made to dance to, it might not be "dance" the genre but that's only one type of music for dancing

yeah i don't believe in that distinction at all...Justice is music made to dance to, it might not be "dance" the genre but that's only one type of music for dancing

-- PoMXII, Friday, May 2, 2008 2:14 PM (47 seconds ago) Bookmark Link

this isnt a dance vs dahnce argument

Sure, I agree, and like I said above, many of their songs would probably be fine to dance to (not that I've tried).

xpost

yeah thats the thing i think, dance to what you want - justice is an artist that, if i were DJing to a crowd of ppl unfamiliar with justice, i would not drop records by, because people who dont already have some appreciation for justice are probably not gonna feel like compulsively hitting the floor, whereas you can drop some obscure/less known music (in lots of different genres) that naturally embrace a kind of common groove that people find ideal for dancing, even if they are unfamiliar w/ the music previously.

its not like you CANT dance to justice, or that it isnt good for dancing; it just has certain limitations.

i think part of my prob is trying to explain this earlier was from the perspective of the dancer rather than the DJ

Sabbath totally should have had Moroder produce an album....I can't get that combo out of my head right now

(and DJs can MAKE ppl 'feel' Justice thru context - sticking it in between songs they know or songs with really danceable grooves and then going 'punk rock' w/ justice or whatever - your basically burning some audience good will with it, tho)

I kinda wished Justice never made "D.A.N.C.E." and just led off with "DVNO" from the get-go. "DVNO" is easily the best song on the album.

lots and lots of people including girls who would never in a million years know what an Ed Banger is hit the floor when DANCE comes on........

im actually cool with 'waters of nazereth' also, if only cuz it sounds like the most successful embrace of their own sound. DVNO is great but the influences are more apparent, or something

where are these dance crowds who have never heard justice xxp

PoMXII, if you can layer more analog synths and drum machines and vocoded singing on top of the second half of Sabotage, you'll get pretty close. I mean, "The Thrill of it all" is begging for a 4/4 dance cover, at least the second half of the track.

where are these dance crowds who have never heard justice xxp

-- s1ocki, Friday, May 2, 2008 2:21 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Link

lol hipster :D

everyone that knows it and likes it dances to it when they hear it cuz they know it and like it!! but thats not a property of the music itself

deej, would you say the same for the most recent Daft Punk? (i would)

you mean like stuff on robot rock?

or Human After All, yes

its been awhile since i listened but probably. i like that album but aside from 'technologic' (which def has a more straightforward groove) i never really danced to any of it

w/ justice i kinda think a huge part of its cachet basically is that it refuses to groove sometimes. its rebelling! im not saying thats uninteresting conceptually, its just uninteresting to me 'on the floor' a lot of times. im loyal to that house boom boom boom boom

everyone that knows it and likes it dances to it when they hear it cuz they know it and like it!! but thats not a property of the music itself

-- deej, Friday, May 2, 2008 7:24 PM (16 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

yes but they like it, and that has to do with the properties of hte music itself!!

you can't disprove dancing!

http://pagead2.googlesyndication.com/pagead/imgad?id=CNu-7pfOuKmgSRCsAhjvATIIyC80pnxnzmc

yes but they like it, and that has to do with the properties of hte music itself!!

-- s1ocki, Friday, May 2, 2008 2:41 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Link

yah but im saying that its dancegrooveability is not one of those things!!

i feel like youve gotta acknowledge that its attempting to be anti-groove to even acknowledge what its going for

kinda can't believe this debate is still raging.

-- s1ocki, Friday, May 2, 2008 6:29 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Link

^^ completely

they are the punk rock of dance music, and part of their rebellion is like 'fuck a dance groove - we're too cool for that shit.' im not saying its a legit reason to dislike them on principle but it is a reason to say 'you know what, they don't really groove the way dance music generally does'

i dont really think im a part of the 'debate' going on upthread, this is meta commentary on that debate

you can put scare quotes around 'punk rock of dance music' cuz im not entirely serious about that

ok ok ok. I mean, that goes for about a ton of electronic dance artists in the 80s, 90s, and 2000s though. Does this mean I can talk about Renegade Soundwave now?

no.

but i don't think it's ANTI-danceable by any stretch

my dislike of justice is PURELY for reasons of sound. that screechy treble annoys the hell out of me. it hurts my teeth. i can't even imagine hearing it loud in a club. i would kill myself. same with noize boyz and whatever the hell that new one was i got recently. the group with the annoying name. so, i guess in some sense these dudes are punk rock cause they are irritating and punks are supposed to irritate people. and they are way more irritating to me than actual noise music or gabber or dhc stuff or whatever.

YAHHH DESTROY TWO THOUSAND YEARS OF CULTURE YAHHH

i am pro whatever makes tom irrationally angry

up with people

we are totally set up for a DHR revival aren't we.

:(

has anybody combined DHR with ringtones yet? or did I just describe the worst of dubstep volume 14 or whatever

sorry, I meant best of dubstep

these guys are worse than the free credit report dot com jingles

2 Justices 1 Tombot

dvno is great, not too fussed by anything else they've done.

ok i finally heard them~

i totally get them but i'm also really tired of this kind of dance music at this point so this cd just elicited a giant shrug from me.

From Pitchfork's interview with Saint Etienne today, and found it hilarious and oh! so true:

Pitchfork: You guys have always been, probably because of your history as a music writer, considered a conceptual band. Is that a fair statement?

BS: Well, we're conceptual in as much as we want each album to sound like a complete album, I suppose. I think, hopefully we managed that.

Pitchfork: Part of it is probably a bias, especially back then that you guys weren't four or five people playing more organic instruments, working through things in rehearsal--

BS: Yeah, I've always thought it was a positive for us that we aren't an organic group with five members, where the bassist wants to do his song on the album or whatever. We've been able to chop and change our sound whenever we wanted. You know, because we're not proper musicians. I read an interview with Justice the other day, and they were talking about, "It's not about playing instruments, it's about having ideas," and I think that's obviously pretty much what we think as well. Having the right ideas is a different matter (laughs).

good posts from deej on this thread no sarcasmo

they were in that soulwax doc. (-> god knows why I watched it, probably some fucked up masochistic trip)

tapping foot for Justice Mk 2. Not interested in live album. † and all was fun, but really, ready for brand new material, plz.

their own remix of DVNO really sucks imo. even i found that one pretty much unlistenable.

It's not about playing instruments, it's about having ideas," and I think that's obviously pretty much what we think as well. Having the right ideas is a different matter (laughs).

This makes so much sense considering Justice come from a design background.