synthetic drums + bass/guitar

Sorry to do one of these threads, but I'm trying to work out more reference points for something, so ... what are your favorite acts/songs/albums that are built off of drum machines or programmed drums (or even just really synthetic-sounding triggered ones) plus "real" bass and guitar playing? I know this encompasses a whole lot of stuff, so I guess preferred answers would be those where that seems like a really relevant part of the sound, or where something interesting seems to be happening with it.

prince

big black "atomizer"

octis
phantomsmasher

Herbie Hancock's Perfect Machine has 3 or 4 tunes with electro beats, Bootsy Collins on bass and the singer from Ohio Players singing, I think there's guitar there too (possibly by Nicky Skopelitis?). Anyway, it's a fab album.

And for a totally different thing, try R by Pole. The first four tunes on it are minimal electronic clicks & cuts with improvised acoustic guitar, it's a nice combination.

cocteau twins?

Genghis Tron

Sly

jesus & mary chain
sisters of mercy
portishead - "dummy"

much of Broadcast's 'Tender Buttons' LP

The Foxgloves

The Arc Lamps

New Order

the new Yeah Yeah Yeahs.

Métal Urbain (no bass though I think)
Morsüre

OMD

Jeffrey Osborne-Stay with me Tonight

Simmons+that BASS

spitfire parade

Cocteau Twins, The Radio Dept.

MX-80 Sound were in between drummers when they recorded Existential Lover plus a few side projects, so they had to rely on "Norm", their drum machine. This followed the Dave Mahoney (drums) era, which was preceded by their two-drummer period (Mahoney and Jeff Armour), which came after their brief three- drummer period with Mahoney, Armour and Kevin Teare (sadly unrecorded.)

I generally have an aversion to this if it's noticeable. For whatever reason, I hadn't really taken note of it w/Jesus and Mary Chain, but once I did, it bugged me. I don't think it bothers me as much when everything has a synthetic/automated quality like Sisters of Mercy or Ministry.

Heh: see, I love this kind of thing. Not sure why, but there's an aesthetic quality about very obviously programmed, digital drum sounds beneath traditional rock instrumentation that really appeals.

Yeah, it definitely is a particular aesthetic, that I can appreciate for doing something "different," but I just don't really like it. It generally feels vaguely abject to me, like they can't get a real drummer, especially considering of the stuff listed above (with the exception of Mick Barr's Octis), the parts would be pretty easy to play. I am aware that this an irrational reaction, and that just because a band uses programmed drums doesn't mean no drummer will deign to play with them. I'm sure my general aversion to this is related to the fact that I like to listen to music with interesting, complex or at least varied drum parts. I'd rather hear fake guitar and real drums.

I'd rather hear fake guitar and real drums.

that should be a thread.

Clinic - The Second Line (a band who have a real drummer but used a drum machine instead, which will probably make sarahel cry)

Oh, and Godflesh.

I feel like this was briefly the cool thing to do in late 90s indie. Either you were a guitar band with a drum machine or you were a synth band with a real drummer. I love both options. The latter might be a bit greedy to those poor lonely guitar bands you see placing drummer wanted ads, but it's a great combination. (And off-topic for this thread, of course)

and then again with shit electroclash bands 2 years later. Oh and now as well if you like the sort of horrible electro emo nonsense that seems to wash around camden

Not sure why, but there's an aesthetic quality about very obviously programmed, digital drum sounds beneath traditional rock instrumentation that really appeals.

yeah totally agree

Mechanistic spareness works well with generally melancholy music (Cocteaus, New Order etc). The less going on in the beats the better in stuff like this IMO.

Actually the best example I can think of as to why that utterly impersonal drum sound works is Mother Stands For Comfort by Kate Bush. Where the arrangement of everything else is so rich and emotive and there's this stiff deadened drum machine sound fencing everything in.

young marble giants

insides - euphoria

Two Door Cinema Club do this. Chromeo use synths, programmed drums and electric guitar.

Clinic - The Second Line

Ha, this song was actually on my original playlist of stuff to listen to for this issue -- the real drummer comes in at some point, but yeah, it's a great example. Especially since it's not just A Drum Machine in the way that a lot of guitar/bass groups use one; it has the sound of a very programmed beat, and not just a Rhythm Ace pounding away in the back of the room, or whatever.

Thanks for all suggestions, by the way! The description I gave fits like a billion things, technically (especially through the 80s), but y'all seem to have homed in on exactly the reason I'm asking.

I'd rather hear fake guitar and real drums

Young Gods to thread...

Yeah, it definitely is a particular aesthetic, that I can appreciate for doing something "different," but I just don't really like it. It generally feels vaguely abject to me, like they can't get a real drummer, especially considering of the stuff listed above (with the exception of Mick Barr's Octis), the parts would be pretty easy to play. I am aware that this an irrational reaction, and that just because a band uses programmed drums doesn't mean no drummer will deign to play with them. I'm sure my general aversion to this is related to the fact that I like to listen to music with interesting, complex or at least varied drum parts.

I know exactly what you mean, but I find it strange that it should be so. being able to program drums gives you more leeway. in theory, it enables you to create drum patterns that no human could play, or at least no single human. or anyone that isn't tatsuya yoshida. for me (cos I do a bass + programming thing myself) that's the appeal of it.

in principle, I'd take the sound, the ragged edge and the unpredictability of a decent drummer over a machine every time. but being drummer-less enables you to be as fast and complex as you like (if that's your bag), not as fast and complex as the drummer can handle.

of course, in the first place, this all began because I didn't have a drummer.

oh, and missing from this thread: THRONES.

xp m the g: I'm with you on the "in theory" part. If Mick Barr used programmed drums in place of Zach Hill on the duo record they did a couple years back, I might have not liked the sound as much, but it would have been an understandable and appreciated strategy, as few drummers can play the drum parts that Zach can.

Okay - yeah, Thrones, I can get behind Thrones.

except shred earthship was an improv record, no? a really great one, too. that's the major flaw of programmed beats - zero capacity for spontaneity.

what I like about joe preston's drum programming is that it's not that no drummer could replicate those parts, but few would think to play like that. they're awkward and clunky and non-drummery in a way that's really unique and compelling.

xp m the g: You are right on both counts. The thing with Thrones, (I've only seen him live), is that the drums blend into the overall wall of sound really well, as opposed to sticking out awkwardly, like that Clinic example.

Aw, part of what I like about the arrangement of that Clinic song is that it feels to me like the beat begins naturally and then makes some of the other things stick out in odd/interesting ways! (They've done some interesting negotiations around it, actually, e.g. the way the guitar is first used pretty much like a sample.)

jesus & mary chain

Good For My Soul is the acme of this entire thing, I think.

*waves hand timidly, not wanting to disturb this thread* um...Grimly (whispers) "check your email"

Kraftwerk Ralf & Florian has some nice examples of this, with the tinny little drum machine and the slide guitar playing off of each other.

Field Mice
the first two Ultra Vivid Scene albums

Carter USM (although I never really liked them)

jesus & mary chain for the Psychocandy demos - some of those tracks are better than the album versions (incl "Never Understand")
Sisters of Mercy obv

http://www.discogs.com/Monte-Cazazza-Stairway-To-Hell-Sex-Is-No-Emergency/release/188336

the first Le Tigre album

By the time The Church began working on the Starfish album, drummer Richard Ploog had exploded become somewhat unreliable. As a consequence, certain drum tracks had to be programmed using the studio's Synclavier sampling system.
It works beautifully in Under the Milky Way, I think; the machine's metronomic precision is a perfect counterpoint to the jangling haze of guitar and Steve Kilbey's Beatles-esque bass.

2 bands that did this back in the day, brilliantly i might add :

red lorry yellow lorry.
the three johns.

alien sex fiend (sometimes)

bob mould, for a bit.