Ghostface Pollah

1) Ironman
2) Supreme Clientele
3) Pretty Tony
4) Fishscale

haven't heard more fish, big doe, and bulletproof wallets only a couple times like a zillion years ago.

but srsly, listen to ironman again, it's so raging and dense and relentless, early period wu at it's most arcane

pretty toney
supreme
big doe (mad underrated)

Sorry, it's Fishscale for me, with Ironman very close behind. Fishscale is a perfect distillation of Ghost.

Big DOe is def underrated but better than Fishscale???

but srsly, listen to ironman again, it's so raging and dense and relentless, early period wu at it's most arcane

otm

yo god i had crazy visions

^best skit ever

i didn't like fishscale that much!! call me challopsface killah

not challops iirc

iirc it was ranked album of the year by stylusmagazine!!

Clientele
Ironman
Fishscale
Pretty Tony
Big Doe
More Fish

clientele i guess but they're all close except maybe wallets+morefish

the tracklisting for Wallets is so messed up - woulda been infinitely improved by inclusion of "The Sun"

I also love 718 still listen to a bunch of the songs from that regularly

also much love for Put It On the Line

irc it was ranked album of the year by stylusmagazine!!

wasn't this basically a 'we blew it' for underselling Pretty Toney the year before?

I felt like Fishscale basically rode on PT's coattails in terms of critical recognition. Like when they finally give the oscar to whoever's shitty late period 'comeback' to make up for all the years they overlooked their actual good performances.

first half of fishscale is pretty great from what i remember

pretty toney wins on artwork

wow fishscale got great reviews, guess the hate is challops

fwiw I think Fishscale is pretty great, he just has other albums that are better (Pretty Toney, Ironman, Supreme Clientele kinda)

^^^

Pretty Toney over SC over Ironman over Fishscale over Bulletproof over bad albums

Ironman
Supreme
Toney

voted SC, my first GFK album & favorite

fishscale love was nonsense. the album was a thrown together mess of concepts & ideas that hed done previously, like 'pretty tony' b-sides (soul samples!!) & good will for using Dilla & Pete Rock beats (one of Pete's most zzz beats too) + folks who had been sleeping for the last decade

supreme clientel, pretty toney & ironman

bulletproof wallets (pre-sample clearance issues)

the rest

one of Pete's most zzz beats too

?! no way Be Easy is probably the best song on the album

supreme clientele

Supreme Clientele is pretty much my favourite hiphop album of the decade. I'm not sure anything touches Apollo Kids, even in this terrific career.

Hating on Fishscale is just as zzzz as the ppl who think it's his best album.

so basically you're only entertained by ppl who think fishscale is meh?

that album has a lot of really incredible moments

zzzz and doubel zzzz

supreme
pretty toney
ironman
big doe

and the rest...

All Ghost's albums are really uneven, but here's my order:
Fishscale
Iron Man
Pretty Toney
Supreme Clientele
Bulletproof Wallets

On second thought, I'd probably take Big Doe over Bulletproof for 5th place.

so basically you're only entertained by ppl who think fishscale is meh?

― J0rdan S., Wednesday, March 25, 2009 3:58 PM Bookmark

Not at all. It's a good album, but a bit patchier than Iroman or Supreme or Toney, which pretty much goes without saying imo.

And here we have the rongest thing on this thread:

All Ghost's albums are really uneven, but here's my order:

Yeah, probably the most consistent rapper in history

Fishscale is a little patchy all right but Rev otm that hating on it is dull as fuck, it's good, it's just not The Greatest. plus there ought to be a law stating that if you are going to dis Fishscale you have to, every time, preface your remark with "sure, Shakey Dog is a fuckin monster but"

cause that song is a fuckin monster

and "kilo" is great too, really to zzz on fishscale is both zzz and rong

The second half of Fishscale is the most consistent thing he's ever recorded: "Clipse of Doom," "Jellyfish," "Be Easy," "Dogs of War," etc.

ironman. supreme clientele has a lot of beautiful moments, though

who produced kilo?

"kilo" is great and so is the wu joint and "shakey dog" yeah but i don't get how it's more zzz to hate on a critical cumrag like fishscale then it is to hate on any other album that is a big crit record

also "whip me with a strap"

Man I'll have to think on this one. I never heard Big Doe or Bulletproof.

its prety much in the order they came out for me. the last 3-4 just kinda blend into one for me but i should prob check them out again as now i dont have the big expectations i had for ghostface albums.

Ironman
Supreme Clientele
Bulletproof Wallets (the promo version)
Fishscale
The Big Doe Rehab
The Pretty Toney Album
More Fish

y'know I don't really care if I ever hear an actual entire Amy Winehouse song, but Ghost rapping over "You Know I'm No Good" is fucking awesome

and the way it goes right into "wu tang... will survive" oh my goodness

"9 Milli Bros" is some kind of career high but Supreme Clientele is probly top 3 albums ever made for me.

yeah alfred is insane

sorry i misunderstood yr post rev

cant trust a dude who isnt feeling 'cherchez la ghost' like wtf

thats the blueprint for like half the songs he did after that album

I want to love that one cuz I love Dr. Buzzard, but the sample refuses to give.

Why are you guys all hot and bothered over "Whip You with a Strap" for fuck's sake? I mean I'll admit it, I voted for Fishscale, it's my favorite album of his, but honestly "Whip You" is the only track I consistently skip over when I play the album through.

it's so short, though!

I want to love that one cuz I love Dr. Buzzard, but the sample refuses to give.

― The Screaming Lobster of Challops (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, March 30, 2009 10:05 PM (30 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

what does that even mean

The sample just sits there; he doesn't do anything with it. You're right that this album marked the beginning of a new R&B-based approach, but to me an approach it remains.

are those Bulletproof Wallets protest/joke votes or what

My vote was genuine, it's the best Ghostface album I've heard. I like him in general, but I think his voice and flow can get kinda irritating if you listen a full album by him, so BW benefits from having many guests. Also, the beats are varied and sound nice (Supreme Clientele has some crappy-sounding beats), "Flowerz" is one of the best Wu-ballads ever, and there's a perfect blend between poppy moments like "Ghost Showers" and weirder tunes like "The Forest".

To be honest though, I haven't heard anything he's done after Pretty Toney.

there is good stuff on Wallets (I love the Across 101th St/Walking Through Darkness bit) but the album's just kind of a mess... Supreme Clientele is really good and was such a big surprise when it came out, it towers above the other Wu-Tang solo sophomore albums (possible exception = ODB) and that was kind of a shock. Did not expect him to come back after Ironman with something so strong and unique. Even so, its one of those long, super-dense records that I never listen to all the way through, I mostly cherrypick tracks from it.

Yeah, I think it's easier to listen to Fishscale all the way through (though I cut out the skits and stop after "Underwater") than SC, but I still went with SC. I feel like I'm always noticing new things on SC. Plus it has "One."

Ha, I completely forgot Fishscale DOESN'T end with "Underwater".

yeah, i voted for Fishscale too. and i still don't get deej's hysterical anti-scale stance either, but whatever. poll results more or less otm, tho i'll probably never understand the Pretty Toney love; tracks just seem to sit there and not do much of nothing, in my experience.

To me, Pretty Toney is the album where he most seemed capable of pulling off any type of song he wanted. He could put a breakup song next to chase music next to a song about love for everybody who's shaped him and have them all be equally and overwhelmingly effective. Hell, he could pull off multiple roles convincingly within one song. Peep the way on "Tooken Back" he goes from detailing the reasons he'll never go back to her, to begging her to let him back in.

plus it just SOUNDS more cohesive, beatwise, than anything else (with the possible exception of Iron Man)

basically, the range of responses here are like a great Ghostface album.

plus it just SOUNDS more cohesive, beatwise, than anything else (with the possible exception of Iron Man)

― This House is a Prison on Planet Bullshit (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, March 31, 2009 12:11 PM Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

The really interesting thing there, is that it's probably his most diverse album, beatwise. By everything sharing soul-sample signifiers in common, but otherwise lacking a sonic center, he's able to reach out and pull a lot of things (club bangers, street shit, one-track jacks, etc.) into his tent without them seeming at odds with anything else. Even the more light-hearted moments on SC seem slightly out of place among the darker material that makes up the majority of the album, even if they are necessary in preventing the tone from getting too oppressive.

yeah, i get all that. problem is, most of the tracks just don't sound all that compelling as music to me. then again, i used to think something similar about Supreme Clientele until that one finally hit me a few years back. so...maybe i just need to listen up a little more. kthxbye.

Maybe he reason u don't get my fishscale hate is bcuz you don't get ghostface albums?

deej I don't know how to break this to you but music isn't math

yeah & i think the grand canyon is beautiful but this dude talking up a rocky outcropping & hating on the grand canyon isnt going to convince me that fishscale is SC

*better than SC

i mean so far Alfred & Ionnis have made such compelling arguments as "its not all that compelling as music" and "the sample refuses to give" -- at least im presenting an argument that in some way relates to the sounds of the records were talking about here

I voted for SC too I just kinda don't get how you go from "I think it's below par & here's why" to the kinda earth-scorching you're copping here, it's like you're on some "there's deej's understanding, and then there's bullshit" tip

like, that bit about the sample refusing to give - did you try to parse it, put a minute's work into asking yourself "what might that mean" instead of phoning in a "what does that even mean?" you're smart, you could probably tease several readings outta that but instead w/the chest-puffing "only I am actually presenting an argument" which ain't true, like, at all.

not hating btw just talkin ok.

i mean so far Alfred & Ionnis have made such compelling arguments as "its not all that compelling as music" and "the sample refuses to give"

Well, excuse me for not wanting to fucking explain at length, at leisure, on a thread in which we all agree that this motherfucker is the best album artist this decade.

I mean, are you personally offended I don't like "Cherchez La Femme"? Get a job, man.

*La Ghost

i have a job, i posted that from my cell phone while standing in the rain @ wrigley field

i dont think the 'earth scorching' stance is any more ridiculous than ppl claiming its the BEST GHOST ALBUM ... EVER!!!

it is kind of like a diminishing returns highlight reel of the albums leading up to it

i mean if someone wants to argue thats a good thing, that would be one thing

we all agree that this motherfucker is the best album artist this decade.

huh you know I had totally not thought about him that way but looking back at the 00s I think you may be right

hey, SC is 2nd best (tho very very close) to FS for me, dude. one i love, the other i love just a tiny bit more. so what. both cohere about as well as rap albums ever do, i just get this extra charge out of one that i don't from the other is all. i think it just comes down to how they each sound ultimately. different ears interpret different sounds differently (duh!).

xp

you could also argue that it pretty much sums up the previous several albums worth of Ghost-eccentricities in somewhat more entertaining/hooky/compelling ways.

pop vs rock yet again.

both cohere about as well as rap albums ever do

when deej lights you up for this I'm not gonna defend you ok

lol

i rest my case

haha--i meant that they cohere about as well as any rap albums i've ever heard, ie best Wu/Biggie/De La/etc. better than any Missy i've heard for example. and i really love Missy.

Missy's more of a singles artist (although I love bits of pretty much all her records)

arent we past this 'missy is a singles artist' thing too -- her 2nd & 3rd albums are both pretty perfect ...?

Da Real World is far from perfect. Actually my favorite of hers is Under Construction.

really? i've always loved her debut best myself. anyhow, even if she is primarily a singles artist, she's a singles artist with a difference. like CCR or PSB, say.

xp

the thing is although I am not minimizing/devaluing yr arguments here deej (I lose interest in Fishscale about halfway through the album, to me its main purpose is to give the fucking incredible "Shakey Dog" to the world) there's still this grotesque orthodoxy to talking about rap that's about as attractive and interesting as it was when it was rock orthodoxy back in the seventies - "guys who like this one best don't understand the artist" is just not a good look imo

OTOH yeah cherchez seems like one of those "what do you mean you don't like pie?" songs

Cherchez is fun, kinda one of the goofiest Ghost songs there is. But the beat is nothing special and there are at least a dozen songs that hit me on a more emotional/gut level than that one. (also Tommy Matolla ref has always mystified me I must admit)

The beat's got this really great minimalist, kinda dancehall-ish shuffle to it. Proto-"Whisper Song" shit. And the way it switches up from the rapped parts to the sung parts gives the song a nice tension and release.

Shakey, this might explain a thing or two:

The beat's got this really great minimalist, kinda dancehall-ish shuffle to it.

OTMFM. It's about that bubbly bass. Sounds best through a huge system, or, 2nd best, on headphones - it's kind of hiding but it's really the heart of the song to me.

Hey everybody show love to Method Man's verse on "Buck 50," so goddamn great.

haha ah I see thx Rev

Hey everybody show love to Method Man's verse on "Buck 50," so goddamn great

fave moment on the album for me (well, either that or Redman's verse). Runner-up = Apollo Kids

the beat on 'cherchez' is so creative!