so... is this ever going to be released? cannot even call it the rap chinese democracy anymore. guns and roses next record is the hair metal detox.
why is it still taking so long? my own theory is because dre is so worried about looking ahead of the game that he gets butterflies every new record he hears. it doesnt help that he has seemingly only started working with people after they got big, and not been able to find an eminem before they break. dude needs a third party to tell him to step away, go through the 1000s of tracks hes most probably made, find the 20 dopest and stick them on a record.
― wheezy f baby (a hoy hoy), Tuesday, 30 November 2010 16:51 (fifteen years ago)
honestly at this point does anyone really care? not to derail the thread or anything, but what could Dre really offer now - judging by the random leaks and unofficial singles like "Under Pressure" and "Kush," this album won't be a game changer, his sound hasn't really progressed all that much from what he was doing in the mid 00s with Storch & Co. - sterile pianos, crisp mechanic drims, etc. It'll be interesting to hear if it does come out just because, but still...
― no hipster hats (The Brainwasher), Tuesday, 30 November 2010 16:57 (fifteen years ago)
i dont think it counts as a derail if its the first post
― wheezy f baby (a hoy hoy), Tuesday, 30 November 2010 16:58 (fifteen years ago)
i stopped caring about dre a long time ago but in an absurd way that makes me even more intrigued to how this will eventually sound, if it ever exists.
― wheezy f baby (a hoy hoy), Tuesday, 30 November 2010 16:59 (fifteen years ago)
Not quite to this extent, but I remember being "who the hell cares, dude is kinda past his prime" in the lead-up to Chronic 2001, so I'm remaining hopeful that I can be more than pleasantly surprised again.
― "I am a fairly respected poster." (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Tuesday, 30 November 2010 17:05 (fifteen years ago)
New single: "Care About Dre."
― Two and a Half Muffins (Eazy), Tuesday, 30 November 2010 17:06 (fifteen years ago)
don't really understand why the album needs to be a "game-changer' or a significant "progression" from the last album to be a worthwhile listen.
― hope this helps (Granny Dainger), Tuesday, 30 November 2010 18:17 (fifteen years ago)
it doesn't, but those were the times Dre was talking about Detox in from the beginning
― Prince SBanBan (some dude), Tuesday, 30 November 2010 18:27 (fifteen years ago)
times=terms
i think it's kind of hilariously how creatively bankrupt Dre has been over the years, kind of riding the same basic sound out for all those 50/Eminem blockbusters for years and years, then he turned up with those wack beats on Kingdom Come and now 4 years later I keep seeing the TV commercial where he's in a futuristic laboratory cooking up this amazing "next level" shit and it sounds like a Kingdom Come outtake.
― Prince SBanBan (some dude), Tuesday, 30 November 2010 18:31 (fifteen years ago)
http://youraudiofix.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/eminem-dr.-dre-vibe-magazine.jpg
this cover (from like 3 months ago!) is a perfect visual metaphor for how few ideas either of these guys have had since the "In Da Club video
― Prince SBanBan (some dude), Tuesday, 30 November 2010 18:32 (fifteen years ago)
"kush" is just terrible
― kl0pper city in the ghetto (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 30 November 2010 19:19 (fifteen years ago)
"Kush" especially sad because if Dre made this record anywhere near when he said he would, Nate Dogg would be all over it, but since Nate hasn't sung since he had a stroke a couple years ago instead we get fuckin' Akon.
― Prince SBanBan (some dude), Tuesday, 30 November 2010 19:38 (fifteen years ago)
man nate never recovered from that? :(
is it gonna kinda be like a D.O.C. car crash career ender?
― kl0pper city in the ghetto (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 30 November 2010 19:41 (fifteen years ago)
dre has no ideas left, and apparently no confidence either, so even though the demos with t.i, killer mike etc were pretty strong, ive a feeling his now-detrimental perfectionism will fuck those songs up somehow.
― titchy (titchyschneiderMk2), Wednesday, 1 December 2010 11:29 (fifteen years ago)
like, a solid, low key nothing fancy album from dre i would love, but i doubt thats what he will release/turn in (whether down to his own high must-change-the-game standards or the label, who are prob banking on him to sell a few million for them).
― titchy (titchyschneiderMk2), Wednesday, 1 December 2010 11:30 (fifteen years ago)
nate dogg had a stroke? ;_;
― purblind snowcock splattered (a hoy hoy), Wednesday, 1 December 2010 11:30 (fifteen years ago)
em has proved that any old shit would sell a few million. also dre owns his own label?
― purblind snowcock splattered (a hoy hoy), Wednesday, 1 December 2010 11:31 (fifteen years ago)
dre could prob still sell a few million if he did make it a back to basics style record but thats too much of a risk for him. but then i dont think dres been up to much as a producer for god knows how long.
― titchy (titchyschneiderMk2), Wednesday, 1 December 2010 11:33 (fifteen years ago)
i like "kush" -- dre piano beats will kinda always be the shit to me -- this one still works for me, sorry
the way they have eminem styled in a v stylish plaid shirt/plaid tie combo is killing me for some reason -- seems so ill fitting on him & just overkill
but anyway
― jagger reupholstered my pussy (J0rdan S.), Wednesday, 1 December 2010 11:55 (fifteen years ago)
i'm much more fascinated by the ubiquity of 'beats by dre' headphones than anything to do w/ this actual album tho tbh
― jagger reupholstered my pussy (J0rdan S.), Wednesday, 1 December 2010 11:56 (fifteen years ago)
the alex da kid song that's supposedly on this album is unspeakably depressing to me -- i'm okay with dre putting out TO THE TIME MACHINE!!! songs that are just worse versions of shit off '2001', but i absolutely cannot stomach him putting out a song that's a slightly worse version of "love the way you lie" -- shit is sickening
― jagger reupholstered my pussy (J0rdan S.), Wednesday, 1 December 2010 12:01 (fifteen years ago)
wasn't 2001 basically produced by mel-man and storch? i don't think people are just thinking it is dre alone behind the boards. which is why his collaborators are so important and uninspiring*
*hey wonder what dark twisted thread inspired me to start this one?
― purblind snowcock splattered (a hoy hoy), Wednesday, 1 December 2010 12:11 (fifteen years ago)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BuJDaOVz2qY
― Erykah Badiou (markers), Friday, 10 December 2010 21:35 (fifteen years ago)
I can't even imagine what he could come with that I would find engaging at this point. Of the two beats he had on Only Built 4 Cuban Linx 2 one was terrible and the other was decent
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 10 December 2010 21:44 (fifteen years ago)
still like his beat w/ snoop & d'angelo
― lotta diamonds ... but prolly more display names (deej), Friday, 10 December 2010 21:47 (fifteen years ago)
I can't even imagine what he could come with that I would find engaging at this point.
The thing is that he no longer seems like a musical innovator to me. He strikes me as someone who is just aping the dominant elements of current rap music. His incessant perfectionism seems to be coupled with a constant fear seeming irrelevant. I think for him to make something engaging would require him to actually move away from cutting edge, and to move back to his roots.
― Lazarus Niles-Burnham (res), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:03 (fifteen years ago)
how the hell are they gonna play that on mtv
― in my world of young puppies (Whiney G. Weingarten), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:04 (fifteen years ago)
what does innovation even mean in hip hop anymore
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:09 (fifteen years ago)
the whole idea of innovation seems sort of culturally bankrupt at the moment, no wonder he's having a problem figuring out what to do
Well, if you think about the growth of rock music, what ended up happening is that there was a revival of older styles that were integrated into new music. Like how in the late 90s and early 2000s everyone suddenly circlejerked to the Beach Boys and Beatles, even though if you said to anyone in 1994 that you liked the Beach Boys, people would laugh in your face.
Likewise, there's an entire generation of kids out there who don't know any hiphop that sounds like, say, early Wu-Tang or Chronic-era Dre. I actually think that kind of stuff might be a major revelation in the relentlessly boring current hiphop mainstream. I realize that it might sound silly, but I'd love to see hiphop move back into the soul/jazz/rock sampling arena. "99 Problems" is an example of something that doesn't really sound innovative per se (if you know hiphop history), but it's different from most of the stuff out there that young people are currently listening to, and it works well.
― Lazarus Niles-Burnham (res), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:27 (fifteen years ago)
I realize that it might sound silly, but I'd love to see hiphop move back into the soul/jazz/rock sampling arena
You, me and everyone on earth. Unless copyright laws change drastically, you can keep holding your breath, sadly
― in my world of young puppies (Whiney G. Weingarten), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:30 (fifteen years ago)
It sucks that I have to be subjected to shitty club rap for the rest of my life because of this.
― Lazarus Niles-Burnham (res), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:33 (fifteen years ago)
you're telling me
― in my world of young puppies (Whiney G. Weingarten), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:34 (fifteen years ago)
I'm sympathetic to your position in some ways, but befuddled in others - I mean moving BACK to soul/jazz/rock sampling wouldn't really be innovation as much as it is retreading familiar ground with new technology. And while I definitely prefer the sample-based styles of a previous era, I don't think this would reinvigorate the genre. If anything it would just make it seem even more dead than it already is. I think hip hop's reached the point that rock reached about a decade ago, where it had basically integrated every other genre and style available, it had become an omnivore that swallowed everything, the boundaries of the genre had expanded such that the very definition of it had become kind of meaningless. Hip hop is there now, in it's most popular form it's more or less indistinguishable from anything else - in fact the majority of pop music right now seems to slavishly adhere to a template that was already silly and passe by the mid-90s: a "hip hop" drum loop/rhythm, R&B crooning choruses, some rapping on the verses, and maybe some rock guitar or other "old school" signifier thrown in. Apart from being a predictably horrible mishmash, this approach seems ever-present across stuff that is nominally classified as R&B, as hip hop, as rock, or as country. They're all the same shit now. And this blurring of genre boundaries has sort of signaled the death of genres in general - because genres can be defined in a large part by their rules and what they are NOT, but now everything (at least at the most popular end of things - MTV, chartpop, major label acts, etc.) is just this poorly defined glop.
Dre's probably aware of this - there's no specific method or genre he can borrow from (Kanye samples King Crimson for chrissakes. Axl Rose gets sued for sampling some IDM geek, etc.) Genre cross-pollination is now a dead end. And with ProTools you can basically do ANYTHING, so there's no kind of technology-based method that can be considered innovative, everybody's using the same tools. So where can someone like him go?
ike how in the late 90s and early 2000s everyone suddenly circlejerked to the Beach Boys and Beatles, even though if you said to anyone in 1994 that you liked the Beach Boys, people would laugh in your face.
also I dunno about this, seems kinda revisionist
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:38 (fifteen years ago)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hykZtBaPKps
i was listening to this earlier and thinking the same thing. in l.a. you can listen to power 106, which is crappy club style rap for the most part these days, or i can listen to kday, which plays dope stuff like this regularly. or i can listen to npr and maybe they'll play the odd jurassic 5 track.
― omar little, Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:38 (fifteen years ago)
wow KDAY is still going? that's kind of awesome
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:41 (fifteen years ago)
http://www.935kday.com/
― omar little, Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:43 (fifteen years ago)
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, December 10, 2010 6:09 PM (37 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
it would probably help you argue with this if you listened to new rap at all
― lotta diamonds ... but prolly more display names (deej), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:47 (fifteen years ago)
I love how you keep tabs on what I listen to
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:48 (fifteen years ago)
I mean I wouldn't say I listen to a lot, but I do pay attention y'know.
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:49 (fifteen years ago)
I realize that it might sound silly, but I'd love to see hiphop move back into the soul/jazz/rock sampling arenaYou, me and everyone on earth. Unless copyright laws change drastically, you can keep holding your breath, sadly
― in my world of young puppies (Whiney G. Weingarten), Friday, December 10, 2010 6:30 PM (16 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
ugh dude. you post on ilx. how are you saying stuff like this, for real?im trying to phrase this in a way that isnt me rmde all over the place, but this is the home of OMG THE NEPTUNES & TIMBALANDproducers have been sampling ALL OVER THE PLACE for the past 10 yrs, esp now that no one is releasing major label records who couldnt afford to clear a sample anywayif anything, sample-based rap is some of the most critically overrated -- both in rock crit & hip hop crit circles -- of the past ten years.
i mean christ we have a x000 post thread about kanye west!!
― lotta diamonds ... but prolly more display names (deej), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:50 (fifteen years ago)
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, December 10, 2010 6:48 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
you post about it all the time!
take that as either 'lol shakey posts' or 'deej legitimately pays attention to shakey's opinions' depending on whether u want beef or no
― lotta diamonds ... but prolly more display names (deej), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:51 (fifteen years ago)
I think you're confusing "like" with "listen to". If I go on the Wocka Flocka Flame thread and listen to all the youtube links people post, I believe that qualifies as "listening", even though my reaction is "ugh I don't know how long I can bear this unlistenable garbage"
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:53 (fifteen years ago)
and I think from previous threads I have a decent idea of what you consider innovation in hip-hop these days (primarily the evolution of personas and how they are developed/refined/consistently presented) but... musically? I have no idea what you would consider on the cutting edge for rap. Again I wasn't making an argument so much as asking a question - when a genre has no boundaries, how can anything within it be considered to push boundaries?
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:55 (fifteen years ago)
like is Li'l B's ambient record really "innovative", for example, because it grafts ambient techno onto stream-of-consciousness rap? (fwiw I doubt that was the first time that was done anyway, there's gotta be some 90s precedents for that, probably some shit that Tuomas is in love with lol)
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:56 (fifteen years ago)
does anybody hear a rap record these days and think "oh my god, I CANNOT believe how this beat is put together"? really? Maybe I am just jaded.
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:57 (fifteen years ago)
basically heres my take on this, im actually working on a 'piece' (for myself no luck getting this on p******* soon lol) discussing 'progress' & 'innovation' in rap & what it means for rap fans as a mass vs. music critics & how theyve treated it, ive talked about this before but basically i reject the linear evolution that ppl talk about, the futurism that was incorporated through dance crit, and i see popism as a sorta related thing that interacts w/ rap but doesnt wholly cover it.
but basically, 'innovation' in rap is about rappers, and how they rap, style & personality & creativity & having something to say (whether that 'thing' is inane or not), and that this is a hugely undervalued aspect in rap. that this is basically the undersung part of rap history & that essentially kelefa sanneh's pretty much the only rap crit to cover it in a meaningful way
― lotta diamonds ... but prolly more display names (deej), Saturday, 11 December 2010 00:58 (fifteen years ago)
like, imo, the biggest non-pac influential rappers in this decade were like, jay-z, 50, t.i., duh, but also smaller-sphere dudes like cormega, soulja slim & mac dre, dudes whose rap style had really big impacts on *how rappers rap*. This many years on, & dudes like roach gigz are getting attention doing spin-off, personalized versions of mac dre's narrative style (seriously listen to "not my job" then any gigz track0
― lotta diamonds ... but prolly more display names (deej), Saturday, 11 December 2010 01:00 (fifteen years ago)
mean moving BACK to soul/jazz/rock sampling wouldn't really be innovation as much as it is retreading familiar ground with new technology.
I guess I don't really care that much about innovation, so much as a I care about hearing things that I like. Most "innovation" seems to me like people desperate to make some kind of statement about their originality rather than people interested in making good music (e.g. Animal Collective is the first group that springs to mind). In that sense, innovation isn't necessarily a mark in anything's favor, at least in my book.
I think hip hop's reached the point that rock reached about a decade ago, where it had basically integrated every other genre and style available,
Yeah, maybe. But like in rock, it doesn't mean that everything has to suck from that point on. Like I said, "99 Problems" is an example of a song that doesn't tread any new ground, but no one, as far as I've seen, refers to it as a tired throwback to the past. How do you feel about that song?
Really? I remember Beatles and Beach Boys tapes being in cut-out bins all across America. Only old fogeys liked that shit. It just seemed deeply uncool to the musical mainstream for a long time until at some point there was a critical re-evaluation (oh, and when there became perverse sense of status in liking uncool things).
― Lazarus Niles-Burnham (res), Saturday, 11 December 2010 01:00 (fifteen years ago)
but basically, 'innovation' in rap is about rappers, and how they rap, style & personality & creativity & having something to say
this would seem to exclude Dre entirely
not that you're wrong, but we were specifically talking about production here
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Saturday, 11 December 2010 01:01 (fifteen years ago)
or like, listen to jacka & you hear cormega, or any rapper trying to do that kind of poetic understatement thing.
― lotta diamonds ... but prolly more display names (deej), Saturday, 11 December 2010 01:01 (fifteen years ago)
99 Problems is a great song. It is also straight out of 1987, and is basically the same tired shit Rick Rubin always does when he makes a rap track.
xp
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Saturday, 11 December 2010 01:02 (fifteen years ago)
What I'm not understanding is how it can be "great" and "tired" at the same time. I feel like "tired" means something that I really don't want to hear because I've already heard it, and done a lot better before. I may have heard something similar to "99 Problems" in 1987, but I still want to hear it now because it's better than a lot of what I heard in 1987.
― Lazarus Niles-Burnham (res), Saturday, 11 December 2010 01:06 (fifteen years ago)
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, December 10, 2010 7:01 PM (15 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
ha fair enough, was defending rap in general
here's another theory i have about rap production (which i basically argued when writing about gucci's last major label record) -- production in rap was, until Dre, largely about 'beats' not 'songs,' and he (along with a lot of other guys in the late 90s / early 00s) crossed over to becoming pop producers, rather than beatmakers. (this also bites a lil bit of theory from an old tim f blog post on timbo, arguing that his approach is more 'pop' than 'hip hop,' so hes constantly reinventing rather than churning out beats like 'so many rinds of pork'). so fabolous could clock in with the neptunes, record his verses, clock out, grab a paycheck, and it was a hit. Neptunes made that song, from the hook to the beat to the concept to even telling Fab how to rap on it (supposedly they told him to model his rhyme patters on "holla back" off of vanilla ice (!))
then the bottom falls out of the industry, and only the flo rida's and rick ross's can afford big-name beatmakers (a steadily shrinking pile of artists) -- sha money xl's g-unit beatmaker farm team dries up w/ the end of pop rap as a viable thing. so rappers cant be just clock-in clock-out dudes any more if they want hits -- they have to be all-around artists -- so you have the rise of guys like soulja boy, drake, and gucci mane, rappers who arent just rapping, but do hooks, concepts, have to figure out not just how to rap in cipher videos but to create entire pop songs that will catapult them into fame (the problem w/ gucci's last record is that he didnt realize that these were skills that made him who he is as much as his rapping was -- makes sense cuz hes like 30 right? he remembers the superproducer era -- so he buys a bunch of wack superproducer beats & the songs, no shit, suck)
but the best 'beatmakers' in this era are much more mercenary, mercantile, churning out endless iterations of a similar style w/ slight variation (zaytoven) or making shambolic low-budget versions of open pop production (dame grease) or ... i dunno the deal w/ drake's shit, biting the-dream i guess? lol
so anyway, production has 'retreated' (although thats arguable whether that is really a negative thing imo) into creating 'beats' rather than 'songs' and now rappers have gone from being 'rappers' to 'artists' again -- does this make sense?
― lotta diamonds ... but prolly more display names (deej), Saturday, 11 December 2010 01:09 (fifteen years ago)
one of the reasons i love bay area stuff right now (& tim f talked about this in his thread) is that it's actively trying to sound ambitious, huge, pop, and hi-budget (because equipment is so cheap now!) & yet remains almost entirely underground
― lotta diamonds ... but prolly more display names (deej), Saturday, 11 December 2010 01:11 (fifteen years ago)
its like the total opposite of current rap trendzzz
So is the difference between a 'song' and a 'beat' the level of focus you, as a listener, are supposed to place on the rapping? trying to understand what you're getting at.
― Lazarus Niles-Burnham (res), Saturday, 11 December 2010 01:13 (fifteen years ago)
a total bite from Tim to explain ---> 'dirt off my shoulder' is a 'beat' because its a codification of all these timbo attributes into one 'oh that sounds like timbo' production. a 'song' would be like "ryde or die bitch," where if you recognize that it's timbaland, its only because hes the kind of guy who would totally upend his formula from one track to the next ... also something to do w/ where the pop appeal is coming from ...
in gucci's case, for ex, what makes 'wasted' sound like a 'pop song' to me isnt the beat, but what gucci does with the beat
― lotta diamonds ... but prolly more display names (deej), Saturday, 11 December 2010 01:16 (fifteen years ago)
deej is otm here
i mean..
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Saturday, December 11, 2010 12:57 AM (32 minutes ago) Bookmark
i dont even get this? you were talking abt sampling jazz + shit before... do you think ppl were listening to that + wondering how those beats were put together????
― just sayin, Saturday, 11 December 2010 01:40 (fifteen years ago)
ps im drunk
― just sayin, Saturday, 11 December 2010 01:41 (fifteen years ago)
back in the late 80s/early 90s I was regularly amazed at how guys like DJ Pooh or Prince Paul or Dre put a song together, just "holy shit how did they get all these samples in there" kinda thing. sequencing and drum programming and looping samples seemed like some kind of arcane art form.
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Saturday, 11 December 2010 02:48 (fifteen years ago)
Deej is correct here I think, though I feel rather more ambivalent about that timbaland theory now - perhaps because the times have moved away from that model.
― Tim F, Sunday, 12 December 2010 21:21 (fifteen years ago)
there's gotta be some 90s precedents for that, probably some shit that Tuomas is in love with lol
I love how you keep tabs on what Tuomas listens to
― i'm assuming that it's tity boi, host of the mixtape (sic), Sunday, 12 December 2010 22:49 (fifteen years ago)
ugh dude. you post on ilx. how are you saying stuff like this, for real?im trying to phrase this in a way that isnt me rmde all over the place, but this is the home of OMG THE NEPTUNES & TIMBALANDproducers have been sampling ALL OVER THE PLACE for the past 10 yrs, esp now that no one is releasing major label records who couldnt afford to clear a sample anywayif anything, sample-based rap is some of the most critically overrated -- both in rock crit & hip hop crit circles -- of the past ten years.i mean christ we have a x000 post thread about kanye west!!― lotta diamonds ... but prolly more display names (deej), Friday, December 10, 2010 7:50 PM (2 days ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
― lotta diamonds ... but prolly more display names (deej), Friday, December 10, 2010 7:50 PM (2 days ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
Kanye uses like ONE sample on a song, producers in the "golden era" used like seven. Its a world of difference, and that's what i'm talking about. I know that samples still exist, doy
― da puppier (Whiney G. Weingarten), Sunday, 12 December 2010 22:58 (fifteen years ago)
i think seven is pretty much an exaggeration unless youre a huge paul's boutique fan, & i dont think its really hurt the music at all. & the idea that its the one thing keeping rap from pushing boundaries just feels totally wrong to me. im not sure most listeners even knew / cared when rap producers were using 48908 samples vs. 1 track jacks. lots of premo's best stuff was just chopping up one sample a bunch of times. and its not like theres anything keeping dudes from making all-sampled underground albums, esp now since most rappers are giving music away for free
― lotta diamonds ... but prolly more display names (deej), Sunday, 12 December 2010 23:05 (fifteen years ago)
getting rid of samples & introducing synths allowed rap to keep pace with / outpace dance music in terms of production techniques anyway
― lotta diamonds ... but prolly more display names (deej), Sunday, 12 December 2010 23:06 (fifteen years ago)
the idea that its the one thing keeping rap from pushing boundaries just feels totally wrong to me.
I never said that!
and its not like theres anything keeping dudes from making all-sampled underground albums, esp now since most rappers are giving music away for free
yeah, i've kind of wondered why this isnt happening. I mean, I've def pondered making my own Bomb Squad 2010 jacks in my spare time...
― da puppier (Whiney G. Weingarten), Sunday, 12 December 2010 23:08 (fifteen years ago)
I think most good rap of the past 20 years gains a lot of its intensity by virtue of not being overstuffed with detail sonically - even the really intricate "futuristic" beats of say 10 years ago (Cash Money productions for example) plugged their intricacy into the groove itself so that rather than wowing you with all these different sounds out of nowhere the productions really support and propel the momentum of the rapping.
In general (with some obvious exceptions) sample-heavy stuff seems better suited to light-hearted or even comic rapping (which is why one of the best latter-day examples of this approach is Under Construction).
In that regard the sonic shift away from dense sampling to me seems like an effect of the shift in rapping styles, for the most part.
― Tim F, Sunday, 12 December 2010 23:57 (fifteen years ago)
yeah & speaking of Dre, that was an innovation hes credited with a lot of the time -- & you can see how the mood & sampling style reflected each other -- the beauty of reducing a rap beat to a simple addictive idea combined w/ repetition
― lotta diamonds ... but prolly more display names (deej), Monday, 13 December 2010 00:35 (fifteen years ago)
This is interesting stuff. Will read after Oilers game. Keep going plz.
― rihanna refurbished my dick (rennavate), Monday, 13 December 2010 00:54 (fifteen years ago)
it keeps me busy
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Monday, 13 December 2010 16:53 (fifteen years ago)
― in my world of young puppies (Whiney G. Weingarten), Saturday, December 11, 2010 12:30 AM (2 days ago) Bookmark
As the new breed don't seem to even be thinking about selling their music, I don't see it being a long time until they start going sample crazy. What are the lawyers gonna say, "how dare you don't make any money off other peoples music?"
lol xp
― irish xmas caek, get that marzipan inta ya (a hoy hoy), Monday, 13 December 2010 17:08 (fifteen years ago)
I want to hear that low, low part before Snoop's verse through some fancy sound system.
― would like a calmer set (Eazy), Monday, 13 December 2010 17:13 (fifteen years ago)
I don't see it being a long time until they start going sample crazy. What are the lawyers gonna say, "how dare you don't make any money off other peoples music?"
this is like wondering when big swing bands are going to come back into style. I just don't think it's gonna happen. Techniques/technology is different now, why go backwards.
― fuckin magnates, why don't they work (Shakey Mo Collier), Monday, 13 December 2010 17:15 (fifteen years ago)
Sadlt the Digital Millennium Copyright act doesn't protect sampling even if its for no profit. But then again there's not a lot of motivation to sue those ppl
― TamTam Club (Whiney G. Weingarten), Monday, 13 December 2010 17:19 (fifteen years ago)
"backwards". Most hyped record of the year has its first single based around King Crimson. Samples didn't just die.
Also reading the 33 1/3 pauls boutique and nation of millions make it sound extremely intricate and hard and long work. if you can put together 20 samples in a couple hours to sound awesome because of the technology, is that going backwards?
Also big sample heavy records are p fucking rare over a 30 year period, there is what: PE, Prince Paul, Pauls Boutique, the DJ Shadow, Avalanches, a few other things...
― irish xmas caek, get that marzipan inta ya (a hoy hoy), Monday, 13 December 2010 17:20 (fifteen years ago)
I don't think that's true at all - there are tons and the vast majority of them are all from the same '88-'93 (or so) period and produced by a fairly small subset of producers/DJs, after which the technique became prohibitively expensive/impossible due to the legalities involved. Some other examples: Ice Cube's first three and a half records (Bomb Squad, DJ Pooh, Sir Jinx), Kool G Rap's "Live and Let Die" (Sir Jinx again), the first wave of NWA stuff (Straight Outta Compton, Eazy Duz It, No One Can Do It Better, We're All in the Same Gang single, etc.), WC and the Maad Circle "Ain't a Damn Thing Changed" (Sir Jinx again), the first Del the Funkee Homosapien album (I Wish My Brother George Was Here, produced by Cube), the first Lench Mob album (Cube and Jinx again), the Afros "Kickin Afrolistics" (Jam Master Jay), Pete Rock and CL Smooth "Mecca and the Soul Brother", maybe the first Cypress Hill record... there's probably more
― from the lowly milligeir to the mighty gigahongro (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 17:04 (fifteen years ago)
so this is going to be depressingly awful. absolutely fucking awful. not 1 thing worth saving from kush or i need a doctor so far.
― if there is a King Moaty, apparently he is huge into slapstick. (a hoy hoy), Friday, 18 February 2011 21:23 (fourteen years ago)
http://60646blog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/stop-work-order-7-11-08b.jpg
― teenage cream (J0rdan S.), Friday, 18 February 2011 21:25 (fourteen years ago)
there's something adorable about the Saigon album finally dropping this week and Detox I guess coming pretty soon, like the 'most anticipated rap albums of 2005' are here!!
― some dude, Friday, 18 February 2011 21:56 (fourteen years ago)
i 100% think that most of Dre delaying the album was him being gunshy about dropping it when record sales keep being at all-time lows, and that Recovery being huge was the thing that finally made the water warm enough for the old man to get in the tub.
― some dude, Friday, 18 February 2011 21:57 (fourteen years ago)
Interesting theory
This ain't doing recovery numbers tho
― teenage cream (J0rdan S.), Friday, 18 February 2011 22:24 (fourteen years ago)
nah but i'm sure he at least Detox to do numbers comparable to it in the way 2001 did numbers comparable to MMLP
― some dude, Friday, 18 February 2011 22:48 (fourteen years ago)
at least WANTS
Er, my wife really liked the chick that sang the "I Need a Doctor" hook at the Grammys. That's about all I can say.
― rendezvous then i'm through with HOOS (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Friday, 18 February 2011 22:49 (fourteen years ago)
Lol had no idea she was the same girl fka "Holly Brook" that sang on that Mike Shinoda side project song.
― rendezvous then i'm through with HOOS (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Friday, 18 February 2011 22:50 (fourteen years ago)
ohhh wow that's who Skylar Gray really is? lol
― some dude, Friday, 18 February 2011 22:52 (fourteen years ago)
Yeah, was just looking at her wiki page to find out.
― rendezvous then i'm through with HOOS (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Friday, 18 February 2011 22:54 (fourteen years ago)
I f/w "Kush"
― banjee trillness (The Reverend), Saturday, 19 February 2011 07:26 (fourteen years ago)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyG8Qg9snVY
surprisingly fun.
― Nult AGL (a hoy hoy), Tuesday, 22 March 2011 19:28 (fourteen years ago)
unsurprisingly empty and boring :(
― lol kudso (sic), Tuesday, 22 March 2011 23:54 (fourteen years ago)
― Prince SBanBan (some dude), Tuesday, November 30, 2010 2:38 PM (3 months ago) Bookmark
:(
― some dude, Wednesday, 23 March 2011 01:03 (fourteen years ago)
Got some Michael Mann existentialism going on in the video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VA770wpLX-Q
― Magnum PI and Fashion-Forward Dudes (Eazy), Thursday, 24 March 2011 14:17 (fourteen years ago)
Oh, just checked, it's Allen Hughes directing.
― Magnum PI and Fashion-Forward Dudes (Eazy), Thursday, 24 March 2011 14:20 (fourteen years ago)
Oh. And then the song starts.
― Magnum PI and Fashion-Forward Dudes (Eazy), Thursday, 24 March 2011 14:33 (fourteen years ago)
6 minutes 7 seconds until Dre starts rapping
― some dude, Thursday, 24 March 2011 14:41 (fourteen years ago)
Dre's verse should have been along the lines of "Eminem, dude, I'm fine. In fact I've produced plenty of tracks for you and other Aftermath talent since 2001. You got some issues, Marshall, I think you need counseling, to help you from screaming every lyric when you get down some. And this shit about us meant to be together?"
― da croupier, Thursday, 24 March 2011 15:20 (fourteen years ago)
haha
I love the idea of pitching verses to Dre like they're acts in a film treatment.
Wonder if this was recorded before "Love The Way You Lie" or after.
I'm still all for "Kush", though.
― Magnum PI and Fashion-Forward Dudes (Eazy), Thursday, 24 March 2011 16:27 (fourteen years ago)
obv way after. "wait, we're actually releasing this now? ok, we need an actual single, get Em in the studio with those people that wrote his last giant pop hit and see what they come up with"
― some dude, Thursday, 24 March 2011 16:35 (fourteen years ago)
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-S5dSbhu1R54/TWiocdVZtHI/AAAAAAAAT9s/5vzOfkWFDJs/s320/Dr.+Dre+-+I+Need+A+Doctor++Eminem%252C+Skylar+Grey.JPG
I NEED A DOCTOR!
http://media.thedailyswarm.com/images/headlines/dr-pepper-nabs-dr-dre-detox-debut_top.jpg
And I need a Doctor...PEPPER!
― da croupier, Thursday, 24 March 2011 17:20 (fourteen years ago)
as proven by my lazy man's gif i find this track rather amusing
― da croupier, Thursday, 24 March 2011 17:22 (fourteen years ago)