Dance Music That's "Too Gay" for America

but why is that? I live in GAY CAPITAL USA and I see plenty of non-gay kids lining up at clubs. Gays are not the only people that like to dance.

that's so junior high

As for music that is too gay for Americans. Well, it's a tricky issue because you have to figure out exactly how particular songs are appealing to certain (groups of) people. For instance, to certain people, anything house-y with diva vox is going to sound completely over the top and probably almost unlistenably gay (at least in earnest). There are other sorts of disco and whatnot that fall into this category as well. This has a lot to do with the fact that you hear often from many people who would say things like, "I'm not homophobic, I have no problem with gay people, but I don't like it when they're flamboyant." As though the sound of a person's voice, the flop of a wrist, or the sound of a particular song, conjures up pornographic closeups of anal penetration and oiled up body builders.

You can't deny that a lot of dance music is definitively gay or straight. A lot of dance music is inherently sexual, in fact, and granted I'm pretty young, but it seems fairly recent (no one mention kraftwerk or other robotic electro, please) that dance music has consciously sought the androgynous or the asexual (or maybe I'm reading most Kompakt stuff wrong).

"DANCE MUSIC THAT'S 'TOO GAY' FOR AMERICA"

The house tunes that THEY were too straight to let you jack to! We at Trax know that Americans are tired of suppressing the incessant homosexual urges that keep you awake at night and make your days an endless erection? So now for the first time on this unique compilation, we bring you the most homosexual records of all time.

Did you know that jack meant something totally gay? Of course you did, and that's why you Americans never did it in the late 80s. But we can tell you right now in Britain being gay as a cultural pursuit has been big since Paul Oakenfold invented ecstacy! Back in those days the Brits were jacking here, and jacking there, every night would end with an extended bout of jacking. "Jack jack!" they'd say, so often that the name Jack became at least as gay as names we Americans consider flaming, you know, like Bruce or Julian.

But we stuffy Americans were too busy fighting wars and inflicting foreign policy on people to take those Brits to jacking school, even though we invented the damn jack! Jack that Britain!

Anyway since house music is now sort of cool here, we at Trax have decided to give you all the gift of jack this spring, Jack is the one who unites all nations, erm..or so we thought at the time......you may be white, you may be........er.....you're probably white......yeah how does the rest go.

Check out this great compilation, we at Trax can assure you Americans all over the country won't think twice about a shower with their Dad once they have heard Joe Smooth's "Promised Land".

whatEVER *said with a flip of the limpwrist*

most of my formative dance music experiences were at gay clubs in the 80's. it was the only place you could hear great dance music here at that time. today, gay clubs here have a soundtrack that is a joke. the worst music i've ever heard. a friend of mine booked me to play at a gay night here recently and i almost cleared the dancefloor. the verdict seemed to be my selection was 'too gay'.

'i wanna fuck you in the ass' is such a great record.

Which is why Blur or Suede never made it there, for instance, as they were doing way too much gender bending and genre bending.

I think of house as being, in a broad sense, intrinsically gay music (the way hip-hop or, y'know, EVERYTHING is intrinsically black music, but not even to that degree). But has that ever stopped straight people from enjoying it? Some of the most homophobic types, like Jersey/Long Island guidos, can't get enough of it (and what they listen to is virtually identical to what queens in Chelsea at Roxy or XL dance to). A genetic predisposition to mousse and self-tanner = a genetic predisposition to big, ugly, gay, trancey tribal garbage.

And, like, aren't there multiple instances of Martha Wash's vocals showing up on Jock Jams?

http://prodtn.cafepress.com/5/17851465_F_tn.jpg

stuff like LCDS fares much better, and lindstrom doesn't do badly for these people (but not nearly as good as lcd)

sheesh, gear, ever hear of culture club? they were gigantic here.

I don't think that anyone who is using the term "dance music" thinks that it is the only type of music that is danceable (or that club music is the only music that can be played in clubs, or that rock music is the only music that can rock, etc etc etc etc etc).

But wasn't disco in general a watered down AM lite version of P-Funk/Sly Stone/Philly?

Sylvester, Larry Levan, Salsoul Orchestra, certainly they were not a watering down of what you mention.

While I'm thinking that some of the various social conditions mentioned upthread do have an effect on Americans' willingness to enjoy dance music - I'm surprised that besides the smattering of robot talk no one has mentioned how musically weird a lot contemporary dance music is: the repetition, the digital sounds, the (sometimes) lack of conventional song structure.

Of course Europe had similar pop music as america and dance is huge there now. So why did Europeans accept this radical shift? Maybe it's because many of the popular music styles of the second half of the 20th century (rock, hip-hop, soul) were originally American. Europeans were used to embracing strange new music, so when one showed up that sounded like it was from outer space - it was just another new exotic sound. Where as in america pop music was more connected to the native culture, therefore more likely to provoke attachment and likewise revulsion to the new gay black robot music.

Obviously pulling this out of my ass after reading the thread. I'm thinking hip-hop avoided the fate of dance music (while sharing many qualities) by having so many easily reconcilable cultural signifiers, keeping familiar song structures and having heavier emphasis on vocals.

"...the real animosity between rock and disco lay in the position of the straight white male. In the rock world, he was the undisputed top, while in disco, he was subject to a radical decentering. Only by killing disco could rock affirm its threatened masculinity."

-Peter Braunstein, "Village Voice," 1998.

America (and everywhere else) has been dancing to (and buying) mediocre music for as long as it has been available. You really think that the proliferation of sub standard music was the cause of the disco sucks movement?

The argument that society might be "homosexualised" is a bit closer to the truth, I believe. The press had finally picked up on the gay, underground origins of disco. Not only that, but the fact that disco culture had originated in a black and Hispanic subset of that subculture. And now American was dancing to music, wearing fashions, and partying all night long just like these...well, marginal folks.

It, quite clearly, wasn't merely the music that people found offensive. Middle America had spoken, And there were undeniable homophobic overtones to what they said. They finally understood the lyrics to "YMCA" and they didn't like what they heard. Dancing was for sissies. Real men play ball, so to speak.

Many people find homosexuality offensive, no need to debate that one, they just do. You are right in saying that much of the music being put out under the disco banner was poor, pathetic even, that's capitalism for you. The record companies saw a cash cow and milked it.

I switch on my radio and hear a constant dribble of Coldplay, James blunt, watered down comercial hip-hop and cheesy cover versions of MOR tracks speeded up and given the new millenium dance "treatment" but it doesn't make me want to burn cds, carry banners or whatever militant action it seems to fire in you. I just turn the fucker off and put a Fall cd on instead.

Think again.

In case you haven't noticed, there haven't been any sizeable CD-burnings or banner wavings about Euro/techno in America. Hell, I can't think of ANY such behavior in America in the last 30 years (apart from maybe some Christians w/80s metal). If Americans are so threatened by the GAYNESS of Euro/techno, why aren't they reacting in the manner of the hysterical, threatened homophobe, as opposed to the more common American reaction of bored indifference? Again, an overemphasis on the Comiskey Park episode pointlessly clouds the issue...

America is the real enemy here, BURN BABY BURN!

They all come onto boards like this and whine instead.

Anyway, I was just reacting to the words of another poster who claimed he would have willingly joined in.

Not sure it does cloud the issue. I have made little comment about the attitudes of Americans at the present time other than pointing people in the direction of a board that shows present attitudes to dance music in America.

No one is claiming attitudes haven't shifted. we might just be debating about how much...

Dixie Chicks, 2003. At least in a couple of shitholes like Shreveport.

In fact, people were so deeply disturbed by the lyrics of "YMCA" that they made up a funny little dance to go with it (spelling out the letters Y-M-C-A with their arms) and sang and danced to "YMCA" at most sports events, weddings, and bar mitzvahs of the next 25 years.

haha - yeah, and even that's a very specific, political thing (similar to Tom Leykis running a steamroller over Cat Stevens records after the Salman Rushdie fatwah)

-- Fritz Wollner (fritzwollner5...), February 16th, 2006.

I've witnessed my grandma and grandad dancing to "relax" at more than one wedding...

-Peter Braunstein, "Village Voice," 1998.

http://www.gawker.com/news/peter-braunstein/make-your-own-p

You know there is actually a really good thread on here somewhere wherein the homophobia or lack thereof of the disco sucks movement is intelligently discussed. I'm not sure how to search for it, off the top of my head, but somebody should. It beats this one,

http://www.gawker.com/news/peter-braunstein/make-your-own-peter-braunstein-papercraft-145480.php

origins of fear/hatred of disco

ts funny how in these discussions about black gay robots (and how much white rockists hate them), the consistent and overwhelming homophobia of America's black community never gets mentioned.

underground dance culture = on the DL

Also, remember, Travolta (playing a gay black robot) was a NEW YORKER. The Disco Sucks movement hits its apex in the MIDWEST. So there was regional pride/chauvinism stuff at work in there as well. (Even though lots of disco acts themselves came from Mid-America, obviously. But Studio 54 didn't, which is more to the point.) (i.e.: disco sucks was mainly ANTI-BEAUTIFUL PEOPLE, a prejudice I admit I relate to to this very day, despite its often unsavory aspects, and despite the fact that disco is one of my favorite musics ever.)
-- xhuxk (xedd...), April 5th, 2005.

After all this was before the arrival of Autotune.

This may also have to do with the fact that the disco hits were for a large part produced in the USA (even though some of the producers were European by origin) whereas house music, other than the first Chicago underground wave that didn't do well anywhere commercially, quickly turned into a very European thing.

-- jhoshea (totalwizar...), February 15th, 2006 7:31 PM. (later)

Except in, you know, Detroit, where the Belleville 3 plus some guys from Windsor were making most of the music that inspired Europe.

my favorite part is the entry about that seventh avenue record. genius.