I think Joe Boyd just explained why I like music from the UK so much

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"I have a feeling that New York was a better music place in the past than it is now," he said. "And London is in some ways better," owing mainly to the presence of musicians from exotic parts of the world. "But New York is fundamentally a much more serious music place than London. The thing about English musicians is that there’s not a tradition of playing, of jamming. There’s some terrible legislation there forcing licenses on pubs. The tradition of the bar with a band doing covers, or whatever—that doesn’t exist. In England, you have people at home figuring things out in their studios. It’s a concoction, more than it is here."

Most of my favorite music is the result of limeys "figuring things out in their studios". Bar bands and jamming, pfeh.

― lukas, Monday, 2 April 2007 21:01 (eighteen years ago)

That doesn't ring true for me at all! Compared to the bulk of the US, NYC is really low on the cover-band-in-bar scale, and most of the people doing that sort of thing have zero impact on the mainstream of recorded music; for the most part they're older than extant recording bands, not kids who'll grow up into them. Compared to the UK, which has not THAT long ago had a whole style/genre known as "pub rock?"

I mean, I'll kinda take his word for it, but it sure doesn't sound right to me.

― nabisco, Monday, 2 April 2007 21:07 (eighteen years ago)

that quote is packed with so many faulty assumptions and bullshit that it's hard to know where to start.

― M@tt He1ges0n, Monday, 2 April 2007 21:09 (eighteen years ago)

Haha now if he means Americans want to get together in the rehearsal space and really PLAY, whereas Brits just hop straight to recording stuff without any huge attachment to live-performance culture, that rings slightly truer, just not for the reasons he mentions (and with results that are as often disastrous as worthwhile).

― nabisco, Monday, 2 April 2007 21:09 (eighteen years ago)

yeah it's too bad america's never had a real tradition of people embracing hip-hop, techno, and more electronic, producer-oriented forms of music.

― M@tt He1ges0n, Monday, 2 April 2007 21:14 (eighteen years ago)

but if the stuff i come across from reading NME threads is indicative of what brits can do with rock bands these days, then yeah maybe it's a good thing if they just stop.

― M@tt He1ges0n, Monday, 2 April 2007 21:15 (eighteen years ago)

if he means Americans want to get together in the rehearsal space and really PLAY, whereas Brits just hop straight to recording stuff without any huge attachment to live-performance culture

Having gigged and recorded in both England (albeit for a fairly brief time) and the US, I'm not sure I'd understand that distinction any better.

― St3ve Go1db3rg, Monday, 2 April 2007 21:19 (eighteen years ago)

Joe Boyd is perfectly welcome to sit through four acne-ridden 17 year olds stumbling through an acoustic version of "What A Waster" down the Frog & Hammer next Thursday night and see if he still holds onto those opinions.

― Dom Passantino, Monday, 2 April 2007 21:20 (eighteen years ago)

I'm willing to believe he's completely full of shit. But I've wondered why so many of my faves come from my former colonial masters, so, you know, it was a working theory.

Americans want to get together in the rehearsal space and really PLAY

What I'm hearing is that US music sucks because of the Protestant work ethic.

― lukas, Monday, 2 April 2007 21:21 (eighteen years ago)

I'm not going to turn to Joe Boyd for any kind of assessment of today's music scene, I'm just looking for the Sandy Denny anecdotes.

― James Redd and the Blecchs, Monday, 2 April 2007 21:23 (eighteen years ago)

But, yeah, he should go across Bleecker Street to one of those Bl00z bars and see how long he can stand it there.

― James Redd and the Blecchs, Monday, 2 April 2007 21:24 (eighteen years ago)

Joe Boyd S/D Ilx thread

― curmudgeon, Tuesday, 3 April 2007 12:59 (eighteen years ago)

Here's another quote from him in that article:

“In the sixties, rock and roll was this whole new room that had been opened, in which white people were playing with African-American traditions, and nobody had really done it before. There were huge amounts of floor space. A kid today walking into that room, all the space is taken.”

― curmudgeon, Tuesday, 3 April 2007 13:02 (eighteen years ago)

"and nobody had really done it before"

― scott seward, Tuesday, 3 April 2007 13:03 (eighteen years ago)

60's people be saying stupid stuff shocker.

having said that, he's a friggin' genius and he can say whatever he wants.

― scott seward, Tuesday, 3 April 2007 13:03 (eighteen years ago)

“In the sixties, rock and roll was this whole new room that had been opened, in which white people were playing with African-American traditions, and nobody had really done it before. There were huge amounts of floor space. A kid today walking into that room, all the space is taken.”

Guess the guy's never heard of Elvis, Jerry Lee, Carl Perkins or even earlier musicians like Benny Goodman or Stan Kenton. What a dumb statement from someone who should know better. I also don't agree that all the space is taken either. And jamming in the hands of hacks is a sure route to musical disaster. Anyone who's listened to "Blues Hammer" stumble through their umpteenth rendition of Stairway to Heaven knows what hell sounds like.

― leavethecapital, Tuesday, 3 April 2007 13:50 (eighteen years ago)

God I *wish* that opening quote were actually true. Bands should be permanently excluded from pubs wherever possible.

― Matt DC, Tuesday, 3 April 2007 13:53 (eighteen years ago)

If only famous producers and musicians could speak in nothing but ILM-approved statements.

― James Redd and the Blecchs, Tuesday, 3 April 2007 13:58 (eighteen years ago)

And then the world would be a better place!!!

― leavethecapital, Tuesday, 3 April 2007 14:04 (eighteen years ago)

retake:

New Yorker profile of producer Joe Boyd

"I have a feeling that New York was a better music place in the past than it is now," he said. "And London is in some ways better. Hi dere." "But New York is fundamentally a much more serious music place than London. I has a bucket. The thing about English musicians is that there’s not a lol jamming. There’s some terrible etc, more than it is here."

― Mark G, Tuesday, 3 April 2007 14:13 (eighteen years ago)

(sorry, I'm tired. Must sleep more)

― Mark G, Tuesday, 3 April 2007 14:17 (eighteen years ago)

The thing about English musicians is that there’s not a tradition of playing, of jamming.

Because Fairport Convention never "jammed," right?

― mike a, Tuesday, 3 April 2007 14:22 (eighteen years ago)

Don't get me wrong: I think Boyd is out of his league here. However, this statement -- The thing about English musicians is that there’s not a tradition of playing, of jamming. -- doesn't seem that outlandish. In my very humble opinion, America does seem to have a stronger tradition in jamming, whereas England seems more about songcraft.

Fairport Convention is good example. Yes, they dove into Brit folk, but the jamming aspects of the band's folk-rock are profoundly influenced by the Dead, the Byrds, the Airplane, and the Band (Canadian/American).

― QuantumNoise, Tuesday, 3 April 2007 14:33 (eighteen years ago)

America does seem to have a stronger tradition in jamming, whereas England seems more about songcraft.

And, basically, that is the main reason why UK music is so much better than US music.

― Geir Hongro, Tuesday, 3 April 2007 21:59 (eighteen years ago)

Don't worry, man, I know how awful it feels when you say something like that and then Geir comes along and agrees with you.

― nabisco, Tuesday, 3 April 2007 22:10 (eighteen years ago)

oh man THAT fucking guy

― river wolf, Wednesday, 4 April 2007 03:30 (eighteen years ago)

I've been "hongroed"

― QuantumNoise, Wednesday, 4 April 2007 14:21 (eighteen years ago)

stack waddy to thread

― Snop Snitchin, Wednesday, 4 April 2007 16:29 (eighteen years ago)

stackwaddy totally jam. great band.

― QuantumNoise, Wednesday, 4 April 2007 20:11 (eighteen years ago)

stack waddy are so fucking awesome

― pretzel walrus, Wednesday, 4 April 2007 20:12 (eighteen years ago)

one month passes...

Well, that got a response! Pleased to see so many outraged comments. To clarify a quote that was pared down and edited by the New Yorker, I can say with total confidence (having lived many years in both cities and travelled around both countries) that there is a huge difference between the musical cultures of America and England. But I never said and certainly didn't mean that American music was therefore superior. In my book, I talk about how the British Invasion of the Sixties was fuelled by art-school students just learning how to play their instruments and thereby coming up with way more original stuff than the fluent Americans.

Pub Rock may have been played in pubs, but it was worked-out sets, played by groups who created their own material, not a bunch of guys playing whatever they felt like that night for people to dance or drink to. There is way more live music in America than there is in Britain. Most pubs had to close at 1030 or 11 until last year, and now they need complicated licenses to allow live music and dancing. And that doesn't mean American music is better, just different.

If you want to find even more annoying stuff, go to my website - www.joeboyd.co.uk -

cheers - as they say in Britain

Joe Boyd

― Claudia on behalf of Joe Boyd, Tuesday, 29 May 2007 20:18 (eighteen years ago)

ilm never fails to astound and amaze...

― Edward III, Tuesday, 29 May 2007 20:38 (eighteen years ago)

Joe Boyd,

Big fan!

Love, me

― Curt1s Stephens, Tuesday, 29 May 2007 21:49 (eighteen years ago)

"as they say in Britan" --thanks, guy

― Mr. Que, Tuesday, 29 May 2007 21:54 (eighteen years ago)

Hi dere, Joe!!!

― leavethecapital, Tuesday, 29 May 2007 22:17 (eighteen years ago)

And you still complain about Google?

― Geir Hongro, Tuesday, 29 May 2007 23:31 (eighteen years ago)

i propose rolling ask joe boyd thread

seriously, you are responsible for a ton of great music being released, thanks!!

― gershy, Wednesday, 30 May 2007 02:36 (eighteen years ago)

one year passes...

<3 joe boyd, come back!

― velko, Wednesday, 15 October 2008 09:02 (sixteen years ago)

Ah, he doesn't have to. Book is fine!

― Mark G, Wednesday, 15 October 2008 09:30 (sixteen years ago)

one year passes...

blimey.

― the highest per-vote vag so far (history mayne), Wednesday, 3 February 2010 15:39 (fifteen years ago)

Yeah.

― Mark G, Wednesday, 3 February 2010 16:01 (fifteen years ago)

As I say, book is recommended.

― Mark G, Wednesday, 3 February 2010 16:01 (fifteen years ago)

one year passes...

Just saw him reading from the book and chatting with Robin Hitchcock onstage at the Birchmere outside DC. Some good stories

― curmudgeon, Friday, 11 March 2011 05:40 (fourteen years ago)

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/03/08/AR2011030804581.html

― curmudgeon, Friday, 11 March 2011 05:43 (fourteen years ago)

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