A Perfect Circle - The Thirteenth Step

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I have listened to this album more than any other Maynard-related musical enterprise. I think it's great; the caught-in-amber perfection that others decry as ProTools abuse speak very, very deeply to me. I've never seen these songs live and I doubt I will, so it doesn't particularly bother me that they've been mechanized and the edges have been carefully smoothed over; in fact, the obsessive production tweaking makes me love it even more. What better way to get across desperate alienation than to put together an angry album that sounds too perfect?

Poll Results

OptionVotes
9. The Nurse Who Loved Me 4
3. The Noose 2
1. The Package 1
10. Pet 1
7. The Outsider 1
6. A Stranger 0
5. Vanishing 0
8. Crimes 0
4. Blue 0
2. Weak and Powerles 0
11. Lullaby 0
12. Gravity 0


1899 Horsey Horseless (HI DERE), Wednesday, 10 June 2009 15:42 (sixteen years ago)

lay your head down child/I won't let the boogieman come...

1899 Horsey Horseless (HI DERE), Wednesday, 10 June 2009 15:43 (sixteen years ago)

I was lucky enough to catch the tour for this -- the show started with a version of "The Vanishing" that was mesmerizing.

I've listened to Lateralus a bit more but this is the runner-up in terms of Maynard-related stuff for sure. Friend Stripey once noted about the album that it's in many ways a shoegaze album but mixed differently -- the guitars are the 'buried' instrument in comparison to the rhythm section.

"Pet," in retrospect, for me defines a lot of the willful mentality of the W. years of the decade more than most other cultural products.

Ned Raggett, Wednesday, 10 June 2009 15:46 (sixteen years ago)

The video for "The Outsider" is nonstop lolzy silliness:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MP1U5dnUIoM

1899 Horsey Horseless (HI DERE), Wednesday, 10 June 2009 15:51 (sixteen years ago)

Haven't heard this album in years, voted for "The Nurse" though.

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Wednesday, 10 June 2009 17:01 (sixteen years ago)

the outsider

BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Wednesday, 10 June 2009 17:06 (sixteen years ago)

"The Nurse Who Loved Me", although I think that is mostly a sentimental shoutout to the aptly named band "Failure" who wrote it :(

they were great

AMYL NATHRAKH (jjjusten), Wednesday, 10 June 2009 17:12 (sixteen years ago)

failure were great.

it's "the outsider" for me, but i really like "the package" as well. the whole album is quite good, but i haven't listened to it lately.

borntohula, Wednesday, 10 June 2009 18:04 (sixteen years ago)

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

System, Friday, 12 June 2009 23:01 (sixteen years ago)

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

System, Saturday, 13 June 2009 23:01 (sixteen years ago)

And the winner...Failure!

Ned Raggett, Saturday, 13 June 2009 23:04 (sixteen years ago)

yeah xpost Just listen to Failure's Fantastic Planet.. it's far more satisfying. (I actually don't like APC's cover that much and would have voted for the one where he sings about suicide.)

billstevejim, Sunday, 14 June 2009 17:05 (fifteen years ago)

five months pass...

many of these songs deserved votes ;_;

lift this towel, its just a nipple (HI DERE), Friday, 20 November 2009 21:30 (fifteen years ago)

five months pass...

I was lucky enough to catch the tour for this -- the show started with a version of "The Vanishing" that was mesmerizing.

^^^^^^^

Revisiting this album today and it's pretty fucking good. Haven't listened to much Tool/APC stuff since, oh, first year of college... but there's time in my life to revisit certain sounds, and today it's this album. It's been... 6-7 years since I played this? And not sure how the entire album's going to hold up, but Lord does that watery bassline in "The Noose" sound incredible.

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 16:13 (fifteen years ago)

Don't really like when Maynard goes all American Idol with his voice, running up and down mini-scales like he's trying to make Ellen DeGeneres cry. He's much more appealing when his vocals stay blended/buried in the songs.

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 16:28 (fifteen years ago)

Like where? I really can't think of any examples of him doing this.

Marriage, that's where I'm a Viking! (HI DERE), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 16:31 (fifteen years ago)

You know, like on his cover of "Ring the Alarm." (Actually now I'm trying to imagine that...)

Ned Raggett, Tuesday, 27 April 2010 16:35 (fifteen years ago)

love this record so much

ksh, Tuesday, 27 April 2010 16:41 (fifteen years ago)

Like where? I really can't think of any examples of him doing this.

"So glad to see-eeee-eeeeeee-eeeee you..." (approx. 0:32)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BVXTmav24Wk

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 16:52 (fifteen years ago)

Here's a few more gratuitous examples:

"Threeewww-w-ew-w--ew-e-w-www you the obvious..." (0:28)
"A naaaa-aaeeeya-aaaa-aee-mmme in your recollection..." (0:38)
"See you naked but obliviioo-oouu-oouuou-sssss..." (1:04)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoqXDPbivFs

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 16:55 (fifteen years ago)

Maynard, I get that you can jump all over the place vocally, but please just cut it the fuck out and just sing the damn song like a normal person already, this is NOT good for my ears.

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 16:57 (fifteen years ago)

You know, like on his cover of "Ring the Alarm." (Actually now I'm trying to imagine that...)

A+ would pay $$ for this.

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 16:57 (fifteen years ago)

... so when you said "mini-scales" you really meant, like, singing any vocal line with notes shorter than a quarter-note in them?

Marriage, that's where I'm a Viking! (HI DERE), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:01 (fifteen years ago)

Precisely, if I was using language attuned to someone with knowledge of such things.

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:03 (fifteen years ago)

you realize there are all sorts of songs with runs of short notes in them and that singing them does not automatically mean you are "showing off" unless knowing how a song goes and singing it correctly is automatically defined as showing off, right

like, we are talking billions of hymns, old Celtic tunes, Gregorian chants, blues records, soul records, rock records, jazz records, etc etc etc

Marriage, that's where I'm a Viking! (HI DERE), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:10 (fifteen years ago)

i don't see any of those moments as examples of showing off!

ksh, Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:30 (fifteen years ago)

I do realize that. I just think Maynard's singing in particular fares better without the short runs all over the place (see, for example, when the lyrics in "3 Libras" repeat in the second verse: "Threw you the obvious..." and he then chooses to sing it more straightforwardly, and the runs he does throw in aren't as rapid-fire showy sounding).

xpost

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:32 (fifteen years ago)

i don't see any of those moments as examples of showing off!

I can just picture Simon Cowell going, "Okay, so I get that you're a good singer, Maynard, but you're trying to do too much with the song. You're showing off too much, it's too obvious. We know you're a *technically* good singer, you've proven that. I just wish you had injected the song with a bit more restraint, instead of always going for broke and then overdoing it."

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:33 (fifteen years ago)

And yes, I realize at this point I sound completely irrational.

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:34 (fifteen years ago)

we'll just have to agree to disagree then, man. i'm w/ HI DERE

ksh, Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:35 (fifteen years ago)

HI DERE I'M W/ HI DERE

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:36 (fifteen years ago)

speaking of APC, has anyone heard that Ashes Divide record?

ksh, Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:36 (fifteen years ago)

i don't see any of those moments as examples of showing off!

ksh, it actually makes sense that you'd dig these vocal tricks -- it's like he's going all Maynard James Newsom on that shit.

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:37 (fifteen years ago)

just fyi you've made the transition from "completely irrational" to "like you're wearing soiled underwear on your face"

Marriage, that's where I'm a Viking! (HI DERE), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:39 (fifteen years ago)

Maynard James Newsom

i lol'd irl

ksh, Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:40 (fifteen years ago)

like, okay I get that some people react to vocal embellishment with total AFFRONT, like how DARE that person have the NERVE to sing extra notes in that melody line, but you're kind of transitioning into "... and furthermore it would be much better if singers just didn't sing, period"

Marriage, that's where I'm a Viking! (HI DERE), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:42 (fifteen years ago)

it all depends on what someone's idea of "showing off" is, and none of those examples come close to anything i'd consider actually "showing off"

ksh, Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:44 (fifteen years ago)

It's showing off within the context of APC/Tool/Maynard stuff, relatively speaking. Not to be compared with anything else, I mean, it's not like we're talking Andrea Bocelli here.

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:47 (fifteen years ago)

you're kind of transitioning into "... and furthermore it would be much better if singers just didn't sing, period"

Didn't do this at all.

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:48 (fifteen years ago)

hahaha wait, Bocelli ornaments nothing; he's like the strictest, most conservative interpreter of tenor rep out there

all I am really hearing is Maynard singing like Maynard, pretty much exactly how he does on all of the other Tool/APF stuff I've heard (like, have you listened to the "Opiate" EP lately?) so your complaints are just not making any sense to me whatsoever

Marriage, that's where I'm a Viking! (HI DERE), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:52 (fifteen years ago)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xt0Zqo-vOFM

... for example

Marriage, that's where I'm a Viking! (HI DERE), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:52 (fifteen years ago)

hahaha wait, Bocelli ornaments nothing; he's like the strictest, most conservative interpreter of tenor rep out there

Again, I get your point, but he's someone the layperson would consider to be "showing off" vocally.

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:54 (fifteen years ago)

but you're violating the terms of your own argument here, namely that Maynard is showing off in the context of people who sing like Maynard, by citing an example where the person named does not show off in the context of people who sing like him

Marriage, that's where I'm a Viking! (HI DERE), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:56 (fifteen years ago)

I think we're looking at different sides of the same coin here...

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 17:58 (fifteen years ago)

If it bothers you, then please just scrap the Bocelli reference. My point in comparing the two was that if you ask the average music fan who is more vocally showy -- Keenan or Bocelli -- what's the obvious answer gonna be (regardless of whether Bocelli is *actually* a pretty straightforward singer who just happens to have a fucking great voice)?

I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 18:02 (fifteen years ago)

five months pass...

I have loved this album for years without really paying attention to the lyrics. Today is the first time that I noticed that the whole album is kind of an overarching concept piece about being an addict and the attendant loss of control that comes with it.

I fucking love this album so much.

GLEERILLAZ! (HI DERE), Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:32 (fourteen years ago)

Today is the first time that I noticed that the whole album is kind of an overarching concept piece about being an addict

Twelve Steps to Serenity... Thirteenth Step... reading comprehension really isn't your thing, is it

more than ever convinced ilxor is a sock (ilxor), Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:35 (fourteen years ago)

j/k

Great album!

more than ever convinced ilxor is a sock (ilxor), Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:35 (fourteen years ago)

dan have you ever listened to that failure song

MMLLLARRRFF (jjjusten), Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:37 (fourteen years ago)

listening to it now

ooh this is creepy and awesome

GLEERILLAZ! (HI DERE), Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:39 (fourteen years ago)

Fwiw I think the Failure cover is kinda the weak link on this album. That said, I see why they covered it here; the themes btwn the two albums are v. similar -- addiction/recovery, loss of control, doing lots of smack, etc.

This version = far superior, though:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVg9GcUDArQ

more than ever convinced ilxor is a sock (ilxor), Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:39 (fourteen years ago)

okay so note to self: investigate Failure

GLEERILLAZ! (HI DERE), Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:40 (fourteen years ago)

First album's kinda tough to find in used bins (OOP) but the latter two and esp. Fantastic Planet can be had pretty easily for a few bucks in most CD shops. Well worth picking up. Fantastic Planet def. their most spaced-out album, the prior two (Comfort, Magnified) are more straightforward heavy '90s rock with hints of their greatness to come.

more than ever convinced ilxor is a sock (ilxor), Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:42 (fourteen years ago)

You've heard them before Dan, they were the guys that did "Enjoy the Silence" on the For the Masses Depeche tribute album back in 1998 or so.

Ned Raggett, Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:45 (fourteen years ago)

o rly

I'll have to dig that out as well

GLEERILLAZ! (HI DERE), Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:52 (fourteen years ago)

love this record so much

― ksh, Tuesday, April 27, 2010 12:41 PM (5 months ago)

markers, Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:53 (fourteen years ago)

man, I keep forgetting about tracks like "A Stranger"

this thing is fucking fantastic

GLEERILLAZ! (HI DERE), Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:54 (fourteen years ago)

Didn't one of the Depeche guys say he prefers the Failure version to the original?

more than ever convinced ilxor is a sock (ilxor), Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:54 (fourteen years ago)

Probably the drummer.

Ned Raggett, Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:55 (fourteen years ago)

It won this poll handily, btw: In case Gaga fucks it up: "For the Masses" Depeche Mode tribute album poll

more than ever convinced ilxor is a sock (ilxor), Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:55 (fourteen years ago)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zN-DL8o1TQ

more than ever convinced ilxor is a sock (ilxor), Thursday, 14 October 2010 16:56 (fourteen years ago)


pardavesiela
1 month ago

its sounds good, why is this failure?

markers, Thursday, 14 October 2010 17:00 (fourteen years ago)

Failure/Tool collab sorta

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8apm-PX9Ws

billstevejim, Friday, 15 October 2010 04:02 (fourteen years ago)

Nice little record, that.

more than ever convinced ilxor is a sock (ilxor), Friday, 15 October 2010 13:34 (fourteen years ago)

lay your head down, child
I won't let the boogeyman come

MC Tramp Stamp (HI DERE), Monday, 18 October 2010 21:55 (fourteen years ago)

...go back to sleep.

Ned Raggett, Monday, 18 October 2010 21:56 (fourteen years ago)

just stay with me
safe and ignorant

LOVE THIS SONG SO MUCH

MC Tramp Stamp (HI DERE), Monday, 18 October 2010 21:56 (fourteen years ago)

A perfect Bush-era song, really.

Ned Raggett, Monday, 18 October 2010 22:19 (fourteen years ago)

the sequencing on this is pretty killer too. there's no other song it could end with but "Gravity"

markers, Monday, 18 October 2010 22:30 (fourteen years ago)

A perfect Bush-era song, really.

http://www.nndb.com/people/590/000103281/gavin-rossdale-1-sized.jpg

ilxor is awesome what the fuck are you guys on about (ilxor), Tuesday, 19 October 2010 03:15 (fourteen years ago)

two weeks pass...

lol, apparently one of the dudes who played on this album was a former member of Failure

DJP, Friday, 5 November 2010 20:00 (fourteen years ago)

eight months pass...

just saw these guys live at the beacon and the setlist relied too heavily on eMOTIVE (which, why) but the thirteenth step songs sounded real special—they kind of unfurled, got to sort of exist in a space around themselves. not sure if that makes any sense, but i offer "orestes" (which is not a thirteenth step jam but is a jam regardless), the script of which was altered so that the song could live inside of billy howerdel's guitar tone for awhile.

they ended with a new song that was maybe the best song in the set? i need another record from these guys

preschoolin' life (BradNelson), Sunday, 17 July 2011 00:09 (thirteen years ago)

new song was sort of structured like "the package" but with MORE ATMOSPHERE if you can get into that

preschoolin' life (BradNelson), Sunday, 17 July 2011 00:10 (thirteen years ago)

new song:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LDNAxHQeQyc

preschoolin' life (BradNelson), Sunday, 17 July 2011 02:05 (thirteen years ago)

one month passes...

clever got me this far
then tricky got me in

Tal Berkowitz - Vaccine advocate (DJP), Monday, 12 September 2011 16:23 (thirteen years ago)

That was the line that Stripey locked into almost immediately when she first heard the album.

Ned Raggett, Monday, 12 September 2011 16:23 (thirteen years ago)

Dan otm. Didn't vote but would've voted for The Package.

Vision Kreayshawn Newsun (Le Bateau Ivre), Monday, 12 September 2011 16:45 (thirteen years ago)

lol, I voted for "Pet"

Tal Berkowitz - Vaccine advocate (DJP), Monday, 12 September 2011 16:48 (thirteen years ago)

I just got around to hearing this last month and yes, I would have picked The Package too. That line reminds me of "The Ageing Young Rebel" by DJ Food.

kkvgz, Monday, 12 September 2011 16:50 (thirteen years ago)

A "Fantastic Planet" poll might be cool if more than 7 people on ILX loved Failure.

billstevejim, Monday, 12 September 2011 16:57 (thirteen years ago)

I want to check them out after hearing that song. I mean, I went and found the youtube of the song, but haven't delved any deeper.

kkvgz, Monday, 12 September 2011 17:02 (thirteen years ago)

this record is so great

markers, Monday, 12 September 2011 17:44 (thirteen years ago)

I am randomly listening to the 'did anyone know this existed' record by Billy Howerdel from a couple of years back under the name Ashes Divide. Kinda clear why on his own he's fair enough but pretty unremarkable in general.

Ned Raggett, Monday, 12 September 2011 18:35 (thirteen years ago)

one year passes...

your assignment is to listen to this as soon as possible

markers, Friday, 29 March 2013 04:00 (twelve years ago)

two months pass...

https://twitter.com/grimezsz/status/345092013085057025

markers, Friday, 14 June 2013 04:31 (eleven years ago)

sigh, well if grimes says I should listen to it.

Moka, Friday, 14 June 2013 05:17 (eleven years ago)

one month passes...

not just her tho

markers, Thursday, 8 August 2013 01:47 (eleven years ago)

A "Fantastic Planet" poll might be cool if more than 7 people on ILX loved Failure.

Ok so me, you, who are the other 5.

O_o-O_O-o_O (jjjusten), Thursday, 8 August 2013 01:52 (eleven years ago)

me

emo canon in twee major (BradNelson), Thursday, 8 August 2013 02:59 (eleven years ago)

Okay enough

Ned Raggett, Thursday, 8 August 2013 02:59 (eleven years ago)

three weeks pass...

it's in many ways a shoegaze album but mixed differently -- the guitars are the 'buried' instrument in comparison to the rhythm section.

I love this. Lack of votes for "Blue" is craziness.

how's life, Friday, 30 August 2013 11:07 (eleven years ago)

one month passes...

guitars sound like ashes divide

markers, Monday, 14 October 2013 18:14 (eleven years ago)

well, guitar

markers, Monday, 14 October 2013 18:14 (eleven years ago)

on the new track

markers, Monday, 14 October 2013 18:15 (eleven years ago)

three years pass...

i'm only now realizing how good the drumming is on this record

who is extremely unqualified to review this pop album (BradNelson), Thursday, 5 January 2017 00:23 (eight years ago)

like i know josh freese is the man but there is something v special going on during "blue" and "vanishing"

who is extremely unqualified to review this pop album (BradNelson), Thursday, 5 January 2017 00:26 (eight years ago)

A "Fantastic Planet" poll might be cool if more than 7 people on ILX loved Failure.
Ok so me, you, who are the other 5.

― O_o-O_O-o_O (jjjusten), Thursday, 8 August 2013 01:52 (three years ago) Permalink

me

― emo canon in twee major (BradNelson), Thursday, 8 August 2013 02:59 (three years ago) Permalink

me

Western® with Bacon Flavor, Thursday, 5 January 2017 00:57 (eight years ago)

freese is such a joy to watch too, when he really gets going he just flails about

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3N9PKGc-Tg

borntohula, Monday, 9 January 2017 21:43 (eight years ago)


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