Those melodies that exhibit the "less is more" thing

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You know how sometimes an artist will stay on like FEWER notes than you expect them to - for ex. they work the same interval for a while - and at first you're like, what? but then you realize it's probably even more interesting to listen to because at least it's not hopping all over the place like so much other stuff?

I love that.

Some examples: Kate Bush - Under Ice, Somewhere in Between, and a lot more from her; Madonna - I Know It, Bedtime Story (which is really Bjork there); George Michael - Hand to Mouth (the chorus), OK and there are like fifty better examples that of course are leaving me now. i think Kristin Hersh does something on this new album which is why i thought of this, but even though i'm still listening to it now, i forgot where on the album that was.

any experience with minimalist melodies really winning you over?

― Surmounter, Thursday, 10 May 2007 01:51 (eighteen years ago)

thread connections: total moment of this happening in The Thin Man off the new Kristin album.

― Surmounter, Thursday, 10 May 2007 01:57 (eighteen years ago)

the bassline to "Connected" by the Stereo MCs.

DOONK! DOONK! DOONK! DOONK! DOONK! DOONK! DOONK! DOONK! DOONK! DOONK! DOONK! DOONK! DOONK! DOONK! (repeat throughout the whole song)

― Mr. Snrub, Thursday, 10 May 2007 02:17 (eighteen years ago)

Arovane - Tokyo Ghost Stories

Never, ever fails to take my breath away.

― mehlt, Thursday, 10 May 2007 02:31 (eighteen years ago)

roxy music - in every dream home a heartache

― Fetchboy, Thursday, 10 May 2007 02:34 (eighteen years ago)

i guess it's more the repetition

― Fetchboy, Thursday, 10 May 2007 02:34 (eighteen years ago)

the beatles - in my life

those 6 notes kill me every time

― 6335, Thursday, 10 May 2007 06:27 (eighteen years ago)

Magnetic Fields - I Shatter

Two notes, three chords (except in the background vocals).

Chopin Prelude in em, No.4 I think

― Poffdl0, Thursday, 10 May 2007 06:50 (eighteen years ago)

I don't like that way of writing songs. It may work if you vary with a number of chord changes, but minimalism is usually a bad idea in every possible way

― Geir Hongro, Thursday, 10 May 2007 08:22 (eighteen years ago)

Generally, there is no such thing as "less is more". Less is less, and the more the better.

― Geir Hongro, Thursday, 10 May 2007 08:26 (eighteen years ago)

I disagree.

― Mark G, Thursday, 10 May 2007 08:31 (eighteen years ago)

Well, you are wrong. Minimalism leads to repetitiveness and repetitive music is boring. Music needs development and a sense of working up to a climax.

― Geir Hongro, Thursday, 10 May 2007 08:33 (eighteen years ago)

I'm not wrong.

― Mark G, Thursday, 10 May 2007 08:33 (eighteen years ago)

less is more is a beautiful thing. see, minimalism/repetitiveness i find challenging/interesting rather than boring, Geir.

― Surmounter, Thursday, 10 May 2007 12:28 (eighteen years ago)

for instance Under Ice, Geir, on HoL side - definitely could be described as repetitive, but the way she insits upon that interval throughout the whole song builds such a sense of drama/tension.

― Surmounter, Thursday, 10 May 2007 12:30 (eighteen years ago)

*side 2

― Surmounter, Thursday, 10 May 2007 12:30 (eighteen years ago)

Geir's posts which continually repeat and repeat the same theme over and over are pretty boring so maybe he's got a point.

― jim, Thursday, 10 May 2007 12:37 (eighteen years ago)

teehee now now. i must point out tho that mark was indeed not wrong :-)

― Surmounter, Thursday, 10 May 2007 13:48 (eighteen years ago)

the bassline to "Connected" by the Stereo MCs.

DOONK! DOONK! DOONK! DOONK!

you need to hear Jimmy Bo Horne's 'Let Me (Be Your Lover)'

― blueski, Thursday, 10 May 2007 13:51 (eighteen years ago)

the beatles - in my life

those 6 notes kill me every time

Which 6? The guitar riff? I don't think of that song as very melodically minimal.

And you have no idea what you're talking about, Geir.

― St3ve Go1db3rg, Thursday, 10 May 2007 15:10 (eighteen years ago)

But speaking of The Beatles, the bridge to "Fixing a Hole" comes to mind - "And it really doesn't matter if I'm wrong I'm right / where I belong I'm right" etc. Especially the latter half of it, which is pretty much one note - "See the people standing there who disagree and never win / and wonder why they don't get in my door"

― St3ve Go1db3rg, Thursday, 10 May 2007 15:11 (eighteen years ago)

xpost the intro?

― Mark G, Thursday, 10 May 2007 15:13 (eighteen years ago)

do neil young guitar solos count? eg: cinnamon girl, cowgirl in the sand, etc.

― negotiable, Thursday, 10 May 2007 15:19 (eighteen years ago)

sure why not

― Surmounter, Thursday, 10 May 2007 15:33 (eighteen years ago)

Generally, there is no such thing as "less is more". Less is less, and the more the better.

-- Geir Hongro, Thursday, May 10, 2007 4:26 AM (7 hours ago)

Geir, I don't think the stodgiest, most old-fashioned music composition professor in the world would agree with you on this. You're really out on a limb.

― Hurting 2, Thursday, 10 May 2007 15:46 (eighteen years ago)

i must agree here

― Surmounter, Thursday, 10 May 2007 15:47 (eighteen years ago)

i feel like less is more even applies to a lot of classical music, in terms of melody/tunefulness, not arrangement

― Surmounter, Thursday, 10 May 2007 15:47 (eighteen years ago)

uh, we're talking about a guy that never leaves the house. i dont think he needs people to agree with him

― 696, Thursday, 10 May 2007 15:47 (eighteen years ago)

TS: generic baroque music v. the Ode to Joy theme

― Hurting 2, Thursday, 10 May 2007 15:49 (eighteen years ago)

Geir, I don't think the stodgiest, most old-fashioned music composition professor in the world would agree with you on this.

No, and this is true of most of the things he says. That's why Geir shouldn't be a strawman for music academia generally. His weird opinions are wholly his own and are not generally held by any group of peopleaaaaaargh...

― St3ve Go1db3rg, Thursday, 10 May 2007 16:24 (eighteen years ago)

You're really out on a limb.

but is it Tromso?

― blueski, Thursday, 10 May 2007 16:25 (eighteen years ago)

so what are you a strawman for, Stevie Goldberg

― Mr. Que, Thursday, 10 May 2007 16:26 (eighteen years ago)

for scarecrows

― St3ve Go1db3rg, Thursday, 10 May 2007 16:28 (eighteen years ago)

Richard Simmons clones.

― Noodle Vague, Thursday, 10 May 2007 16:28 (eighteen years ago)

so what are you a strawman for, Stevie Goldberg

-- Mr. Que, Thursday, May 10, 2007 12:26 PM (2 minutes ago)

WHADDA YOU GOT?

― Hurting 2, Thursday, 10 May 2007 16:29 (eighteen years ago)

It's like the music they made for Twin Peaks. Especially that one sort of 50s doo wop sounding song that had like, 4 guitar notes over and over. Do dooo..... do doo.... do dooo.... do dooo.... I love that song.

― filthy dylan, Thursday, 10 May 2007 16:50 (eighteen years ago)

i can't believe i haven't seen Twin Peaks. awful. lynch movie music in general has some of this style.

― Surmounter, Thursday, 10 May 2007 17:04 (eighteen years ago)

the beatles - in my life

those 6 notes kill me every time

Which 6? The guitar riff? I don't think of that song as very melodically minimal.

-- St3ve Go1db3rg, Thursday, 10 May 2007 15:10 (2 hours ago)

yes, the guitar melody. maybe i misinterpreted the question. i was thinking more about total # of notes and not so much as 'they only used 3 out of the 12 notes here'

― 6335, Thursday, 10 May 2007 17:37 (eighteen years ago)

grandaddy - 'stray dog and the chocolate shake'. i dare you not to find it infectious

― Charlie Howard, Thursday, 10 May 2007 17:41 (eighteen years ago)

Debussy- "Pas Sur Le Neige" from 24 Preludes, among many others in his solo piano stuff.

― Jon Lewis, Thursday, 10 May 2007 18:43 (eighteen years ago)

Help does this. There's what, 6 notes in the entire song? The verses esp. are a case study of how to write a pop song with v. few notes. (it's all about the chord changes innit)

― The Wayward Johnny B, Thursday, 10 May 2007 19:06 (eighteen years ago)

um what's that song... oh Honey, by Mariah, or even a lot of like r&b/hip hop diva singles. there was that article about how Irreplaceable by Beyonce in light of the minimalism discussion, talking about how sso many hit singles these days use the minimalist melody to their advantage. i used to not have the attentino span - like i used to hate Mariah's Honey, but i now i dig the sparseness.

― Surmounter, Sunday, 13 May 2007 01:04 (eighteen years ago)

And let's not forget the This Mortal Coil/Cocteau Twins version of "Song to the Siren"

― mehlt, Sunday, 13 May 2007 01:29 (eighteen years ago)

The Beatles' "Baby You're a Rich Man" chorus

― nicegeoff, Sunday, 13 May 2007 04:02 (eighteen years ago)

Oh Superman, ffs!

― Trayce, Sunday, 13 May 2007 04:09 (eighteen years ago)

Feist--My Moon My Man

― kornrulez6969, Sunday, 13 May 2007 04:25 (eighteen years ago)

Generally, there is no such thing as "less is more". Less is less, and the more the better.

The potential greatest band of all time:

http://www.conklinguitars.com/images/awardbass.jpg
http://www.weblogsinc.com/common/images/6326656222366312.JPG?0.25004745400492867
http://www.record-producer.com/i/big-drum-set.jpg

― Z S, Sunday, 13 May 2007 04:56 (eighteen years ago)

I'd say the guitar riff to Smoke On the Water is a pretty good example of less is more.

― earlnash, Sunday, 13 May 2007 06:48 (eighteen years ago)

xpost:

I'd love to see a band play with those instruments. Something about seeing three folks with such a mass of equipment tickles me pink. Xanadu-era Rush came close to this, but not quite.

― Moodles, Sunday, 13 May 2007 08:05 (eighteen years ago)

I tend to think that less is more and more is more.

I object to anyone who dithers in the middle - so there!

― Moodles, Sunday, 13 May 2007 08:07 (eighteen years ago)

More is more, which is why Genesis are the best ever. 20 minute suites that changes all the time (but never abanding the sense of melody and harmony having top priority) is what it should be about.

― Geir Hongro, Sunday, 13 May 2007 11:23 (eighteen years ago)

There's something about Stevie Wonder's Superstition that is so addictive where he seems to be intentionally avoiding some note in the chorus.

Also, Yoo Doo Right.

― I know, right?, Sunday, 13 May 2007 18:41 (eighteen years ago)

Garbage, Push It - the chorus, and that chorus is incredible

― Surmounter, Sunday, 13 May 2007 22:30 (eighteen years ago)

OMG The Breeders: Cannonball (watch it! kookoo! cannonball!) all the same note, and Invisible Man fer sher

― Surmounter, Sunday, 13 May 2007 22:38 (eighteen years ago)

Cobain was good at this kind of thing - "Frances Farmer...", for example, has only seven notes in its entire vocal line, by my counting.

― chap, Sunday, 13 May 2007 22:51 (eighteen years ago)

btw correction: Cannonball = want you! kookoo! cannonball!

― Surmounter, Monday, 14 May 2007 02:11 (eighteen years ago)

two weeks pass...

THe verse of Prince's I Would Die 4 U consists of 1 note, the chorus pretty much of 2

3 notes = song

― Surmounter, Sunday, 3 June 2007 23:26 (eighteen years ago)

Less is less, and the more the better.
I'm almost beginning to admire Geir. Whenever he says something so dumb that I don't think he could get any worse, he always tops himself.

― Jazzbo, Sunday, 3 June 2007 23:30 (eighteen years ago)

THe verse of Prince's I Would Die 4 U consists of 1 note, the chorus pretty much of 2

Which, in one of the versions I have, is good for 30 minutes of song.

― Jon Lewis, Monday, 4 June 2007 14:48 (eighteen years ago)

Mozart used too many notes.

― Jazzbo, Monday, 4 June 2007 15:09 (eighteen years ago)

Which, in one of the versions I have, is good for 30 minutes of song.

crazy right??

― Surmounter, Monday, 4 June 2007 15:13 (eighteen years ago)

Book of Love's "Boy" has like 4 notes for the vocal melody and 4 notes for the instrumental hook, and it's a great song!!

― Curt1s Stephens, Monday, 4 June 2007 15:22 (eighteen years ago)

two months pass...

Janet Jackson Miss U Much. it's a handful of notes and the chorus is practically the same as the verse!

― Surmounter, Wednesday, 8 August 2007 02:03 (eighteen years ago)

melody wise

― Surmounter, Wednesday, 8 August 2007 02:03 (eighteen years ago)

And let's not forget the This Mortal Coil/Cocteau Twins version of "Song to the Siren"

This, most certainly, is true.

Imagine, by John Lennon, is another example, in that the simplicity of just having a few instruments and really focusing on the tune makes less more.

Another example of less is more: No Woman No Cry, live. The raw, in-the-moment feel makes less more (in terms of not needing a studio production).

A song that combines both of these elements is Liz Phair's 'Shatter,' off of Exile. Minimalist production and spare instrumentation (and even the lack of a proper singing voice) make this a classic where a Hongro-ist would have produced a train-wreck.

And then, of course, there is the ever-present football player Kristin Hersh, whose best stuff comes when she is at her most spare (see Hips and Makers) or most raw (see Hate My Way).

I know that the corrupting influence of punk has destroyed my ability to really understand music and instrumentation, and as a result is causing me to have misguided and unintelligent opinions. That being said - I'm right.

― humansuit, Wednesday, 8 August 2007 02:14 (eighteen years ago)

did i know u liked kristin?

― Surmounter, Wednesday, 8 August 2007 02:16 (eighteen years ago)

Yes we've been over this before.

― humansuit, Wednesday, 8 August 2007 02:21 (eighteen years ago)

As in, yes, we've been through this before! One of my favorite subjects too.

― humansuit, Wednesday, 8 August 2007 02:22 (eighteen years ago)

okay good, u know i forget ; ) one of my faves as well

― Surmounter, Wednesday, 8 August 2007 02:23 (eighteen years ago)

Did somebody say "more"?

http://mog.com/images/users/4825/1155069686.pjpeg

― Elvis Telecom, Wednesday, 8 August 2007 03:01 (eighteen years ago)

Mark Kozelek, despite obviously being a ridiculously talented guitar player in terms of technical skill, is brilliant at this sort of thing. Search, for example, "Moorestown" from "Little Drummer Boy" live record. The melody throughout the song is montonous and insistent, but works perfectly within its context.

Also, his live arrangements of previously recorded studio songs seem to become increasingly minimal with repeated performances. For example, search live versions in recent years of "Grace Cathedral Park" compared with the original studio version. (And, it's better...to my ears, anyhow.)

― dell, Wednesday, 8 August 2007 03:24 (eighteen years ago)

Yeah his live version of "Bubble" is beautifully minimalist and spare too. I love it.

― Trayce, Wednesday, 8 August 2007 03:45 (eighteen years ago)

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