2012 World Series: Tigers vs. Giants

Verlander ought to win a Series sometime in his career; you never know, he might not get another chance. (Cabrera already has one.) On that basis, the Tigers. But I like the Giants a lot, so if they win, great.

No real animus against the Tigers or D-town, and as it's been 28 years I'd probably root for em if I didn't think they luckily snuck into the tourney. If Verlander shuts down the Jints twice I could see the Tigers winning in 5 or 6, but my guess is SF in 6. (Scutaro becomes slightly mortal, Posey MVP)

For what it's worth: as much as I love Back the USA, I don't think the 5 ever had a song as great as Hot Tuna's "Sea Child."

kinda cool that melky is most responsible for sf getting home field

I love SF the city, but I kinda want the Tigers to win this. No predictions as to how it will go, though.

Verlander reminds me of some other famous person and it's been bugging the hell out of me for a couple of weeks who it could be.

No real rooting interest. Feel like the fact that the Giants will have to beat Verlander at least once and win at least one game where Lincecum or Baumgardner starts might be a tough road, but Lee was basically Verlander two years ago and they managed that so.

Generally speaking I root for the team who hasn't won one in a while. Tigers in 5

kinda cool that melky is most responsible for sf getting home field

Don't forget Verlander.

wanted to challenge hitters and put on a show iirc

rooting for 'igers out of bitterness and giants just won the thing

xxp i guess panda too, forgot abt pablo

Verlander reminds me of some other famous person and it's been bugging the hell out of me for a couple of weeks who it could be.

Y'all help me out here, if it's an athlete I think it's either a football player, golfer or baseball player, but it might not be an athlete. This is driving me nuts!

Aaron Rodgers?

That's close, but I don't think that's the one I'm thinking of. For some reason golf or acting (not Jake G) is floating toward the front.

Luke Wilson?

maybe dustin johnson? both tall & have similar sideburns/facial hair often

same beard as Verlander, slightly adenoidal speaking voice... aargh!

No real animus against the Tigers or D-town

Could have fooled me.

http://mlb.sbnation.com/2012/10/23/3526460/tigers-giants-world-series

http://www.mercurynews.com/music/ci_21838661/batter-up-giants-tigers-walk-up-music

HERE YOU GO, MR. ZITO.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVSBgxiYbV4

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

ILB gets behind mediocrity!

What the fuck does that even mean.

watering down of the baseball season a la the other stinky sports

I try to look at a team's relative strength as more than a one-year snapshot (as you would a player). The Tigers were as bad as it gets in 2003, and followed with a couple of mediocre years, but they've been pretty good starting in '06: 95 wins twice, 88 twice, 86, 81-81, and one losing season. Two trips to the Series, almost a third. Their 88 wins this year were fewer than what most people expected. Not exactly a dynasty, but I wouldn't call them a mediocrity.

Or maybe just about anything looks good from Toronto.

also the first title for PelosiLand may have caused backlash in the 2010 midterm elections

ILB gets behind mediocrity!

― crazy uncle in the attic (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, October 23, 2012 8:04 PM (36 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I'm sure the nine of us would have gotten the same exact response for predicting/pulling for the Mets in '73.

yeah, I am aware of that seeming contradiction. Except it's the Mets, y'know.

and damn the A's back then, Reggie made them hateable just by himself.

Would love to see Mays and Kaline simultaneously throw out the first pitch for game 1, but I guess they stick to home parks for that sort of thing.

Thought Willie was all but blind now?

was not able to vote before the poll closed

the whole world is picking the Tigers

so i just found out that Zito is pitching game one. it's the right move, Lincecum is just having a lost season. he has no idea where the ball is going. that playoff game against the Cards almost blew up in the Giants face. he was not pitching well at all and got lucky that he only gave up those two runs in that second inning?

as far as game two starter Madison Bumgarner seems like the right call. the Tigers are only one game over .500 against lefties. so why not throw two of them in game one and two and at home and see what can happen. Madison Bumgarner however is having the worst slump in his major league career. very risky move. i personally would pitch Ryan Vogelsong on three days rest and have him ready for game 6. that way you have Matt Cain in three and seven.

The Giants have won Zito's past 13 starts dating to Aug. 7. if he actually wins against Verlander his $127 million contract will be almost all forgiven.

*almost*

Thought Willie (Mays) was all but blind now?

Today is the 40th anniversary of Jackie Robinson's death, and I remember him speaking and throwing out the first ball at the WS nine days earlier. He was essentially blind from diabetes.

http://www.biography.com/people/jackie-robinson-9460813/videos/jackie-robinson-last-words-2183107128

http://www.imdb.com/video/biography/vi1659569433/

Great clip, thanks. I talk about Robinson for 15-20 minutes twice a year--on his birthday and today. I show the kids one of the Ken Burns segments and a Biography Channel clip; I always mention the '72 Series, so it was great to be able to show them the actual clip this morning.

Steven Goldman looks over post-Cobb Tiger WS teams:

http://mlb.sbnation.com/2012/10/23/3543606/detroit-tigers-world-series-teams-history

http://mlb.sbnation.com/2012/10/24/3547406/detroit-tigers-world-series-teams-history-part-2

I forgot all about Rusty Kuntz.

He's the Royals' first base coach!

do I hear Barbaro Garbey?

Derek Carty in BP w/ anti-Bee OK wisdom:

I’m still not sure why the Tigers are starting Anibal Sanchez in Game Three—lining him up for a second start in Game Seven—and Max Scherzer in Game Four—limiting him to just a single start. Sanchez is a quality pitcher, but Scherzer is an ace; he’s just not widely recognized as one yet.

Perhaps more egregious, however, is Bruce Bochy’s decision to give Vogelsong two starts instead of Cain. While both will have had enough rest to start Game Three (and then would, in turn, have enough rest to pitch Game Seven), Bochy said, “(Vogelsong) is throwing the ball as well as anybody on the staff, so we just kept it in order. If Vogelsong gets (Game Seven), we have no problem with that. I know Matt has worked hard. He's got a lot of innings. I didn't think we needed to flip-flop the two, to be honest, the way Vogey is throwing.” Cain is not only the best pitcher on the Giants, but he is one of the best pitchers in all of baseball. With the Giants at a large pitching disadvantage to begin with, this move could prove fatal if the series goes seven games.

I think it's safe to say that Cain will be brought into Game 7 if Vogey struggles, though?

Bochy and ILB agree: Vogelsong best Giant's pitcher.

Here's to a great series!

Nice Giants quartet, but couldn't they have gotten Marichal up there too?

Zito's first time pitching in a World Series. Posey is the only(?) starter from the 2010 squad (is that right?)

I don't see that the Giants have anything figured out (except that you should put together a decent team and hope for the best). Parts about the decline in WS viewership and expanded post-season chances is interesting, but to be frank no American sport except treats the champion of the regular season as the league champion (it's not like pre-Wild Card baseball did either and you can't convince most peeps that the '87 Twins were a better team than this years Giants.)

Except...except...finish that thought!

I found the regular-season win totals of WS winners over the years, and the 100-win-seasons stuff, really interesting. It's the most obvious point in the world, but actually seeing the math reinforced it.

I was initially going to say no sport that I am aware of except European soccer but then I realized I don't really know that's true so I limited to US and forgot to to excise the except. Winning the Premier League is arguably bigger than winning any of the Cups or even the Champions League, but not sure that holds for any of the other Euro leagues.

And to be honest that really is the model that's needed here to avoid devaluing the season completely a la the NBA. Establish a league champion and award a prize and a trophy and some hefty team bonuses around it.

wow that's some egregious "i'm not saying i'm just sayin" by pos

Schadenfreude aside how many non-Detroit fans really enjoyed watching that series vs. New York? Baseball is just a boring sport when you don't have a rooting interest.

Psh get outta here with that shit

compared to football and basketball?

"schadenfreude aside" sure as hell thins out your nba and nfl audiences.

The problem with Pos' argument is that there usually isn't a big difference in talent between a 95 win team and a 100 win team, so it's not that big of an upset when a 100 win team loses in the playoffs. I don't think it devalues the regular season, it just shows that making the WS is a lot harder (you have to win a lot more playoff games) and the talent level of playoff teams is uniformly high. Plus luck in a short series, of course.

Going from eight to ten playoff teams actually added more importance to the regular season because we won't see teams coasting at the end of the season once they've clinched a playoff spot (like in the AL this year).

Yeah AL September was really the best argument for the new model (although given how bunched it was, it would have been exciting no matter what.)

Baseball is just a boring sport when you don't have a rooting interest.

This is I Love Baseball, frogs -- I Love Bandwagon-Jumping and I Love Trolling are down the road a piece.

hey don't get me wrong - *I* don't think the playoffs are boring! (and what exactly makes me a bandwagon jumper?) Baseball is my favorite sport but I much rather watch Monday Night Football or a regular-season matchup between say, OKC and the Lakers than a Sunday Night NY/Boston game because it gets boring quick. It's not like Kobe is going to shoot 0-25 one night. Whereas even Miggy has his off days. I would imagine a lot of people use the same logic to explain why they don't watch the playoffs.

You said it was a boring sport when you don't have a rooting interest.

I'm not well versed enough in baseball to find regular season games all that compelling, probably because there's 162 of em for each team. That's my shortcoming, not baseballs. But post season baseball FUCKING RULES, and I find it way way more compelling than post-season NFL or NBA.

Good god nothing could convince me to watch a regular season basketball game.

And I really like basketball!

Basketball does a better job at promoting its stars, but it's easier to do that when (like frogbs said) your stars aren't going to shoot 0-25. But regular season baseball kills basketball in terms of quality, even taking the longer season into account. You don't see baseball teams loafing on defense in April. You'll ever see somebody not bother running after a fly ball because it's only the first or second inning.

You'll *never* ...

I've seen Hanley Ramirez play so I'm not sure what you're talking about.

http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/slides/photos/000/291/812/102722680_display_image.jpg?1278688188

having not watched basketball in a long long time - is that seriously the case? how do they get away with phoning it in when they make so much money?!

16 teams make the playoffs (over half the league) and playing "all out" through the first couple months will likely result in injuries. Players who take charges just aren't going to say healthy all season. I've thought for a while that the season should be shortened (last year's 66-game slate was perfect).

http://ww3.hdnux.com/photos/16/00/31/3671634/3/628x471.jpg

Reader letter (shortened) for James about the Giants under his dynasty formula. Overstatement?

After winning the World Series this year (the Giants) are back up to 8 points. If they only win their division next year with 90 or more games, that would give them 2 more points and a running total of 10 points for the period 2010-2013, thus qualifying them as a dynasty. Is this correct?
Asked by: Michael Skarpelos

Answered: 10/30/2012
I believe so. Two World Series titles is a big deal. If they can do anything at all to build on that, they deserve to be listed among the great teams of history.

I always tell people that whoever wins the ws isnt the best team, they're just the team that won the ws..

you cant just assume marco scutaro is going to hit like babe fucking ruth or that hunter pence will hit like shit except with risp or that gregor fucking blanco will capably replace someone who was hitting .350 until the all star break. or that a key at bat in game 3 of the ws will result in the ball hitting the fucking bag and lead to a couple more runs that takes the home team and crowd out of the game..

that being said I love beisbol and would piss my pants if my team won it all

Seems like a modern baseball team would have to dominate across at least four years and retain at least 2/3rds of the first year's roster to qualify for something like that.

LOVE Romo's shirt.

If they can do anything at all to build on that, they deserve to be listed among the great teams of history.

uhhh wait a minute here

basketball is really the only sport where the best team wins the title a good portion of the time

can i get a quick link to James' dynasty scoring mechanism. i like the idea of it, as i kind of doubt we will see another 3x in a row WS winner in our lifetimes.

I think it's behind a firewall, but maybe not: http://www.billjamesonline.com/dynasties/?AuthorId=3.

Paywall...election overload.

all i know is that when the Giants won in 2010, for the first time ever in San Francisco, i said that i would be completely satisfied for five years. now that they won again 2012, which was so much better of a team by the way, i want another ring in two years. this team is young and home grown. the Panda, Brandon Crawford, Brandon Belt and Buster Posey are all brought up through the minors. we also have Timmy, Madison and Matt Cain and could have also had Wheeler as young arms for years to come. side note, we should try and get something for Timmy this off-season. i think this team is right up there and will be a force for years to come.

I hope you wait another 50 years.

lol, hater

but you know that probably won't happen, sorry your team sucks.

Yes well I'll always have '89. And you will always have your cliches.

"Schadenfreude aside how many non-Detroit fans really enjoyed watching that series vs. New York? Baseball is just a boring sport when you don't have a rooting interest."

I think it is more by history baseball is still a very regionalized sport and I think it is quite a bit because of TV.

I said it on a thread long time back, but really until ESPN started carrying national games all the time in the early 90s, I rarely saw much AL baseball. Where i grew up, you had some Reds games on TV (rarely at home- usually the west coast road trip games), Cubs were on WGN, Braves on TBS and some White Sox games were on WGN. You had that, the Saturday afternoon day game on NBC and then ABC during the summer would run some baseball on Monday nights instead of Football. I just rarely saw much AL baseball as it wasn't on TV or the radio to find it.

I think now with the regional sports networks, this kind of breakdown still largely exists and why certain regions just don't care if their club is not in it. Even baseball's odd TV licensing rules won't allow you to buy a package and watch what you want either on cable or on-line if it competes with these mini-fiefdoms and some of the breakdowns of markets in this setup are really weird.

If I can go the rest of my life without hearing such triteness on ILX again, I would gladly forego any future Giants championships.

BTW the Giants are 2 for 2 when I start their threads.

we should try and get something for Timmy this off-season.

seems like this would be pretty much the worst time in Timmy boo boo bear's value, right, coming off an extremely disappointing season and continued reductions in velocity? Unless you think he's going to be even worse next year.

I hope you wait another 50 years.

― One bad call from barely losing to (Alex in SF), Thursday, November 1, 2012 9:59 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark

lol. same except 500 years

we should try and get something for Timmy this off-season.

seems like this would be pretty much the worst time in Timmy boo boo bear's value, right, coming off an extremely disappointing season and continued reductions in velocity? Unless you think he's going to be even worse next year.

― but the boo boyz are getting to (Z S), Friday, November 2, 2012 9:18 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i just came to post "lolwut" @ that, sabean should be retroactively fired a decade ago if he tried to sell lincecum

"hey 29 mlb gms, i've got this unbelievably expensive pitcher at literally the only pt in his career when he has been terrible, what you got"

Z S, the regular season doesn't count anymore! It's like the NBA.

It's not quite that bad yet.

Louisville Slugger will hide 30 commemorative World Series bats Saturday around San Francisco landmarks such as the Palace of Fine Arts, Fisherman’s Wharf and AT&T Park, and fans are invited to track them down in a digital scavenger hunt.

The first bat will be hidden at AT&T Park, and Louisville Slugger will begin posting clues on its Facebook page and Twitter accounts at 9 a.m. Saturday as to the items’ whereabouts. Another clue will be posted every 15-20 minutes. The company’s Twitter handle is @sluggernation.

The bats are full-sized Major League quality. They are inscribed with the World Series trophy and the Giants logo. Only 2012 bats were made and they are individually numbered.

Chances one of these bats will be used in a crime before the day is out. Very high.

this is wacky and interesting at the same time:

http://www.sfgate.com/giants/article/Rule-Full-playoff-share-to-Melky-Cabrera-4006463.php

Yeah the rules for playoff money division are actually really fascinating. We talked about this a bit when the Nationals lost, I think.

So it's true that second place teams that don't make the playoffs get a share of the playoff money? We discussed this a while back and I could never find any confirmation for it.

http://mlb.sbnation.com/2012/11/21/3676102/the-meaning-of-hunter-pence