Paul's Boutique & Abbey Road (and beasties & beatles in general)

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the most obvious similarity is the side-B song fragment collage, but there's something else, something I can't quite identify, a certain je ne sais quois if you will that is deeply beatlesy about the beastie boys' second album. can the denizens of ILM help me figure this out, or perhaps even dissuade me from this idea completely?

― Fritz, Tuesday, 6 August 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

secondary (& less supportable) argument: the beasties are as washed up and aged and hopelessly last decade as they possibly could be right now. HOWEVAH, they were as culturally significant to american teens from "licensed to ill" thru "ill communication" as the beatles were from "meet the..." to "get back" (only 4 or 5 years, anyway).

similarities:
1. appealed to both proles and the bohemians
2. kids emulated the way they dressed and wore their hair
3. started moneylosing record labels to boost their street cred (or possibly as tax shelters)
4. seen as flakes for promoting Eastern philosophies
5. began by imitating african-american artists - developed their own voice within an african-american idiom - their innovations boomeranged back to the african-american artists they emulated
6. pulled "back to their roots" schticks (beasties doing hardcore, beatles with the semi-abandoned "get back" scheme)
7. public enemy was better than both

― Fritz, Tuesday, 6 August 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Seemingly a stretch, Fritz, but an interesting question all the same. I agree with you on the point about the ambitious song-fragment collage, but I think when you examine the context of their respective recordings, they're quite different. ABBEY ROAD served as the Beatles' last gasp, if you will, spewing forth as much music as could be contained in a relatively sprawling catch-all of an album that captured their progressively fragmenting collision course with each other. PAUL'S BOUTIQUE, however, served as bold house-cleaning for the Beastie Boys, flying directly in the face of expectation by *NOT* being LICENSE TO ILL - THE SEQUEL, but a surprisingly varied and legitimately ahead-of-its-time document (as cliched a statement as that has become). That said accomplishment is largely the work of the Dust Brothers is another matter (there's a sub-thread for you: "TS: the Dust Brothers vs. George Martin). In any case, PAUL'S BOUTIQUE was a declaration of new intent, whereas ABBEY ROAD was an elaborate farewell.

― Alex in NYC, Tuesday, 6 August 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

The original Rolling Stone review of Paul's Boutique in 1989 called it the Sergant Pepper's of hip-hop, which I thought was an incredible thing to say.

― Mark, Tuesday, 6 August 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Alex, I agree that the contexts were different, but the intent was the same. Both albums were "housecleaning", as you put it. And remember that the Beasties were embroiled in lawsuits with Def Jam - it took forever for Paul's Boutique to come out, and for a long time before and after its release it seemed as if Paul's Boutique was destined to be the Beasties' last record. There seems to be a a lot of filler on both these records - sketches of songs, pisstakes & jokes - that is actually more interesting to listen to than more carefully constructed stuff on other albums. At the risk of sounding like a dirty hippy, there is a similar energy to the two records. Ack!

― Fritz, Tuesday, 6 August 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

At the risk of sounding like a dirty hippy, there is a similar energy to the two records.

At the risk of sounding like another hippie, I would say the energy on Paul's Boutique is actually more positive than Abbey Road. One problem with Abbey Road (and perhaps for most Beatle records) is that it's hard to divorce the music from the circumstances of their breaking up. I hear a lot of those songs, and also remember that John hated the side 2 medley, and George was aching to get the hell out of Dodge to do his own thing, and Paul seemed to be constantly out of step with everyone (even George Martin!) -- it's an album that presents a smiling face for 4 very unhappy guys. PB, on the other hand, is all about discovery and newfound creativity (even if it wasn't the Beasties', in the case of production). The only thing about PB that has always struck me oddly is the stuff about stealing cars and shooting people in the face. The Beasties never seemed like gangstas to me -- at worst, rascals.

― dleone, Tuesday, 6 August 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

hippy! (insert smileyface as needed)

― fritz, Tuesday, 6 August 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I think its a bit too much of a strech. The Liscense To Ill fans belong to a different age bracket, old skool rap fans or people bored with MMpop. Check Your Head reminds me of the legions of little skaters in high school, and they've been envolving into a cartoon ever since then, climaxing with their appearance on Futurama. I got Pauls Boutique as a present years ago, after a few listens found it too scattered at the time. It didnt belong in the period it came out from but its looking like the sure winner to be one of those classic albums that gets all the attention from the kids in the future as their "signature" album. Outside of side one on License to Ill its all I can listen to repeatedly by them now days.

― Mr Noodles, Tuesday, 6 August 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Monsier Noodles sed: "[PAUL'S BOUTIQUE] didnt belong in the period it came out from but its looking like the sure winner to be one of those classic albums that gets all the attention from the kids in the future as their 'signature' album. "

While I'd agree, it's bizarre to call it their 'signature' album, as they haven't made a record that sounds like it since.

― Alex in NYC, Tuesday, 6 August 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Initially I was tempted to think that your corralative comparison between Road and Boutique was claptrap but having thought about it and read the other threads - there is arguably some (perhaps intangible) parallel between the two works.

I think it lies in the production and the musical texture. Though as has been pointed out, there may (or may not) have been similarities in context or intent, I am more tempted to conclude that the similarities in the attention to minute musical detail and are the play of coincidence. Although the Beasties do tip their hat to the Fab Four's most widely acknowledged 'experimental' work on Sounds Of Science...

Perhaps the way the two bands wrote the material has some part to play in the similarity (though I thought the Besties put their music together in jam style?), yet I think it is well, I've always felt like it was... raw, even ragged production, which nails it for me. The sound on both records is not polished or rounded-off - as Fritz suggests; the albums possess a sketch-like quality. This is as much down to the production as the actual compositions themselves.

Finally, I have no qualms at all about sounding like a hippie, and would say that though Road is a fantastic album, with gorgeous songs, it is not a positive album (Here Comes The Sun... y'know George was waiting for it to arrive man; sometimes I think melancholy is the overriding trip on that album) whereas Boutique seems much more effervescent (the first track kinda sets the tone).

― Roger Fascist, Tuesday, 6 August 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Sorry:

"I am more tempted to conclude that the similarities in the attention to minute musical detail and rich textural layers are the play of coincidence.

― Roger Fascist, Tuesday, 6 August 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

can I swop "raw, even ragged production" for "more back-seat"?

― Roger Fascist, Tuesday, 6 August 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

thanks roger. i was reading and like 'how come nobody is saying that pauls boutique samples abbey road'??

― Ron, Friday, 9 August 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Paul's Boutique = most overated record EVER.

― Chewshabadoo, Friday, 9 August 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

four years pass...

you know what? PAUL'S BOUTIQUE doesn't have a thread to itself.

― pisces, Friday, 20 July 2007 15:39 (seventeen years ago) link

make another record 'cause the people they want more of this

― sexyDancer, Friday, 20 July 2007 15:49 (seventeen years ago) link

suckas they be sayin they can take out adam horovitz

― kingkongvsgodzilla, Friday, 20 July 2007 16:48 (seventeen years ago) link

hurricane

― sexyDancer, Friday, 20 July 2007 16:51 (seventeen years ago) link

got clout

― jon abbey, Sunday, 22 July 2007 10:58 (seventeen years ago) link

Paul's Boutique = most overated record EVER.
-- Chewshabadoo, Friday, August 9, 2002 12:00 AM

westminster_chime_RONG.mp3

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Sunday, 22 July 2007 11:07 (seventeen years ago) link

Didn't "Paul's Boutique" actually sample a sequence from "Abbey Road"?

― Geir Hongro, Sunday, 22 July 2007 20:02 (seventeen years ago) link

big hoos aka the steendriver, dont use RONG (c) to refer to statements which are not RONG (c)

― and what, Sunday, 22 July 2007 20:05 (seventeen years ago) link

"The Sounds of Science" uses part of "The End" according to the-breaks.com, but that doesn't sound quite right to me, I thought they used a different song.

― Oilyrags, Sunday, 22 July 2007 20:08 (seventeen years ago) link

"The Sounds of Science" definitely samples "The End" for that guitar riff. It also samples the sounds of a crowd murmuring and an orchestra tuning up from "Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band", in the break.

― dryga, Sunday, 22 July 2007 21:04 (seventeen years ago) link

Didn't "Paul's Boutique" actually sample a sequence from "Abbey Road"?

Does it ever, even once, occur to you to read a thread before posting?

― energy flash gordon, Monday, 23 July 2007 10:35 (seventeen years ago) link

two years pass...

I've been trying to like Paul's Boutique pretty much since it came out.

Bought the 33 1/3'd book on it the other day...interesting read, but still couldn't really get into it.

Then, yesterday, played it in the car for the first time (don't usually listen to music while driving as I only go short distances). Totally revelatory experience. It's kind of scary how much situation can matter for some albums...

― dlp9001, Wednesday, 28 October 2009 18:22 (fifteen years ago) link

Definitely a driving album. I think Chris Rock called it "the first CD you buy when you're in a rental car."

― ok star grumbles (lukas), Wednesday, 28 October 2009 19:18 (fifteen years ago) link

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