Underappreciated in America '70s Hard Rock Battle: Thin Lizzy vs. UFO

Both UFO and Thin Lizzy released classic albums in the '70s and both bands are looked to with reverence by a slew of modern day bands and critics. Another thing that connects both bands is how criminally underrated both of them are/were in America compared to their European homeland (and other places) where they had a ton more commercial success.

I got for UFO between the two bands but it's very close. I think Lizzy penned a few songs which I like better as songs but UFO had full albums that satisfy me more.

Exact opposite for me. Lots of great Thin Lizzy albums but I'm ore track-by-track with UFO. Both have seminal live records.

Thin Lizzy has a way deeper catalog of records and tunes than UFO. I think if you consider just early Thin Lizzy and later after the Robertson/Gorman guitar duo broke up, those periods of the group made quite a bit of good music. Add in those middle albums with the classic lineup, Thin Lizzy has one of the better discography's in 70s hard rock.

UFO had a long history, but really the only period that has music I have heard and liked with the albums with Michael Schenker. That said, I definitely think Eddie Van Halen was listening to UFO, as I think there are definitely similarities in sound between the two groups.

"Thin Lizzy has one of the better discography's in 70s hard rock."

or rock! or pop or just music of the 20th century if you ask me. but i'm not lucid when it comes to thin lizzy. i just love it all. UFO rocked but they couldn't hold a candle to thin lizzy songwriting-wise. phil to me is up there with van morrison and bruce springsteen as far as 70's storytellers go.

i've never actually been a HUGE UFO fan to be honest. i've listened to all the records, i still listen to them when i get them in the store, but i don't think i even own one. which is strange. but there you have it. i own multiple albums by way more marginal bands. UFO definitely had their fans in the states. my brother was one of them. Thin Lizzy sold a ton of records here too and have been on the radio every hour in this country for the last 35 years or so.

i mean obviously thin lizzy only had one big hit and one big album in the states but they were always consistent sellers and well-liked and well thought of among rock fans of the 70's and beyond.

i guess what i'm saying is that i don't think they were all that underappreciated here. UFO were known here by more serious hard rock fans and guitar freaks.

i also think thin lizzy probably would have done way better here if they had been on a label like warner brothers from the beginning. mercury took the cheap way out with their records and promotion. they deserved better. and the later albums on warner look much nicer. higher quality product.

I am a GIANT fan of UFO's whole '70s run, from Phenomenon through Strangers in the Night. On the other hand, while I like one or two Thin Lizzy songs, they're the exceptions - for the most part, everything about them (Lynott's voice most of all) leaves me cold.

decca actually treated them good. as far as nice packages and amazing sound and all that. don't know what happened there. or why they just didn't continue recording for MCA in the states after those first three Decca albums. ten years of awesome stuff though. i love the first album as much as i love chinatown.

definitely the earlier the better for me as far as UFO goes. the later stuff that treads Bad Company ground does nothing for me. they helped create NWOBHM along with priest and others and god love them but they have never thrilled me. the guitars could be great though! would just personally rather listen to other stuff.

The live album is pretty unnecessary (it's no Double Live Gonzo!), but the studio albums from '74-'79 have so many great songs - and I really like Phil Mogg's voice, it's got this weird desperation to it. I never paid any attention to UFO when I was younger, but I stumbled into their catalog a couple of years ago and they just blew me away. Same thing happened with Uriah Heep; I heard all these great albums and said, "Fuck! Why wasn't I paying attention earlier?"

you need more Chicken Shack in your life. Talk about underappreciated!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U58JZ05qlGk

I suppose...I mean, I already have Black Cat Bones' Barbed Wire Sandwich, both Jukin' Bone albums, and both Killing Floor albums in my iPod, so I could probably find room for this one.

well, make it that album if you can SPARE the room. fierceness.

phil to me is up there with van morrison and bruce springsteen as far as 70's storytellers go

this is not hyperbole. his work seems deeper to me now than it did in the 70s or 90s for that matter

Both of these bands had Springsteen-esque overtones.

Im a little shocked at this:

The live album is pretty unnecessary (it's no Double Live Gonzo!),

Strangers in the Night is a phenomenal live album, i rate it higher than the sacred cow Live and Dangerous.

Yeah, I haven't heard every single thing by UFO, but Strangers in the Night is by far my favorite of what I guess were their top-selling LPs (mid to late '70s). I don't know what word best describes it - intense, maybe.

agreed with scott about Lizzy; as I said on the Clash poll, Lizzy > the Clash, and > most rock bands tbh

I grew up in Chicago where UFO was massive, so it's hard for me to agree with the "unappreciated" part of the title to this thread.

TL was always on classic rock radio here, at least "Boys". I also remember hearing "Jailbreak" and "Dancing in the Moonlight" quite a bit on FM, although those ones are gone from the rotation now.

UFO, on the other hand, were never heard at all. I remember Metallica and other metal bands would bring them up in interviews, but you just didn't hear them unless you had the records.

"Rosalie" and "Cowboy Song" were a couple more another Thin Lizzy songs that were in pretty regular rotation in Indiana rock stations (like Q95) when I was a teenager. "Dedication" got a bunch of airplay when that greatest hits CD came out in the 90s too. "Doctor Doctor" and "Too Hot to Handle" would be heard by UFO, but they seemed to be a band that lost airplay when the big corporate play lists got so narrow.

i always think i'm going to LOVE UFO and then i listen to them and it's just ok

thin lizzy rules forever

all the thrash bands held UFO in weirdly high regard for some reason

How is Thin Lizzy underappreciated in the US? They're almost cult at this point.

Yeah, but their cult always has this weird belief that they should have been, like, as big as Aerosmith.

It probably would have changed if Phil Lynott would have been around to tour with Thin Lizzy in the 90s. Little Feat had fewer radio hits than Thin Lizzy but the later 80s group without Lowell George toured a ton and I think raised the profile the group quite a bit.

Apart from BABIT and sarah i can leave TL tbh, never liked the sound never enjoyed Lynott's delivery.

I am a GIANT fan of UFO's whole '70s run, from Phenomenon through Strangers in the Night. On the other hand, while I like one or two Thin Lizzy songs, they're the exceptions - for the most part, everything about them (Lynott's voice most of all) leaves me cold.

I totally do not mean this to sound condescending or anything, I'm into the discussion here not a fight - but this is an utterly fascinating post to me; UFO was a band I really, really wanted to like when I was a kid. They're called "UFO" for the love of Christ! they have to rule! but every time I heard them I'd be like "wow...this just is not that good." It just seemed so indistinct. Whereas Thin Lizzy, I didn't feel that pull to check them out that sort of defines one's attractions (or mine, anyway) but every single time I'd hear them - and still to this day - I'd feel like their songs were perfect. The voice, the guitars, the groove: all exactly in this pocket of feeling and attitude that's wholly theirs. UFO did seem distinctive, but I really could not get what they did. I think I have to give them another look now, I guess.

the UFO logo is an all time great IMO

are they like the scorpions or something where they have "cool early" shit that's more psych?

m@tt, check out their second album Flying. ("One Hour Space Rock"!)

(aero too)

Re: Unappreciated in America

UFO doesn't have a single Gold album or single in America and Thin Lizzy only has one Gold album (Jailbreak) and no platinum releases.

Yeah, but their cult always has this weird belief that they should have been, like, as big as Aerosmith. ― 誤訳侮辱

well, to be fair, americans ARE pretty dumb. though they do love lynyrd skynyrd here, so they get some things right.

americans appreciated fastway.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5_oPyavUaw

Deep Purple seems to be another hard rock band whose shadow is much larger in Europe than in the US. By the other hand, is it correct to say that Americans seem to like The Who a bit more than across the pond?

yeah when i say i like earlier ufo i do kinda mean the first two pre-schenker albums and to be honest even THAT stuff is nowhere near my fave space boogie rock. i mean there were just too many amazing bands back then and UFO were not all that amazing. i certainly appreciate tracks like "flying" and "prince kajuku" and "silver bird" but for some reason i just have no great love. its a mystery.

this is rad footage though. and i will always love boogie pronounced BOOOOOGAYYYY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Ee1L4uHckk

seems like there a some pretty different takes on the the relative unknown knowns of these two - my perception would be that everybody here has at least heard The Boys Are Back In Town, if not consciously then in movies and ads and stuff whereas UFO would be way more obscure. I dunno, maybe it's a regional thing.

The Who are huge in Europe too, though, aren't they? Are they really bigger over here?

where was the love for Man in this country?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfVZJL5e1zI

It seems to me The Who has been a bigger concert draw in the US since they periodically toured starting in 89'. I swear they could just sit up shop at Great America and a bunch of Chicagoland would probably go see them play everyday.

I have to add that I listened to Strangers in the Night on the train home tonight and I was way underrating that album. It fucking rules.

tarfumes can give us all who sales stats if he sees this.

by way of comparison - and honestly i don't have any real problem with UFO! - this thrills me to no end. i mean this is endlessly thrilling to me. so fierce. i almost can't take it it makes me want to jump off a roof. madness. greatness. to me anyway.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=He8ahXuG7V4

I've always meant to check out Journey's early prog albums.

this is, as the kids say, the shit:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-3fHcTo-Us

yeah the actual first 2 or 3 albums are great, but they never got the INSANITY of the live 1973 stuff on album. you gotta look for bootlegs of unreleased stuff and live stuff. santana gone metal. just so heavy and raging.

wow, great stuff there! Like Blue Cheer covering Mahavishnu or something

the only ufo song i knowingly know is "star storm" which is some serious badass spaced out hard rock.

on that last journey link, the unreleased stuff from 73, the very end is three live tracks by Birthday, which was the short-lived post-santana/pre-journey group with schon/rollie. very cool.

0:55:22 - Concert Cut 8:22 Your Little Girl (Schon/Rollie - Birthday)
1:03:44 - Concert Cut 6:14 Voodoo Chile (Schon/Rollie - Birthday)
1:09:58 - Concert Cut 7:26 Tonight (Schon/Rollie - Birthday)

but that whole thing is great. if you have an hour to kill.

this especially. don't miss this:

38:44 - Unknown 6:23 Agressive Fusion Track [Schon lights it up]

because he really fucking lights it up.

Who remembers Waysted, the band formed by Pete Way of UFO around 1983? I seem to recall they had a good song called "Women in Chains," with a video.

Larry Wallis was in an unrecorded version of UFO. Larry Wallis was also in Motorhead. Brian Robertson was in Motorhead. Brian Robertson was in Thin Lizzy. this is why I love Martin Strong's "Great (whatever) Discographies".

Eddie Trunk is always mentioning UFO on his VH1 show, so I recently researched their history, and heard "Too Hot to Handle" for the first time in 20 years. I don't think I ever knew who did that. If I'd been forced to guess from memory without hearing it again, it would have been Foreigner or Eddie Money or something. How did UFO become ingrained in my brain without me ever figuring out who they were?

Groups with so much in common in retrospect - both capable of killer music, but both wildly inconsistent. Lizzy are the better group for me: more exploratory, with a variety both within albums and across the catalogue that UFO didn't have. Though I rather like UFO's new wave/Springsteen singles, Let it Rain and Lonely Heart (from about the same time Lizzy had a single with a very similar sound and almost identical title).

I interviewed Phil Mogg last year. He was good value.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NKKPBmMPYN0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NQJ3-77xvI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4R_vDapyndk

^ monster tune off the first UFO album beats any Thin Lizzy for me

Wow, that UFO track is great!

yeah, it's a lot more of a caveman rave-up than the rest of the stuff i've heard by them

that bass sounds so nice

I tried checking out UFO a few years ago based on the Mike Clink connection to GNR (they hired him to produce Appetite partially based on his production on Strangers in the Night). But I didn't buy Strangers in the Night! I got whatever album it is that has the Alone Again Or cover on it, since that had the most stars from Allmusic or whatever, and it didn't really grab me. But I'm listening to some tracks from Strangers in the Night on youtube right now and they're amazing!

Wish I'd heard this earlier in life. For some reason when I was a kid, Michael Schenker was one of those guys you heard about in rock magazines, maybe there was a t-shirt in Rockabilia or whatever, but no one ever listened to.

I think maybe the whole Scorpions association tainted them for me. In my late-80s gang of 5th-grade headbangers, Scorpions were almost as uncool as Kingdom Come or Dokken.

Michael Schenker was only on the first Scorpions album - the jazz rock one – wasn't he? And he was only about six at the time.

xpost I saw Waysted! Supporting Iron Maiden, I think, at Hammersmith. Ozzy came out and sang Paranoid with them.

In my mid '80s high school years, the Scorps were one of the bands revered by both the pop metal fans (thanks to their Love At First Sting monster) and the underground types (thanks to their earlier stuff). I remember a kid in my 12th grade music theory class who loved Lonesome Crow and also lent me his copy of Rocka Rolla which he swore was the best Priest album. He was a hipster ahead of his time.

xxp: yeah, but the other Schenker was in the band. Hey, it wasn't easy to keep track of all those Germans. 80s Michael Schenker was pretty bad too though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xj__XDh8LCk

"Strangers in the Night" only made it to #42 on the albums chart in the US, which is kind of surprising considering its influence on 80s hair metal bands. Not exactly a "VU & Nico" phenom, but the arena rock sound on this LP stretched pretty far into the next decade. ("Lights Out" hit #23 in the US, their best performance on the chart).

As a result of "Strangers" influence, I think to most ears "Strangers" would sound somewhat generic now. Which is a shame because it's got a great live sound, very good guitar solos, and the band is tight. The arrangements aren't bad, either.

Thin Lizzy will probably wear better though, due to the songwriting. They also had pretty good sounding albums (although Mercury vinyl, esp. the skyscraper labels, aren't among my favorite sounding LPs), and the twin-guitar leads never really get old. Phil could write and sing a ballad, too--something not done well by many hard rock acts of that era.

xpost Michael Schenker Group were responsible for one my all time favourite moments of unintentional comedy thanks to Gary Barden's rhotacism. Coming onstage at the Reading festival sometime in the early 80s, he introduced the band's opening song: "Awwwiht, Weading! Are You Weady to Wock?"

The following year, of course, Loudness challenged him with: "Herro Reading! We are Roudness!"

very grateful to this thread for the music I'm enjoying in the kitchen tonight - Strangers in the Night, which I was curious about in the cut-out bin for years but never enough to pull the trigger. Don't really think the songs are generally in the same class as Thin Lizzy - lyrically Lynott rules over this stuff mercilessly - but maaaaaaaan this is a fuckin' GROOVE

maaaaaaaan this is a fuckin' GROOVE

Exactly. UFO just steamroller right over you, but they've got some killer choruses too.

wowww @ Birthday

i really want to hear this "dream after dream" soundtrack Journey did in 1980. mostly instrumental, hearkens back to the style of first album according to wiki.