R.E.M. - Reckoning POLL

Welcome to the best post-punk band the U.S. produced pre-1985, though 10,000 Maniacs was a close second.

should really be a time after time lauper v rem poll

10,000 Maniacs was a close second

In what unholy alternate universe? Don't get me wrong, I like the maniacs fine, but they never came within a kudzu-covered mile of achieving what REM did.

Tough poll. My favourite REM album -- or, not my favourite exactly, but my "perfect" REM album, the one I never want to change a note of, or alter the sequence of, or cut a song from.

I'll use this poll as an excuse to pull it out again before voting.

Pretty Persuasion

I also voted for Pretty Persuasion. I love lots of songs on this album but Pretty Persuasion is the one I keep coming back to.

Pretty Persuasion is gorgeous.

Hard choice, but easy choice: So. Central Rain.

Listening to it again Rockville has stood up the best over time.

Harborcoat is a very very good opener

like, maybe even better than "Radio Free Europe" (blasphemy, I know)

I shall go with Pretty Persuasion today, but tomorrow I'll probably wish it was So. Central Rain.

seconding Rockville.

Great album. I am going to vote "Harborcoat" because then the whole album is covering after.

Unimpeachable album, though strangely the "hits" here, Rockville & So. Central, are probably my LEAST favorite of the singles of this area. Almost impossible for me to choose between the similarly gorgeous, vague, uplifting "Harborcoat," "7 Chinese Bros." and "Camera," but the one that's in my head most often of these is los Bros. so let's go with them.

i always loved that "jefferson i think we're lost" wasn't about that jefferson.

this is most probably my favorite r.e.m. album, chronic town excepted.

Really tough to pick one here, but am going with "Time After Time." Whenever I hear it I think they decided to write their own Velvet Underground song to cover.

Far too obvious, but I'm going with So. Central. It's a tough one, though. I prefer the live version of Time After Time/Red Rain/So. Central on the Document reissue to the album version of Time After Time, I guess.

"Time After Time" is my least favorite song.

Actually, ha, my least favorite is "Camera."

Then name your favourite you HEATHEN!!!!!

But I'm having a little buyer's remorse now about overlooking the two spectacular rockers on this one, "Pretty Persuasion" and "Little America." In particular, "Little America" absolutely smokes in every live recording I've ever heard.

Tough poll. My favourite REM album -- or, not my favourite exactly, but my "perfect" REM album, the one I never want to change a note of, or alter the sequence of, or cut a song from.

Ditto. For me, this was the last indisputably great R.E.M. album, and probably their best-produced of all.

little america

KAMERA

At least I think we can all agree that the guitar solo for Camera is the low-point on the album.

"Time After Time" was my least favorite song
"Time After Time" was my LEAST favorite song

If "that crazy noise at the end of 'Little America'" was an option I'd vote for that, but I guess I'll just go with "Second Guessing"

So Central Rain. The first song I ever heard by them, and was enchanted by it. Honorable mentions to Pretty Persuasion and Harbourcoat, and the Chinese Bros too.

"So. Central Rain" for me. Honourable mentions: the rest of the album.

Voted Pretty Persuasion, 'cuz the entire song still rings in my head, at least 10 years after last hearing it. Just amazing, but Camera comes close, Also the Itchy tension of Second Guessing, and Harborcoat and 7 Chinese Bros and Rockville. Nowhere near as mysterious, otherwordly and complete-sounding as Murmur, but still damn near perfect.

Production here is a lot more straightforward, too, less 0_o, jaw on the floor.

Bimble, why are you stealing my polls? :( You're going to leave me with nothing but unpopular Warner-era albums to do!

As with Pageant (and unlike Fables and Murmur) I think the slow songs here are really, really boring - could HAPPILY lose "7 Chinese Brothers," "Time After Time," and "Camera" - "Rockville" on the other hand is brilliant.

"Letter Never Sent" I always kind of forget about, presumably b/c of its cryptic title that doesn't match to anything in the song. Love the brief bridge - "Here's my new address" - and Stipe's delivery throughout, the punchy stop-start quality of it...

If my soul was made of stone,
no, not, not so
dark, dark and it's sooooo

All that said, it really has to be "Rockville." Wish it had more of the backing vocal harmony that you can hear on some live recordings, where "Rockville" is matched with a high "Rock VEH-HiLLLLLLLL!"

("Second Guessing," "Pretty Persuasion" and "Little America" are all super-essential too...don't have much to say about them, but they're songs I'd like to name-check.)

I go back to Rockville again and again and again.

Probably in my all time top 10 R.E.M. songs.

If I had to get by with only one REM album, this would be the one for me. It is the first one I heard, I got it on tape after seeing REM play So. Central Rain on the old NBC Letterman Show. There are about five songs that I love equally and really I like them all.

Peter Bucks guitar on Pretty Persuasion and Harborcoat is really great. I have no idea what he is doing or how he exactly got it to sound that way, but it is a forceful jangle and not just rattling on an F chord like some of the sound alike groups from the same period.

The songs also worked better on these early REM records as they were kind of dreamy, you never really exactly knew what they were about or you could take these lines in different ways. It is way more subtle than say Shiny Happy People or Everybody Hurts.

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

huh, missed this one initially

I voted for "Letter Never Sent". It's not the lyrics that earn that title, it's the song overall, with its mix of elegance (in the riff) and awkwardness (in the vocals) adding up to the sort of adoring letter you write to a pined-for lover, and you open your heart and you say it right but it comes out embarrassingly nonetheless b/c what you're feeling is gushy and confused and so, a letter never sent.

I like that! Will think on it on my next listen.

I think this is pretty overrated as far as 80s REM albums go, but Rockville and So Central Rain tower above everything else here. Voting Rockville.

Harbourcoat just pips Pretty Persuasion for me. Both have some of Buck's best guitar work - Andy Gill angles and McGuinn jangles. Harbourcoat is such as stunning opener, and the way that gorgeous chorus flowers from the post-punky groove of the verse is masterful.

for whatever reason i always thought of side two as side 1. i think on the vinyl they were labeled something cutesy in a way that didn't establish primacy. so for me, "second guessing" is the kickoff and "time after time" the end.

i think on the vinyl they were labeled something cutesy in a way that didn't establish primacy

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know what you mean. I think the prob is that the record sleeve puts the titles on there in this haphazard way that you can't really decipher too well, so you aren't sure what you're going to get unless you stare at the inside label of the record going around. Another interesting thing is that if you look at the inside of the record, they do these weird things with capital letters vs. lower case. So it's totally arty and you are confused no matter what you do.

And I hate to say it, but I've always found all that to be to the detriment of the record, really. I would have preferred something more straightforward.

is this one overrated? People tend to gush about Murmur but this seems to get filed away as "son of Murmur". This one's less murky overall, more shimmering, with a slightly wider palette of song-types in my estimation: Dad, "Rockville" *is* country, "So. Central High" is gothier than anything off Murmur and leads towards Fables, and "Time After Time" and "Camera" are still pretty unique in their catalogue.

"So. Central High" is gothier than anything off Murmur

Hahah. Oh my god where to start. First of all, I love for saying this. Second of all, it's called So. Central Rain (which I'm sure you already know)...third of all I wonder...is "Perfect Circle" goth? No, I guess not.

lol whoops was thinking of Degrassi High for some reason. I don't think "Perfect Circle" is goth, but it's probably the closest thing to it on Murmur, in the vocal inflections Stipe tries out.

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

Well, Camera and Rockville are good. Little America, Second Guessing and LNS are slight in comparison to 1-5.

REM seemed to solve this later by putting on the weirdo slower stuff on side 2, it kinda starts here.

I would put that first side on par with any equivalent REM run though.

Poo on the idea that side 2 of Pageant is weaker. It would be hard for anything to compete with those opening 3, but I Believe >What If We Give It Away > Just A Touch > Swan Swan H > Superman is a pretty fucking amazing run of songs.

"Letter Never Sent" is the best, gtfo

Aw man, "Little America" is so good.

"second guessing" is a fucking jam

What If We Give It Away is by the numbers. I Believe is great, yes.

LRP is the sound of a band struggling for material...I know people like the diversity of the second half but for me it detracts from the cohesive first.

TS: R.E.M.'s "Life's Rich Pageant" vs "Document"

I would have voted "little America"

God, for me this would have been a tough choice between 'Harborcoat', 'So. Central Rain', 'Pretty Persuasion' and 'Little America'. I love this record to bits and have a lot of fond teenage memories attached to it. Dare I say it, I easily prefer this record over Murmur!

Pretty Persuasion is the one. Little America and Harborcoat not too far behind.
I like the slower songs on this one a lot as well though, and I def can't say that about every REM album.

https://www.facebook.com/REMhq/photos/a.479925337983.252067.8759772983/10153107281857984/?type=1&theater

Whoa! Let's link this thing directly!

https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xft1/v/t1.0-9/q86/s720x720/11855905_10153107281857984_3399254495237802073_n.jpg

Bugger.

engineer the givens

But yeah, I've always found things like this interesting, especially in R.E.M.'s case... this was the band that could have called themselves Cans Of Piss or Slut Bank, after all. Monster could have been called Exploding Head, and by the looks of it Reckoning could have been called Trolling For Olives, Silhouette of Hygiene or Big Pete's Greatest Hits (Fuck You)!

Also, I have a 1984 UK pressing of this on vinyl, and the mastering on the thing is so quiet that whenever I listen to it, I have to turn the volume up to a level which would probably fuck my speakers up if I listened to anything else on that setting.

wish mitch easter and don dixon produced more of their records

The last time I listened to Chronic Town about a couple of months ago, I was struck by how great it sounded - very clear and punchy.

Wow. Cries and Whispers! That's a New Order song released in 82.

stone, no, not, not so dark, dark and it's so o o o heaven is yours heaven is yours where i live

"time after time" is my most favorite song

At least I think we can all agree that the guitar solo for Camera is the low-point on the album.

― Cunga, Sunday, December 21, 2008 11:03 AM (fourteen years ago)

!!!(??)

In another thread recently, I learned (via poster "westbury white horse") about the alternate version "Little America" with a little coda tagged on... really blew my mind-grapes (considering I owned this album in All Three Formats back in the day).

Still mad So. Central Rain won this

I'm sorry

lol

That Little America coda's a nice touch and I don't get why it appears/disappears seemingly at random across editions.

there was some dumb twitter poll about their best funk song and I nominated the break between Camera-Rockville

I'd be inclined to agree if it was longer. I guess Lightnin' Hopkins is sort of similar.

I remember a radio interview with them after the album came out where they were taking call-in questions and somebody asked about that break. They laughed and one of them said it was them trying to "a James Brown thing" in the studio.

(that stuck with me because at the time I was only vaguely aware of James Brown and it sort of intrigued me that these guys would be listening to him. I think "Genius of Love" was my second cue that I should check this guy out.)

Does the "Bang and Blame" coda count as a funk song? If so, that's my nomination...

Not sure if it does but you're now among the only people I've ever seen mention it, besides me and whoever added it to Wikipedia's list of hidden tracks.

I assume it was intended as a homage to Murmur and Reckoning but its placement arguably contributes to tremolo overkill between B&B itself and I Took Your Name.

Yeah you know I tried looking it up after making that comment, and it's barely mentioned anywhere... I found a bass tab for the song with a "Coda" section, that was about it.

white horse if it was longer it would be "can't get there from here", and, obviously, terrible.

40 today

Wow

still no reggae cover

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pK_59KxuZKs

Still mad So. Central Rain won this

― Guayaquil (eephus!), Monday, October 16, 2023 2:47 PM (five months ago)

I'm sorry

― the world is your octopus (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Monday, October 16, 2023 3:16 PM (five months ago)

honestly appreciating that RECKONING is the midway point between now and preparations for D-Day

"Little America" is where they lay down all their cards, what a great album closer... and if it weren't the last song I wouldn't like it as much.

All four reunited last night at 40 Watt to join Michael Shannon, Jason Narducy, John Stirratt, Jon Wurster et al on a cover of "Pretty Persuasion." Stipe and Buck were onstage first, then Mills ran up to add backing vocals, then Berry walked on to add tambourine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZOgPcnTbZ8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFCgSuO5GXc

Love how Stipe really comes to life when he sees Berry's onstage.

Did it again! This time all four on stage from the start:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NqK-LfBYf40

Was Stipe this energetic at any point during their post Berry run?

They were my favorite band in high school and I lost interest after Berry left. That video is heartwarming.

He was always energetic on stage!

I had Tourfilm on VHS and I remember his rat tail bouncing around.