is the album format dead dying being reinvented or just playin possum

http://www.calendarlive.com/music/cl-ca-rock4feb04,0,2092179.story?coll=cl-music-features

http://www.usatoday.com/life/music/news/2003-12-04-album-main_x.htm

O NOOES I AM BECOME CAPN SAVE-A-GEIR DESTROYER OF WORDLS

http://www.wnyc.org/shows/soundcheck/episodes/2007/02/08

Early 70s, the singles were about a buck each. You got a top 100 hit plus a b side that may or may not be on the album. The album cost close to five bucks. You took a flyer that out of the ten-twelve songs you'd get more than five that you liked enough to buy.

Where Geir fails is that the buyers of Beatle songs still were primarily singles buyers, but with their track record it became a better than even bet that the whole album would reward.

Until the demise of the 7" single, I think the buying pattern remained an economic choice rather than one of whether Slade or Led Zeppelin were more singles oriented. If you could afford the album, had a turntable and, better yet, your own room (or apartment) you bought the album. It was cooler. If you lived at home, were still in the seventh grade, had a $2.50 a week allowance, you bought the single.

Related question: how long do people think before the market completely collapses on CD/record stores and they all go under? Amoeba is getting emptier and emptier it seems to me and my own trips there end up being pretty fruitless more often than not. Everyone keeps saying that stores are getting more used stock than they can handle but it certainly isn't showing up in what ends up on the flood. And this is happening there, I can only imagine how stores in the rest of the country is dealing with this. Will it be almost impossible soon to buy a CD from a physical location in the next ten years?

You'll still be able to buy a CD from a physical location in 2017, but I think this will be limited to two types of stores: the all-media store (Border's, B & N, so forth) and the used-media stores. Virgin, HMV, et al, will adopt more of the mixed media than they already do (as Tower once tried to do) or they will adopt other methods of sales.

Online music doesn't ALL suck, but that's not the question. Amazon, CD-Baby, GEMM and also brick & click vendors can sell physical objects pretty well through this system of tubes, and browsing from your home has replaced the social event of going to the record shop with friends to see & hear the latest releases.

I could opine about how the homogeneity of the major media companies and their desire for vertical markets helped cause the demise of the independent media merchant, but that story is at least twenty years old now. Ask the former one-stop record distributors, if you can find any. They are surely no longer an essential part of the distribution chain.

People still need to have meaningful chunks of information. An artist could release 24 hours worth of music at one shot, but why? The listener/buyer can't make sense of it and it surely makes no economic sense to sell that much of your output at one shot--not that that should be your defining reason for how much material to release.

A box set for a career retrospective, sure, especially if the artist is dead or no longer making new music. The issuer makes new money based on repackaging something fans already have, throws in a couple of possibly relevant rare items to make it arguably collectable.

Or a one-time event--a festival say--makes sense to put a several hour long collection together.

But listening to music is defined by the time you put aside for it. You watch a 90-120 minute movie because there is a narrative arc, or some captivating special effects. I say "you" not me--most movies drive me crazy after about 10 minutes; if they grab me, I'll stick it out, otherwise, I'll find something else to do. I'll read for hours. I'll listen to music for hours. But rarely the same artist for more than about, oh, say, 70 minutes at a time? Even then, I usually have my cd player or my pc-based media player set to random.

So, yeah, I think that artists will still package their ideas in album-sized chunks. Boy, that took me too long to say. Larger sets will be a waste of their time. Shorter sets and ep-length releases would be welcome, but I think their egos make them think they have more to say than they often do.

I'm not saying that there aren't problems with their business model, but I think that a physical store for new media products will still be a reality for at least the next ten years, barring an unforeseen development.

ultimately -- arguably -- the album form was dictated by the physical format. as was the three-or-four minute song by the length of a 78 record (or recording cylinder). so as the physical object fades into irrelevancy or oblivion doesn't the album format become somewhat arbitrary or limiting? one widely accepted notion these days is that CD length helped kill off the album w/filler. is 45 minutes -- or 30 or 50 -- really an ideal length for musical statements? does the traditional album really = the novel?

Online stores (files and CDs) will take a larger bit of the market for every year.

However, record stores are saved by the fact that people buy lots and lots of DVDs. Whereas people would mostly rent VHS videos rather than buy them, they tend to buy DVDs. The video rental market is collapsing way faster than the record store market though.

Albums could easily be stretched to 50 minutes plus. Most albums released by Genesis, Yes or ELP in the 70s were around 50 minutes.

Well, I know I am oversimplyfying, and it may have been somebody else (Clapton?) who did it before, but the guitar solos did become considerably lengthier with the guitar heroes.

Sure it may have been Dylan who broke the 3 minute mark, but his long songs are long simply because they have 15 verses, and that is not something that has influenced lots of other acts. The lengthy guitar solo, however, did became a permanent feature in most popular music from Hendrix onwards. Punk and grunge remain exceptions in the long run.

CDs are dying, though. I can't really see it being replaced by anything other than mp3s or something like mp3s, and fairly soon. The only way any physical medium is going to compete is if it can offer something beyond the music in the packaging. Some bands are offering bonus, limited edition CDs or 7 inches if you preorder their album. Or, another example is Deerhoof's new album, with all of the different cover artwork that you can choose from. Still, I get the feeling that most people don't really care that much about artwork and good liner notes anymore.

but i'll bet if they came out now they would have more tracks anyway!

i love lots of long-ass albums, but i like the idea of people putting out their very best stuff in a manageable way. chances are if you have 15 GREAT songs to put on an album than you are some sort of super-genius. and how many super-geniuses are there around? depends on genre of course. if you are some sort of snoozy drone-master, than, yeah, nothing short of forever will do.

me too, Scott, me too.

Those are the things that are killing the brick and mortar stores.

Having said all that, I do agree with a couple of things like basically "filler" is killing the LP and EP's are trending nicely. Problem is, the physical cost of making an EP is the same as a CD, but with a lower list price, so the incentive to make them is not as great. Also liked the idea of the 10-hour drone album!!

Finally, I love albums and CDs but I live in NY and basically have been spending an extra $500-$1000 to house them for about as long as I can remember. I am tempted sometimes to just get rid of them all...

45 minutes was generally about average. There's still a massive difference between a 45 minute album and a 35 minute album, just as there's a massive difference between a 75 mph bowler and an 85 mph bowler.

I myself still care about cover art and liner notes, can't speak for the rest of my generation, though.

You mean, he should go and buy Helmut Loti instead? :)

About eight years ago, a label I was on rejected an album of my then-band because it clocked in at 31 minutes. "I'd have to sell this as an EP," said the label. I responded by emailing a huge list of 'classic' albums that were under a half hour in length and currently sold for upwards of $18.99 in chain stores. The album was never released.

I hope the album format sticks around because, frankly, my livelihood depends on it. I'm assumming many others on here are in the same leaky boat.

Why is the film industry safe in all of this? Why is Nic Cage still making millions of dollars when an album that sells less than 200,000 copies (which meant major label death in the nineties) can crack the Top 40? When are people going to start stealing from the REAL millionaires, ie not fucking Ghostface and Silversun Pickups? Are there heavier / stricter mandates in place for the illegal downloading / bootlegging of films?

A friend of mine had the only positive spin on this I've heard so far, though, to be fair, he doesn't own a label or a distribution company and can probably afford to be a little more optimistic. What he told me was obvious but it cheered me up. The album format is less than 100 years old - there was music before and there will be music after. I don't think the problem is that people aren't enjoying music anymore, but they're not attaching the same meaning / worth to what goes into the music because of the relatively short shelf life.

I just hope that an entire generation of musicians' ability to put food on the table isn't being sacrificed in this transition.

We're through the looking glass here, people!! Bring back the cassingle!!

I wouldn't worry too much.

Most of the musicians I listen to most likely make most of their music-related money by touring and selling merchandise themselves, and have part or full-time jobs back home.

Merch, yes. And licensing - don't forget licensing!

if you never ever listen to records and only hear music via cd or mp3 you aren't gonna care. what you don't know won't hurt you, i suppose.

Rock criticism has never mattered in the way film or theater criticism matters, and most people ignore it.