"Indie electro": the worst genre ever?

During the last couple of years some trendy friends of mine have dragged me to various trendy clubs, where they always inevitably play the music I call "indie electro". I'm not familiar with this genre to name any band names, but you know what I'm talking about - lo-fi, electro-influenced dance music (sometimes with added rock guitars) combined with indie-style, shouty and nasal vocals, which are quite often distorted. And every time I have to hear this stuff I feel like it's the worst genre ever. It takes away the sexiness and funkiness from dance music, and in return adds the whiny, miserablist nature of indie to it. It's like the worst of two worlds!

What's the point of this genre? Does it exist merely for indie fans who feel that regular dance music is too gay or too smooth or too lower class or too black (or whatever) for them? Or is there something I'm missing?

lo fi? what?

is it important to question the validity of things you do not enjoy? i suppose people find it fun, there are plenty of venues that play your kind of music, no?

wait isn't that about 50% of threads on ilm

You know, buzzing synths and simple drum machine beats, not much processing of the sound. I'm not saying it's actually made with lo-fi instruments, but they're definitely trying to imitate the pre-digital/pre-computer electronic music sound.

(xx-post)

http://i29.tinypic.com/2n6t8k4.jpg

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/8505/kudos1sr.gif

You know, buzzing synths and simple drum machine beats, not much processing of the sound. I'm not saying it's actually made with lo-fi instruments, but they're definitely trying to imitate the pre-digital/pre-computer electronic music sound.

Hasn't this been happening since the electroclash boom of 2001 Tuomas?

And yes, like all genres there's some bad stuff (never understood the appeal of shit like the Klaxons for example), but there have been some great tunes from this genre: "We Are Your Friends", "Let's Make Love and Listen to Death From Above", "Alice Practice" etc.

Hasn't this been happening since the electroclash boom of 2001 Tuomas?

Yeah, but I'm talking about a specific genre that adds (often distorted) indie vocals to it.

I remember listening to a band called Crystal Castles which seemed like the prime example of this in all its awfulness.

Also, the focus of this music seems to be in the upper register sounds whereas bass sounds usually play a smaller role, which adds to the unfunkiness of it.

This is the dominant form of electronic music played on Austin college radio.

WORST. MUSIC. EVER.

It sound like music made by people with Barbie doll genitals for people with Barbie doll genitals.

It takes away the sexiness and funkiness from dance music, and in return adds the whiny, miserablist nature of indie to it.

I know someone else who does this!

God?

Partyshank ;-)

of penis vs vagina fame??

I dunno Tuomas, it's like all (crossover) genres, there's good and bad stuff. I think the people who listen to this are the same who listened to Screamadelica or Fat of the Land or Bentley Rhythm Ace or Human League or Fischerspooner or Pitchshifter or the Knife. It's perhaps not even meant to be used in a pure clubbing context, just indie acts exploring electronic pallettes rather than sticking to guitar/bass/drums. In fact I'd say that the latest stuff does a better job of marrying rock to dance than clumsy past efforts.

I was joking about Partyshank, they're great.

Whether or not it's meant for a clubbing context it's definitely played at hipster club dance floors, otherwise I would've never come across this stuff.

Also, Fat of the Land and Bentley Rhythm Ace were pure gold compared to this. At least they had some nice beats and basslines, and the vocals didn't make you want to pull your hair out.

Fat of the Land was shutt too though. I don't want to go around defending Crystal Castles cos they're by no means the best band in the world or anything, but I'd rather the indie kids were listening to MGMT, CSS, Death From Above 1979, Foals, Lat Of The Pier and all that crowd than the rip-your-hair-out blandness (Babyshambles and whatever) that they were listening to before.

Great thread.

great poster

http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z92/dazzlej2/greetings/great-day/great-day_18.gif

Lait of the Pierre

Lait of the Pierre

^^^
I give this 24 hours before it becomes someone's username

Had the misfortune of seeing Erol Alkan DJ a few months back - I used to like his style 5 or so years ago - but the music he was playing now was similar to this: funkless, undancable, just crap, the worst bits of dance mixed with the worst bits of rock. Horrible ‘cult of DJ’ surrounding him as well.

Does that make a ‘houseist’?

No he has definitely gone to shit over the last couple of years.

Metal techno: the worst genre ever?

^^^ haha

tuomas you truly are a fucking ponce

1. ponce 342 up, 125 down
An individual who attempts to fake having intelligence, class, or culture

(just in case)

haha

indie electro is the default music for freshmen students around here, its annoying because they are annoying, but we had worse music back in the day, dancing to cranberries 'zombie' was mandatory

also it isnt even the worst dance genre ever, that would be kirmestechno (1 • 2 • 3)

1. ponce 342 up, 125 down
An individual who attempts to fake having intelligence, class, or culture

What does this have to with hating a particular subgenre of dance music?

And if in 2003 I said metal techno was the worst genre ever, that's only because I couldn't imagine something like this would come up within a few years.

I agree with you, Tuomas, this is very obnoxious, but that could be because of the overexposure I've been put through rather than the absolute lack of quality.

To be honest though, "indie electro" probably isn't the worst genre ever, but the other types of awful music I usually manage to avoid, whereas this thing's trendiness in clubs has made it almost unavoidable, if you want to dance in Helsinki.

T/S: indie electro vs frankenstein house

Solution = Don't go to Hipster Clubs!

Dibs on starting this thread next week

i am very glad to be someone who has never hated an entire subgenre of what is widely referred to as dance music

altho goa trance comes pretty close

Which is worse in 2008: bad mersh electro-house or bad indie-electro?

AKA Vandalism's "Smash Disco" vs MGMT's "Kids (Soulwax Remix)":

i'd still take both of those over Darren Styles and Basshunter

Happy hardcore is still by far THE WORST

ILX really needs a "best Hard2Beat release" thread

I don't know Darren Styles but the big Basshunter single was awes.

You should all be listening to this instead:

Happy hardcore is still by far THE WORST

yr
so
wrong

the other problem is that those big breaks happen CONSTANTLY -- like you can make shit like that work if you spaced it out, let it build to a huge break or something, but its like every other song has long periods, maybe a few of them per song, where that happens -- thats sorta what i meant about no sensible structure

That is a WORD UP. Maybe it's leftover indie pop/rock song structure instead of thinking about records like DJ tools? So they have to have the whole structure contained in every son? Do you think more 'indie electro' gets listened to out of a mix context than 'real dance music'?

Do you think more 'indie electro' gets listened to out of a mix context than 'real dance music'?

― Gavin

Way more. And this probably why it's less beholden to rules governing what works (and what totally fails) in that context.

Not that you're necessarily endorsing that, but the "this isn't governed by the rules" indie-approved versions of other genres almost invariably results in bad music.

yah basically breaking rules only matters if the rules are allowed to exist at all

if i go to a club and every song 'breaks the rules' then no songs break the rules

yes, more about gruesome songs like Does It Offend You, Yeah?'s "Let's Make Out" because that song is hilarious! like it's a parody of something but I don't know what. yes it sucks but that's only half the issue, the other half is that it's funny and hence probably fun for some people (maybe idiots, but so what, like any of us are anything more than that).

I'm very much a tourist in all genres including dance music, so I have no axe to grind re. this stuff, but this thread has in general been hilarious without giving me any interest to dig deeper into this subgenre, or call it the plague or whatever. So good thread!

Do you think more 'indie electro' gets listened to out of a mix context than 'real dance music'?

I can't imagine anyone listening to this shit OUTSIDE of a mix context

There's something very... phallic about a lot of the indie electro... harsh, saw wave synths, pummeling kicks, the "fuck it"-type brawling glitchy aesthetic... Even the stuff with women ride the dominatrix chixx-wiv-dixx angle pretty hard. I can see dance fans into more immersive "deep" production being turned off by it. The latest wave seems definitely more macho than electroclash (which was, I dunno, a bit queer and gothier). Funny, frankenhouse also strikes me as bringing out all the latent frattiness in a lot of otherwise "indie" doods.

see: cheap records sleeve art in the late 90s

I'll ride for International Deejay Gigolos.

"Funny, frankenhouse also strikes me as bringing out all the latent frattiness in a lot of otherwise "indie" doods."

This is OTM. A lot of this stuff strikes me as the dance music equivalent of Reel Big Fish.

Tuomas could make the wind sound racist/classist.

are you saying it isn't already

I'm just picturing Tuomas in the club thinking, "these people must like this music because they are too racist/classict/homophobic to like where elements of it come from." Please stay home.

"This is OTM. A lot of this stuff strikes me as the dance music equivalent of Reel Big Fish."

no! chumbawumba! (or at least the lager drink song)

can someone recap this thread for me?

none of this would have happened if finland had any decent bands of their own

see: cheap records sleeve art in the late 90s

^^ cred pts noted

thread strayed, missed opportunities, lack of specificity

let's be clear about this: "does it offend you, yeah" are rub

waste of a great name, to be sure.

There's something very... phallic about a lot of the indie electro... harsh, saw wave synths, pummeling kicks, the "fuck it"-type brawling glitchy aesthetic... Even the stuff with women ride the dominatrix chixx-wiv-dixx angle pretty hard. I can see dance fans into more immersive "deep" production being turned off by it. The latest wave seems definitely more macho than electroclash (which was, I dunno, a bit queer and gothier). Funny, frankenhouse also strikes me as bringing out all the latent frattiness in a lot of otherwise "indie" doods.

― Gavin

This is OTM. A lot of this stuff strikes me as the dance music equivalent of Reel Big Fish.

― Tim F

You know what is a lot bigger in clubs than Justice et. al. or Frankendance?

erm....POP MUSIC?

Well, yeah. Pls to delete thread.

"erm....POP MUSIC?"

Well, yeah. It just annoys me how sometimes we all talk about the "music of the kids" when we really mean "(the indie version of) music of the kids".

The closest experience I've had to this whole coked up hipster babes experience was at Favela Chic in Paris. They didn't play this kinda stuff though; I do remember them playing Timbaland's "Give It 2 Me" (which sounded a lot better than usual in this context) and some brazilian funk (go figure) and then weird old new wave and the like. It was like an upmarket version of frankendance.

yeah no I see your point completely, the people who like this stuff are not free of snobbery or blindly diving into music without aesthetic choices either...

The best track on Kitsune Maison 3 sounded like a Girls Aloud tune; which was a good demonstration of the fact that not only did dance not need Kitsune to interestingly merge dance and rock (hello "Where's Your Head At", hello "I'm So Crazy", hello "Missy Queen's Gonna Die", hello etc. etc.) but that pop music was already way ahead of that game as well.

I thought that was pretty well implied in the original post you made, but yeah, that is a really valid point.

I hated Reel Big Fish and the Mighty Mighty Bosstones as much as anyone, but I dug Rocket from the Crypt and Death From Above 1979.

Aren't both of the guys from MSTRKRFT ex members of DFA 1979?

Anyway, I like Judas Priest. So its not as if I don't have some time for arena rock for frat boys. I just prefer it to be made by Rob Halford and band.

My question is, if you're familiar with the soundtracks of the frats,

would your prefer the existing mix of music, or this stuff?

Personally I'm getting a little tired of AC/DC + Lil Jon, even if that vibe is contained in overtly "phallic" electro. I wouldn't mind seeing it re-queered though, something like the Skatt Brothers or EBM remixes of the aforementioned Priest.

I've been accused of having an overly kitsch appreciation of metal in the past though.

this stuff is nu-metal dance music though. not good metal dance music. i think people who like this stuff would really like the horrible remix of raw power that iggy pop made a couple years back. justice and noize boyz actually remind me of ross robinson and the production on slipknot albums. and like nu-metal its both popular and hated pretty viscerally by people who hate it.

you might like this one, siah, if you can find it:

http://www.maidenfans.com/imc/pictures/tributes/electro_a2.jpg

http://www.maidenfans.com/imc/pictures/tributes/electro_b2.jpg

Personally I'm getting a little tired of AC/DC + Lil Jon

dont really give 2 fux about this thread or this shitty music but i just suggest banned you for that

full cd version:

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/182/413850833_f025a0fd5f.jpg?v=0

"Great work with a hint of a laugh throughout" = COLD BUSTED

Maybe I should have rephrased that.

Something more like "I'm tired of AC/DC and Lil Jon as frat music"

I love Lil Jon and always will.

And a Legowelt cover of Run To The Hills sounds very promising, thanks Scott.

I think a lot of these bands are actually setting themselves up in opposition to the rest of dance music and have no real interest in following its conventions, and I've seen interviews with both Justice and Crystal Castles that back this up. I mean, they're perfectly free to do that but it does kind of undermine the 'wah nasty dance gatekeepers forcing the indie kids to stare through the club window like Dickensian orphans' argument.

OTOH most of the actual indie-dance is pretty good - if I listen to Friendly Fires or the Rapture or Hot Chip I can tell they obviously love the music they're vibing off and the music is all the better for it.

http://hypem.com/track/704910/Polarkreis+18-Allein+Allein+(Metal+On+Metal+Instrumetal+Remake)

Ah yes, brings back many a nerdy memory of Final Fantasy soundtracks and Swedish Death Metal.

Okay, so when we're talking about swaggering macho fratty dance music, we're talking about something besides MSTRKRFT and Crystal Castles, right?

My question is, if you're familiar with the soundtracks of the frats,

would your prefer the existing mix of music, or this stuff?

― DJ Ecchi

Okay, so when we're talking about swaggering macho fratty dance music, we're talking about something besides MSTRKRFT and Crystal Castles, right?

There seem to be about 8million clones that no one ever talks about because they aren't any good. I mean, I heard Erol play a year or so ago and virtually the entire first half of his set was near identical third-rate MSTRKRFT/Justice Xeroxes. I have no problem with people building entire mini-genres out of the same noise but please pick a less shit noise next time.

I'm not so much interested in mixing electro and metal, as in deejaying music that is "dance music" (and I mean that in the sense of making people dance not pogo) that borrows from metal's melodic and textural sensibilities without getting too full on rock.

I don't honestly think that this music is it, but some of it seems to be an interesting step in that direction. Drum and bass has had a malicious metal influence for years (Evol Intent) and I despise it, not huge on dubstep with a metal influence either (Distance).

Its gotten to the point that dance music critics have begun using a reference to any heavy metal influence as shorthand for "evil rock fans who don't have any interest in sexy music". Which isn't fair, I love metal and house and don't really have a desire to overly bastardize either form. What I'm looking for is a new form altogether.

And yes I really like crunchy synth basslines.

im at an indie elecro night right now. a badly promoted one at that. im doing visuals for a load of rather tragic bands who are coming out of this. thank christ ive midi control and wireless. there seems to be some kind of proto emo trance doing the rounds and not even even any decent birds, plus im thinking the promoter is roaching me for cash as theres about 30 people here

I was listening to a bunch of indie electro and garage and dubstep the other day just sampling through stuff that amazon.com recommended me when I used plastician as a starting point - other users bought this! hey check it out! 3 degrees from vampire weekend lol. It struck me that a big part of the sonic difference is that "indie electro" uses disco and rock drum samples with long envelopes for the most part while dubstep etc. use hip hop and techno drum sounds, more clipped, more highpass on the cymbal sounds. Of course there's the difference in vocal styles, avg bpm, syncopation and overall tendency to rely on casiotone/nintendo/SID bullshit, but thinking in terms of how you set up a production to begin with, that seems like the first place they all diverge, and pretty important from my perspective.

I also thought it all sounded like a bunch of garbage and made me feel old again.

Crystal Castles sound like they should've been on Tigerbeat6 in 2002

i ont mind crystal castles. i loved tigerbeat in 2002

numbers yeah!

"tv scene is a great song

― beyonc'e (max), Thursday, December 11, 2008 10:27 PM (11 months ago) Bookmark"

why, thank you!

^^^^i think so too. whats yr phone #?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d5/Shout_emoticon.png

https://www.nylon.com/entertainment/bloghouse-book-interview-lina-abascal

my eldest got me this book for xmas.
its basically a long magazine article.
very enjoyable, and full of nice little extras.
turns out i have a lot more bloghouse in my digital collection than i had realised.