RFI: Pitches and their order in the pitch count

For me, the funniest moment in Moneyball was when Hatteberg fouled off six straight Jamie Moyer pitches, so Moyer comes down off the mound and yells "What do you want? I'll throw it!" and Hatteberg doesn't know what to say...

Dave Duncan changed things being the pitching coach under LaRussa, he was the first coach to get into databasing every pitch and what each hitter did and do alot of statistical study back in the late 80s. Everyone does it now.

It depends on the pitcher and the hitter involved. Some pitchers are not that subtle either, it is just reach back and deal smoke.

Some of the hitters that make pitchers crazyist are the ones that hit all sorts of crap, so it doesn't matter. You might be able to fool them and get them chasing pitches, but sometimes they can hit those OK.

It is impressive how much Moyer has improved. He pitched forever and was never that great, but he has really figured things out and has become a very solid starter. I think Moyer may have needed for his arm to decay enough so he could throw that slow. I wouldn't be suprised if he turns into someone like Orosco and keeps pitching into his late 40s.

I know pitch count has become such a huge thing with pitchers. Beyond being able to draw walks, has there been much statistical study benefit on teams that force clubs to throw more total pitches in a game or an inning?

I'm curious about the breaking point for some starters. This was thinking about so many starters, some of them quite good that seem to often sail through 5 and then completely become unhinged. I'd say the mean on this would be around 90-100 total pitches, but it seems to me to be when all the sudden a pitcher loses efficiency has to throw maybe 20-25+ pitches in an inning. It can come early in the game, even if they somehow get buy that inning the next they seem gassed. Usually it is a loss of control that leads to many starters downfall, they miss a couple pitches and put people on bass and/or plant a pitch that can be driven or seem to just run out of gas from going to a high pitch inning. I was wondering if there was an amount of pitches in a single inning being statistically when a starter or reliever uses it? It seems that reliever that gets tasked with a 15-20 pitch inning is pretty much done too, even if they survive without giving up a run going to a second inning often too.

Vice versa what lineups are best at the knock out punch inning? I'd say that is a big part of some of the Cubs early success has been that they often seem to be able to get starters to come completely unhinged and get lots of big innings.

The impact of high stress innings has definitely been studied. Throwing 120 pitches in a CG without any really tough innings is much harder on arms than throwing "only" 100 pitches but laboring through five innings. I think pitchers that have to gut out 25-30 pitch innings have a higher chance of getting bombed in their next start, and a higher risk of short term injury. It makes sense for that to happen within a single game too.

High contact teams are probably the best at the knock out punch inning because they can extend at bats and drive up pitch counts. Teams that strike a lot like the Cubs (although less than they were last year) are probably less good at it. On the other hand, home run hitting teams tend to be good at working counts, and can drive up the pitch counts by having big innings.