Former Youth Against Gender Fascism: thurston moore imploding thread

"Jezebel is gender fascism. By not having any real critical facility to understand, in their case, men in relationship to women (presumably them) they opt to promote hate by imperialist blather. By couching it in feminism is a distinct lack of class, but i'm sure they're having a bit of online fun and when they grow up maybe they'll glean the complexities of real life and love."

I think their messy divorce and inarguable end of Sonic-Youth deserves its own thread. man… ill just say it… i always knew he sucked!!!!!! or was full of a lot of hot air…. i love most sy records, their side projects, everything, but thurston…. you are the poser!!!!!!

at the same time… i dont mean to disrespect the man's work… sorry…

friend on twitter-

"wish I didn't have an opinion on the Kim/Thurston thing because they're adults and it's none of my business"

same feeling here?

cheating on your wife is some lame bullshit, dude

for reference:
http://jezebel.com/thurston-moore-confirms-he-is-a-dick-1537153414
http://jezebel.com/philandering-old-man-thurston-moore-calls-jezebel-gend-1538686647

"gender fascism" jfc what is this flake even talking about

yeah that is one step away from using the godawful please-shoot-this-idiot-now phrase feminazi

cheating on your wife is some lame bullshit, dude

Yep, it's as simple as that. If you don't want to be married anymore, talk to your wife about it. If she agrees, but wants to stay together for the kid, or if she kicks you out, or whatever happens, at least you aren't being an asshole who's sneaking around on the person who loves you. I don't care how you rationalize it, cheating makes you a dick.

yup

16 year old me wishes I still owned Sonic Youth albums on vinyl, so I could take great pleasure in gouging out the Thurston tracks.

fuck thurston!!!!!!!!

Pretty clear he's an asshole. Idk, it's not like he's Varg or Woody though.

I have weird feelings about this. should probably keep my mouth shut

Yeah, he's not on that level, but when people won't own up to their own shit it (rightfully) makes other people irritated.

not that I have any sympathy for cheating spouses that shit is unforgivable

I wish that Body/Head had a better band name than Chelsea Light Moving.

They are a better band though.

Ranaldo still rules.

It's not like he's big or bad or evil. He's just a sordid, dirty little liar and a hypocrite, and that's almost more of a disappointment.

Yeah, feelings are complicated, and emotions change. But, y'know, it is the 21st century and there's divorce, and there's managed consensual non-monogamy, and then there's being a liar and a sneak. And then there's being a liar and a sneak, and throwing around a bunch of bigoted crap when you get called on it. And that's just sordid and gross.

Anyway, I have wasted enough of my life thinking about Thurston Moore now.

Has anyone come up with a good portmanteau for a thinkpiece tabloid

I have weird feelings about this. should probably keep my mouth shut

^ yeah, this is the little chat that thurston probably should've had with himself beforehand. feel sad about seeing him get a kicking though, no matter how much he might deserve it

If you're going to air your dirty laundry in public (which he did) and then get defensive and reactionary when people (rightfully) shame you for that dirty laundry, then you are a low low person. Fuck Thurston Moore.

quiet slimeball > attention-seeking slimeball

he's basically like the sonic youth-loving dad creeper in 'juno'

Eva Prinz ain't a teenager, but yeah.

If you're going to air your dirty laundry in public (which he did) and then get defensive and reactionary when people (rightfully) shame you for that dirty laundry, then you are a low low person. Fuck Thurston Moore.

― Johnny Fever, Friday, March 7, 2014 1:13 PM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah this. i could not give less of a fuck what thurston moore does in his life but last i checked interviews were not compulsory.

I recall him saying at the time it broke "I am never going to talk about any of this" and thought that was a good idea.

going after Jezebel in this half-cocked way just looks petty

this just reminded me that i have to buy Body/Head ASAP

so a magazine calls him a "dick" and he hits back at them in anger. yes, he should have kept his mouth shut and been classier about it but yknow this is hardly a reason to break out the hatorade.

the self-righteousness of some people here....he cheated on his wife, horrible and ugly i know, but it happens its life

he's a public figure who made public comments!

I don't know what thread you're reading that you see so much "self righteousness" when everyone here is pretty much shaking their head and going "this guy" with tones of their teenage selves being vaguely disappointed. Maybe you need to step back a bit.

yeah that is one step away from using the godawful please-shoot-this-idiot-now phrase feminazi

― eardrum buzz aldrin (NickB), Friday, March 7, 2014 12:56 PM (38 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

OTMFM

yes you do (xps to al)

I just remember reading about that Thurston-taught school in NYC from a few years ago, where people would bring their toddlers to learn all about boomboxes and cassette tape and the art of the tape mix, and just thinking, man people take this guy too effing seriously.

lmao

my 3 yr old on Steve Reich - "daddy can you turn this off? it makes my ears feel bad"

let kids listen to raffi and shit jfc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0jCA_q5Zws

I recall him saying at the time it broke "I am never going to talk about any of this" and thought that was a good idea.

― lauded at conferences of deluded psychopaths (Sparkle Motion), Friday, March 7, 2014 1:26 PM (15 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

pretty much. he seems to want to give people some kind of context in which his actions will seem a-OK, but that's not gonna happen, he shoulda left it alone.

i always thought of Psychic Hearts as this big-hearted, empathetic album he wrote about women while his wife was tending to their newborn daughter. this whole "gender fascism" thing is unfortunate. will still listen to and enjoy the album in that mindset, though.

I'm one of the outliers here for sure, because I've always found Thurston the least interesting component of Sonic Youth (and care very little for his work outside the band), so it's easy for me to flip a switch on him.

i blame the fast crowd he hangs out with. peer pressure to be a bad boy.

https://scontent-b-iad.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/t1/1922157_679104415482942_1145930831_n.jpg

same!

i agree with him that jezebel etc is diminishing otherwise smart ppl's capacity to engage in basic thought rather than just look for things to categorize and condemn... otherwise i don't give a shit about any of this. sonic youth fucking blows + 'thurston' is literally the stupidest name for a human imaginable.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/0/0e/Thurston_Howell,_III.jpg

You're just jealous.

Even when I was younger and SY was at its peak and I followed stuff TM said more often, I always got the feeling that every other word he used was simultaneously too fancy for the sentence he was speaking and also wrong in usage. At one point I thought it was intentionally parody, but not I'm not so sure

he seems to want to give people some kind of context in which his actions will seem a-OK

"Vis a vis the context of contemporary adult relationships, one's dedication to a partner in perpetuity calls into question the conflict: what happens when one tires of sexual intercourse with one's partner and one is compelled to explore coitous with another, younger woman, who is also not the mother of your kids because, man, kids. Also, bourgeois and words like that."

i don't give too much of a shit about this. sonic youth always seemed better than the sum of its parts to me anyway, i have no attachment to moore. i don't even have an attachment to anything sonic youth did since, i don't know, 1987? agree that cheating on your wife is lame. also agree that jezebel pretty much sucks too, i totally hate that stupid kind of reactionary scolding web gossip. feel the same about gawker. all the gawker media sites suck pretty much.

i love peter brotzmann though scott and think he is the toughest and most stylish dude around

Ditto. Bennink, too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYKI8tAELXY

man people take this guy too effing seriously

So OTM.

Like obviously cheating your wife is a massive dick move but I'm pretty sure there are literally hundreds of rock stars out there who have done way worse things than anything Thurston Moore has done. But because there are people who have literally grown up with Thurston and Kim as a married couple then the implosion of that marriage hits home, because Kim has equally if not more prominent all along.

So while it's obviously not like your parents splitting up or whatever there are relatively few husband-and-wife creative teams that last that long and forge such an emotional connection with people. It's just not the same as some standard douchebag baby boomer rock star leaving his third wife for a 20-year old, even though objectively there might be no difference in the amount of emotional hurt caused to the people involved.

And while I think "fuck all you guys who think you know my marriage better than I do" is an understandable reaction, none of this diminishes the fact that Thurston's outburst is colossally dickish and "gender fascism" is just head-in-hands awful.

let kids listen to raffi and shit jfc

my kind likes it when I play stuff with a d-beat

Kim started this shit with her fuckin stupid Vouge interview

I also feel like the reason why they broke up is none of anyone's fuckin business

Also Jezebel is a fuckin joke

i wonder how many middle aged dads could successfully resist an independently wealthy sexual libertine twenty years younger than him who really liked his awful poetry

― da croupier, Sunday, March 9, 2014 3:19 PM (13 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

This is key

excuse me elle

http://www.elle.com/pop-culture/celebrities/kim-gordon-sonic-youth-profile?src=spr_TWITTER&spr_id=12892&q5545908=1

On top of the 'groupie' slur, I feel that this is also worth noting:

http://www.thefrisky.com/2013-04-24/other-woman-eva-prinz-did-not-break-up-kim-gordon-and-thurston-moores-marriage/

yeah to be clear i don't consider eva a "homewrecker" - while I can sympathize with the temptation, his apparent course of action in regards to it strikes me as pathetic as fuck and he's 100% accountable for it. that said, considering the article where prinz discussing her provocateur ways centers around a picture of her hugging kim gordon, can't say prinz comes off like a champ either.

that's racist

― μ thant (seandalai), Sunday, March 9, 2014 9:15 AM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Well i dint wanna say

― peak environmental scaremongering (darraghmac), Sunday, March 9, 2014 9:30 AM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

don't blame me. blame matos's mother's incredibly stupid ex-husband.

Depressing (to me) role models for contented conjugal bliss..but i regret posting it. Tbh my basic poison is that it is none of anyone's business.
― mohel hell (Bob Six), Sunday, March 9, 2014 8:56 AM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Oof yeah I hope I don't end up happy, wealthy, and respected... sounds horrible

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mb3jv9aubV1rwl09fo1_500.gif

tumblr whines

Guy confesses to being an asshole, Jezebel agrees with him, guy takes exception, calls them assholes, everybody's right what's the problem

Perusing this thread makes me sad. I want those 2 minutes back.

Is this a fair order of events of this whole sordid gossipy affair:

1) Jim O'Rourke has affair with (then-married) Eva Prinz

2) Eva leaves her husband AND Jim for Thurston

3) Jim leaves Sonic Youth and departs the USA for Japan

4) Thurston leaves Kim for Eva

5. Christine McVie leaves Steve Shelley for Glenn Branca

xps oh cool is this the thread where white guys complain about jezebel

― perfect puppy (Whiney G. Weingarten), Sunday, 9 March 2014 15:01 (2 hours ago) Permalink

Has it ever occurred to you that you're part of the problem, white guy whining about his fellow white guys as if he's not part of the problem?

JO'R moved to Japan cos he got dumped?

i gotta say that wire magazine does a v. poor job of covering celebrity avant-rocker tittle-tattle

Y'all cut it w the age-ist stuff. The shitty thing is cheating on your wife, who cares who is it with.

Oh, Whiney's part of the problem alright.

Like, would it be cool if she was the same age as Thurston, and maybe had an experimental guitar orchestra of her own. Would that make it cool? No.

xps oh cool is this the thread where white guys complain about jezebel

― perfect puppy (Whiney G. Weingarten), Sunday, 9 March 2014 15:01 (2 hours ago) Permalink

Has it ever occurred to you that you're part of the problem, white guy whining about his fellow white guys as if he's not part of the problem?

― Murgatroid, Sunday, March 9, 2014 5:07 PM (10 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Eva Prinz, what's on your iPod?

i wonder how many middle aged dads could successfully resist an independently wealthy sexual libertine twenty years younger than him who really liked his awful poetry

cheating on your wife is also cheating on your daughter, and dragging this shit into the public is also dragging his daughter out there, I'm sure she reads the internet.

I thought my second post would have made this clear but I wasn't making a "judge not" argument.

The Problem

Its a doozy, The Problem.

People often ask me if I have any words of advice for young people.
Well here are a few simple admonitions for young and old.
Never interfere in a boy-and-girl fight.

- William S. Burroughs

perfect

burroughs is a great dude to listen to in these kinds of cases, it's true. impeccable track record in his relationships with women.

How on earth are any of us interfering

you are both too literal and have no apparent sense of humour, that's from a bit that is basically a standup comedy routine

that was a misspelling of humor not an affectation

being british is not an affectation, jesus christ cool it with the anglophobia.

actually my comment was coming from a place of amused disbelief over people announcing that the private life of public figures is none of their business in a thread inspired by comments by a public figure about their private life

nobody here gets it at all.

wow da courpon is a truthteller

stick, your, fingers
in, your, mouth
squeeze, your, tongue
and wrench, it, out

maybe "knee your jaw and bite them off" works better for the computer age, idk

That's Chris and Tina Weymouth? THAT'S who you'd hate to end up as?

Damn this mess merited it's own thread

I interviewed Chris and Tina over the phone once and they were such an endearing double act. I would love to end up like that if I were a married musician tbh.

^^^^

also:

Damn this mess merited it's own thread

― RAP GAME SHANI DAVIS (Raymond Cummings)

it really didn't

Damn this mess merited it's own thread

― RAP GAME SHANI DAVIS (Raymond Cummings)

I imagine this line sung like the first line in "Found a Job."

Just spotted him and Prinz at my local bookstore, maybe hoping readers of today's Miami Herald story will wanna point and whisper.

the dude turned into every other person in the Northeast over 60

I’m confused, is he a TERF now or something? Did this 10 year old thread get renamed along the way?

Oh God I read the first post. Hoo boy.

Alfred, he was scheduled to appear at an event here in Stoke Newington today...admitidely I did not attend, but think maybe that wasn't him you saw?

DAMMIT.

I suppose this independent bookstore (mentioned in this Miami Herald) has many tow-haired sixtysomething males and their much younger girlfriends

For contrast, here's Lemmy at the same age, on doctors that told him as well to slow things down into his sixties.