The NL East All Star Team... aka the 2013 Toronto Blue Jays

I'd just like to welcome all the newcomers... R.A., Jose, Emilio, Mark, Maicer, Melkey, Josh, Josh and all the other catchers in the back... Adam Lind? The fuck are you still doing here?!

my bold prediction: Morrow will lead the team in Cy Young voting.

Was waiting for you to start this. The future frequency of my posts here can be accurately calculated by Bill James's "Pythagorean Bandwagon" formula (margin of error +/-0.5%).

wonder who ends the year with the better record - jays or dodgers

I really want to be optimistic about this season, but there have been so many disappointments and underachieving teams in the past decade that I can't help but be skeptical.

It's going to be an assload of fun this season either way though.

Closer to two decades, NTBT.

The Gord Ash era was a never ending rerun of mediocrity and completely uninspired baseball (Tim Johnson's fake Vietnam pep talks excepted), but I had high hopes for the Ricciardi era. So strictly speaking, one decade.

Either way, feels like five decades, at least.

Took a quick look, and they had their best year in the first decade (1998), their best back-to-back years in the first (1998-99), and their best three in the second (2006-08). For me, from the standpoint of '83-93, it's just one big blur after that. But you've followed them a lot closer than I have the past decade, so I can see where you'd had higher expectations.

W-L record is misleading here, Gord Ash couldn't understand that the team needed to get worse and rebuild before it could get better. Instead he kept signing and overpaying middle of the road players and pretty much doomed the team to several years of middling mediocrity. He'd do enough to keep the team around .500 but there was no long term strategy and no way to make the playoffs without a lot of luck -- which almost happened in '98. Riccardi understood what had to be done -- cut the fat from the payroll, rely on the draft, and only splurge on free agents when they had a stable core of players in place and it was time to go for it. So I had high expectations for his tenure, he just messed up the execution completely and by the end he was a PR disaster too.

They were replaying Game 1 of the '93 Series on TSN last night. I watched some of it, stupidly opted for the Academy Awards instead. It was so much fun watching White and Alomar--that was the game Alomar took the hit away from Dykstra with the diving catch behind first base. White made a great nonchalant catch in deep centrefield Mays-style, also hit a home run. And the Phillies were probably the most interesting losing WS team of the past quarter-century.

as much as we may have overrated him, White was always amazing to watch.

I would have agreed with that for years, but now I wonder if we did overrate him for those first three years. He was so good with the glove, his WARs from '91-93 were all over 6.0 (then he fell off a cliff the next two seasons). With the bat, yeah, I'm sure we overrated him some.

I was completely against the Junior Felix trade when we got Devo. I thought Felix was going to be the next Ken Griffey (senior) or someone like that. And if you look at his last season in Toronto (1990), it was fairly promising for a 22-year-old. Except you later heard he wasn't 22 at all...who knows?

Alomar, '91-93: 16.6 WAR (466 games)
White, '91-93: 18.2 WAR (455 games)

No, that does not make sense to me.

huh!

dWAR for that period:
White: 8.0
Alomar: zero... aka 0.0

you going to the opener, btw?

I assume it's a weekday, in which case I couldn't; if I'm wrong, I'm definitely interested.

Alomar seems to be a key lightning rod when it comes to defensive metrics. I want to be one of those stupid guys who says stuff like "But I saw with my own eyes how great he was," but I won't. (Unless I just did.)

i will personally back up your eyes.

and the opener it a tuesday (i think).

It is--night game, though. I'd love to go, but I think it's already a sellout, no? Let's try to get out to a game in April or May.

Sounds good! I had to settle for tickets to the 2nd game of the year... When I bought them, a good 1/3 of the 500s were already sold out!

That's crazy - i usually go buy a 500 ticket for the 2nd game and sneak down and sit like 10 rows field-level infield! i'm gonna miss sitting wherever i damn want, but all is forgiven if i get to sit in 1 playoff game

would like to get up there this year

that would be awesome!

yeah ive only seen a game there w. dr.bb!

I haven't written anything baseball-related on my page for a while, but I just posted something on the '92 Jays' pitching staff, a group of pitchers I find kind of amazing.

that's awesome. i'm sure it's been beaten to death over here, but has it been discussed how dave stieb is probably the greatest forgotten pitcher of the 80s? maybe throw frank viola in there, too.

Thanks. I think Stieb has, by now, gotten his due. Almost any article you read calling into question Morris's HOF candidacy will bring up Stieb's superior credentials. I think Viola, Chuck Finley, and Mark Langston are probably still underappreciated.

The 80s also had quite a few starters that seemed to figure it out late and had peak years in their 30s like John Tudor, Dave Stewart and most likely thanks to a nail file Mike Scott.

That Jays staff was really impressive. Duane Ward was a pack mule putting up that many innings out of the pen.

Nice work clemenza, I was really surprised by the 43 4+ WAR seasons.

We didn't realize it at the time, but when you look at Duane Ward's IP numbers now it's a miracle his arm didn't fall off sooner than it did.

I watched p much all the postseason games of that era and have no memory of Duane Ward.

career WAR:

Stieb 53.5
Key 46.1
Morris 39.3

Ward had five straight years of 100+ IP going into the '93 season; not sure where to begin checking, but that's got to be the last time that's happened.

I was curious how many 4.0+ seasons the 2011 Phillies had on their staff. To date:

Halladay -- 8
Lee -- 4
Hamels -- 4
Oswalt -- 5

No one else that I can see--21 total, half what the '92 Jays had. They'll pick up a few more, I'm sure, but won't come close to the Jays' 43.

If you're in Toronto and up: TSN is replaying Game 4 of the '93 Series right now: 15-14! (Not sure if they're going to condense it or go with the entire four-plus hours.)

ugliest Series game ever?

Just finished the first inning--more craziness/ugliness right there than in most Series games. First time ever both teams score 3+ runs. Jays go up 3-0, Stottlemyre goes out and walks four guys (tying a Series record for one inning) and the Phillies go up 4-3. McCarver's apoplectic that Gaston never gets anybody up to warm up. White misses by inches of making an inning-ending catch identical to his phantom-triple-play catch in the '92 Series.

Top of the 8th, where the Jays score six to go ahead 15-14, no less stunning than that Rangers-Cardinals game from a couple of years ago. I counted three times at least where it felt like the Jays could have been sunk for good. 1) In the 7th, Daulton almost hits a grand slam that would have put the game out of reach--just foul. He gets hit by a pitch instead, bringing in another run. 2) Eisenreich comes up next, still bases loaded and one out, 14-9 at that point, and for some reason he swings at the first pitch--pops up. Next guy makes out, no more runs. 3) Next inning, Alomar makes a quick first out. Carter and Olerud get on, then Hollins gets caught between hops on Molitor's ground ball--that goes for a double, and the rally's on.

Even Henderson's big hit in the 8th, which he drills to center field, could have been caught by Dykstra. It would have been a nice play, and would definitely have been risky, but it was catchable.

Romero to Dunedin

wow.

i guess they're hoping the Halladay treatment might work?

The decision blindsided you?

“Yeah, absolutely, I had already sent my car up, sent everything, I have a place up there and everything, so it blindsides you a little bit. Like I said, it is what it is and you’ve got to keep that chin up and head high. I feel like I’ve done a lot of good things and God forbid I had a bad spring, everyone made a big deal out of it.”

“I thought it was going to be harder because when it happened, I go like, ‘This is supposed to help my confidence?’ When it first happens, you’re kind of like, ‘Whoa.’ A million thoughts go through your head. I don’t know if you guys have ever been fired from a job and you go and sit at home and you’re like, ‘What the hell did I do wrong?’

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/romero-discusses-struggles-demotion-future/

Like has any pitcher whose had a lousy spring following a league-worst season been demoted ever? OK...GOD!!! Fuck this organization.

huh?

The primary objective of the Blue Jays this year was to help build Ricky Romero's confidence. So yes, I understand his surprise.

Lol

(If I'm reading Andy's first sentence correctly, I think he's making the same point.)

The sentence beneath the link (with the incorrect use of whose) is mine/sarcasm. The stuff above the link is from the article.

"I'm not a minor-league pitcher, I’m a major-league pitcher. I’m an all-star for a reason."

Come on, man.

all-star status has to be renewed every year, iirc

1) In the 7th, Daulton almost hits a grand slam that would have put the game out of reach--just foul. He gets hit by a pitch instead, bringing in another run.

Ha, I remember this sequence now ... I think that was the moment where I needed to get away from the TV for a while. It looked like the game was about to be put away and I needed a break since the game had been going on for about 17 hours already. I came back in the next inning, couldn't believe it the Jays had managed to escape without further damage, and got to see the 8th inning comeback.

Before our 38-year-old knuckleballer officially makes all the bad go away, one last word about the '93 Series. I watched about half of Game 6 on the weekend, and I'd totally forgotten that a) Alfredo Griffin was on that team, b) he was out at SS for the top of the 9th (not sure why, missed that--did Fernandez get hurt?), and c) he was actually on deck when Carter hits his home run. I was so down on Carter at the time, I distinctly remember praying that he wouldn't hit into an inning-ending double play as a best-case scenario; I just wanted him out of the way and (presumably, even though Griffin's in the on-deck circle) for a pinch-hitter to come up with two outs.

Everything worked out fine.

But Alomar was gone a couple of years later and second base was a revolving door of suck after that. They could have found a position for Kent.

I don't know. I don't think anybody expected Alomar to be gone by '96 at that point--he was in the midst of only his second year with the Jays and seemed to be set for a long time. I don't see Kent as a SS, so maybe 3B or LF? Gruber seemed set also, but Maldonado was clearly a stopgap out in left, so maybe they could have moved Kent out there.

I still would have made the deal, though. The Jays had to move forward in '92--another ALCS exit would have hurt a lot, maybe even put a dent in their phenomenal crowds for '93. I think you agreed with me on some other thread that psychologically, the acquisition of Cone was huge (and he did pitch pretty great the rest of the way, much better than his record showed). Also, was there any expectation at the time that Kent would ever end up that good? He was 24 in 1992, a 20th-round pick coming off three okay years in the minors.

Let me change one thing in that: Gruber most definitely did not seem set at the time. He was great '88-90, so-so in '91, and was on his way to playing himself out of job in '92. So maybe they could have tried converting Kent into a third basemen, although generally such attempts don't work out, no?

the Lawrie experiment is still underway in that regard.

I should check everything thoroughly before posting...turns out Kent actually began at short (38 games) and third (35 games) his first year at St. Catherines; he didn't move to second until Dunedin in 1990, when I guess the organization decided they had Fernandez and Gruber but needed a second baseman. The Alomar trade obviously turned everything upside down.

3-7 since the streak, 6.5 out in the wild-card again. They need to figure out how to tread water a little better when they're not playing well.

Blue Jays catcher Arencibia rips analysts Hayhurst and Zaun as 'below average players'

inform us the right way, jp, you career .267 opb hitter

ugh. JPA can feel free to rip Zaun when he gets over 1,200 games under his belt and Hayhurst when he's written a best-selling book.

and also once he figures out how to block a ball in the dirt.

lol Pelfrey pickoff of Reyes

Lawrie is back. hoo-ray.

rough

a new rock bottom?

Don't jump the gun--I'm sure they can get worse yet.

Like I said: have faith.

Hell hath no fury like a bandwagon-jumping fan: I hope they get swept by Houston.

dude. not cool.

wow they needed to play the astros for a while now.

I know about the big contract and all, but maybe they ought to think about shutting Johnson down for a while. His numbers get more hideous every start.

Matt Sussman, BP: "You will never figure this team out. There is no answer. If they were an SAT question, you would throw it back in the proctor's face and ask for the real SAT booklet."

Exhibit #637: 7-2 lead going into the 5th against the equally mighty Mariners (now exactly equal), a chance to take a modest 4-game winning streak into back-to-back series with the A's and Red Sox, and they lose 9-7.

Bonifiasco: traded
Rasmus: DL

I was down Monday afternoon, the game they lost in the ninth. I went with an old friend of my father's, and he told me something I was completely unaware of: that when he and I and my uncle saw the Jays play Texas a number of years ago, Dickey was the Rangers' starter.

BP:

J.P. Arencibia's on-base percentage (.248) is last in the majors among qualifiers by .019 and would be the lowest OBP since Vernon Wells in 2011.

Wish I could find the Larry Sanders clip of Hank after his divorce. Arty (paraphrase): "Hank's way past hitting bottom--he's somewhere completely new right now."

Buehrle and Sabathia now the only two guys working on 13-year streaks of 10+ wins. The surprising thing (to me, anyway) is that Buehrle's right there with CC in WAR. Buehrle got a bit of a head start, not much--50 innings in 2000--and he stood at 54.5 going into today's start; CC's at 54.2 (but about 15 months younger).

i am very suprised - 54.5 WAR!

Early postmortem:

http://espn.go.com/blog/sweetspot/post/_/id/39994/what-went-wrong-with-the-blue-jays

Nothing that's not in plain view: starting pitching, yikes.

could probably do better than the guy we got catching them too.

You mean you're not satisfied with a couple of guys who get on base almost 25% of the time? Man, you're hard to please.

not even talking about the hitting. just behind the plate, JPA makes me so very sad. i just keep thinking back to the home opener... why... WHY was he catching (or at least trying to catch) Dickey?!

Don Cherry @CoachsCornerCBC
5) p.s I thought for sure the Blue Jays might pick up Justin Morneau, a Great Canadian and all that. He knocked in 4 runs in one game last

Don Cherry would have been a terrific GM during the Latino explosion of the 1990s. "We'll take the Quantrills and the Butlers; those other teams can have the Rodriguezes and the Martinezes and the Gonzalezes."

let us not sully this thread with Fuckface Cherry

Wow!

"Barring injury, this will be Buehrle’s 13th straight season with 30 starts and 200 IP, joining Tom Seaver, Christy Mathewson and Cy Young as the only pitchers with such a streak in the first 14 seasons of a career."

(30 GS/200 IP are basic benchmarks, so that strikes me as genuinely impressive--it's not one of those Rube Goldberg-type combinations.)

http://www.highheatstats.com/2013/09/2013-milestone-musings-pitchers-edition/#more-16141

This is why Buehrle was our only SP I wasn't worried about during all the preseason hype.

The other thing I like about him is he's got a great John Houseman name. "Mark Buehrle--did you hand in your assignment, Mr. Buehrle?"

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/09/11/the-blue-jays-will-be-playing-on-grass-eventually

O.O

Going to start a band called the Arencebia Line. At the moment, his .236 OBP is the fifth-worst ever (450+ PA) in the live-ball era.

@joe_sheehan
John Gibbons just called a sac bunt in front of a guy with a .267 OBP.

Playing spoiler for the Yankees is nice.

if anyone is around - i'll be heading to the game friday!

I have a couple of work-related things Friday, else I'd join you and pay my respects to the deceased.

I've become fascinated by Buehrle's metronomic consistency. During his 13-year streak of 200+ innings, his most starts in a season was 35; his fewest, 30.

it's amazing after the rough start he had this year and how close he's come to his career numbers (still a little worse, granted). a career bWAR of 54.7 is pretty respectable!

http://skreened.com/render-product/v/u/u/vuudycpnwafwsslakprq/the-alfredo-griffin-canadian-remix.american-apparel-unisex-baseball-tee.white-asphalt.w380h440z1.jpg

I didn't realize we came so close to blowing our spot in the bottom ten:

http://espn.go.com/blog/sweetspot/post/_/id/41002/bad-baseball-final-tanking-standings

dioner navarro signed; arencibia to be traded or non-tendered

somewhat relieved - but feel somewhat crappy giving up on the guy.