Might be unfashionable to say so but I think Cormac McCarthy is terrific and I will always re-read Blood Meridian
― flamboyant goon tie included, Saturday, 8 August 2020 11:01 (four years ago) link
Chinaski, I am unable to find the document at present, but his abusive and misogynistic behavior toward Joanne Kyger (his first wife) has made him a bit of a persona non grata in certain circles, particularly those in the Bay Area where Kyger was a mentor and friend to many. I mean, he literally stole into her room and edited her private journals without her permission! He's no Ted Hughes, but he's kind of a prick, by all accounts.
― blue light or electric light (the table is the table), Saturday, 8 August 2020 11:07 (four years ago) link
I only came to Murdoch this year and loved her. Given that I was expecting 'dons with neuroses' I was pleasantly surprised: I didn't expect existential folk horror.
With McCarthy, I'll always have a place for that visceral gut-punch I got from first reading Blood Meridian but not sure I'll go back all that often.
xp
― Vanishing Point (Chinaski), Saturday, 8 August 2020 11:09 (four years ago) link
Murdoch a good example of a woman I'll never read, despite attempts. The descriptions of her work and the reality of it on the page are so disparate that I felt insane during every attempt I made, tbh...
And xpost, what's funny is that I don't get the existential folk horror at all from her work. And the prose is clunky.
― blue light or electric light (the table is the table), Saturday, 8 August 2020 11:10 (four years ago) link
Thanks for the Synder story, the table. I'd not heard that before. Ugh.
― Vanishing Point (Chinaski), Saturday, 8 August 2020 11:10 (four years ago) link
Unfortunately that's my ish with Murdoch as well. The prose is unreadable.
Oh yeah I read the first half of Local Anaesthetic and thought it was OK but I doubt I'll ever return to any Grass.
― flamboyant goon tie included, Saturday, 8 August 2020 11:15 (four years ago) link
If we're talking about "female authors that just don't work for us" it's Renata Adler for me. I think it's impossible not to enjoy Joan Didion but I'm probably the least-enthusiastic of all the people I know. Unhip female authors I unabashedly love: Heti and July.
I feel a desire to type my favourite authors, scanning through my bookshelves just now: Baldwin, Barthes, Borges, Bowles (Paul and Jane), Calvino, Carson, Carver, hooks, Joyce, Le Guin, Lovecraft, Melville, Mishima, Nabokov, Flann O'Brien, O'Connor, Oe, Strugatskys, Vidal, Joy Williams, Wolff.
Fave ever is prob Barthes and Joyce, Mishima continues to rot in my brain I still love that horseshit, O'Brien and Gore Vidal less so but still important, Joy Williams is my go-to "recommend something new to people" choice. Any holes? I could use an intervening recommendation these days, I'm looking at my "next up" pile and it's a re-read of Lydia Davis short stories and a couple Hollinghursts I haven't read. I could use a recommendation. Maybe I should finally read Cheever like people have been telling me to
― flamboyant goon tie included, Saturday, 8 August 2020 11:26 (four years ago) link
Constance barnett, or at least so far. Still wondering how accurate a translation it is in terms of mood etc.May eventually rethink but have never progressed far into her work cos it just seems so genteel.Wish I read russian though
― Stevolende, Saturday, 8 August 2020 11:27 (four years ago) link
Which Murdoch have you attempted? There's an awful lot of it and the quality varies wildly.
― Matt DC, Saturday, 8 August 2020 11:32 (four years ago) link
The Black Prince
― flamboyant goon tie included, Saturday, 8 August 2020 11:34 (four years ago) link
Yeah, just from experience, I've read two Murdochs - Under The Net and The Sandcastle - and would never have guessed they're even by the same writer. Sandcastle very much is dons with neuroses - Under The Net is a madcap comedic novel.
Speaking of clunky prose tho I soldiered through The Disposessed, and did enjoy it for its ideas, would never dismiss LeGuinn entirely she's such an obviously great figure, sci-fi is full of writers with less than stellar prose styles, disclaimer disclaimer, but anyway on the evidence of that book a great stylist she wasn't.
― Daniel_Rf, Saturday, 8 August 2020 11:56 (four years ago) link
Oh good, so I'm not alone in failing to gel with Le Guin's prose style. I'll give Left Hand another try sometime. Maybe I was expecting something different.
I tried my first McCarthy like a month ago (All the Pretty Horses), and bounced off of that too. Another time.
― jmm, Saturday, 8 August 2020 14:29 (four years ago) link
Yeesh, the aura around this guy in his time is hard to comprehend.
The reaction to the incident in the literary community to which Mailer and Morales belonged has been judged by many observers to be remarkably mild. As Mailer later noted, his friends "closed ranks" behind him. He remarked to New York Magazine in 1983 that "the reactions were subtle as hell. Five degrees less warmth than I was accustomed to. Not fifteen degrees less—five."[8] Many of his counterparts saw the assault as an artistic, even literary act; James Baldwin a writer and friend of Mailer, characterized it as an attempt to free himself from "the spiritual prison he had created with his fantasies of becoming a politician," "like burning down the house in order to, at last, be free of it".[9] Diana Trilling later recalled being told by her husband, critic Lionel Trilling, that the stabbing was a "Dostoyevskian ploy" allowing Mailer to "test the limits of evil in himself."[5]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stabbing_of_Adele_Morales_by_Norman_Mailer
― jmm, Saturday, 8 August 2020 17:15 (four years ago) link
See also the killing of jean vollmer constantly described as something Burroughs “never got over”, like - I would fucking hope so tbh! People always talk as though it’s something that happened to him
― Rishi don’t lose my voucher (wins), Saturday, 8 August 2020 17:23 (four years ago) link
Norman Mailer’s son was a guest at one of my best friend’s wedding. He was married at the time to the sister of the bride. He stood up to make a toast, I think he claimed it was going to be in French but really what he said was “I have two words for you: couples therapy.”
― Time Will Show Leo Weiser (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 8 August 2020 17:27 (four years ago) link
Another illustrious guest at the wedding was Alfred’s favorite, Billy Collins.
― Time Will Show Leo Weiser (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 8 August 2020 17:28 (four years ago) link
Shame on you for not killing Collins when you had the chance.
― blue light or electric light (the table is the table), Saturday, 8 August 2020 17:32 (four years ago) link
If you only knew.
― Time Will Show Leo Weiser (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 8 August 2020 17:55 (four years ago) link
There were lots of creepy old dudes of his age there, hard to single out one.
― Time Will Show Leo Weiser (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 8 August 2020 17:56 (four years ago) link
I'll give Left Hand another try sometime. Maybe I was expecting something different.
It might help to know that the second half of Left Hand is vastly different from the first half. The first half is all politics and world-building and serves to set up the second half, which is much faster-paced and more emotionally charged.
― Lily Dale, Saturday, 8 August 2020 18:45 (four years ago) link
one of my best friend’s
― Time Will Show Leo Weiser (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 8 August 2020 19:33 (four years ago) link
xp The last 100 or so pages of Left Hand are extraordinary - as good as anything I've ever read.
― Vanishing Point (Chinaski), Saturday, 8 August 2020 21:32 (four years ago) link
That does help to know, thanks. I didn't get to the second half.
― jmm, Saturday, 8 August 2020 21:37 (four years ago) link
I will never read Richard Ford or Elizabeth Strout; they look so deadly dull.
― Tsar Bombadil (James Morrison), Sunday, 9 August 2020 01:09 (four years ago) link
I've only read some Ford short stories, but I thought they were pretty decent.
― blue light or electric light (the table is the table), Sunday, 9 August 2020 01:18 (four years ago) link
The Lay Of The Land and Independence Day are both incredible imo. Terrible endings iirc. But the observation and language are just tremendously pleasurable.
― Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Sunday, 9 August 2020 07:54 (four years ago) link
Elizabeth Strout is not dull. She's good.
― the pinefox, Sunday, 9 August 2020 09:20 (four years ago) link
I changed my mind about this thread.
I agree with Matt DC.
This is the second spike I’m worried about pic.twitter.com/TUQQkWLENj— Sebastian Milbank 🥀 (@JSMilbank) August 7, 2020
― xyzzzz__, Sunday, 9 August 2020 10:01 (four years ago) link
Patrick O'Brien. I think he's a terrific writer but I can't get through the sailing jargon.
I think a less snotty way of looking at this thread would be "Authors you will never read again", because then at least you've tried and failed, rather than dismissed without evidence -- but I wouldn't want to prudishly deny anyone the true pleasure of snottiness.
Authors I wouldn't want to read again: McEwan, Ford, Chia Melville, Hemingway, Barnes, Scott Lodbell
― Chuck_Tatum, Sunday, 9 August 2020 10:05 (four years ago) link
If I'd only read "The Man in the High Castle", I probably wouldn't want to read PKD again; thank god for Ubik
― Chuck_Tatum, Sunday, 9 August 2020 10:07 (four years ago) link
Inferno good to read. The rest of it is just okay, tbh.
― blue light or electric light (the table is the table),
Purgatory's the dullest part, but I loved each one of the blessed's description of how h/she earned a place in it.
― TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 9 August 2020 10:09 (four years ago) link
*earned a place in Paradise
― TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 9 August 2020 10:10 (four years ago) link
the thread-shift to "authors you will never read again" is doubtless inevitable but distinctly less interesting, kudos chairman alph for asking the real questions
― mark s, Sunday, 9 August 2020 10:15 (four years ago) link
Agreed.
Never read? I'll be real: I've never read Salman Rushdie, Philip Roth, Norman Mailer, or Jonathan Franzen.
I will never read them. With the exception of Mailer, whose macho aura repels me, the remainder of them just seem to write novels that are lauded by critics but aren't actually very good, as not many people I know have read through them...and I don't really hang out with a lot of people who don't read a lot, for better or for worse.
― blue light or electric light (the table is the table), Sunday, 9 August 2020 11:33 (four years ago) link
uh oh gooblar to thread
― Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Sunday, 9 August 2020 11:47 (four years ago) link
I'm curious though, if you've never read Rushdie/Roth/Franzen, yet know they are lauded by critics, how do you come to the conclusion that they aren't actually very good? Esp when you don't know people who read them! No trust in the critics?
― Scampidocio (Le Bateau Ivre), Sunday, 9 August 2020 12:01 (four years ago) link
Rushdie is such a dickhead it's hard to imagine him writing anything worth reading. And, yes, I know dickheads have written great novels in the past.
― Udo Starmer (Tom D.), Sunday, 9 August 2020 12:15 (four years ago) link
Never going to read a novel by anyone who appeared on Late Review
― Ward Fowler, Sunday, 9 August 2020 12:16 (four years ago) link
Now you're talking.
― Young Boys of Bernie (Tom D.), Sunday, 9 August 2020 12:19 (four years ago) link
I think w/Rushdie...I've yet to a see a sentence from him that tells me this is good shit (and on twitter any ppl will screenshot a page or make a bot and I haven't seen anything, and if I have it certainly hasn't resonated w/me because I don't remember).
Sadly the noise of his circumstances needs to clear up, too. Wouldn't surprise me if one of the early novels might be ok. But at this stage in proceedings I'm not looking for ok either. I have a good pile of stuff and I know the voice I'm looking for.
― xyzzzz__, Sunday, 9 August 2020 12:26 (four years ago) link
You're missing out not to read The Ghost Writer, at least
― Chuck_Tatum, Sunday, 9 August 2020 12:50 (four years ago) link
Rushdie has a fun tendency to invent words iirc, but otherwise did not need/enjoy
― flamboyant goon tie included, Sunday, 9 August 2020 12:56 (four years ago) link
Reading Rushdie is like an exhausting Robin Williams routine
― Chuck_Tatum, Sunday, 9 August 2020 12:59 (four years ago) link
There are a few Late Review / UK literati writers who I like on the page but can't stand as celebs (of course there more I dislike in both cases) - so I'm glad I didn't dismiss them all out of hand.
Only writers I have not read anything by and never would are the writers of epic multi-part series which I don't have the time for - Robert Jordan, Catherine Cookson, James Ellroy, etc.
― Anti-Cop Ponceortium (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Sunday, 9 August 2020 13:22 (four years ago) link
I'd stan for Richard Ford's Frank Bascombe novels. Their politics are questionable and there is a dullness about them but still. And Roth is a hoary old fucker but I'm glad for Sabbath's Theatre, American Pastoral and The Ghost Writer.
― Vanishing Point (Chinaski), Sunday, 9 August 2020 13:35 (four years ago) link
I had a like/hate relationship with the Late Review Show and it was hilarious reading that thread on here and I wish I had been here back when the show was on (though really, a good internet diet cancels out my television watching). But I do plan to read China Mieville, Kim Newman and Jeanette Winterson (admittedly they weren't regulars) and wouldn't be against John Carey because I found him quite likable and he once pulled the best look of exasperated bewildered disdain that I've ever seen and I wish there was a gif of it.
― Robert Adam Gilmour, Sunday, 9 August 2020 15:27 (four years ago) link
Tom Paulin was kind of funny too. I liked how his eyes blinked separately.
― Robert Adam Gilmour, Sunday, 9 August 2020 15:29 (four years ago) link
Would like to try Hari Kunzru too.
― Robert Adam Gilmour, Sunday, 9 August 2020 15:39 (four years ago) link
I've recommended paulin's essays on northern ireland to ilxors before now, a novel is going way too far tho
― mark s, Sunday, 9 August 2020 15:48 (four years ago) link