Hou Hsiao-Hsien

I'm in the FOS/GSG camp.

i really wanted to love city of sadness but found it far too long, and not meaty enough. i did really like a time to live and die (saw it twice, and liked it much better 2nd time round, maybe i need to do that with all his films) but this i just found dreary. took me about an hour to get into its rhythm, but found it impossible to really navigate all the characters when i did. maybe its this film, or maybe its just him, but his style can be too delicate and slight. beautiful and poetic, sure, but i wanted more than that - everything was as if it was rendered in miniature, but it makes it hard to get any sense of an emotional arc. its all just played at one pitch almost. found it easy to like particular scenes, but difficult to get a handle on the bigger picture. did love the idea of rendering every letter thats read out on the screen though - that was a lovely touch. a time to live somehow seemed better as his simple style suited the relatively simple story (though it was still epic in scope).

Was there too. There was this tension in the film between the telling of the history and the telling of that family's history that seemed unresolved by Hou. When the deaf man and his wife-to-be start conversing independently of the rest of the family -- who are talking about the political situation, big boy stuff -- and the two talk instead about their lives and the music playing you are clearly seeing what Hou is more interested in. Or at least the terrain he feels more comfortable in, because the bigger picture details did get lost over time. He never found any equilibrium here.

Its a film I'd watch again someday - it was interesting to depict such a turbulent time for a nation in such a non-epic manner.

One other thing I'd remark on is how 80s those keyboard stabs sounded to me. You can so date the movie through that, its how I amuse myself.

i found myself stuck between frustration that a subject like this DID deserve the big epic treatment and trying to see the reason for why hou wouldnt take that approach. neither was particularly satisfying. his small-detail minutiae focus can be riveting (eg a time to live...), it can also feel like a safe option. avoiding obvious big drama might seem brave or clever but it also just seems like an easy way out, and one more about preserving auteur style over what the material is desperately crying out for. if there were plenty of other epics already telling this story, i might think a small-focus movie like this to be fine, but as there arent loads about the subject, it seemed like a missed opportunity.

ha - i loved the 80s music. it was actually one of the easiest things to like about the film. he has a good ear for music.... though there WAS something rather 80s-arthouse about the film as a whole (same dated feel i get from watching something like the double life of veronique these days)

i found myself stuck between frustration that a subject like this DID deserve the big epic treatment and trying to see the reason for why hou wouldnt take that approach.

Well he is more interested in the interior life - the life of family houses and rooms, the life of a deaf mute - than what is happening more widely. Thinking more again you see that table where the father is eating, and the film pretty much ends with that scene of the eldest surviving the turbulent times. There he is, eating...Somewhat analogous to having the grandmother die at the end of A Time to Live..., the eldest outliving her son/daughter (can't remember which side she is on).

might double feature cute girl and the puppetmaster next weekend, haven't seen either.

There's been talk in All Purpose NYC ILX Film Snob Thread

I'm watching Good Men, Good Women for the first time. Its fucking w/space and time is unexpected!

brand new print of Flowers of Shanghai on the big screen in Queens last night, stunning reds and golds, glow from the gas lamps too. This retro will tour to Berkeley and presumably elsewhere.

http://www.fandor.com/keyframe/daily-also-like-life-the-films-of-hou-hsiao-hsien

Was it sold out?

close if not

Looked sold out tonight too, for supposedly the sole extant subtitled print of the puppetmaster

Yesterday I saw A Summer at Grandpa's (1984), which is ultimately a pretty sobering portrait of two sibs (aged ten and six, approximately) learning a lot about adults. It's not much like Meatballs even though there are pants-wetting and hemorrhoid scenes.

flowers is the only movie i've ever felt the need to watch twice in a row (well, with a night's sleep in between viewings).

Checked the "Sing-Song Girls of Shanghai" out from the library; ordered DVD copy of "Flowers" to rewatch--I will understand this movie eventually.

Saw "Three Times" on Sunday--wasn't as impressive as the first two ("Flowers" & "Puppetmaster").

Gonna miss "Millennium Mambo" this Friday as have tix for the Replacements . . . not too upset as I hear it is similar to the last of the Three Times. Ordered it on Netflix though to try and keep up with the programming.

I really liked Millenium Mambo. One of his best of the post-Flowers ones, imo. There are some really beautiful pictures of snow...

I'm so jealous of this retro.

wb v. plain

I'm really enjoying reading the novel that "Flowers" was based on--but its making me want to stay inside reading all day as the rain falls outside.

Question: were they smoking some low grade opium in those days, or was everyone just an addict? In the book they have some wine with lunch, then smoke some opium to relax, then take a nap before arranging a drinking party. Nice life!

You know, I forgot until I looked at the credits of Flowers that that's Tony Leung in the lead. (Hair.)

David Bordwell on "cheerful staging" in the early films:

http://www.davidbordwell.net/books/figures_intro.php?ss=4

this thread is reminded me i need to rewatch yang's "the terrorizers" (preferably alone as my ex's boredom ruined the first viewing)

remindING*

i'll come over next year to watch it :)

actually i think dayo just told me he bought The Terrorizers

i'd be into the idea of a static cinema marathon: the terrorizers, jeanne dielman, kiarostami, etc

i am inviting myself to this party

this ... slumber party

The Boys from Fengkuei is a formidable entry in the I Vitelloni genre.

Otm. This scene has been in my mind since I saw it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2jvVT-xYRs

Esp. the second shot.

Yep, that was definitely the best scene of the movie.

hmmm, i wouldn't go that far. Were you there Sunday?

Frederik, do these films circulate in Europe? Because I probably last saw The Boys 20-25 years ago until this weekend, and I bet it hasn't been possible to see it on more than 2-3 other occasions in NYC in that time.

Hoberman (who mentions that the retro will go to Cambridge, Berkeley, Washington, D.C., Rochester, Toronto, Vancouver, Houston, and Chicago):

When I interviewed Hou many years ago in Tapei we met at his preferred spot, a Japanese style teahouse—a marked contrast to the “Chicago-style” burger joint chosen by Hou’s leading contemporary Edward Yang. Unlike the gregarious Yang, whose masterpiece A Brighter Summer Day (1991) concerns Taiwan’s “American” period, immersed in high school turf wars and imported Elvis worship, Hou was reserved and modest, preferring to speak through a translator although he clearly understood English. He disliked travel, he told me, and was critical of Taiwanese investors who, rather than support Taiwanese films, preferred to put their money in Hong Kong or mainland productions: “It’s typical. People don’t value their roots here.” Rather than talk movies, he preferred to explain the history of Cold War Taiwan.

http://www.nybooks.com/blogs/nyrblog/2014/sep/19/taiwan-master-timekeeper-hou-hsiao-hsien/

I don't really know if it circulates in Europe, I'd guess there would be french copies. I can't figure out if any of his films ever got a Danish premiere (four are mentioned in the database, but without premiere-dates and number of tickets sold. Don't know what that means) He is way more obscure than he should be, and I'd love for this retrospective to come to Copenhagen.

There was a retrospective in 2007, apparantly. Time for one more!

Liked the piece quite a bit:

In a certain sense, Hou is an artist out of time—a reminder of our belatedness more than his. When Flight of the Red Balloon (2007) opened here in 2008, I began my Village Voice review with the unprovable assertion that if the director were French, he’d be far more appreciated. Flight of the Red Balloon was in a way a French movie, shot in Paris (it even played at the Paris Theater in New York) but I should have written, “if Hou were French and we were still living in 1974.” His presence signifies the end of a particular era in film culture that ended long ago.

Even in the mid-70s 'timekeeper' stuff was getting made in France but how appreciated was it really?

More valuable is how that moment has lingered on and taken further by others in different ways, that includes Hou.

Saw the '83 omnibus film The Sandwich Man, intro by Jonathan Rosenbaum (who reminisced about singing drunken Beatles karaoke with Hou in '91). Hou's title segment was likely the best-made -- apparently a transitional work from the three pop comedies he'd made -- but in a way the other two episodes were more socially acute, the second beginning essentially as comedy and sliding into tragedy, the third vice-versa, and taking as their respective themes the role of the Japanese and American presence in Taiwan.

https://whatson.bfi.org.uk/Online/default.asp?BOparam::WScontent::loadArticle::permalink=houhsiaohsien&BOparam::WScontent::loadArticle::context_id=

Can't wait.

i want to delve into that season but am wary of which to see. i wasnt into city of sadness but did like a time to live a lot (on second viewing at least)...

am wondering what those early genre movies of his are like.

see as much as you can imo!, just because it's all enlightening, & seeing the development of his style adds a lot to the films you're watching & the films you've seen. but probably if you want to be cost effective see everything after (/inc.) the boys from fengkuei, which is the first genre pic to really mirror his later kinda multi-generational semi-slo-mo dynasty style. actually seeing (& hearing, really great scores & fx throughout) taiwan genre cinema from the '80s is just super interesting anyway i think.

the genre movies are like taiwanese porky's btw

Yeah its gonna be interesting to see some genre work as well as things like Puppetmaster.

does the assassin have a uk release date? i want to see that more than the old ones tbh.

no it doesn't / go see the old ones

i want to see that more than the old ones tbh.

What are the BFI doing showing us old films huh?

i think HHH is the kind of director whose films you have to watch twice. i didnt get a time to live and time to die until the second time. i really liked the boys from fengkui and summer at grandpas house, though at times im not totally sure why - theres a real delicacy in SAGH, but i love how that seemingly idyllic surface is broken up by these violent/domestic disruptions, but without it being jarring. HHH isnt trying to shock, or be 'disruptive' to the mood, he somehow makes it seem totally level (which occasionally i think might be his flaw). is dust in the wind worth seeing?

Dust in the Wind is the only one I've seen twice, and yeah, it's definitely worth seeing. It's very much life as it happens, and I think the first of his films where the characters reach some kind of maturity. I'm still having trouble figuring out what happens and who is related to who, but some of it is edged in my memory.

any supporters of daughters of the nile? i want to see that one more than dust as it sounds a bit more urban in setting, but might just do both, as neither are on dvd.

Dust in the Wind is better, but they're pretty much all good. Watch them both, definitely.

I loved City Of Sadness. It was long but had a really strong sense of period authenticity and some subtle performances and Flowers Of Shanghai was also beautiful as well. I need to watch A Time to Live ... next.

i didnt get a time to live and time to die until the second time.

What didn't you get the first time that was now clear?

Its a beautiful film and fearless about confronting the grubby business of death in the family. As w/many things, it grows the more you spend time with it, but I loved it on my only viewing.

City of Sadness available in a decent print on YouTube btw