Post Surf's Up Beach Boys - C/D S/D

So Tough/Carl and The Passions is kind of OK. Weak-ish, but good to have around.

I have not ventured beyond Holland, but I might pick up MIU/LA as Mr. Hopkins is a good judge.

You're taking big risks after Love You, mostly due to the fact that band ditched idiosyncrasy in favor of crappy AOR-lite sounds. I will say that almost all Beach Boys LPs have something to offer, but some of them don't validate being purchased.

I've never heard anyone say a single good word about 15 Big Ones. Anyone?

Other LPs I've never heard: Keepin' The Summer Alive, Beach Boys, Still Cruisin'. I'm in no hurry to catch up with any of these, although part of me thinks there might be a gem or two on KTSA. But maybe not.

I heard "Summer In Paradise" when it came out ('92) and, erm, wasn't wildly impressed.

I haven't heard it in years, but I also remember 'Love You' being fairly wretched... 'Johnny Carson'??

'Pacific Ocean Blue', the Dennis solo alb, doesn't really match up to the songs that he contributed to things like 'Sunflower' - the production is really seventies-supersession-muso-slick sounding, and the songs are never more than so-so. Apparently there's a second, unreleased, Dennis solo alb called 'Bamboo' - there must be bootlegs of it floating around somewhere. And on a related note, I'd just like to add that Primal Scream's cover of Dennis's 'Carry Me Home', on their 'Screamadelica' EP, is one of the best things they've ever done.

When I bought the Dennis LP I hated it, and now I think about half of it is heartbreakingly marvellous.

A sometime ILMer (who I'm hoping will pop up here and lay waste to us mortals with his Beach Boys skeez) promised me a CD of Dennis outtakes, but it hasn't arrived yet (not a surprise because I owe him lots of stuff). I can hardly wait.

About Love You, there are some moments that really make me think Brian could've been a late 70s contender if he'd wanted (The Night Was So Young, I'll Bet He's Nice), but others like "Solar System" just make him seem nuts. Still, I'll put that up against unreleased "gems" like "Lines" and "Life is for the Living".

You need a mess of help to stand alone
all the California saga songs
Only with you
Leaving this town
Mt Vernon and Faraway
Everyone's in love with you
In the still of the night
Just once in my life
Mona
Solar system
The night was so young
Let's put our hearts together

I haven't got any albums past Love You.

"Carl And The Passions/So Tough" is quite underrated, mainly because of the GLORIOUS Dennis Wilson songs on it. I have to agree with the liner notes in regards to them being "criminally" underrated. Also "Marcella" and "All This is That" are fine fine fine.

On the hand, "Holland" is IMHO overrated, but has some of their most amazing tracks.."Trader" which is Carl Wilson's crown achievement, "Only With You" (Oh, Dennis, I think I love you), and "Funky Pretty", which is one of Brian's best of the 70s. Not to forget is the "Mt. Vernon and Fairway (A Fairy Tale)" add-on.. which is really funny, bizarre, and cheesy in one sense, but really nice in another.

"15 Big Ones" is a pretty big fall, coming from the potential that "Holland" could have hinted at, with the Chaplin/Fataar band. But I think "15 Big Ones" is underrated. As overly cute and squelchy as they are, I like "It's OK", "Had To Phone Ya", "That Same Song", and "Chapel Of Love"... "Just Once In My Life" is a surprisingly strong exception.

And once again, yes, "The Beach Boys Love you" is IMHO overrated. Brian really comes off as an analog to the stereotypical 70s Elvis in this record, which is either a) very amusing, or b) very sad.
"Johnny Carson", "Solar System", and "I Wanna Pick You Up" are tracks I enjoy for reasons slightly more earnest than I would with, say, the Kids of Whidney High.

"M.I.U." is almost pure shit. Their worst record pre 80s, easily.
Remove the redeemable "Pitter Patter" and "Winds of Change", and you have the chemical building blocks of dung.

"Light Album/L.A." is an unabashed dog's breakfast. "Good Timin'" is excellent, as is the overwrought but still turgent "Baby Blue" (Dennis's last gasp of greatness), and "Goin' South" is fine. "Here Comes The Night" disco is extremely cheesy and dated, but really fun. And I'm embarrassed to admit I'm slightly charmed by "Sumahama", as seemingly insulting to Japan as it is. But the rest is forgettable.

"Keepin' the Summer Alive" is shit, too... but slightly more happy-go-lucky shit. First two tracks "Keepin' the Summer Alive" and "Oh Darlin'" are fine, the rest is eeehhhh.

"The Beach Boys" (1985).. HAHA, speaking of the Kids of Whidney High! I think both this Beach Boys records and "Special Music From Special Kids" used the same exact studio and production for these records! Very frightening... only one slightly redeemable song "Where I Belong". Otherwise, "The Beach Boys" is pat down their worst record.

And what about "Still Cruisin'"? I never bought, because the concept is too frightening. But I still rank this record higher than the 1985 record because of "Kokomo". I think I've been too hard on "Kokomo"... it think it's a horrible song in context and theory, but aside from that, it's redeemable. More redeemable than anything on the 1985 record, hence.

I agree that Dennis is the key to much of the best stuff through the '70s.

And I take it "Summer In Paradise" was a step too far for you too?

Andrew L is on the money about the sleevenotes though lol!

That's the only tune I can stand off that record. It seems like a cleaned up version of music from Smiley Smile.

former is one of Dennis's best songs ever,
latter feat uncredited Christine McVie (his flame at the time)

got Bamboo off Napster a few years back - it's good!
more of the gutbucket New Orleans funk he so loved (see Sunflower)

fave Dennis songs?:
"You And I", "Baby Blue", "Litte Bird", "Be With Me"
and just about all the others...

Most of above opinions are sound. Having recently bought all the 2fers in the HMV sale for 6 quid each, the LPs are fresh in my mind, so my 2-pennorth:

CATP:SoTough is half great. Dennis songs are fabulous, All This Is That is super-smooth, He Come Down sounded really great listening to it for the first time in about 15 years. Brian songs are sub-par-ramalama-boogie. Fataar/Chaplin songs still sound like the worst music released under the BB name.

Holland: it's odd. The LP has such a dull & leaden production yet contains some fabulous songs (Sail On Sailor, Trader, Only With You, Big Sur). The Fairytale EP is some of the most otherworldly music of its era.

15 Big Ones does actually have some pretty stellar moments: Just Once In My Life is simply heartbreaking (and is Ralf Kraftwerk's fave ever BB recording!!), while Had To Phone Ya, TM Song & (in particular) Talk To Me/Medley are among the most mental music like ever. Officially the worst cover design in music history tho'. KittyHawk Graphics, inevitably.

Love You: I think Side One is fabulous too, tho' parallels can certainly be drawn with BBToday! (one side of upbeat fun, one side of relective heartbreak). I could live without Mona but that aside, every song is a winner. Still sounds fresh too, unlike PetSounds.

Ding-hey!-dang-wooooo!-ding-anna-ding-dong.

MIU: My Diane, Sweet Sunday, Pitter Patter are good, everything else could go...

LA: surprisingly great. Astonished that Tim (or anyone) likes the disco number, but Good Timing, Lady Lynda, Full Sail all superb.

Keeping The Summer Alive: Goin' On, Endless Harmony, When Girls get Together all marvellous things in their own little ways.

85 is dross apart from 'Where I Belong'. The non-LP 45 from around this era 'Rock & Roll To The Rescue' is a wonderful celebratory record & truly unmissable.

Even I don't have Still Cruisin', but I do have 'Summer In Paradise'. Can't bring myself to listen to it, mind you...

Look, basically you need all of them, OK?

Avoid Carl's solo LPs at all costs, similarly Bruce's. Not even sure about much of Dennis' LP, to be honest (heresy!!).

Dennis solo LP has some corkers on it. I think its biggest stumbling block is that epic production about getting your shirt off in the street on a Saturday night.

I bought 15 Big Ones but haven't really listened to it very much, but I really really like the song Talk To Me when done by Little Willie John.

Don't sit around on your ass, smokin' grass -- that stuff went out a long time ago.

What about Dennis's collaborations with Chicago et al? Best avoided? There's a nice Chicago retrospective out at the moment. Filed next to David Soul in the CD folder of my heart.

I still don't see the huge difference between "15 Big Ones" and "Love You", aside from the latter being basically all Brian.
(meaning I still stand by my "15 big ones" = underrated and "Love You" = overrated stance)

Both records have plenty of songs that make me smile, but don't necessarily make me swoon nor go adrift like others. "Had To Phone Ya", "T.M. Song" (one of three "TM" songs... haha), "Chapel Of Love", "Just Once In My Life", "It's Ok", "That Same Song", "Everyone's In Love With You", and "Susie Cincinnati" all from "15 BIG ONES" are all worth just as much as most of "Love You". Shrug.

Also rediscovering: The Trader which is fast becoming one of my faves. NEver bothered to listen to the lyrics till recently.

Hmm, I think my point may boil to something that will be very hard for me to say, and that is: Brian lost it by then anyway. Sure, "Johnny Carson", "Ding Dang", "I'll Bet He's Nice" are all really charming in a quirky way, but it's many horizons off his past achievements. Listening to "Love You" is kinda painful, in that it makes me wonder if Elvis fans feel the same way listening to his 70s output.

Granted, less Mike Love is always nice, but "15 Big Ones" thankfully doesn't have anything as stinky as "Student Demonstration Time" or "California Saga".

"The Night was so Young" and "Let's Put Our Hearts Together" simply defy any suggestion that "Love You" is lacking in a certain amount of greatness. Both of these IMHO stand alongside BW's finest work; yes... production-wise, it is in a lower key undoubtedly, but as songs they really move me. And really, they sound perfectly fine in the context of the album, and are *well* if not brilliantly produced. "Solar System" is just wonderful I find... yes, it is not "Pet Sounds", but that time was not going to be repeated, and one has to accept BW's 1970s work for what it is: fine when judged on its own merits. "Honkin' Down the Highway", "Mona"... these are buoyant, rousing pop songs, that if written by an unknown would be far more acclaimed.
"15 Big Ones" does have a few really low ebbs, and few high water marks. "Had to Phone Ya", and possibly "It's OK" (Roy Wood guests!) and the "Just Once in my Life" version, are highlights, but little else is anywhere near really. "Palisades Park" surprised me on a recent listen; had a lot of life to it - but such revelations were the exception.
Indeed, I very much stand by "Love You" as a far stronger record than its predessecor.

Just a point; how on earth can "California Saga" be equated with the awful "Student Demonstration Time"? The Saga really beguiles me, especially "Big Sur" (one of Love's very few successes in his songwriting career) and "California". "Beaks of Eagles, The" contains some quite spiffing music, and a rousing chorus filled with fine harmonies... the only flaw is the ill-hewn 'poetry' from Messr ML.

What about Brian's solo output to put a new twist on things? I only have "Brian Wilson" and it's quite nice. I'd say stylistically it's a midpoint between Love You and Pet Sounds, which would make sense. "Rio Grande" is amazing (is it an outtake from Smile?) and "Melt Away" really touches me.

Keepin' the Summer Alive is a good album.

"Just Once In My Life" works for me, largely due to the very heartfelt duet between Brian and Dennis (or is it Carl? a while since i listened to it, but i think it's Dennis).

"Keepin' the Summer Alive" has *some* good material and is no worse than "15 Big Ones"... but, much of it is quite poor. "Santa Ana Winds", "Goin' On", "When Girls Get Together" are vintage BBs though...

I hate the way he sings "Baby, Baby!" on "Just Once In My LIfe" it just shows how much he'd fucked his voice up.

When Mike Love tried to start a franchise based on fursonas of the Beach Boys

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSeMlHnxDM0