RFI: Stealing Home

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Ty Cobb holds the record for times in a season (8) and all-time (54).

This one has always left me a little perplexed, and the odds/frequency of this happening are a little rare.

It's got to be a righty at bat because the catcher can be distracted by a large ass blocking his periphery between third and home. And the pitcher should be a lefty so he has his back at you during delivery (of what's most probably an offspeed pitch).

Have you seen anyone steal home successfully and who was it and what was the set-up? I've only seen the last few moments of Robinsons' famous examples from brief highlight reels.

FYI: I read a nice article from baseball digest that talked about the lost art of stealing home which prompted this thread.

gygax! (gygax!), Wednesday, 4 February 2004 01:40 (twenty-two years ago)

I remember seeing Tim Raines when he was with the Expos steal home against the Cubs. I don't remember the details.

I think it could be done with a right handed pitcher with a slow delivery, possibly trying to pitch away to a power hitter. I think it has to be either someone that has complete blinding speed or a situation where they are not paying attention to what is going on.

The stolen base is a lost tool. The Marlins brought back a bit of what made Herzog's Cardinals tough. The Cards only had one decent power hitter in their lineup (early on George Hendrick, later Jack Clark and to a much lesser extent Andy Van Slyke), but every one else in their lineup was a switch hitter, could run and usually always made contact. Add in that turf and they could take apart some pitchers that were even on their game.

Some teams I think don't want players stealing bases out of the idea it is easy to get hurt sliding around the base paths. It is easy to break a finger, jam something up or have some freaky collison happen.
I grew up seeing Tim Raines, Eric Davis and Ricky Henderson in their prime and both were just freaks that could take apart teams when they got on base.

Raines and Davis' career were definitely shorted up from the pounding they took, at their peak they were both as good as it gets. Henderson seemed to weather it better, but he missed quite a few games over his career.

The squeeze play is also not used as much as it could be, but it is similar and quite effective with the right personnel (i.e. someone that actually knows how to bunt). Zimmer was pretty crazy as a manager, he did a suicide squeeze once with Mitch Williams (yes that one) on third and it worked.

earlnash, Wednesday, 4 February 2004 04:19 (twenty-two years ago)

I stole home once when I was thirteen!

Good baserunning in general is a lost tool, I think, and increasing acceptance of sabremetric theory will only bury it further. Stealing home is such a rare play that there's an insufficient sample size to assess its risk and payoff--but it seems pretty risky. Unless there are two outs, it seems like you'd be better off going for a fly ball or hit rather than (cliché ahead) taking the bat out of the hitter's hands. Or squeezing, except that no one can bunt any more...

mookieproof (mookieproof), Wednesday, 4 February 2004 15:12 (twenty-two years ago)

Stealing home was my specialty when I was in junior high, but it was kinda cheating: I'd just take a huge lead, like obscenely huge, like duh-I-don't-know-what-I'm-doing huge, get a scared "deer in headlights" look in my eye, dare the catcher to throw back. As soon as he did, I was off. I only got caught by a fake one time, but I'd say I scored 10 or 15 runs like this.

Of course, I couldn't hit and my arm was for shit, but I was definitely the Herb Washington of my league. Other teams hated my guts...and so did my own teammates, but for different reasons.

Begs2Differ, Wednesday, 4 February 2004 16:16 (twenty-two years ago)

Nails

mookieproof (mookieproof), Wednesday, 4 February 2004 17:01 (twenty-two years ago)

On a pitchout, would the slow delivery/pitch get balanced out by the catcher's increased field of vision?

Leee Majors (Leee), Thursday, 5 February 2004 00:27 (twenty-two years ago)

I think most pitchouts are delivered pretty quickly (otherwise giving the baserunner more time to execute his thievery).

gygax! (gygax!), Thursday, 5 February 2004 00:49 (twenty-two years ago)

i saw billy hatcher steal home, i believe it was on a botched squeeze play.

otto midnight, Thursday, 5 February 2004 02:41 (twenty-two years ago)

A pitchout on a steal of home wouldn't necessarily be a good thing, as the catcher would have to go up to get the ball and then down to get the runner. Someone stealing another base, this is an advantage as the catcher is getting the ball at a ready to throw position.

If the runner has a big jump, he is going to be on the plate probably around the time the pitch gets to the plate.

That one clip of Jackie Robinson stealing home against the Yankees during the World Series, Yogi Berra gets the ball on a regular pitch and has to quickly make the tag. I've seen Berra state to this day that Robinson was out, as if you remember he gets up in the umps face right after the safe call.

earlnash, Thursday, 5 February 2004 02:46 (twenty-two years ago)

one year passes...
For a short time you can see Shea Hillenbrand steal home off of a Randy Johnson pick-off attempt to first, knowing Giambi can't throw/field very well:

(copy/paste into your media player URL window)
mms://a1503.v108692.c10869.g.vm.akamaistream.net/7/1503/10869/v0001/mlb.download.akamai.com/10869/2005/open/topplays/archive08/080605_nyator_hillenbrand_run_350.wmv?ct1=mlb

gygax! (gygax!), Saturday, 6 August 2005 22:52 (twenty years ago)

oh man that's the worst throw I've ever seen

gear (gear), Saturday, 6 August 2005 22:58 (twenty years ago)


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