British Folk (and Revival)

FWIW - a few of my favorite original British folkies:
Shiley & Dolly Collins
John Kirkpatrick (early 70s stuff is great)
The Watersons
Andy Irvine & Paul Brady
A L Lloyd
Nic Jones (criminally unsung!?)
...and many more...

- Espers
- the return of Vashti Bunyan

I would recommend these records as a way of getting into folk, or just for any reason whatsoever bcz they're fucking amazing:

Fairport Convention - Liege and Lief (Tam Lyn is amybe my favourite song ever.)
Steeleye Span - The Lark in the Morning (a two CD comp. of their first 3 LPs which is all you need by them - includes a transcendent version of When I Was on Horeseback. These LPs are also a big fave with Simon Reynolds)
Shirley Collins and the Albion Country Band - No Roses (the only folk album to feature someone to have played on a damned LP)

They should all be able to be found cheaply.

Alasdair Roberts - Farewell Sorrow is an excellent modern LP and on Drag City/Rough Trade so easy to find for indie kids.

The show might've been talking about Spiers and Boden or Eliza Carthy, who're more part of folk music 'proper' or anyone though, so this may be of no help.

If anyone can point me toward good books on this subject I'd be very happy.

"English-rose front-man, Moray, laces the lyrics of folklore with powerful Matrix-styled guitars, film-score piano and a backing band which grinds together electric double bass and thundering drums. His presence on stage is something to behold. He looks scruffy on his website but he's beautiful in person.

Don't confuse this fresh indie approach with the folk rock of Fairport Convention or Steeleye Span, but rather be surprised to sense impressions of Ben Folds greets Depeche Mode greets Evanescence. It's all here, whichever musical genre ticks your box, Moray can offer it up without confusion or the awkwardness of musical experimentations. He even played the piano with his arms crossed at one point."

Re: Jim Moray - I suppose the artists that provoke the strongest reactions are the most interesting... I like the idea that folk can be moved in new and strange directions, but what I've heard of Jim's music does nothing for me - the beats and sounds seemed a little clichéd and it all felt a bit MOR to me, I'm afraid. Shame, because I'd really like to like him! :(

I don't know how helpful it will be to the original poster, but http://www.theunbrokencircle.co.uk/ might turn up some interesting stuff, although it's more concerned with psychedelic, odd and abstract folky stuff (oldies like Incredible String Band, Comus, Forest and new stuff like the 'New Weird America' thing).

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0747553300/qid=1134640482/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_2_1/026-1867087-2774036

... and this is significant in what way exactly?

The Eighteenth Day of May come closer than anyone else I've heard to that late 60s / early 70s British folk-rock sound. They're good.

Lucky Luke (from Glasgow) are great, though... go see them live and/or anticipate the next record.

Okay, so we're talking about folk rock here right,rather than straight-up trad folk, which can hot and heavy enough in its own addled way? I would love it if I could stumble on some decent bands that were ploughing the same sort of furrow as peak-era Fairport or Trees or whatever and that didn't suck outright. I know it's sort of backwards looking of me, but there's a certain clanging and organic feel and texture and god damn guitar sound that I never really feel I can hear enough of. Maybe I'm looking in the wrong places. All I can think of right now that fit the bill in any way are Ghost and Acid Mothers Temple ca. La Novia. Certainly no British bands that I've come across.

X-posts: I don't mind Espers, but they seem rather too gentle for me. Lucky Luke I've heard of, but am yet to hear.

this is the place to go: http://www.thegreenmanfestival.co.uk/

for all your brit-folk needs!

also worth looking out for, a new compilation called Strange Folk, with tracks from the aforementioned Vashti, Tyranosaurus Rex, Donovan, Espers, Incredible String Band, Lucky Luke (iirc) and loads of other ace people I can't remember cos i left it at home.

-- We Buy a Hammer For Dadaismus (dadaismu...), December 15th, 2005 9:56 AM. (Dada) (later)

I just thought it was ILM law to mention Reynolds whenever possible.

I wish there were more songs like Tam Lyn by Fairport, i.e funky Black Sabbath. Swedish doom band Witchcraft get there sometimes.

most of the the wyrd-folk stuff is only surface level weird. The second Steeleye recording of The Blacksmith is so much more bizarre than any of them, and that isn't even what it's trtying to do - what an amazing arrangement it has. Modern wyrd-folk types too much like Colin Hunt types... "You do have to be mad to work here but it doesn't help" etc.

You're right

The message I'm getting from this thread is that newer musicans aren't up to the standard of older musicians in folk music? Obviously ppl like mattacks, dransfield, guys from gryphon, thompson etc are hard to follow (evidence on eg Fairport's ROCKING live album "House Full") but I had kind of thought folk would be a genre where powerful/expressive musicianship/group playing would still be at some sort of premium. Dissapointing if not so.

Anyway, "No Roses" by Shirley Collins/Albion band is fucking great, and should get more props, basically.

AFAIK the terrible term wyrd-folk was coined by Stone Breath's Tim Renner.

But, before I begin to sound like a prog rocker, you don't have to be a brilliant musician to play folk music - in fact, one of the reasons I got sick of that whole scene was its muso-ishness (especially, fiddle players who only want to play as fast and as twiddly as possible!). To play like Fairport you have to be pretty good tho of course!

Morris On I like, other Albions stuff I'm not mad on, really. Perhaps the drums are why? I haven't listened to any for a while.

That's a good record that is. 'Lay Me Low' or whatever it's called just kills me. Totally tramples over any sort of aesthetic barriers I might have erected against that sort of soppy twaddle and stomps all over my jaded old heart. Sniffle.

Didn't really know there was any "revival" of British folk right now in terms of new bands playing it. I knew there was a revival of interest in the last few years, otherwise I wouldn't really know who Fairport Convention was, honestly.

I've often thought that 60s British folk revivalists treated folk music with much more respect and subtlty than their American counterparts did (who went for "simplicity" and "rawness"). This might also explain why I find Brit bands better at playing blues than their white American counterparts.

search: Shirley and Dolly Collins "Plains of Waterloo."

and sweet heavens, some forty posts in let me be the first to say the hallowed name of Davy Graham.

Have you seen them? Because they fucking do. Or did when they opened for Devendra in Edinburgh. But crap.

i missed out on the box, but catching up on all the extra tracks now via spotify. such a lovely band, horrible sad news this

more of a reminder to myself, but there's a big 1991 terrascope interview with celia here that i need to sit down and read:

http://terrascope.co.uk/MyBackPages/The_Trees.htm

gosh, her voice still sounds great on those 2018 live cuts

jesus christ, that bit where they come back in after the fake-out ending on murdoch *always* gets every hair in my brain standing on end

Sad top hear about her passing.
I'm hoping that a copy of the box set is actually going to arrive having now been told taht it was on its way to me as an Xmas present.

I've been listening to a lot of Davy Graham in the last few days and god I'd forgotten how transcendent he can be. Midnight Man in particular is sending me to all sorts of places. Anyone have any experience with the recent Bread & Wine reissues? I can't find much in the way of information about them anywhere (even the Hoffman forums seem empty of news or opinion!).

Been on a Spotify kick of Scottish travelers and some English stuff:

Belle Stewart
Davie Stewart
Jeannie Robertson
Fred Jordan
Sam Larner

Way upthread, I reposted my from one of the post-Fahey threads about xpost Davey Graham re Renbourn's early 60s-travelling The Attic Tapes, and no lime tangier provided me with some Graham tips:

(in the notes, Renbourn) also talks about finding traces of the UK songster Davey Graham in various cities, ideas that lodged in the heads of musos who may well have had no reel-to-reels, or anyway didn't need one to summon the bits that JR puts together here. Mind you, he does give Graham the writer's credit for the opening tightly loose bedsit version of "Anji"(that's from the box marked "1962").
...the grand finale teams JR with Graham himself, on "Nobody Knows You When You're Down And Out": jazzy-bluesy, duh, and rawther magical. What other Graham should I check out?
Oh yeah, audio and more info here:
http://www.worldmusic.net/store/item/TUG1089/
Wantin those Graham tips yall.

― dow, Tuesday, September 8, 2015 6:11 PM (four years ago) bookmarkflaglink

lots of davy graham releases i've yet to hear but...

the comp that came out on see for miles is a great place to start, picks and chooses from most of his decca albums. not sure if this has been superseded by a more recent collection or not.

favourite dg lp of mine: large as life & twice as natural. stretched out folk blues jazz raga (love the joni both sides now cover that kicks it off), cd reissue has good notes from john renbourn himself.
& if you don't want to hear him sing (i like his voice personally) the collaboration with shirley collins is a+

― no lime tangier, Tuesday, September 8, 2015

I'd not heard Large As Life - brilliant. The Joni cover is magnificent. Davy's magic aside, Danny Thompson is in imperious form, Jon Hiseman too.

The live set from Hull University is pretty great. Or athat is to say the dorms after I think an earlier gig.
ITs called After hours at Hull or something

I could really do with getting Caedmon but i think the current release had no cd version.

Thought would be about next week’s release of Beeswing.

Next week?
Right time flies by.
There was an extract in the last Uncut the VU covered one.
Seemed to fly through some time that I would have hoped was more thoroughly covered so hope it was more of an intro.
But yeah do think it is pretty essential

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2022/jan/13/carthy-folk-dynasty-appeals-for-financial-support-after-income-dried-up-during-pandemic Also, Martin and Eliza Carthy are due to play live throughout the UK this winter, with an intermittent run of dates kicking off in Durham on 27 January. Eliza wrote that she had recorded a new album during the pandemic, proceeds from which would also help the family. No mention of Norma's participation; hope she's okay.

Sad to read that story, will definitely bung them a few quid as soon as I can

Eliza posted that Norma passed away yesterday. RIP.

;_; RIP Norma

Tragic news. I'd gone to the record shop to buy a copy of For Pence and Spicy Ale, and was informed of her death by the shop owner.

That version of Hal-An-Tow on Frost and Fire, I don't even know what half of it means tbh, but that to me is one of the most joyful and life-affirming songs I can think of, that song basically banishes death and that is how I will always think of her. RIP Norma

oh :(

coming at it from the opposite direction to Nick, I feel like every word of Red Wine & Promises off of Bright Phoebus is seared into my brain and I feel as though I understand what she meant exactly, down to the last nuance, and it is one of the saddest and most beautiful songs I've ever heard. one of those rare songs i've listened to repeatedly at moments of crisis in my life, just poured my soul into it and internalised it and made it all about me and my parents. a fucking wonder of a song.

but yes, Hal-An-Tow is joyful, A Souling Song is terrifying.

my Dad got me hooked, he used to play this track in the car when I was quite young and still utterly obsessed with the Libertines (and through them the Smiths, the Clash, the Jam and all of that). this, along with Poor Old Horse by the Albion Band and Penguin Eggs, showed me a completely different vision of what constituted "distinctly British music" and i'll always be grateful for that

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9qlI6hQYy0

RIP

on his invaluable doomandgloomfromthetomb tumblr, ilxor tylerw sez:
...check out this fantastic 1960s documentary on the Watersons, capturing the group very early on in their folk club days. The inky black-and-white style of the film could easily fit in with those classic British kitchen sink realist films of the era — you almost expect Tom Courtenay to be lurking in the background (Instead, there’s Anne Briggs, which is even better). It’s a beautiful time capsule.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Vrszb4w318

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOFsJLQZpcM

Is this book good? Hadn't heard of it.

Enjoying this book called Dazzling Stranger by Colin Harper. Connecting a lot of dots for me. Recommended if you’re into this sort of thing—British folk, Bert Jansch, blues, what have you. pic.twitter.com/8Ehg2hZMK6

— Shane Parish (@shaneparishgtr) July 1, 2022

Was out a long time ago? I read it but I can't remember much about beyond Bert saying he was never interested in the Beatles.

yeah thought it pretty great. Also looks at the Edinburgh and i think London folk scenes as they tie in with the narrative.
There is a companion cd in 2 versions one either side of the Atlantic. They change a couple of tracks presumably tie din with rights etc.
Unexpected appearance of Bruce Loose of Flipper whose dad was a promoter on the folk scene in the late 70s and also put Bert up a few times when he was drinking way too much. & Loose apparently started mimicking his behaviour.

I thought it was a good book as are the other couple of books by Harper I've read. Irish Folk, Trad & Blues: A Secret History and Bathed In Lightning: John McLaughlin, the 60s and the emerald beyond

.. Archie Fisher jumping out of a window to avoid Licorice McKechnie's dad is in there I think? Also Licorice and Bert almost getting married?

Hell yes. https://t.co/q2F50kLxBZ pic.twitter.com/Ulc1FuKKRW

— Tyler Wilcox (@tywilc) July 14, 2022

I love when a UK folk band expands their horizons to adopt the propulsive electric bass grooves and backbeat that characterized US folk-rock of the era. This LP is a great example, but Shirley Collins’ otherworldly voice and the song choices keep the vibeS trending traditional pic.twitter.com/q8v8E5zAiD

— the modern folk (@themodernfolk) August 1, 2022

Keep meaning to buy Show of Hands' Singled Out, but I'm little puzzled by what it's meant to be exactly. A compilation of assorted post-2001 songs(?), with two rare recordings from the early 90s Columbus EP and "Crazy Boy" from 1997's Dark Fields. But why? What's it for?

since the season is officially here and there has been a lot of “brit folk = chilly weather” discourse lately, here’s that uk folk mix i did for @aquadrunkard a while back https://t.co/NPzE7kYLlW

— jocelyn romo (@theeroamer) September 25, 2022

Lankum album (despite the album art) is really as good as they say

heavy, droney, druidic trad
https://lankum.bandcamp.com/album/false-lankum

Lankum are not British! And there's already a thread for them!

lol true on both counts, sorry!

Oops.

have been spinning shearwater multiple times this last week so seeing this was a nice surprise today: https://thequietus.com/articles/33584-martin-carthy-bakers-dozen-favourite-albums-jon-wilks

Lovely Martin Carthy. My grandfather played and sang with him in Bath and Sidmouth. I'm reliably informed their singing voices were very similar too.

I saw Martin Simpson at a local church last weekend. He was great as ever, and just as pissed off. He played mostly stuff off his new album; Deportee, a Woody Guthrie cover, was probably the highlight. It's a predominantly conservative area, so some of his barbed comments about Rwanda and Gaza were met with a mixture of soft applause and awkward silence.

American here and I don't know Martin Simpson at all except that I have ardently loved his cover of "Boots of Spanish Leather" for many years, just the most beautiful guitar figures. I don't even remember how I first came across it but I throw it on not infrequently. Nice to see his name pop up :)

He's an extraordinary guitar player. I've never really fallen for a record of his, which is strange given how many albums he has. He makes sense in a live setting: along with his mesmerising playing, he's a brilliant storyteller and his rage is palpable.

He lived in the States for about 10 years, I think. He's back in the UK now - living in Sheffield; Richard Hawley is a neighbour. If he tours anywhere nearby, go see!

will do!

Seriously in love with this song.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEL7rw3iDEA

Question about british folk from 60s/70s vs the last few decades: does the eerie/mythic/mystical side still have a lot of presence or has that mostly migrated into rock and metal? Whenever I'm in the folk section the new cds never seem to have much of that in their presentation.

The traditional songs haven't changed.

feels like it comes up sometimes, like Candidate and Woodcraft Folk, but recently people that way inclined seem to go straight to Hauntology

Not her main thing, but you do pass through some of that when Hull's Katie Spencer pauses in the olde walls with members of John Martyn's band, principally on Hurt In Your Heart. She sounds like she's learned a lot from Martyn, but doesn't imitate him. The Edge of the Land was my gateway, still a particular fave, but it's all good on her Bandcamp---kinda reminds me of (an unmistakably British) youngblood Bonnie Raitt, just showing up knowing how to do all this stuff: https://katiespencerofficial.bandcamp.com/

Anyone going to see Martin Carthy on his US tour? Sadly not coming very close to me.

https://transformmethenintoafish.com/

Martin's quite frail and forgetful these days, which might be uncomfortable to witness; a good friend of mine saw him in March, and wrote at length about it towards the end of this blog post: https://www.davidbelbin.com/blog/2025/03/the-old-guys-martin-carthy-john-cale-van-morrison/

I was reminded last week that I got Steve Roud's Folksong In England a while back and never got around to reading it.
So need to get into that and a couple of other books on the subject in the near future.

Question about british folk from 60s/70s vs the last few decades: does the eerie/mythic/mystical side still have a lot of presence or has that mostly migrated into rock and metal? Whenever I'm in the folk section the new cds never seem to have much of that in their presentation.

Can't speak for the last few decades, but there's definitely been a few acts like that in the last few years. Angeline Morrison has an incredible voice, low and resonant or still and piercing, and has albums of traditional tunes and original songs, including one project (The Sorrow Songs) putting the stories of several Black Britons through history into song. It's incredible, the best album of the 2020s so far. The new Shovel Dance Collective album is on that same level, it's quite sparse most of the time but then bursts into these waves of noise. Goblin Band are a little sillier but their version of The Brisk Lad is discordant and sinister in all the right ways.

And a little older, but Alasdair Roberts' 2005 album No Earthly Man is stunning if you're interested in Scottish folk. The instrumentals and his voice are almost unbearably light.

If you're interested in the eerie and mythic side you'll have the most luck with current Irish folk. Lankum (who have their own thread somewhere here) draw out old folk tunes into these gorgeous bleak drones, and their side project ØXN is also worth listening to. Eoghan Ó Ceannabháin and Lisa O'Neill are more singer-songwriter-y but share some of that sublime bleakness, the latter's All You Need Is Chance is my 2nd favourite album of the 2020s so far.

Other acts that I haven't checked out as much but also lean in that direction: Burd Ellen, The 15th Day of May

Would that be The Eighteenth Day of May or has someone come up with a similar name?