I know AICON is a joke, but it made me think of some good questions: When does it happen that you understand "cool" means nothing apart from "I like that" or "I identify with that right now"? There are so many cool coolios associated with music that are at complete odds with each other, mocking each others' subcultures, etc. that I can't help finding it amusing. Music seems to be a good polarizing device. You're either "with it" or you suck. I think I realized it for *real* my freshman year at college and began wearing normal hair and clothes again. Still, it seems others are always riding the wave of hipsterness to ripe old ages and snickering at the rest of the nerds. How do we stop this? What is one logical sentence that could make any urbanite wannabe rapstar, indie rocker, glam rock, punk rock, hippie or raver chick shrivel up and die from embarrassment? (This would be a throwback to my hostile-yet-joking first posts on this site. I hope you understand I am not referring to any of YOU people. Take no offense and don't get "all up in my grill, aight?!")
(This would be a throwback to my hostile-yet-joking first posts on this site. I hope you understand I am not referring to any of YOU people. Take no offense and don't get "all up in my grill, aight?!")
― , Tuesday, 3 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
I know AICON is a joke, but it made me think of some good questions: When does it happen that you understand "cool" means nothing apart from "I like that" or "I identify with that right now"? There are so many cool coolios associated with music that are at complete odds with each other, mocking each others' subcultures, etc. that I can't help finding it amusing. Music seems to be a good polarizing device. You're either "with it" or you suck. I think I realized it for *real* my freshman year at college and began wearing normal hair and clothes again. Still, it seems others are always riding the wave of hipsterness to ripe old ages and snickering at the rest of the nerds. How do we stop this? What is one logical sentence that could make any urbanite wannabe rapstar, indie rocker, glam rock, punk rock, hippie or raver chick shrivel up and die from embarrassment?
(This would be a throwback to my hostile-yet-joking first posts on this site. I hope you understand I am not referring to any of YOU people. Take no offense and don't get "sall up in my grill, taight?!")
― Kevin Enas, Tuesday, 3 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
When I wear outlandish clothes, it's because I want to. Nothing more, nothing less. AICON is a joke, and a bad one at that; discrimination based on appearance has killed millions of people.
― Inukko, Tuesday, 3 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― , Wednesday, 4 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
I am extremely uncool. For all I know there are plenty of people who haven't wanted to hang out with me because of this. But they've not made that known to me so I've not been able to come up with a stinging anti-hipster riposte. So I'm wondering under what circumstances would this killer phrase be said?
― Tom, Wednesday, 4 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― Michael Bourke, Wednesday, 4 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― Robin Carmody, Wednesday, 4 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― DG, Wednesday, 4 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
I also disagree with Aicon but it's slightly improved for not being anonymous anymore. If you're going to put shit on someone at least you should take responsibility for your comments and own up to being an asshole.
― Audrey, Wednesday, 4 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
ANYHOW, can I just point out that if you're being fed your "snappy comeback" by other people it is no longer either snappy, clever or cool? In fact, you'll probably fumble the line and say it wrong and look like an idiot. Much better off to just laugh at the person - though I am a bit curious as to why someone would just offhandedly dismiss basically the entire population as "too cool for the room".
― Ally, Wednesday, 4 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― Momus, Wednesday, 4 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― Inukko, Thursday, 5 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― Ally, Thursday, 5 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― , Thursday, 5 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
Innuko, I can understand using "No Scrubs" as an example of class discrimination. Where does the racism angle come in?
― Dan Perry, Thursday, 5 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
Put it this way, I wouldn't consider myself to be cool, but I'd hate to think I'm ever anything less than fresh.
― Robin Carmody, Thursday, 5 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― Sterling Clover, Thursday, 5 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
Can the hip/savvy distinction be reduced to just hip? Cos invariably there will be something the savviest person is unsavvy about. Or is taste innate and fundamental?
― youn, Thursday, 5 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― Sterling Clover, Friday, 6 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
Anyway, No Scrubs is linked to racism because, if white girls were to say the same thing, they would be branded "gold diggers"... But a black girl says it, & she's "empowered". As for my earlier, more cynical remarks, remember that I'm from the US, and there, posturing and "fronting" is closely linked to violence. Gang violence, at least.
Damn, I'm depressing... I'll stop now.
― Inukko, Friday, 6 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― Tom, Friday, 6 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― ethan padgett, Friday, 6 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― Patrick, Friday, 6 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― Dan Perry, Friday, 6 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
I've always thought of genuine "cool" as being like zen. The harder you try, the less likely you are to attain it. Only when you completely relax and become at peace with and one with yourself will you ever be cool. And if you try to hard, there should be large bald monks to hit you upside the head with bamboo sticks.
The terminology is difficult- the hip/savvy dichotomy is cruel, coz before Sterl expounded, I thought it was the other way around.
It seems there are two concepts there. One is being genuinely yourself. The other is conforming to a societal or herdal standard. What if your true self *is* being a sheep?
I don't know. I am obsessed with cool, because I've never been *it* despite all the things I've done and acheived in my life, I have never been able to pull off the superficial aspects neccessary for coolness.
Is there anything you can say to the sheepcool to make them stop? Probably not. Unless everyone else stops, too.
― kate the saint, Saturday, 7 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
I can't agree that "No Scrubs" is harmful because of rascist assumptions. We're talking about it! That's better than pretending these stereotypes don't exist. So it's already done some good, in my opinion. Maybe we'll all think about it and learn something about our attitudes. It may not have been intended that way, but so what.
I just looked at the song's lyrics online and I can't get with the idea that it's about gold digging at all. Talking about a guy living at home with his Mom, that's not a very attractive choice for a mate, no matter where you're coming from. But even more so when you yourself are a multi-millionaire and run in completely different circles. And not only that, but these fictional guys that don't get no love are always TALKING about all the shit they want, but never actually DOING anything about making money. That's weak, I think we can all agree. It might be different if they were poor and cool with it.
The last thing, though, I don't think it's wrong to assume that different cultures might have different values. It's probably dangerous to make generalizations about how, say, people that live in ghettos in the United States think about money. But no one here thinks twice about making generalizations about how, say, white teenagers think about the world. Is the key to never generalize? That kinds of nips the idea of sociological debate in the bud.
― Mark, Saturday, 7 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― Josh, Saturday, 7 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― Audrey, Sunday, 8 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
I have a habit of biting off more than I can chew (see the Killing Joke thread, with it's 200 answers) but it certainly makes for interesting conversation.
― Inukko, Friday, 13 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link
― Josh, Friday, 13 April 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago) link