List, discuss, attack and defend music-industry villains here!

Just reading a Beach Boys thread and thinking about Mike Love and how he's so regularly portrayed as the evil villain of the Beach Boys story. His crimes seem to include a general attitude of narrow-mindedness, stubborness and profit-drivenness (oh and he did write Student Demonstration Time); but is the popular vitriol justified next to
Murray Wilson, the brothers' violent and over-controlling fatherl; or the controversial Dr Landy?

Plenty of jokes about Yoko Ono ("all that wailing and pictures of people's bums - that's not music/art!". "why didn't she get shot instead?" etc, oh my sides); but she seems to have undergone a critical review of late judging by the latest John Lennon thread.

Are there any other famous music-industry boogiemen? The Blur story seems to knock David Balfe, founder of Food Records (allegedly the subject of "Country House"). Is the general consensus justified or is there more to it than this?

many, many people seem to hate mick hucknell, but grudgingly give him credit for helping to establish the blood & fire label.

I've said it on here many times, the Mike Love Hatred thing is so boring and predictable. I've defended him many a time on ILM!

Don Arden seems a worthy candidate.

well, mike love became the face of the beach boys around the time the beach boys became execrable. so . . .

... don't know how true that is.

Colonel Tom Parker.

Doug Yule was a villain. Now he isn't, and quite right too.

Allen Klein

I'm okay with Allen Klein since he let Anchor Bay put out that boxed set of Jodorowsky movies.

Oh that's OK then

Lou Pearlman

Suge Knight
Jerry Heller
David Geffen (for suing Neil Young)

I feel like a lot of the villains from the 60s and 70s were just sober business dudes trying to deal with drugged-out passive aggressive "geniuses."

Colonel Tom Parker

Couldn't disagree more with this. Colonel was a businessman, and he never pretended to be anything otherwise. His job was to present Elvis with money-making opportunities. Making the best artistic decisions was Elvis's job.

Stan Polley

lou pearlman be touching kids allegedly yo

Gary Glitter made some great records

Mike Appel (though he and the Boss have made amends.)

joe jackson, ike turner

Gary Glitter Mike Leander made some great records

fixed

actually I enjoyed Glitter's singing/persona but interviewing him in 1984 was a disquieting experience. he was making the comeback rounds and I expected to meet an old showbiz trouper who wheeled out the anecdotes etc. instead he was a fidgety uncomfortable-in-his-own-skin type who gave me the creeps for reasons I couldn't identify until years later.

not much of a defense, sorry.

Why Joe Jackson?

BTW, I nominate the doctors who doped-up Briian Wilson and Michael Jackson, respectively.

Trying to post via cell.

PLEASE EXCUSE TERSENESS AND TYPOS.

onimo otm, don arden is ideal villain

http://img.skitch.com/20080417-t6biuhck6juh2h5rmyfexapyi2.preview.jpg

Ike turner.

Beating-up-his-kids Joe Jackson, not Is-She-Really-Going-Out-With-Him Joe Jackson.

don kirshner's rock concert salvaged many a dateless saturday nite for my teenaged ass

Phil Spector ftw

don arden's wiki is a treat

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_Arden

second Allen Klein, god what an asshole (Jodo box set aside)

I nominate Bill Graham, an oppressive, obnoxious boor who's bloated corpse still smothers the bay area music scene to this day

Parker was certainly committed to maximizing Elvis's earnings, and his own, but he showed an amazing lack of imagination and willingness to take risks -- exactly what Elvis did not need as an artist. The second volume of the Guralnick biography has some really depressing examples of Parker's stoneheadedness and Elvis's passivity. The Parker/Presley combo made a lot of money for both but it was creepy and dysfunctional.

Stan Polley, former manager of Badfinger whom Pete Ham called a "soulless bastard" in his suicide note.

Clive Davis seems kinda jerky

Lots of industry/business types which isn't surprising really. What about fellow musicians and WAGs?

I feel like a lot of the villains from the 60s and 70s were just sober business dudes trying to deal with drugged-out passive aggressive "geniuses."

― President Keyes, Wednesday, 23 June 2010 13:35 (4 hours ago)

Totally agree.

On one hand I think it's kind of shitty the way the musicians refused to acknowledge that the industry machine behind them was RESPONSIBLE for their successes as opposed to just leeching off of them. OTOH I guess musicians kind of had to maintain an us-and-them mentality for cred.

Marvin Gaye's father.

nominate Mike Curb

(not least for making it hard to get a good Hank Williams Jr. compilation)

nominate Mitch Miller for hating rock & roll and making banal sing-along albums

http://www.uh.edu/engines/Mitch-Miller-Norman-Rockwell350px.jpg

Sharon Osbourne

The second volume of the Guralnick biography has some really depressing examples of Parker's stoneheadedness and Elvis's passivity.

I thought Careless Love painted Parker in a more flattering light. He had obvious flaws like a crippling gambling addiction, but he had one job and one job only: find profitable opportunities for Elvis.

Elvis called all the shots artistically, but you're otm about his passivity. If Elvis told him he was done making movies in 1966, find something else, Parker would have done as he was told. Elvis just never had the nerve to stand up to him and take the reins of his career.

Sharon Osbourne

oh god yes. what a loathsome harpy

Yeah, Sharon Osbourne's evil manipulation of Ozzy thru the medium of getting him off booze and drugs is a crime that must never be forgotten.

Incidentally I agree that a lot of her "management" career has been dick moves but lol rock star management. The hate is out of all proportion to her place on the scale of rock and roll heinousness.

funnily enough, guralnick has positive things to say abt klein in his sam cooke bio

Her crimes have outweighed whatever role she may have had in Ozzy's sobering up (the claim of which i find dubious at best). Her sabotage of Iron Maiden at Ozzfest is only one of the many things she should burn in hell for. Suing Iommi for the Black Sabbath name, charging bands to play at Ozzfest, subjecting people to the horror that was the Osbournes, giving birth to a couple fat whiny idiots, etc. etc. etc.

xpost

and the overdubbing of the rhythm section to deprive them of royalties from ozzys biggest selling albums

oh, i forgot that one. That one may be the worst.

Bill I was sort of with you but the last crack is lame and really, her behaviour is only on a par with a ton of other shithead managers.

There's a whole story about Ozzy being too cabbaged to stop her doing this shit but I've never seen any evidence that this is the case or that he's not cool with her behaving as she does. Part of the hate feels like a version of the Yoko Ono "ugggggh girls" bullshit.

Im joking about the kids. you're probably right though about the industry. plus her father wasnt exactly a great role model.

I blame Ozzy just as much, if not more. I think he hides behind her persona to pull some of this shit.

Yeah, and behind his own.

and the overdubbing of the rhythm section to deprive them of royalties from ozzys biggest selling albums

this is not industry standard practice and its fucking reprehensible. I would stab her eyes out just for this alone, notwithstanding all the other garbage like suing Iommi and the spat with Maiden etc

Vanz can't dance
But he'll steal your money
Watch him or he'll rob you blind

Out in the street
A crowd is gatherin
Pushed down by the heat of the building
They're wantin' to dance
Makin' their way up the street
A boy with a pig and a radio
Little Billy can work on the crowd
Put 'em into a trance
For the little pig Vanz

Vanz can't dance
But he'll steal your money
Watch him or he'll rob you blind

You're watchin' 'em dance
Not a care in the world
So Billy and Vanz get busy
They're makin' their move
The little pig knows what to do
He's silent and quick
Just like Oliver Twist
Before it's over your pocket is clear
A four legged-thief
Paid a visit on you

Vanz can't dance
But he'll steal your money
Watch him or he'll rob you blind

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saul_Zaentz

"Yeah, and behind his own."

Very true.

and the overdubbing of the rhythm section to deprive them of royalties from ozzys biggest selling albums

this is not industry standard practice and its fucking reprehensible. notwithstanding all the other garbage like suing Iommi and the spat with Maiden etc

― insert your favorite discriminatory practice here (Shakey Mo Collier),

I agree with that

Aren't they getting reissued with the original parts restored? so all the poor sods who bought the cds will need to buy them again to get the proper versions? More money in the osbourne bank account.

i am going to second the phil spector nom. it's true that i like everything i've heard that he has a hand in, but the fact that there was contention between him and paul over let it be, and hat he got his way makes him a villain in my eyes.

oh and he killed people or something, right?

ya but do you prefer let it be (naked)

i haven't listened to the entire album naked, but i've compared across the universe multiple times. it's true that spector's fx on lennon make him sound GOD-LIKE, but it is only an incremental increase! he doesn't realize that lennon sounds god-like ON HIS OWN.

but like, i have no problem with let it be. i'm just saying based this because i am blind to all but they, ommmmmmmmm.

Lenny Hart.

Also, marc iv, maybe it's a reference that I don't get, but that Display Name sucks.

agreed

i can't remember the name of the dude, but that tit who white-anted galaxie 500 and signed dean w to elektra

That Richard Wagner had some talent, give him that

That brings up something I've been wondering: are there any good contemporary examples, particularly from the indie world? Most of the people mentioned on this thread are from the 60s and 70s.

are there any good contemporary examples, particularly from the indie world?

this is an irrational knee-jerk reaction on my part, but i was kind of upset at jamer mercer for kicking that other guy out of the shins. that guy wound up opening a taco stand in new mexico, when he clearly wanted to stay with the band! seemed wrong.

Yeah but those tacos will change your life.

are there any good contemporary examples, particularly from the indie world?

You wanna get sued, you go ahead. Leave me out though.

Yeah but those tacos will change your life.

ha!

tony brummel from victory records

xxp: point taken.

And yeah, Tony's one I've definitely heard about.

Would people like Johnny Ramone or Barry Gibb count? Or are these just examples of particularly strong wills and characters?

I wouldn't think of Johnny as a villain.

running a taco stand sounds way better than having to be a "rock star"

(in 2010)

That brings up something I've been wondering: are there any good contemporary examples, particularly from the indie world?

Stevo of Some Bizzare. Shafted Coil, Einstürzende Neubauten and probably many others over royalty payments.

Eagerly awaiting Robert Fripp's forthcoming book Dear Andrew in which he will recount his battles with various music biz types (e.g. Sam Alder) who have caused him untold grief over the years and ultimately led to his de facto retirement.

particularly from the indie world?

The indie world is brimfull of crooks and shysters

:D

Lenny Hart.

The Reverend Lenny Hart

How about Jimmy Page for ripping off Chicago bluesman and also the guy who wrote Dazed and Confused?

And whipping 14yo groupies?

John Fogerty seems like a bit of a tool, judging by his wiki page.

http://s11.bdbphotos.com/images/orig/e/k/ek6b2fna5lo5e565.jpg

So many good things can be said about Ike Turner I feel ashamed to bring him up here

I'm torn about nominating Neil Bogart - love so many records on Casablanca yet as a businessman he nearly capsized the entire industry in the 70s

i can't remember the name of the dude, but that tit who white-anted galaxie 500 and signed dean w to elektra

Was it Terry Tolkin? According to his wiki page:

In 1979, while writing and charting records for the music industry publication Rockpool Newsletter, Terry coined the term "Alternative Music" to raise awareness of the US and UK post-punk groups he was reviewing.

yeah, charles manson. there's an unsettling story about how he and his cult moved themselves into dennis wilson's home for 6 months. wilson -- who found his uninvited guests when manson greeted him outside of wilson's home one night -- was terrified for himself and his family. the cult finally left, but i can't recall under what circumstances (couldn't have been good).

I don't think they were exactly uninvited at Dennis'

i think they were, actually.

Dennis was one of his biggest fans

iirc, wilson was with two of the female cult members (i don't think he knew they were with manson's cult). but he didn't invite the cult to move in. wilson just found the girls -- and the rest of the cult -- at his home one night soon thereafter.

Plus the opportunity to ball all of Charlie's chicks was a bit irresistible to Dennis

(i'm working from memory, to be fair. this was from the helter skelter book)

"Plus the opportunity to ball all of Charlie's chicks was a bit irresistible to Dennis"

God what a fool. Who was the other guy who they moved in on, Terry Melcher?

The Golden Penetrators they used to call themselves.

if i'm remembering it right, manson's behavior when he met wilson at wilson's home that first night is enough to have scared wilson witless. manson came out of the shadows, introduced himself, dropped down to his knees and kissed wilson's feet while saying "we mean you no harm," and then brought wilson into wilson's home. the book said wilson desperate wanted them gone, feared for his kids and colleagues, but didn't know how to get them to leave (safely). finally, somehow, they left.

That sounds like total bollocks to me. No-one forced Dennis to go around praising Manson ("The Wizard" he called him) to the hilt.

"I guess it's time to talk about it. You see, when I knew Manson it was no big thing. We were friends; we lived together. That was long before the murders. And we'd talk every night, just like you and me. We'd really talk about important things... I know why Charles Manson did what he did. Someday, I'll tell the world. I'll write a book and explain why he did it. Over the years, people have always wanted to know what happened, what my relationship with Charlie was. We were just friends."

i think we're both right, tom. from wiki:

In 1968, Dennis Wilson was driving through Malibu when he noticed two female hitchhikers. He picked them up and dropped them off at their destination.[1] Later on, Wilson noticed the same two girls hitchhiking again. This time, he took them to his home at 14400 Sunset Boulevard, near Will Rogers Park. Wilson then went to a recording session. When he returned at around 3 a.m., he was met in his driveway by a stranger, Charles Manson. When he walked into his home, there were about a dozen people occupying the premises, most of them female. Wilson became fascinated by Manson and his followers. The "Manson Family" lived with Wilson for a period of time afterwards, at his expense.

Initially impressed by Manson's songwriting talent, Wilson introduced him to a few friends in the music business, including Terry Melcher, whose home on Cielo Drive would later be rented by director Roman Polanski and his wife, actress Sharon Tate; Tate and several others would later be murdered at the home by Manson Family members. Recording sessions for Manson were held at Brian Wilson's home studio. Those recordings, if existent, have never been released. The Beach Boys released a Manson song, originally titled "Cease To Exist", but reworked as "Never Learn Not To Love", as a single B-side.

As Wilson became increasingly aware of Manson's volatile nature and growing tendency to violence, he finally made a break from the friendship by simply moving out of the house, and leaving Manson there. When Manson subsequently sought further contact (and money), he left a bullet with Wilson's housekeeper to be delivered with a cryptic message, which was perceived by Wilson as a threat.

In August 1969, the Tate/LaBianca murders occurred. He rarely discussed his involvement with the Manson Family and he usually became upset when the subject was broached. He was upset in regard to Charles Manson and his 'family' and did mention that he felt it was his 'fault' for introducing him to the music world.

but i absolutely recall that it said in helter skelter that wilson was frightened/intimidated, right away, by manson's appearance in his house.

Well he would say that wouldn't he? After the fact.

I think even the horniest, most coked up dude in 1970s California would be slightly "WTF" about finding ones own house full of pie-eyed cult chicks, even if it were for maybe 30 seconds or whatever.

Then again there's been so much misinformation and hearsay about the Beach Boys in that era that details tend to be very blurry.

sorry, late-60s California, that is - which goes towards my point about facts being somewhat opaque.

Horse's mouth though. No pun intended.