best Sonic Youth album of the '90s

Experimental Jet Set, but not by much. I never play Goo but pretty much adore the others.

I think I'm gonna go with Jet Set, for reasons that were discussed a little bit in the previous thread...might wait a while to vote, though, I might yet go for Goo or Dirty (although the last 2 are good too).

washing machine is the only record of theirs past daydream nation i still own tho goo and dirty have much better cover art.

experimental jet set is all filler, no killer and never heard thousand leaves (or any of the 00 albums).

i mean goo is a mess but its miles better than experimental jetset.

i can't believe i never thought of this at the time when i was a nerdy teenager and totally obsessed with this band but it's kind of funny that they had albums with the word "goo" and "dirty" and "trash" in the titles, which were then followed by ~~~WASHING MACHINE~~~

Never heard EJSTANS. Kim rules on Goo and Dirty -- "Tunic," "Swimsuit Issue," "Kool Thing." Thurston's "Theresa's Sound-World" is one of my favorite SY bask-in-sound-for-its-own-sake numbers.

Went with ATL because it's chilly, static, dirty, and pastoral at once, even when it drags.

I think I cherish Goo like no other because it was my Sonic Youth gateway. I'd heard "Teen Age Riot" before, but Goo was my first of their albums.

Stepping back and looking at it objectively, though, I think I'd STILL go with Goo. The sequencing is perfect, "Mote" is one of Lee's best choons, and the guitars on "Titanium Exposé" rival MBV's "Only Shallow" for me in a total WTFHOWDIDTHEYDOTHAT?! situation.

experimental jet set is all filler, no killer

I'd rep for "Bull in the Heather" and "Androgynous Mind" tho.

Goo demos >>>>>> Goo

yeah Goo is so good...I feel like it's gotten a bad rap for following a great album, being their major label debut, supposedly not being as good as the demos (which I disagree with), etc. but in my mind most of the songs are a direct continuation of Daydream Nation and often just as good as anything on that.

haha xpost

1000 Leaves is my 2nd faves album of theirs (first is Evol).

i can respect that, i think i may have said or thought the same thing 10 years ago (although ATL hasn't aged real well for me).

Ranaldo's "Hoarfrost" is his finest moment, imo.

yeah that song rules hard -- really every SY album has songs that rule hard though

Sometimes Lee seems like he needs a hug, or a noogie or something.

i guess i need to listen to experimental jet set again -- it was my first SY album, but I haven't listened to it in ... 10 years? other than "starfield road" and "bull in the heather" there aren't too many songs i remember on it ...

the last 3 songs on Jet Set are one of my favorite stretches on any SY album, "Tokyo Eye" especially

yeah, i sort of have the feeling i might like Jet Set more now ... i'll have to dig it out. where's the deluxe edition??? COME ON.

haha they're definitely never doing a deluxe edition of that album! i'm not sure what they'd even include if they did, besides the acoustic sessions and the alt "Doctor's Orders."

a live disc? did they not even really tour behind that album? i guess they did lollapalooza, but that was a year later, right?

Thurston's "Theresa's Sound-World" is one of my favorite SY bask-in-sound-for-its-own-sake numbers.

It's my Sonic Youth POO.

"Theresa's Sound-World" is so good that Yo La Tengo rewrote it with "Flying Lesson (Hot Chicken #1)."

they only did one full-length show in support of Jet Set, since Kim was pregnant when the album came out. according to the tourstats page, 9 of the songs from the album have been played live at least once: http://www.sonicyouth.com/mustang/cc/songstats.html

Heh. I said I liked Dirty, so ILX ate my comment.

Voted Washing Machine. I love that album.

Washing Machine has "Diamond Sea," my favorite 90s Sonic Youth song not on the SYR series.

voted Dirty, a sentimental fave

Washing Machine is the one i return to the most these days, a huge diverse album with the most epic of all ending tracks.

never got into Goo at all, except the opening track, Tunic and Chuck D

xp Dirty was my first SY album, therefore also leaning towards a sentimental vote...

i'd probably go dirty > washing machine > ejstns > goo > thousand leaves

goo,without a doubt.

dirty > goo > washing machine > thousand leaves > ejsans

I'm leaning toward Washing Machine, but I could probably be convinced of any of these on the right day.

(Also 1995, not 1996, yeah? I think it came out in September.)

yeah, it was '95, and i totally knew that, sorry for the typo

Dirrrty

Thousand Leaves.

Sonic Youth 80s > Sonic Youth 2000s > Sonic Youth 90s

yah totally

I've never really understood why Dirty is so bad and hated by SY fans. Cos they sold out or something?

Which SY fans think it's bad?

at worst it's irrelevant.

Well I like it better than anything else they released that decade, but I have seen it trashed by fans plenty of times

Dirty is my biggest love-the-songs-but-not-the-album record in their catalog, it's just so long and poorly sequenced (and somehow also relegated a couple of really good songs to b-sides). "Purr" and "Theresa's Sound-World" and "JC" and "Sugar Kane" and "On The Strip" are awesome, though.

Maybe it's just my experience but I've known plenty of SY fans who hate Sugar Kane etc

Yeah, I dunno...Maybe it's because I'm on the younger end of their fanbase but I'm fortunate to have never found myself in many discussions about whether SY ever 'sold out' and when, but I always got the impression that that charge was more frequently levelled at Goo.

Yeah that gets it too - but I think more often it's Dirty that has that accusation - I'm likely talking out of my arse though.

They got better at writing fuzz-pop songs this decade, no question. "100%" really sucks as an album opener and an attempt at terse pop; to return to Al's point, starting the album with, say, "Youth Against Fascism" would have gone a long way towards redeeming the muddled sequencing and placed their vague political awakening in greater relief.

Yeah, "100%" was one of the first SY songs I ever heard and I thought it was awful at the time (and still do, more or less), didn't take any interest in them until a year or two later when I saw The Year Punk Broke and heard some of the '80s stuff.

(I don't think they've ever learned how to write political songs, btw. They're good at over- and undertones, though, which is why "YAF" works: singing and writing from the point of view of "youth" is a convenient/perfect way to make us forget the lack of clarity).

lol I love 100% esp the 2 note bass riff at the end...

On the other thread someone said SY is one of those bands no-one can agree on what's good and what isn't, I guess that's true

favourite songs on EJSTANS:

01 sweet shine
02 bull in the heather
03 quest for the cup
04 starfield road
05 winners blues

*runners-up: bone, skink, androgynous minds

any love for "Sweet Shine" (WOO...I'M CUMIN HOOOOOOOOME!)?

it might be my favourite kim song...

washing machine's title track, and diamond sea, are the antithesis of autopilot

we may need to do a Jet Set poll after the Dirty one runs its course

my knock against WM wouldn't be autopilot personally, I mainly don't like the distortion effecton on a lot of the vocals and think they did the midtempo groove type thing better on later albums

Cheers, Al. You and I've been practically lockstep re SY.

How 'bout the Jukebox now.

how bout it! wait, what about it?

i remember buying thurston's solo record "psychic hearts" hoping it would sound like "winner's blues". needless to say, i was very disappointed.

the other song-y solo album he released a couple years ago has a lot of acoustic on it, although it doesn't really sound like that either.

i think at this point i prefer Psychic Hearts to Washing Machine.

I've never heard Psychic Hearts. I guess I should finally give it a try.

songs for all the dead rock stars, or whatever its called, is immense

i remember buying thurston's solo record "psychic hearts" hoping it would sound like "winner's blues". needless to say, i was very disappointed.

― johnnyo, Friday, January 29, 2010 7:52 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark

You might enjoy Thurston's Trees Outside the Academy.

Love this thread -- everyone on their A game. I relistened to the entire SY catalogue as a result.

just started reading the Goodbye 20th Century bio so all the SY threads on new answers are kinda weirding me out! in a good way though.

Not a bad read, even if I disagree with his reviews.

haven't gotten that far yet. enjoying all the detailed backstories full of stuff i didn't already know -- like, Kim Gordon and Danny Elfman dated in high school! who knew!

Is that the best SY bio there is? It got roundly panned by the Wire when it came out so I kinda shied away, but I would be interested in reading a good book on them.

the only place I saw a copy of that was in the checkout lane at the Best Buy in Midland (birthplace of Steve Shelley, natch)--I wish I had bought it while I still lived there..

Goodbye 20th Century?? It's remaindered all over the place isn't it? Can't you find it on Amazon?

New copies are going for .32 cents on Amazon.

Plus $4 shipping, of course.

seein these dudes this evening, w/shellac and pop group and factory floor, o yes

A Thousand Leaves holds up surprisingly well for me.

fairly sure a thousand leaves is the best of these, even considering 'the diamond sea'

atl is extremely rich intertextually and obv p gorgeous, i was gonna write an essay about it years ago 'for no reason'

would agree about the gorgeousness of ATL, but it only intermittently adds up to anything. i'll take "sunday", "hoarfrost" and "karen koltrane", maybe "hits of sunshine" and "heather angel", but leave most of the rest. first album where i don't care for most of the kim songs, first album to entirely ditch rock & roll as a mode of operation, first album where the hippy-dippy aspect of the lyrics really starts to stick in my craw (lovely guitars on "wildflower soul", but damn, man).

of these, i honestly think goo's the best, with dirty, experimental jet set TANS and washing machine running not far behind, in that order. goo has the tunes (flawless through "disappearer") and combines them with the sense of wild growth and experimentation that characterized the albums that preceded it. plus, as an ace in the hole, it's got a wide-eyed, buzzing joy that's unique in their catalog. i guess i wouldn't say that a thousand leaves is worse than washing machine or experimental jet set, but it grabs me a good deal less.

I've never liked ATL as an album--much too interminable, way too long. Cutting it down by half to
Sunday
Hoarfrost
Hits of Sunshine
Karen Koltrane
Wild Flower Soul
Snare, Girl
...makes for a more satisfying listen, in my opinion.

"Hoarfrost" is my favorite Ranaldo song. I still remember my college station playing it in May '98 and the song catching my breath.

The switch from pastoral reverie to atonal skronk in "Karen Koltrane" is disorienting in the best way.

I've never liked ATL as an album--much too interminable, way too long

In the RS book, Rob Sheffield suggested sequencing the album 2-4-5-7-8-10 "for a six-song 46-minute groove album as intense as Sister."

yeah, i forgot about "snare, girl". keep that one too.

OK having listened to them both, I think Sheffield's sequence is better than mine. Instead of putting Wild Flower Soul as the epic closer, he uses it to keep the energy from Sunday going while its denouement informs the rest of the sequence. Cool.
good album... as intense as Sister? Not quite.

nah, it isn't anywhere near as intense or varied as sister. reduced version is solid, though. and i prefer your version to sheffield's (which is just the original sequencing minus duds), if only because WFS's lyrics make me cringe, so i'd prefer to work my way up to them. of those six songs, i might go:

Sunday
Hits of Sunshine
Hoarfrost

Karen Koltrane
Snare, Girl
Wildflower Soul

wildflower's lyrics are nowhere near as bad as some of those on Rather Ripped or even my beloved Sonic Nurse imo

at any rate I just want to point out what a lovely tune Snare, Girl is...

no 'ineffable me', no credibility.

I'll sacrifice credibility, that song blows.

ATL has Female Mechanic on Duty which I like almost as much as Karen Koltrane--for me the best song on the album.

Hoarfrost is a close third.

Heather Angel is really good too.

But then again I like Dirty the most out of the 90s albums.

"Wildflower Soul" rules, regardless of the lyrics. Thurston didn't even sing half the words of that song when they toured the record, and there's a pretty good recording of the early instrumental version on one of the Tibetan Freedom Concert live albums.

lo que sea

These 'reduced' versions of ATL are just based on throwing out all the Kim Gordon songs, right? Why not just say that?:P I don't think those songs are worse than the Moore songs, lyrically or musically. Maybe people just find her voice grating? (Again, I don't really think it's worse than Moore's.) I think "Heather Angel" in particular is great and quite original. I guess "Contre le Sexisme" is a little annoying.

Alfred OTM about "Karen Koltrane".

heather angel is astounding

also, kim gordon was at her most iggy last night. awesome...

yeah these alternate tracklists that throw out "French Tickler" are so rong. but Kim in the late 90s/early 00s are certainly SY's most divisive singer at her most divisive, for better or worse.

There's something about Heather Angel that kind of reminds me of Can's Soup...

in fact, as much as I love Kid A, I think Sonic Youth do a MUCH better job on ATL in channelling Can & reworking their aesthetic into an alternarock template then Radiohead ever manages to do on any album...

Agreed.

radiohead aren't fit to shine thurston's sneakers

These 'reduced' versions of ATL are just based on throwing out all the Kim Gordon songs, right?

― EveningStar (Sund4r), Saturday, January 1, 2011 6:06 AM (6 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

umm, i did say that. i called it the first sonic youth album "where i don't care for most of the kim songs." and that's true. i like kim both a singer & as a musician, but i don't think she was on top of her game here. love "heather angel", though. was working with sparkle motion's song list when i made the 6-song reduction i posted earlier. my personal pocket version would add "heather angel" to the a-side.

radiohead aren't fit to shine thurston's sneakers

― this guy ☜ (stevie), Saturday, 1 January 2011 18:56 (4 hours ago)

that would be a great job for radiohead tho

i think atl may be kim's finest hour, at least after the 80s e-s-dn trilogy

thom prolley would agree with you, stevie!

Kim kinda ruled in the 90s; she had a lot of great songs in Dirty but I think ATL was kind of a culmination for her. Her range is kind of insane--French Tickler is half Sweet Shine, and half aggro noise.

she iz awesome!

ATL is the best album to write and drink coffee to.

thanks some dude for all your amazing work on these polls dude!!!!!oneoneone

― (*ﾟーﾟ)θ L(。･＿･)　　　°~ヾ(･ε･ *) (Steve Shasta), Tuesday, July 14, 2009 12:53 PM (3 years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

hey what else am i gonna do? WORK?

― some dude, Tuesday, July 14, 2009 12:55 PM (3 years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

so shocking that i was laid off less than 6 months later

self-obsessed and sexxee in every way!