Why did Kubrick always receive such a critical panning?

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Okay, so he did get his dues here and there, but it always seems to be subsequent responses that settled the score, whereas on release his films were rarely well-received.
2001 opened to mostly negative reviews, and in that case it could be argued that Kubrick was simply ahead of his time. It's his later work that I feel got the rawest deal, though.
For example The Shining opened to largely negative reviews, yet I consider it one of the greatest horror films ever made. Not much else I've seen inspires such a feeling of dread in me, even after countless viewings.
In my opinion, alot of the criticism stems from his characterisation, and his 'clinical' approach to it. Clinical? Who didn't feel at least a twinge of sympathy as Private Pyle cried after being savagely beaten by his fellow marines?
Kubrick always approached film as a visual medium, and was interested in subjective responses from his audiences, perhaps that's why his work didn't stand up to critics objective viewings, and left them feeling 'unsatisfied' (I personally have never felt unsatisfied by a Kubrick film).
I think it is unfair to judge a film on the same basis as you would a novel, which is probably why it irks me so much to read critics referring to The Shining's adaptation as unfaithful, as though it were a negative judgement.
Any thoughts about Stanley?

David Steans, Wednesday, 13 August 2003 21:09 (twenty-two years ago)

I thought the critics always liked Kubrick. maybe he makes the kind of films that "proper" critics like, but not the kind of tards who review films for the Idaho Redneck.

even so, you are right that he is usually seen as making films that are cold and unemotional, which is an odd thing to say if you have actually seen his films.

DV (dirtyvicar), Thursday, 14 August 2003 10:53 (twenty-two years ago)

I think he stopped becoming a critical darling after 2001.

David Steans, Thursday, 14 August 2003 11:00 (twenty-two years ago)

Critics' response after first viewing : "Wot no explicit emotion? This Kubrick, he's a cold bastard."

After second viewing : "Wait - there's a lot going on beneath the surface innit? All the actors looking tense and anxious and all. This Kubrick, he's a genius."

After having heard about Kubrick's MO : "So the actors are tense because Kubrick made them repeat every take a million times? OMG WTF! This Kubrick, he's a mentalist."

Or so I would figure.

Sommermute (Wintermute), Thursday, 14 August 2003 12:36 (twenty-two years ago)

you know that Shelly Duval story in The Shining (about he horribly bullied her so that she would look really tense on camera): it doesn't say much for his opinions of her acting ability.

DV (dirtyvicar), Thursday, 14 August 2003 13:03 (twenty-two years ago)

Actually the best Kubrick movies are those that were liked by the critics: Dr. Strangelove and A Clockwork Orange. 2001 was pretentious and over-the-top, so no reason for critics to love it. The Shining was a (admittedly effective) horror movie which tried to be something more, but didn't quite make it, so the critics responded accordingly. I like Kubrick, but I don't agree with the common opinion that every film he made after Lolita was a masterpiece.

Tuomas (Tuomas), Thursday, 14 August 2003 13:38 (twenty-two years ago)

I think he gets unfair criticism precisely because of that assumption;
I don't think everything after Lolita is a masterpiece, but I don't think he's made a bad film, either.
I think The Shining is certainly a masterpiece of modern horror.

David Steans, Thursday, 14 August 2003 14:33 (twenty-two years ago)

A Clockwork Orange is not one of Kubrick's best films.

DV (dirtyvicar), Thursday, 14 August 2003 21:16 (twenty-two years ago)

surely Eyes Wide Shut is a bad film?

jed-e-3, Thursday, 14 August 2003 23:27 (twenty-two years ago)

Over the years, my admiration of Kubrick's work has slightly dwindled. That's not to say I don't like him, it's just that when I was younger and first started getting into film seriously, I hadn't much experience with other directors, so I thought Kubrick was like the God of cinema. I don't feel the same way nowadays, but he still doesn't get the respect he deserves among the "wine and cheese" groups.

The thing I dislike about Kubrick is the anti-human thing he has going on. He just wasn't a people person, in his art and in life. But what I really like is how his films depend so highly on the images, which, if you think about it, is really how it should be. Some of Kubrick's films I have loved from the first time I saw them and still do love them (2001, Dr. Strangelove). Others, I am up in the air with (Clockwork Orange, Eyes Wide Shut, Spartacus).

But the one Kubrick film that I have loved more and more with each subsequent viewing is Full Metal Jacket. This is the one Kubrick film that received the most mixed critical response, some calling it one of the greatest war films ever made, others calling it a complete cinematic mess. This is Kubrick's most challenging film (in retrospect, even moreso than 2001), and I think the reason for this is that the film's storytelling technique relies less on the acting, dialogue, and usual narrative techniques and more on what we see. It's tough to get, but the way to really appreciate the film is to look not necessarily at what the shot is of, but what's going in the background and corners of the shot, what preceded and followed the shot, how it was shot, and how shots in the "first half" and "second half" of the film connect in the end.

If anything, I think this was Kubrick's greatest strength, the fact that he pushed beyond traditional narrative and strove to make film, a visual art, more visually oriented.

Anthony (Anthony F), Friday, 15 August 2003 02:53 (twenty-two years ago)

Kubrick was totally despised by at least two major, influential critics - Kael and Thomson - which undoubtedly affected the general reception of his work when it first came out.

I think FMJ is underrated also: the "it doesn't look like Vietnam" complaint usually comes from people whose only knowledge of Vietnam comes from, uh, the movies.

Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 15 August 2003 08:33 (twenty-two years ago)

Justyn is OTM. Vietnam vets have said Full Metal Jacket looks more realistic than the other films often championed as being hyper-authentic.

David Steans, Friday, 15 August 2003 09:38 (twenty-two years ago)

It's funny, everyone who's into Kubrick has a different favourite.

David Steans, Friday, 15 August 2003 09:41 (twenty-two years ago)

oh come on... FMJ looks like it was set where it was filmed - in a wrecked bit of London's docklands.

I wouldn't mind seeing FMJ again, but I remember thinking that the war stuff wasn't as good as the training camp stuff.

I'm fond of Eyes Wide Shut. It is essentially a David Lynch film made in the style of Stanley Kubrick, and that's what's so great about it.

DV (dirtyvicar), Friday, 15 August 2003 12:41 (twenty-two years ago)

"Vietnam vets have said Full Metal Jacket looks more realistic than the other films"

This is absolutely true. Roger Ebert was one of the critics that complained of the film's "unrealistic" look, however, most people's idea of Vietnam come from Apocalypse Now and Platoon. Vietnam isn't all wilderness. The Vietnam FMJ portrays are the cities, that AN and Platoon never touched on. I have heard some Vietnam vets say the sets in FMJ are so close to the real thing, they actually thought it was filmed on-location.

Anthony (Anthony F), Friday, 15 August 2003 15:28 (twenty-two years ago)

i like The Killing a lot.

j fail (cenotaph), Friday, 15 August 2003 16:53 (twenty-two years ago)

The Killing is great entertainment. It isn't as intelligent as, say, Double Indemnity, but does every movie have to be an intellectual experience?

I'm surprised this movie isn't more often cited as being a major cinematic influence. Everyone talked about how groundbreaking Pulp Fiction's structure was, but The Killing was decades ahead of it.

Anthony (Anthony F), Friday, 15 August 2003 19:13 (twenty-two years ago)

Barry Lyndon is a really good movie. The battle scenes are very realistic and give one an idea what it was like to fight in the Napoleonic era. I really like the quote at the end.

Critics probably always wish Kubrick was doing something else rather than being objective about the film they recieved. This probably stems from doing so few films over such a long career.

To me, one of the most impressive things about all of his films was that they look amazing.

earlnash, Monday, 18 August 2003 12:06 (twenty-two years ago)

The main reason Kubrick got a kicking was because the critics were all jealous of him.

jim paper-jam, Monday, 18 August 2003 21:02 (twenty-two years ago)

But it is true Kubrick's films are almost always cold and lacking in emotion, right? I do think Dr. Strangelove and A Clockwork Orange are perfect films in their own right, and I'd give them five stars anyday, but they're still not among my favourite movies. Those film's are great because of their subject matter, not because of their complex and an identifiable characters, which were hardly Kubrick's speciality. 2001 and Shining, on other hand, fail because their subject matter is somewhat goofy (Shining works well as a horror flick, however). This is also why I have much love for Barry Lyndon and Eyes Wide Shut, flawed as they may be; in those flicks Kubrick did try to build characters, and not just say something about the human condition. The ending of Eyes Wide Shut showed Kubrick more humane than he'd been since Paths of Glory.

Tuomas (Tuomas), Tuesday, 19 August 2003 09:37 (twenty-two years ago)

Eyes Wide Shut was alot more accomplished than it was given credit for.
With Kubrick, the critics often seem to focus on what isn't there, instead of what is.

David Steans, Tuesday, 19 August 2003 16:12 (twenty-two years ago)

I love Eyes Wide Shut, but the one thing I really dislike is Cruise's visions of Kidman with the naval officer. I think Kubrick had the opportunity to create something really creepy and dream-like, and instead he just gives us these cheap-looking shots, which just seem really incongruous with the rest of the film.

David Steans, Sunday, 24 August 2003 12:02 (twenty-two years ago)

Have to agree with you there. They reminded me of the cheap softcore/Red Shoesesque stuff they always show on HBO in the middle of the night.

The thing I always love about Kubrick is how I invariably expect there to be more than there is, yet I never seem to mind what I got.

Girolamo Savonarola, Sunday, 24 August 2003 15:00 (twenty-two years ago)

Every film Kubrick made after Lolita IS a masterpiece. Sure some of them are flawed in spots, but they are still brilliant, individual and groundbreaking.

As far as the Naval Officer is concerned, those shots are representations of Dr. Harfords lame imagination visuallizing what his wife wanted -- so to make them creepy and dreamlike would have been totally incongruous. Haven't you ever felt jealousy before? Well I have, and those shots are like quivering little daggers in Harford's mind.

I mean come on, the 'real' parts of the film are creepy and dreamlike to begin with.

PVC (peeveecee), Wednesday, 27 August 2003 22:06 (twenty-two years ago)

Just re-watched Eyes Wide Shut, and the pre-lude to the orgy (with the Romanian chanting and Nick Nightingale playing keyboard blindfolded) is nothing short of masterful. It was so good I wanted to cry.

I sort of figured that would be Kubrick's thinking behind the naval officer scenes, and they do sit better on subsequent viewings, I just hate the grainy blue film it's shot with. Music's good though.

David Steans, Thursday, 28 August 2003 15:03 (twenty-two years ago)

two weeks pass...
I recommend these two takes on Eyes Wide Shut, "pro" from Rob Nelson and "con" from Stuart Klawans. Along with David Thomson's essay on The Shining, they're the best writing on Kubrick there is.

http://www.citypages.com/databank/20/972/article7786.asp

http://thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=19990809&s=klawans

Pete Scholtes, Thursday, 11 September 2003 18:41 (twenty-two years ago)

eight months pass...
Just as a FYI to BitTorrent users out there, that "exploding star" site just posted a torrent file for downloading the three early Kubrick documentaries The Seafarers, Day of the Fight, Flying Padre and the full length Fear And Desire

Elvis Telecom (Chris Barrus), Wednesday, 26 May 2004 20:12 (twenty-one years ago)

I like early Kubrick, but find all his later films fatally flawed--with exception of "The Shining." He doesn't seem to have gotten out among people too much, does he? I watched "Eyes Wide Shut" a couple times, and I just find it completely silly and stupid. The whole thing's off. Kael and Thompson and others were right--he just wasn't interested in what makes film interesting, and there's such a lack of humor. I admit his films are...interesting and worth seeing, and they look cool, but that don't add up to good film in my book. But "The Killing" and "Strangelove," and parts of "Lolita," are great. "Lolita" is a good example of what goes wrong with Kubrick. He couldn't film it in America, or wouldn't, so it loses all the tanginess of Nabokov. However, on the plus side, the early set pieces are nice, and it's well-cast. So, an interesting failure--he was just too damned cold to make a real go of that novel, and it's a shame.

eddie hurt (ddduncan), Friday, 28 May 2004 17:18 (twenty-one years ago)

Anecdotally, Patrice Leconte came by my film school this week to give a quick masterclass, and he actually asked the entire class (in French) if anyone wanted to be like Stanley Kubrick. When no one raised their hand (sensing, perhaps, a set up), Leconte smiled and said "good!" That was deeply confusing for me, because while certainly Kubrick is not the be-all end-all of cinema that he seemed primed as (especially, as with all great artists, during the years of inactivity), I find it hard to believe that anyone doubts that he was one of the best directors out there, at least for a time.

Girolamo Savonarola, Friday, 28 May 2004 20:43 (twenty-one years ago)

Kael and Thompson and others were right--he just wasn't interested in what makes film interesting, and there's such a lack of humor.
Huh? His last three films are humorous at parts - the over-the-top silliness of EWS, the DI and large chunks of the second-half of EWS, Nicholson's performance in the Shining.

I fundamentally disagree with any reading of him as cold, anyway.

And for "he just wasn't interested in what makes film interesting," what does that mean? What, exactly, makes 'film interesting'?

miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Friday, 28 May 2004 22:56 (twenty-one years ago)

i guess for me the thing about kubrick is that he's not bad, but by no means does he seem to warrant the sort of attention given him.

the title of this thread is ridiculous.

amateur!st (amateurist), Saturday, 29 May 2004 04:48 (twenty-one years ago)

"And for "he just wasn't interested in what makes film interesting," what does that mean? What, exactly, makes 'film interesting'? "

they're probably referring to what they see as the exuberance or heart-on-the sleeve emotional power of film or something like that. kubrick is not cold, but he is outside, detached from the action in his films. that probaly irks some critics (such as pauline kael) who like it when film absorbs you directly by overwhelming you with the emotions, images, etc. not that i'm saying that kubrick doesn't always do that either but his perspective can SEEM cold to some people.

but that's his brilliance though, that he can portray characters and situations which you feel empathy for even though it's like watching them from outside.

latebloomer (latebloomer), Saturday, 29 May 2004 10:33 (twenty-one years ago)

and i don't see a lack of humor at all in kubrick's films. in fact there's plenty of humor, though most of it is black humor.

latebloomer (latebloomer), Saturday, 29 May 2004 10:36 (twenty-one years ago)

eerrr why's the title ridiculous?

David-Graham Steans, Saturday, 29 May 2004 12:18 (twenty-one years ago)

and if kubrick appears cold, or is cold, is that necessarily a negative quality? isn't that interesting in itself, you know, a different take on filmaking, and in its uniqueness as personal as the more 'heartfelt' work of whoever you would consider his peers during his peak (perhaps rafelson altman coppola and the rest of the new hollywood)?

David-Graham Steans, Saturday, 29 May 2004 12:37 (twenty-one years ago)

the title's ridiculous because its not true.

jed_ (jed), Sunday, 30 May 2004 12:09 (twenty-one years ago)

one year passes...
"Cold" re Kubrick... as if being as "warm" would automatically be good, the way Ron Howard and Nora Ephron always are?

I will grant you that his films tend to be liked more by people who think that the human race is at best a semi-disaster.

I think the thread title has some validity, tho I haven't gone back to the contemporaneous reviews and kept score. The NY Times critic, Bosley Crowther, was generally puzzled by "Paths of Glory," basically asking what the point of the film was since the military commanders' actions were clearly aberrant, so there was no larger social commentary. So pans by the likes of him could be expected.

Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 27 October 2005 19:06 (twenty years ago)

bosley crowther is fascinating. i have never heard anyone bring his name up except in the context of him missing the point. someone should make a biopic about him.

a spectator bird (a spectator bird), Thursday, 27 October 2005 19:44 (twenty years ago)

Hasn't every film of his from 2001 on gained in reputation over time?

M. V. (M.V.), Friday, 28 October 2005 02:40 (twenty years ago)

pauline kael quotes bosley crowther on lolita: "mr. kubrick inclines to dwell too long over scenes that have slight purpose, such as scenes in which mr. sellers does various comical impersonations as the sneaky villain who dogs mr. mason's trail."

J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 28 October 2005 16:38 (twenty years ago)

I've grown to like Kubrick's Lolita, but I think that everybody except Shelley Winters is miscast.

k/l (Ken L), Friday, 28 October 2005 16:57 (twenty years ago)


Mason as Humbert? Too elegant, not decadent and grotty enough?

Gaining in rep is mostly a function of his getting old/dying, but I don't think that trend has reached Eyes Wide Shut yet.

Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Friday, 28 October 2005 17:19 (twenty years ago)

Yeah, too buttoned down, not Continental enough.

k/l (Ken L), Friday, 28 October 2005 17:39 (twenty years ago)

lolita is more or less unfilmable, but the kubrick version works brilliantly as a black comedy. it's my favorite of his films.

J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Saturday, 29 October 2005 00:09 (twenty years ago)

Re Crowther, here's the opening to his review of Throne of Blood:

If you think it would be amusing to see "Macbeth" done in Japanese, then pop around to the Fifth Avenue Cinema and see Akira Kurosawa's "Throne of Blood." For a free Oriental translation of the Shakespeare drama is what this is, and amusing is the proper word for it.

Stephen X (Stephen X), Thursday, 3 November 2005 16:03 (twenty years ago)


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