Faust vs Neu!

I found a poll like this on Amon Duul II vs Can yesterday that became a general discussion on Krautrock. Could do with finding out more, though i think I have most of the core stuff.

Faust & Neu seem to be doing somewhat different things though. I guess they both used minimalism heavily. One aspect of Faust I really like is the contrast between near monotony and invenion at the same time. The guitar dancing over the b+w chug on NO Harm their cubist take on Sister Ray for example.

& Neu! are fantastic. I haven't heard outside of the 3 main lps except for the offshoots and last year's live material so not heard anything I dislike by them.

Yeah, I saw the thread (I think it's the same one, although it wasn't a poll), and wondered about this..

For all that they seem to be the main touchstones of K-rock thesedays, they are very different in approach and style.

The third "can't choose" is not a cop-out, it's more about wondering if there is any polarity at all (does anybody love Neu! and dislike Faust, or vice versa?)

I would imagine that you could, but probably not vice versa...I can't see anyone not being able to get into what Neu! was doing on some level. It is kind of hard to compare them because they both operated very differently...

neu were vastly better

faust were good

Neu! !!!

I like Neu! plenty but they never really blow me away like Faust can

I have always preferred Michael Rother solo to Neu! And while I recently put the first two Faust records on my iPod, I haven't dug into them yet. So I have some work to do.

both bands are frustrating in various ways but Neu!'s high points are higher than Faust's

I like Neu! Faust plenty but they never really blow me away like Faust Neu! can

Faust!

Is there a Faust albums poll somehwre btw??

NTI - what are the good Rother solo albums?

I've followed Dinger's work up to the La! Neu? stuff, some of which is definitely very good. La-D's first 2 albums are classic and I love the Neondian album, which kind of pulls them more even with Faust which has a zillion more albums

both acts have developed sounds versatile enough to be picked up by a lot of other bands I love. never spent that much time on neu but love their big cruising feel, but faust at their best are really sly and agile in the way they move around & I love that sensibility.

Neu!

Is there a Faust albums poll somehwre btw??

not yet...i'd be very interested to see the results. I would predict So Far and IV would get the most votes but a lot of people like the debut. I wonder if anyone would vote any of the post-IV stuff.

Neu!

Like motorik, dude.

oh look a Faust poll

You Vote FaUSt: The FAUST nearly-complete discography poll (1971-2011)

Tempted to vote 'cannot choose' as I love them both but my heart knows it loves Faust more.

I copped out of this poll

Faust is pretty great, from what I've heard, and I probably like their first album more than any Neu! albums, but the existence of "Hallogallo" & "Fur Immer" is a pretty great boon for the species...

both bands are frustrating in various ways but Neu!'s high points are higher than Faust's

Yes. Also I think there is something in my constitution which just makes me more of a Neu! person.

Someone asked about which Rother solo albums rule. My answer:

Flammende Herzen (as good as any Neu record; one of the best Kraut records, period)
Sterntaler (also terrific, tbh I have not played it as many times as the above)
Katzenmusik (perhaps just a notch below Flammende but uniquely positive/uplifting/noble and not to be missed)

Also Neu! live last year was dissapointing ftmp.

http://www.primus-solutions.de/uploads/RTEmagicC_icon_neu_03.gif.gif

NTI - what are the good Rother solo albums?
--frogbs

More discussion of Sterntaler on the Krautrock listening club thread: KRAUTROCK Listening Klub! - New Albums Every Wednesday

Faust, easy. Their first four albums are untouchable.

Love Neu and krautrock in general but I've never been able to get into Faust.

What's a good album or song to get acquainted with their work?

As I just proclaimed in the Faust album poll thread, Faust IV is the greatest record by any krautrock band bar none. If you like that, start moving backwards chronologically from there in their discography until you hit a record you don't like (if that's possible).

Song-wise, try "It's a Rainy Day Sunshine Girl" from So Far, or "Krautrock" or "Jennifer" from IV.

Voted Neu! without hesitation. I like Faust a lot but that three-album run of Neu!'s is nigh on unbeatable.

As I just proclaimed in the Faust album poll thread, Faust IV is the greatest record by any krautrock band bar none. If you like that, start moving backwards chronologically from there in their discography until you hit a record you don't like (if that's possible).

― scott pgwp (pgwp), sábado 12 de marzo de 2011 18:20 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Song-wise, try "It's a Rainy Day Sunshine Girl" from So Far, or "Krautrock" or "Jennifer" from IV.

― scott pgwp (pgwp),

I swear I gave IV a listen years ago and hated it... it sounded too sparse and flowery for my taste and I remember the vocals annoyed me but gave it another chance just now and it's sounding brilliant. I might have been listening on the wrong headphones then :P

I'm really liking this album now. Guess I wasn't ready back then.

Only thing not entirely convincing me is the saxophone in some songs. It's some sort of prog rock clichee that I hate.

yah saxophones are always terrible but 'kraut rock' and 'jennifer' are great

need to relisten to 'the faust tapes', hope it doesn't contain saxophones

you godless fucking heathen sax haterz

voted Faust

papist ^

I generally hate sax too but the sax in "Rainy Day" is brilliantly placed.

Interesting stuff regarding Faust IV, particularly as JCope's book had it that people were massively disappointed by it when it came out.

I've tried to understand this and came up with :

The previous album cost 49p, and had lots of snippetty ideas and a few more complete songs, whereas IV starts with 11 mins of strummy noise, then some songs and ideas, a not terribly pre-posessing sleeve and a white inner sleeve.

Moral: Never do something cut-price, then expect yr customers to pay top whack next time.

Prog sax roolz

Cannot choose... but anyone suggesting Michael Rother is better than Neu! needs their heads, ears, knees, boomps-a-daisy testing

For all that they seem to be the main touchstones of K-rock thesedays

Eh? Are they? There's this band called Can, out of Cologne...

I was at a bar last night and it was packed but there was this one guy who had all this space to himself because he was dancing; turns out he put $5 in the jukebox and played nonstop Calvin Harris (he played "Acceptable in the 80's" twice!!). His lanky black-rimmed glasses white guy dancing was starting to get obnoxious so one of my buddies yelled out to me "Play some FAUST!"; I don't think he really knows any songs by them, only that another friend picked it up from me and really disliked it...I thought great idea and put on "Krautrock", play next, interrupting the nonstop flow of Calvin, and damn it sounded massive on those speakers. Since it's unrelenting noise everyone had to start shouting over it and there were a lot of frowny faces on the patrons. A few people seemed to enjoy it. Lanky white guy left. The experience cleansed my soul, but I got a hangover.

Neu!

Top bit of wyatting there frogbs

I would totally dance to "Krautrock"

some people did!! it sounds so great loud. the best part was that I followed it with Huey Lewis and the News "If This Is It"

xp: i don't know about other places but here there are two types of internet jukeboxes, and one of them has "Super Roots 7" on there; some days I get drunk and it seems like a good idea

Internet Jukeboxes here suck terribly.

At least in my town.

Voted faust, However if we were to include La D and or Harmonia, on the Neu! side it would certainly flip.

They are bizarre; like one of them has albums by Happy Mondays and Black Grape but without the singles on them! And the selection of Fall albums is really weird; it has a bunch of bootlegs and albums like Cerebral Causting and Kurious Oranj but not their more 'famous' ones. For Underworld it has Second Toughest (minus "Juanita", sigh), Oblivion with Bells, and two versions of the "Crocodile" single. Everything seems so ridiculously scattershot on those things. Do we have a thread about this..?

okay - we do now :)

Neu will win easily, but it's Faust. To me this question is like a litmus test for whether or not you really like Krautrock.

... explain?

faust always and forever

neu!

Dinger für immer

... explain?

The people who love Neu but can't get into Faust probably also don't listen to say the first Tangerine Dream album, or Amon Duul 1, etc. Future Days is probably their favorite Can album. They like the most accessible aspects of Krautrock when it's stripped of any prog tendencies, hippyness, absurdity, noise, avant garde moves, or politics. To me, Faust is the quintessential Krautrock band because they encompass all of those elements. I guess since Krautrock isn't an easily definable "sound" I tend to think that eclecticism is its defining feature, and Neu and Faust are on the opposite ends of the spectrum in that regard. Neu is almost beyond Krautrock in a way and you can easily love Neu without loving Krautrock in general. I'm not sure how you could like tons of other Krautrock though and not like Faust.

.... you can love both and still prefer Neu. not much of a litmus test, then.

I think it may be fair to say if you love Neu! and can't get into Faust you might prefer the motorik side of krautrock to the hippy side, but certainly don't think it would automatically mean you don't 'really' like krautrock. Also, as zappi so correctly says, preferring Neu! is not the same as not liking Faust.

Anyway, voted faust, However if we were to include La D and or Harmonia, on the Neu! side it would certainly flip is sooooo OTM.

preferring Neu! is not the same as not liking Faust.

You're either with us you're against us. (would have worked better with Amon Duul as I could have worked in some kind of terrorist, baader meinhoff angle. oh well)

I think my extra love for Faust is partially due to the fact that JHP was once really nice to me, and also I get the feeling that if I took my synths and ran away to join the band they might actually let me. Ha.

faust.

definitely prefer harmonia to neu. probably la düsseldorf and solo rother as well.

wld vote for harmonia deluxe over all of it

Wd vote for Amon Duul 2 over Neu

Sounds like we need a "greatest krautrock band" poll [and/or album?] poll.

I think I'd still vote for Faust.

The people who love Neu but can't get into Faust probably also don't listen to say the first Tangerine Dream album, or Amon Duul 1, etc. Future Days is probably their favorite Can album. They like the most accessible aspects of Krautrock when it's stripped of any prog tendencies, hippyness, absurdity, noise, avant garde moves, or politics. To me, Faust is the quintessential Krautrock band because they encompass all of those elements. I guess since Krautrock isn't an easily definable "sound" I tend to think that eclecticism is its defining feature, and Neu and Faust are on the opposite ends of the spectrum in that regard. Neu is almost beyond Krautrock in a way and you can easily love Neu without loving Krautrock in general. I'm not sure how you could like tons of other Krautrock though and not like Faust.

Disagree with virtually all of this!

ts;du

It's all a bit, "I'm more Krautrock than what you is"

Well, let's break it down:

I don't "love Neu but not Faust",
I'm not fussed about Tangdr, Amon Duul 1 I'm interested in,
Future Days, I like but it's not my fav.
K-rock 'stripped of it's progness' is basically 'proto-punk' and is a diff kettle fish which just happens to have Neu! in it.
K-Rock isn't a defineable sound as it's a whole country's rock music circa 1974 at it's centre. Is "jane" k-rock? Who can deny? Should they?

I tend to think that eclecticism is its defining feature, and Neu and Faust are on the opposite ends of the spectrum in that regard.
I agree with this bit.

you can easily love Neu without loving Krautrock in general
True, but you could say the same of any band?

I'm not sure how you could like tons of other Krautrock though and not like Faust.

That's sort of the inverse of the previous sentence, however.. It's like saying "I'm not sure how you could like tons of punk and not like the Pistols", um... no/yeah...

I guess since Krautrock isn't an easily definable "sound" I tend to think that eclecticism is its defining feature

I tend to think that you invent your own definition and my definition is different to yours obviously.

I more agree with the first part of the sentence, I don't know if it's its defining feature...

So, what is yours/your take ?

Tbh I think Neu is one of the most important prog bands ever

To me, the less Anglo-American rock influences are apparent (they might still be there of course, but transformed so they are less obvious) the more "Krautrock" something seems to me, therefore Neu! are actually one of the most Krautrock of Krautrock bands (in my head). In contrast, Pink Floyd are all over early Tangerine Dream and there's a hella lot of Zappa in Faust. Which doesn't make them bad or worse by any means

So happens that I mostly prefer "motorik" and electronics to freakout/ acid rock/ jazz rock/ psych jams whatever - Faust do all of those of course! (So do Can)

I do think that Neu stole motorik from Maureen Tucker & Scott Asheton

They did admit they listened to the Stooges... no, hold on, that was Kraftwerk

Well, I don't know enough about Zappa or the Tangs to make those comparisons. So, OK then..

Neu used to be in Kraftwerk...some ppl think Kraftwerk copped their signature sound from Neu's 1st album.

Some people are wrong then. 1st track, 1st LP Kraftwerk sounds signature to me.

voting faust. neu!'s complete discography obviously a more defined piece of work than faust's ditto but that's far from the point with faust. staggering highs, amusing, sometimes frustrating lows.

Dinger's on that album (though not that song as you undoubtedly know)

Yeah he's on the second half of the album, I think he has one pretty noteworthy drum spot but it's not the kind of thing he was known for.

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

drum roll...

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

That would suggest polarity then.

Would've gone with Faust, had I seen this on time. (Not even close for me. I kind of love Faust; have never really gotten Neu!, though I like them okay I guess.)

NEU NEU NEU NEU NEU

!

Man, Faust without question. Neu has one great, fantastic song--that they repeated with minor variations. Faust major "flaw" is being schizophrenically curious--and almost never repeating themselves. Perhaps they never hit on anything quite as stylish (even that I'd debate) but more brains and more brawn than Neu by miles.

And, of course, a great sense of humor, to boot.

Faust, no contest. Those guys blew it up.

just another example of the ILM minority having the wrong contrarian musical taste

"Neu had one song" seems really wrong, though it's bcz of my love for the song in question that made me vote for them.

Result seems to fit the prevailing tastes on ILM. I can't even remember who I voted for! Maybe I didn't.

Neu obviously had two songs, the drifty ambient one and the motorik one. Love em though.

Three I'd say, they had the punky one as well

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Result seems to fit the prevailing tastes on ILM. I can't even remember who I voted for! Maybe I didn't.

― Tom D (Tom D.), Friday, 1 April 2011 08:42 (3 hours ago)

OTM