The official 8-year, $136 million 2007 CUBS thread

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mattbot, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 19:09 (eighteen years ago)

Prior and Wood see their first action in spring training. Good to see the Sun-Times trying to create a little starting rotation controversy right from the start:

Prior, who's trying to shake his shoulder problems, started the game and struggled from the start, falling behind every batter but one and using up his 40-pitch limit in just 1 1/3 innings. His velocity topped out at 88 mph, and that was only one pitch. Scouts in attendance said his fastball was generally 84 to 86 mph.

''That's not going to get it done,'' one National League scout said.

...

Wood, who's moving to the bullpen this year after three straight injury-shortened seasons, looks as worry-free as anybody in camp.

He needed just 12 pitches -- most of them clocked in the mid-90s -- to dispatch Adrian Beltre, Jose Guillen and Richie Sexson in order, including a strikeout of Guillen on a slider.

''I feel great. I've been ready to go this spring,'' said Wood, who like Prior was making his first Cactus League appearance since 2005. ''It's just nice to get some adrenaline running through my body for the first time in a while.

''My heart was racing, but I was able to stay composed and make some pitches.''

If anything, Wood has looked so strong this spring -- and no more so than Monday -- that it might be tempting to start thinking about the starting rotation again with him.

mattbot, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 19:12 (eighteen years ago)

Hooray! 95!

I'm optimistic about Kerry. Is 75 wins to much to ask for?

Jeff, Wednesday, 7 March 2007 12:19 (eighteen years ago)

That's a lot for a reliever.

G00blar, Wednesday, 7 March 2007 14:02 (eighteen years ago)

That's a lot for the Cubs.

Leee, Wednesday, 7 March 2007 18:08 (eighteen years ago)

two weeks pass...
Prior hits 93 mph a few times on the gun today. 1 run in 4 innings, 3 K. Stop me if you've heard this one.

mattbot, Friday, 23 March 2007 00:49 (eighteen years ago)

Wood will start the season on the DL.

Jeff, Wednesday, 28 March 2007 00:12 (eighteen years ago)

Opening day lineup:

A. Soriano cf .000
M. Murton lf .000
D. Lee 1b .000
A. Ramirez 3b .000
J. Jones rf .000
M. Barrett c .000
M. DeRosa 2b .000
C. Izturis ss .000
C. Zambrano p .000

For the first time since Riggleman there's actually someone batting second who's a threat to not make an out. I'm counting on Soriano to pull an opening day Tuffy Rhodes act.

mattbot, Monday, 2 April 2007 17:08 (eighteen years ago)

Frakking Zambrano!

Leee, Monday, 2 April 2007 19:37 (eighteen years ago)

Uniform uniformity

Cubs starting pitchers usually get to select which color jersey the team wears, with the choice of blue or gray on the road and blue or white at home. Carlos Zambrano always has preferred to pitch in the blue jerseys, as he did all of spring training, but the team wore gray Monday.

As it turns out, Zambrano had no choice. Cubs President John McDonough has decided the Cubs will wear gray on the road and white with blue pinstripes at home. The move corresponds with the decision to put names on the backs of the uniforms.


Thank God, Zambrano looked like an over-ripe blueberry in those awful alt unis.

mattbot, Tuesday, 3 April 2007 14:14 (eighteen years ago)

Wow. Nothing quite like the sight of Lou running out of the dugout to yell at Dumpster while snow flies in Cinci.

mattbot, Thursday, 5 April 2007 01:50 (eighteen years ago)

Today stunk.

Jeff, Friday, 6 April 2007 03:07 (eighteen years ago)

Apr 12 The Associated Press reports Chicago Cubs SP Mark Prior (shoulder) left his extended spring training start after two innings Thursday, April 12, with right shoulder discomfort. The Cubs said Prior is scheduled to visit orthopedic specialist Dr. Lewis Yocum for further evaluation.


http://static.flickr.com/117/304406824_3ee3e4919b_m.jpg

mattbot, Thursday, 12 April 2007 23:06 (eighteen years ago)

http://www.tsl.state.tx.us/ld/projects/trc/2006/manual/illos/glue.jpg

The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall, Friday, 13 April 2007 15:03 (eighteen years ago)

Including the Wood and Prior setbacks, I'd say this is the most predictable Cubs team I've seen in years. 8 games in:

3-5 record
.313 team OBP
Murton benched for Floyd
Soriano with the sweet .200/.243/.314 line

I mean, who could have possibly imagined this? Yeah yeah small samples and cold weather and all that. Still.

I'm excited about Rich Hill though. And here's to hoping Wade Miller's awfulness will allow ROCKY CHERRY to make an earlier appearance in the bigs.

mattbot, Friday, 13 April 2007 16:03 (eighteen years ago)

Wow! Zambrano should be hitting cleanup!

The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall, Friday, 13 April 2007 19:35 (eighteen years ago)

Ramirez out with swollen wrist, goes to doctor

April 13, 2007

CHICAGO (AP) -- Third baseman Aramis Ramirez, one of the Chicago Cubs' hottest hitters during the first eight games, was out of the lineup with a swollen right wrist Friday and was sent to a hand specialist to be examined.

Steve Shasta, Friday, 13 April 2007 20:13 (eighteen years ago)

Lou, today:

"Na-ah-ah-I can see... I can start to see some-ah the ways that this team has lost ballgames."

What's not working overall now?

"WHAT THE HELL DO YOU THINK ISN'T WORKING!!?!?!?!!?..... You seen the damn game!"

Andy K, Friday, 13 April 2007 22:09 (eighteen years ago)

Ha ha!

The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall, Saturday, 14 April 2007 16:37 (eighteen years ago)

I mean, who could have possibly imagined this?

Everyone who went "You paid Alfonso Soriano HOW MUCH?"

milo z, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 04:49 (eighteen years ago)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uv23pqH9iG0

bnw, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 06:35 (eighteen years ago)

"The fucking changes that have happened in the Cub organization is multifold."

mattbot, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 12:09 (eighteen years ago)

Lou is bound to do a Lee Elia-caliber soliloquy this year.

Dr Morbius, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 16:29 (eighteen years ago)

or perhaps something like the famous jim mora "playoffs?!" rant...

j.q higgins, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 19:52 (eighteen years ago)

More multifold changes! Effective immediately, "Pie in the Sky" headlines will replace "Winning a Prior-ity" headlines.

Cubs top prospect Felix Pie will be in the lineup today, batting leadoff and playing center field for the injured Alfonso Soriano, who is expected to be put on the disabled list.

Pie was recalled from Class AAA Iowa and will face San Diego Padres pitcher Greg Maddux.

mattbot, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 20:07 (eighteen years ago)

does he say pee-EH like Egbert Sou-ZAY?

Dr Morbius, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 20:24 (eighteen years ago)

I think it's pee-AY, which makes the headlines even better.

mattbot, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 20:33 (eighteen years ago)

It means "foot" in many romance languages.

my favorite = Piedmont = pie d' mont = foot of the hill = foothill.

Steve Shasta, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 20:54 (eighteen years ago)

as long as we're having fun w/ language, i keep on hearing the name of alberto collaspo which looks like collapse-o, is pronounced ko-yahspo and sounds like payaso.

to me anyways...

j.q higgins, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 21:53 (eighteen years ago)

Here's a new way to lose:

Bottom 9th: Chi Cubs
- A. Miles at second
- J. Isringhausen relieved S. Taguchi
- A. Ramirez flied out to right
- M. DeRosa singled to center
- R. Cedeno ran for M. DeRosa
- J. Jones walked, R. Cedeno out at second
- M. Murton hit for H. Blanco
- M. Murton popped out to shortstop

mattbot, Friday, 20 April 2007 21:09 (eighteen years ago)

WTF

félix pié, Friday, 20 April 2007 22:33 (eighteen years ago)

I thought Gameday would have a better explanation, but except for adding that there was an "on field delay" it sez the same thing.

Alex in SF, Friday, 20 April 2007 23:01 (eighteen years ago)

"Isringhausen was helped when pinch-runner Ronny Cedeno was called out at second on a bizarre play for the second out. With Cedeno running, a 3-2 pitch to Jacque Jones was called a ball but Yadier Molina threw to second and shortstop David Eckstein tagged Cedeno when he overslid the bag.

Eckstein and LaRussa both argued Jones (erm no yahoo, you mean Cedeno) should be out, and after conferring, the umpires agreed. Matt Murton then popped out to end the game."

cbs box score initially said Jones struck out :/

bnw, Friday, 20 April 2007 23:03 (eighteen years ago)

Very weird, but it sounds like the right call.

Alex in SF, Friday, 20 April 2007 23:14 (eighteen years ago)

Wade Miller to the DL *coff*, Rocky Cherry called up for today's game. The Cubs are assembling quite the gastronomic lineup. Would be great to trade Jones for Coco Crisp.

mattbot, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 00:14 (eighteen years ago)

The Cubs are already 0-5 in one run games this year, 0-10 in one or two run games.

mattbot, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 15:04 (eighteen years ago)

What month will Lou tear the ivy off the wall in a tantrum?

Dr Morbius, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 15:23 (eighteen years ago)

CHICAGO (AP) -- Oft-injured Cubs pitcher Mark Prior will miss the entire 2007 season after surgery on his right shoulder, the biggest setback yet in his once-promising career.

The 26-year-old Prior had surgery Tuesday by noted orthopedist Dr. James Andrews in Birmingham, Ala. Andrews also worked on Prior's rotator cuff.

Prior has been beset by injuries since his first full season in the majors in 2003, when he almost pitched Chicago into its first World Series since 1945.

Prior was not on the Cubs' active roster to start the year and was optioned to Triple-A Iowa after a poor spring training. He instead went to extended spring training in Arizona, but pitched only two innings there April 12 before reporting discomfort in his shoulder.

The right-hander went to Dr. Lewis Yocum in California before going to see Andrews, who told Prior last October he had genetic looseness in his shoulder joints.

Prior is 42-29 with a 3.51 ERA in the majors. He made just nine starts last year for the Cubs after three trips to the disabled list and took a slight pay cut this season, from $3.65 million to $3.575 million.

Prior finished third in NL Cy Young voting in 2003, when he 18-6 with a 4.24 ERA and struck out 245 in 211 1-3 innings. He was the overall No. 2 pick in the 2001 draft by the Cubs.

félix pié, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 19:32 (eighteen years ago)

this douchebag is dead weight. i think something is off w/r/t his conditioning, because it takes a lot to make kerry wood look durable.

félix pié, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 19:32 (eighteen years ago)

Everyone in Chi
thinks the problem's in his head
instead of his arm

Dimension 5ive, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 20:05 (eighteen years ago)

With Theriot starting at SS today, the Cubs bench consists of:

Two mediocre OFs
Two little league shortstops
Daryle Ward
Henry Blanco

BALANCE.

mattbot, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 20:18 (eighteen years ago)

murton is not mediocre! soriano is not an OF!

félix pié, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 20:40 (eighteen years ago)

Murton should be playing over Jacque, I agree. He hasn't shown a ton in his limited opportunities so far this year though, which gets a :(

mattbot, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 20:50 (eighteen years ago)

Jumping On Prior Conclusions:

Well guess what, folks? Mark Prior has been trying to pitch for what looks like two-plus years with the kind of damage in his shoulder that would have you or I thinking about worker's compensation even though our jobs probably require little more than sitting in from of a computer much of the day. You own him an apology, and if he comes back in the way Dr. Andrews believes he can, many Cubs fans don’t deserve to reap the benefits.

mattbot, Thursday, 26 April 2007 18:25 (eighteen years ago)

playing ineffectively while injured benefits who again?

bnw, Thursday, 26 April 2007 18:46 (eighteen years ago)

maybe he owes the team an apology for not getting this done two years ago which means he'd have been back to full health (lol) last season

félix pié, Thursday, 26 April 2007 18:52 (eighteen years ago)

or maybe they couldn't find it before? i dunno. the cubs shouldn't cut bait with him (which is what some columnists are suggesting).

félix pié, Thursday, 26 April 2007 18:54 (eighteen years ago)

Yeah I don't understand that "he'll never pitch for the Cubs again" sentiment. If the Cubs can give one year contracts to the Dempsters and Millers of the baseball world, surely they can spend a little cash to see how Prior pitches in '08. He's no greater risk than Wade Miller and has somewhere close to 300 times more potential if he comes back healthy.

I think he has a $2-3 mil team option for next year?

mattbot, Thursday, 26 April 2007 19:26 (eighteen years ago)

i will be booing the small bears live and in person tomorrow :) michael barrett, you have been warned!

bnw, Saturday, 28 April 2007 00:16 (eighteen years ago)

Considering how crap Prior's career has turned out, he is still a better bet than many pitchers. Curt Schilling was a total bust and had been given up by two clubs before he got it together with the Phillies and even then he went through some injuries before becoming a big star in his 30s. Jamie Moyer was also a complete washout, nearly out of baseball before coming back and winning all of those games for the Mariners.

Odds are that it probably won't happen for Prior, but it could.

earlnash, Sunday, 29 April 2007 00:32 (eighteen years ago)

The Z Man in pitcher VORP the last 4 years: 5th, 12th, 9th, 26th (this year)

Dr Morbius, Friday, 17 August 2007 19:53 (eighteen years ago)

True, but VORP doesn't take into account mound flair or regular beanings of Jim Edmonds.

It would be very Cub-like if they found an injury now.

mattbot, Friday, 17 August 2007 20:07 (eighteen years ago)

I think BLORP might though.

mattbot, Friday, 17 August 2007 20:12 (eighteen years ago)

I think it is safe to say that this is a less dumb deal than Zito's, but I'm still not sure it's particularly smart.

Alex in SF, Friday, 17 August 2007 20:56 (eighteen years ago)

Reasons why this is good deal: Zambrano is 1) still pretty young at 26, 2) will likely have posted 5 consecutive 8.0 WARP3 years by the end of 2007 and 3) has been a model of health.

Reasons why it ain't: 214 innings from 22 year olds can come back to haunt and his BB rate is still ridiculously high and SO rate doesn't seem like its impressive enough to compensate.

Alex in SF, Friday, 17 August 2007 21:05 (eighteen years ago)

Joe Sheehan: Given where the market went last winter, that contract looks like a bargain in the context of current pay rates for pitchers. It's Barry Zito money per year, and Zambrano is a much better pitcher than Zito is. It's also five years instead of the seven that Zito got.

I have to believe that had Zambrano hit the market, he would have been able to command $20 million per season for at least seven years.

I hate giving five-year deals to pitchers as policy, but that seems to be what you have to do. Better Zambrano than someone like Gil Meche. This seems to establish the top of the pitcher market at $18MM/year, at least until Johan Santana becomes a free agent.

Dr Morbius, Tuesday, 21 August 2007 14:34 (eighteen years ago)

Hello, Craig Monroe.

Andy K, Thursday, 23 August 2007 17:49 (eighteen years ago)

Just what they needed, an insurance policy for Jacque Jones.

mattbot, Thursday, 23 August 2007 18:17 (eighteen years ago)

You mean body double.

Andy K, Thursday, 23 August 2007 18:46 (eighteen years ago)

ha!!

Stormy Davis, Friday, 24 August 2007 04:36 (eighteen years ago)

That 9th was a thing of beauty, Lou. Also, starting Monroe against a righty, it's like Koyie Hill never left!

mattbot, Monday, 27 August 2007 00:20 (eighteen years ago)

what Lou do?

Dr Morbius, Monday, 27 August 2007 13:51 (eighteen years ago)

An ill-advised hit and run call with runners on first and second and nobody out in the top of the 9th, down one. Kendall struck out and Little Lord Fontenot was thrown out easily at 3rd. Kendall does ground into a lot of double plays, but Valverde was so wild yesterday that he should've just let Kendall take the walk.

Cubs were 8-11 in Soriano's absence and gained a couple games on the Brewers to move into first. What a terrible division.

mattbot, Monday, 27 August 2007 13:58 (eighteen years ago)

well, can't wait for this series to see if the space-time continuum will permit both teams to get swept.

Dr Morbius, Monday, 27 August 2007 14:10 (eighteen years ago)

Ugh, this offense.

mattbot, Wednesday, 29 August 2007 01:50 (eighteen years ago)

...can really get it going when it matters!

mattbot, Wednesday, 29 August 2007 02:11 (eighteen years ago)

I'm inexplicably starting to love Jacque Jones. His approach at the plate is terrible, he can only hit RHP, the Cubs had two trades for him fall through in June, and he must absolutely hate Chicago and its fans given how poorly they've treated him. And his bat is red!

♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥
http://chicago.cubs.mlb.com/images/2006/09/17/vm2GbmUP.jpg
♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥

mattbot, Wednesday, 29 August 2007 14:10 (eighteen years ago)

wow, bigtime Schadenfreude on that telecast yesterday.

Dr Morbius, Tuesday, 4 September 2007 13:22 (eighteen years ago)

Soriano's certainly earned his pay today.
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/3756/tacokx0.pnghttp://img62.imageshack.us/img62/3756/tacokx0.png

mattbot, Thursday, 6 September 2007 20:21 (eighteen years ago)

Dempster Juice

Andy K, Thursday, 6 September 2007 22:26 (eighteen years ago)

http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20070909/capt.92ce01aa977141d0a587329524d02e1e.cubs_pirates_baseball_paks106.jpg

Veteran starting pitcher with playoff experience.

mattbot, Monday, 10 September 2007 14:32 (eighteen years ago)

The "race":

CHC		MIL

@HOU @PIT
@HOU @PIT
@HOU
@STL CIN
@STL CIN
@STL, @STL CIN
CIN @HOU
CIN @HOU
CIN @HOU
@ATL
PIT @ATL
PIT @ATL
PIT @ATL
STL
@FLA STL
@FLA STL
@FLA SD
@CIN SD
@CIN SD
@CIN SD

I give the Cubs a slight edge if 1) they don't totally choke at Houston this week (swept in last series there) and 2) SD is still playing for something on the last four days.

mattbot, Tuesday, 11 September 2007 14:39 (eighteen years ago)

15 LOB last night, these guys are going nowhere.

mattbot, Wednesday, 12 September 2007 13:19 (eighteen years ago)

matt, look at the other guys!

SOME 9th inning last night. I think Lou was yelling that he wishes it was winter when he came out of the dugout after the win.

Dr Morbius, Thursday, 13 September 2007 13:52 (eighteen years ago)

Record against the NL Centlol:

11-5 vs. St. Louis
9-6 vs. Milwaukee
8-7 vs. Houston
5-7 vs. Cincinnati
5-7 vs. Pittsburgh

Naturally, 9 of the last 12 are against the Reds and Pirates.

mattbot, Monday, 17 September 2007 18:54 (eighteen years ago)

http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/7389/19cub091907lcstfeed2007hg0.jpg

5 1/3 IP, 4 ER, 7 H and 3 BB

Worst performance to get a standing ovation ever?

mattbot, Wednesday, 19 September 2007 13:42 (eighteen years ago)

hey, they've caught the Mets at the top of the NL Defensive Efficiency ranks (after the weekend the Mets had, someone had to):

Chicago Cubs, .713
New York Mets, .713
Washington Nationals, .707
San Diego Padres, .707
Arizona Diamondbacks, .705

Dr Morbius, Thursday, 20 September 2007 20:03 (eighteen years ago)

Magic number is 8. They're on a roll, too, they'd almost be tied for 3rd in the NL West!

mattbot, Friday, 21 September 2007 21:36 (eighteen years ago)

oh yeah

Jeff, Saturday, 22 September 2007 02:22 (eighteen years ago)

Good article on closers, regardless of inning. Another example of how Dempster sucks.

Jeff, Saturday, 22 September 2007 16:41 (eighteen years ago)

Soto took Kendall's job without much fanfare (unless you could good hitting and capable defense as fanfare).

After all those trades and callups of career AAAA catchers, all Hendry had to do was call up the best catcher in their system. Weird how that works.

mattbot, Sunday, 23 September 2007 18:40 (eighteen years ago)

4!

mattbot, Sunday, 23 September 2007 21:00 (eighteen years ago)

my brother was standing outside wrigley at the spot on sheffield where you can see through the "keyhole" and i got to relay the news of the brewers loss to everyone there.

:D

gr8080, Sunday, 23 September 2007 21:04 (eighteen years ago)

Atmosphere at the game was great today. The impromptu Tomahawk chops were annoying though.

Jeff, Monday, 24 September 2007 01:39 (eighteen years ago)

Really, I hate the Braves. I'd rather them lose and only be up 2 1/2 games.

Jeff, Monday, 24 September 2007 01:57 (eighteen years ago)

how many times will Lou's June 2 ejection be replyed in the Division Series? ARGUING IGNITES TEAMS!

Dr Morbius, Monday, 24 September 2007 13:30 (eighteen years ago)

I read somewhere that the Cubs have the best record in the NL since Lou's June tirade. Their second half schedule has been pretty weak though.

mattbot, Monday, 24 September 2007 13:34 (eighteen years ago)

The tirade's effect was unintentional. Writers and commentators were talking about Piniella and no one else for several days: Does this schtick really work?/How dumb can Piniella be?/Will this fire them up? Piniella was quite possibly naive enough to think it would fire up his team, but it took the media focus off his players. Wouldn't know if it had anything to do with the upswing.

Andy K, Monday, 24 September 2007 14:03 (eighteen years ago)

The Cubs haven't beaten the Marlins since last year.

Lou's been pretty capable this year, but sending Trachsel out there today (alternative: Rich Hill on normal rest) seems like a really, really dumb idea.

mattbot, Thursday, 27 September 2007 12:26 (eighteen years ago)

Remarkably similar to this <a href="http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/recap?gid=230924117";>really, really dumb idea</a> that worked. Shawn Estes, never forget.

mattbot, Thursday, 27 September 2007 14:17 (eighteen years ago)

Current National League Playoff Odds (BP)

Cubs 89.8%
Mets 85.8%
Diamondbacks 83.0%
Padres 57.2%
Phillies 41.7%
Rockies 32.2%

Dr Morbius, Thursday, 27 September 2007 18:40 (eighteen years ago)

Clearly, any system that doesn't include a Trachsel coefficient is flawed.

mattbot, Thursday, 27 September 2007 18:44 (eighteen years ago)

it's awesome that there are like 5 games left and no one has even clinched a playoff spot in the nl

omar little, Thursday, 27 September 2007 18:52 (eighteen years ago)

awesome, or perhaps the Rockies should play the Big Red Machine old-timers for the title.

Dr Morbius, Thursday, 27 September 2007 19:01 (eighteen years ago)

taste the excitement!

omar little, Thursday, 27 September 2007 19:59 (eighteen years ago)

Well that worked as expected. My favorite part was when the bullpen was up after the 3rd batter.

mattbot, Friday, 28 September 2007 00:28 (eighteen years ago)

The Sun-Times with some real talk for Steve Trachsel:

Off Trax

If the Cubs close out the division title in Cincinnati, their next step should be closing the book for good on pitcher Steve Trachsel's Cubs career and cutting him loose before the playoffs. Veteran status and track record aside, his outburst at media waiting near a clubhouse TV for players after Wednesday's game -- "Turn it the (expletive) off!" -- underscored how bad a fit he is in a clubhouse that otherwise is filled with good guys with professional attitudes. One teammate abruptly stopped in mid-sentence during an interview when Trachsel yelled, glaring across the room at him. As for his pitching since the Cubs reacquired him, well, that's a whole different set of expletives.

mattbot, Friday, 28 September 2007 13:04 (eighteen years ago)

http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/6704/corkqi7.gif

mattbot, Saturday, 29 September 2007 03:16 (eighteen years ago)

And I'm totally cool with Trax starting the next two.

mattbot, Saturday, 29 September 2007 03:55 (eighteen years ago)


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