So, exactly what is RIGHT of mainstream?

Indie/alternative/avant garde music is usually described with a political metaphor, as being left of mainstream.

But then, what is right of mainstream? Garth Brooks?

"Left field" is a baseball metaphor, not a political one.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_premise

I like the line about the economy being on the rise.

xpost

Hongro, is your question serious? If so,

"*Fiat ars--pereat mundus*," says Fascism, and, as Marinetti admits, expects war to supply the artistic gratification of a sense perception that has been changed by technology. This is evidently the consummation of "*I'art pour l'art*." Mankind, which in Homer's time was an object of contemplation for the Olympian gods, now is one for itself. Its self-alienation has reached such a degree that it can experience its own destruction as an aesthetic pleasure of the first order. This is the situation of politics which Fascism is rendering aesthetic. Communism responds by politicizing art.

Garth Brooks surely = mainstream tho? Contemporary Christian music perhaps??

Re the size of NY Times critics' record collections: I'd swear one of them said, in print, that he owned about 300 LPs. Alas, no cite, and the Times search function is not finding me what I want.

Contemporary Christian music is actually a very good answer.

^^^

Perhaps the map is a series of concentric circles with mainstream being the center one.

^^ Especially if RIGHT means pro-corporatism, pro-hegemony, then the mainstream IS the Right.

"Left field" is a baseball metaphor, not a political one.

― chap, Sunday, October 12, 2008 9:59 AM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

In politics, centre is centre, and I would expect the same from music too. Christian music feels like a very good answer, though, because it is underground in a way, only in a completely opposite way from indie/alternative.

"Left field" is a baseball metaphor, not a political one.

― chap, Sunday, October 12, 2008 9:59 AM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

― ♪☺♫☻ (gr8080), Sunday, October 12, 2008 12:02 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

http://www.springsteenlyrics.com/lyrics/c/centerfield_alb-c.jpg

http://www.google.no/search?hl=no&q=leftist&meta=

The phrase "out of left field" has come to be used in popular vernacular to describe any idea which seems wildly unrelated to the subject being discussed. This arose at Chicago's second West Side Park, home of the Chicago Cubs from 1893-1915. After the Cubs moved to what is now Wrigley Field the property eventually became the home of the University of Illinois College of Medicine. The U of I built its Neuropsychiatric Institute building in what had been left field, leading to the association with somebody or something that is a little off or crazy.[1]

ted nugent

nsbm

Actually, musically The Amboy Dukes were kind of leftfield back in the day. :)

gr80, you are aware that, apart from "out of left field," "left of center" is an expression often used to describe cultural products.

(can't believe I'm defending a geir thread)

throbbing gristle

burzum

Raffi

"Left field" is a baseball metaphor, not a political one.

― chap, Sunday, October 12, 2008 9:59 AM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

― ♪☺♫☻ (gr8080), Sunday, 12 October 2008 22:02 (57 minutes ago) Permalink

He didn't say left field.

I've never heard the phrase "left of mainstream." But I have heard "left of the dial."

"left of center" is an expression often used to describe cultural products.

I've heard that phrase, too.

But "centre" and "the (radio) dial" are clearly referring to the mainstream in those cases.

Indeed. I'm just wondering if Geir is saying "left of mainstream" is an actual phrase people use.

(I've also always been curious about the roots of "left of the dial.")

To the right is prolly stuff that used to be mainstream and is mainly forgotten save for a few "good music" stations -- the Lettermen, like that.

It's a little confusing, since avant garde is often associated with leftist politics.

LOL people are stupid

"Left Of The Dial" is both the name of a box set and the name of one episode of a rock documentary series.

But I've also seen the term "slightly left of mainstream" used about acts that are not very "alternative" but not quite MOR either.

so what exactly is driving me APPLES?

"Left of the dial" derives from the fact that most college radio stations in the states broadcast in the lower radio frequencies (i.e. on the left of the old radio car dials), no?

Also, since when has radical art correlated with political radicalism in any reliable way? Futurism anyone?

There's no reliable literal correlation but I've definitely heard people apply the metaphors "left/right of centre" to music, even within my grad programme. Even this online indie rock radio station calls itself "Left of Center". At least it makes enough sense to me that I find the thread idea, you know, amusing.

There are two answers if you play out the right of center metaphors, though they're utter opposites : 1) bands that are even more conservative in their structures and politics than mainstream AOR, which pretty much gets you bootstomping Oi!, in all its reactionary glory; 2) all the music found on the right side of the dial, which gets you a lot of commercial urban music in most places (in the US that is--I don't know how frequencies are assigned elsewhere).

Hm, at least in Ottawa and Toronto, classic rock owns the 106/107 end of it.

I think the question is not bad, though it's true that the actual l/r terms aren't applied that much to music.

Need to get Jagger in here, so he can tell us how blues, country and folk are 'reactionary'.

After just having played two gigs comprised of very little else? Ha!

I mean, they ARE, but they're great fun. :D

hooray!

hooray henry

"Left of the dial" derives from the fact that most college radio stations in the states broadcast in the lower radio frequencies (i.e. on the left of the old radio car dials), no?

Not just college radio, but non-commercial radio in general, is generally found at the left end of the dial in the US. Since the non-commercial stations tend to have more diverse music programming than the commercial stations, I think that's how the phrase "left of the dial" became associated with non-mainstream music.

Here's the relevant Wikipedia page:

The term non-commercial educational (NCE) applies to a radio station or TV station that does not accept or air advertisements (TV ads or radio ads), as defined in the United States by the Federal Communications Commission. NCE stations do not pay broadcast license fees for their non-profit use of the radio spectrum. Stations which are almost always operated as NCE include public radio and public television, community radio, and college radio, as well as many religious broadcasting stations.

On the FM broadcast band, the FCC has reserved the lowest 20 channels, 201~220 (88.1~91.9 MHz) for NCE stations only. This is known as the reserved band.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-commercial_educational