Kiko and the Lavender POLL: Los Lobos, KIKO

Wonderful record. "Saint Behind The Glass" always makes me feel better, so today I'll vote for it. Another day I might have gone for "Kiko" or "Peace" or Dream in BLue " or nearly any of the others.

Reva's House 4EVA

I went with "Two Janes." A little story of sad desperation, made mythic by a deceptively simple chorus and a perfect arrangement.

Kiko easy victory, with "Angels with Dirty Faces" right behind

^yes to Kiko.

"Saint Behind the Glass"

i do some solid, serious thinkin about why Los Lobos had mad indie cred with the Spin generation and no indie cred with the Pitchfork Generation

their new one is solid imo

I think the answer to yr question is the Spin gen had connections to guitar-worship/tolerance for guitarslinger types whereas for latter-indie types there's this distrust of chops - & Los Lobos are a chops-heavy band, loved by players - their guitar solos aren't textural pro-forma occurrences, they're proper solos - anathema in indie unless its Malkmus, which is weird because post-Pavement his whole schtick is up on some "wait til I get to the solo and we can all just groove on that" stuff

john you realise malkmus doesn't have much more indie cred w/ pfork gen than los lobos right?

yeah, i think Gen Pfrk's general distrust of people who could actually play their instruments is probably the worst thing about it. And is totally getting its apotheosis with the nu-worship of completely talent-devoid witchhouse bands who pretty much run drum machine presets through some pedals and splash it on MySpace

in short, Los Lobos is awesome

is this album similar to the latin playboys records? i love the two LP records i have

thinking about Los Lobos today & ~the indie question~ & one thing that's maybe peripheral but maybe not is that they're really weirdly situated in the pop landscape. They burst big with "La Bamba", but I remember buying How Will The Wolf Survive? after it got ranked pretty high in Rolling Stone's End of the 80s top 100 albums feature, in 1989 I figure. I don't remember what the blurb in that feature said, but I'm guessing it stressed both their songwriting chops ("Will The Wolf Survive" gives me chills, still) & their ~world~ vibe (since they included sorta Norteño sounding music on their albums at that point). So I think they got lumped in with that global world music thing at the end of the 80s that we've talked about on ILM before. But they connected with other scenes too: I saw them headline a food festival in the ATL in maybe 1992 or 1993, & they were totally getting the proto-jam crowd at that point, like it was a Dead-type situation w/ hippie chicks & I think they covered "Bertha" & it was good-time vibes all around. I guess Kiko had already been released but that was a ~way~ different sound, & I remember them picking up some indie cred at that point (hence polling this on ILM rather than By the Light of the Moon?). At least in south Texas where I was living then, they were a college rock band by that point, the kind of thing frats would put on at parties (esp. that 2-disk comp). After Kiko sank in, I think they rode the adult alternative vibe for a while, though they rereleased their debut on CD later in the 90s & that kept them in the world music, er, world too. So I guess my point is that Los Lobos have had a pretty weirdly diverse career---think that's kinda interesting to think about!

Good discussion so far -- I grew up reading about them, like whiney said. I need to get a proper album. I bought the LP's Colossal Head on xgau's recommendation -- unmoved.

Also: just a theory, but that Mitchell Froom-Tchad Blake avant-pop sound is beloved by Geir Hongro but not by the Pitchfork generation, and it's badly dated.

aren't there thousands of bands that had mad indie cred with gen-spin and no indie cred with gen-pfork?

but as for los lobos in particular, it might be relevant that gen-spin knew them as a slash records band and also knew them as a band that existed before "la bamba." i'm guessing gen-pfork sees them as a jammy bar band at best and as lou diamond phillips associates at worst.

it's been a long time since i've seen them but they were a consistently great live band and a hit-or-miss album band, though their track record thru kiko was pretty damn good. i think the first latin playboys album is terrific too.

there's no separate discography page for los lobos at wikipedia. does no one care about them at all anymore?

They have one of the best box sets ever; El Cancionero: Mas y Mas really lets you see the full range of their work, and by putting Los Super Seven and Latin Playboys stuff on there as well it gives a taste for the side projects, too. Bonus points for having "I Wanna Be Like You (The Monkey Song)" as a separate track so you don't have to listen to Natalie Merchant right before it. Those medleys on Stay Awake suck so bad.

The title track is astounding. Frankly, the first time I heard it I couldn't believe it was Los Lobos, caused me to reappraise them entirely.

aren't there thousands of bands that had mad indie cred with gen-spin and no indie cred with gen-pfork?

It's super funny that Pfork reps for total mersh bullshit like Smashing Pumpkins and Pearl Jam, but would never ever ever admit that Red Hot Chili Peppers has some pretty fucking phenomenal work

red hot chili peppers didn't have indie cred w/ gen-spin though either

i mean, i was on the young and impressionable side, but dudes were all over spin mag, college radio and 120 minutes comps circa 1983-1990

john mellencamp was all over spin mag too, didn't make him lou barlow

is this gonna be like when soto's all 'nobody had even heard of neutral milk hotel in 1998' cuz his college radio station only played like harvey danger and tonic?

John Cougar never had a Trouser Press entry, come on son

The Peppers were declared by a Spin writer to be the greatest rock band in the world. That was in May of '85. In the very first issue of Spin. They had cred.

the one w/ indie rock superstar madonna on the cover?

and a STRYPER feature?

80s spin very different beast than 90s spin. john leland /= jim greer (to leland's credit).

Re the Spin-gen-vs-Pfork-gen question: isn't it just a simple case of a new generation killing the previous gen's sacred cows, and breeding their own? Oldest story in the book.

hence polling this on ILM rather than By the Light of the Moon?

This seems to assume that there's a global ILM-filter that decides what will be polled and what won't. Not the case. I wanted to gin up a Los Lobos discussion, and this was and is my favorite Los Lobos album. If I am a bandwagon of one in these views, so be it.

Los Lobos are a chops-heavy band, loved by players
Really? Maybe I've been reading the Dream Theater threads too much, but I've never heard anyone go overboard praising Los Lobos' chops. (By chops, do you mean "technical proficiency"? That's how I define it.) The praise I heard was mostly for their songwriting, and for their mix of traditionalism and adventure.

Those medleys on Stay Awake suck so bad.
I always thought they were a harmless inconvenience. Then again, I mostly listened to this on cassette, so the medleys-vs-individual-tracks debate has no traction in my brain.

RHCP had cred with generation-Thrasher.

Anyway, went with When the Circus Comes because I'm a stinking Phish-head.

Marvellous album from go to whoa, but 'Wake up Dolores', for me

It's "Wake Up Dolores" for me too - may be my favourite Lobos track ever, in fact, and I likes me some Lobos (even the oft-maligned Colossal Head).

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

yes this is similar to the latin playboys records, to answer a question up above. it's kind of the only los lobos album that is, that I've heard. also one of my favorites. hard to pick one track from this.

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

This 20th Anniversary remaster is gorgeous! I might have to go back to the store and get the live blu-ray/cd combo.

heard something today -- i don't remember what -- and was all like, 'when the circus comes' does this so much better

pretty sure i voted 'saint behind the glass' but what a great record

Excellent record.

Excellent record.