AFI's Heroes/Villains Poll

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I'm not a big fan of lists, but they can be great topics for debate. I think the AFI got it right when they placed Hannibal Lecter, Norman Bates, and Darth Vader as the Top 3 Villains. Some other good choices for the Top 10 were the Wicked Witch of the West from The Wizard of Oz and Nurse Ratched from One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest. I definitely think Frank "Don't you fuckin look at me" Booth from Blue Velvet should have placed higher (he was ranked 36), I can't think of another villain in the movies who has ever shocked me and earned my hatred like him. The Heroes side isn't really as fun (bad guys are always more interesting). Atticus Finch from To Kill A Mockingbird was first, but believe it or not I've never seen that movie. Indiana Jones and Will Kane from High Noon were up there, great choices in my opinion.

― Anthony (Anthony F), Friday, 13 June 2003 20:13 (twenty-two years ago)

Things that crossed my mind:
1) James Bond was picked for his role in Dr. No, where Bond is probably at his coldest, most badass. I'm talking specifically about the scene where he shoots that guy in cold blood, after the guy tries to shoot Bond with an empty gun. Goldfinger is the standard (and rightful, I believe) favorite, and I was surprised that they didn't go with that movie (for Bond, that is...Auric Goldfinger himself was cited in the villain list).

2) Travis Bickle (Taxi Driver) was placed in the villain list. Now, he's not exactly a savory fellow, but I think it's not a clear cut decision to name him as a villain. The men he killed were all criminals, and his motivation really sets him apart from the others on the villain list. But he's such a fascinating character that the voters probably wanted to acknowledge him in some way.

― Ernest P. (ernestp), Friday, 13 June 2003 21:10 (twenty-two years ago)

btw, here's the AFI list.

― Ernest P. (ernestp), Friday, 13 June 2003 21:14 (twenty-two years ago)

Why are Bonnie and Clyde on the "villains" list while Thelma and Louise are on the "heroes" list?

― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 13 June 2003 21:32 (twenty-two years ago)

that's a good question. the afi is very mysterious.*

* mysterious in the sense "stupid and irrelevant."

― amateurist (amateurist), Friday, 13 June 2003 21:44 (twenty-two years ago)

I can't stand these AFI lists. I don't even bother reading them any more. Amateurist is right, they're totally irrelevant.

Who cares what these creeps think? Oohh, Karen Silkwood is the number forty-seven American movie hero of all time! What does that even mean, in any sense?

― s1utsky (slutsky), Friday, 13 June 2003 22:32 (twenty-two years ago)

also, HAL 9000 isn't a villain, he's a tragic hero.

Same goes for Alex Forrest and Delarge, Dracula, Tony Camonte, and the Alien.

― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Saturday, 14 June 2003 05:29 (twenty-two years ago)

I object to call machines, animals and psychotics villains. They have not chosen to be evil and to me that's what villainy is all about. Sociopaths are a different matter - where are Tommy from Goodfellas, Waingro from Heat and Bill the Butcher?

― Sommermute (Wintermute), Saturday, 14 June 2003 10:14 (twenty-two years ago)

throw me in with the "stop, AFI, stop!" group.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 14 June 2003 12:56 (twenty-two years ago)

I thought John Doe from Se7en would be there, surely. Also, not that I was expecting it, but Harry Roat (Alan Arkin) from Wait Until Dark or Kane (Julian Beck) from Poltergeist 2 would have been a treat.

― Joe (Joe), Saturday, 14 June 2003 15:00 (twenty-two years ago)

They should do a list of American cinema's greatest tragic heroes. And misunderstood villains. And "loose cannon" cops. That one can be called "America turns in its badge."

― s1utsky (slutsky), Saturday, 14 June 2003 15:21 (twenty-two years ago)

but didn't gary cooper in "high noon" make the list?

seriously, if buster keaton in "steamboat bill jr." doesn't top the heroes list, why bother?

― amateurist (amateurist), Sunday, 15 June 2003 04:27 (twenty-two years ago)

Isn't it curious that only two of the top ten heroes were female, while six of the top ten villains were?

― Applepie Baseball, Thursday, 19 June 2003 01:07 (twenty-two years ago)

bitches.

― jm (jtm), Thursday, 19 June 2003 04:51 (twenty-two years ago)

This is fucking stupid! I understand you can have "villains" and "heroes" in kiddie films and action flicks, but how can you call Alex from A Clockwork Orange a villain? Serious non-genre movies don't divide people into bad guys and good guys.

― Tuomas (Tuomas), Thursday, 19 June 2003 10:01 (twenty-two years ago)

I think this ties into what the AFI's job should be; that is, to draw attention to neglected films (which includes a lot of genre movies) e.g. Jimmy Stewart deserves to be honoured, but instead of George Bailey or Jefferson Smith why not Howard Kemp from The Naked Spur? Oh wait, he's too complex to fit into the hero/villain dichotomy. So why not do a "100 characters" list and not require that stupidly limiting distinction?

I admit, though, that the villains list is actually pretty cool, although if you accept the lame "cultural impact/legacy" criteria there's no way anyone beats Vader.

― b.R.A.d. (Brad), Friday, 20 June 2003 03:18 (twenty-two years ago)

two months pass...

When I first read this, I though you were talking about a poll compiled by these assholes.....

http://image.allmusic.com/00/amg/pic200_web/drp400/p406/p40648crhvi.jpg

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Saturday, 23 August 2003 05:42 (twenty-two years ago)

What's that, a band called AFI?

― Tuomas (Tuomas), Saturday, 23 August 2003 09:15 (twenty-two years ago)

yep

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Saturday, 23 August 2003 09:23 (twenty-two years ago)

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