Nothing Doting Living Loving: What Are You Reading In The Winter of 2023-24?

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re: McCarthy, I never made it past All the Pretty Horses. I should give the rest of the trilogy another go, if for no other reason than that my brother loves it so much.

immodesty blaise (jimbeaux), Friday, 29 December 2023 17:38 (ten months ago) link

mary shelley - frankenstein
was surprised at how different it was to the film versions i've seen. was dismayed at how long it was for a shortish book. could quite happily be half the length. although perhaps one wouldn't get the full effect of what a whiny prick frankenstein is. would never have finished this if it were a recent novel.

oscar bravo, Friday, 29 December 2023 20:43 (ten months ago) link

As it happens, I finished The World My Wilderness before the witching hour of NYEve, but after posting my 'WDYR in 2023' list. Oh well, pobody's nerfect. It was fine. Macaulay did indulge her penchant for burbling over ruins on a few occasions and the cast of characters, while cunningly sketched, stayed only fitfully vibrant or alive. As a novel of Europe adrift in chaos after the wreckage of WWII it quite succeeded, but from a peculiarly British ruling class perspective.

more difficult than I look (Aimless), Sunday, 31 December 2023 02:24 (ten months ago) link

the memory monster by yishai sarid - short and quite powerful novel about the way in which the holocaust is remembered in israel.

HHhH by laurent binet - more nazi stuff. the conceptually ambitious metatextual stuff doesn't work, which is a shame because it dominates.

stone blind by natalie haynes - the perseus and medusa story. great fun.

the iron king by maurice druon - the first part of the the series that supposedly inspired game of thrones. france ca. 1400. i haven't read GoT, but i've seen the show, and this certainly reminded me of early seasons before all the wizard bollocks. quite trashy, nowhere near the political or literary sophistication of e.g. wolf hall. but pretty good fun. will probably read the rest.

first love by gwendoline riley - very good, very sad novella.

finishing the year with the https://www.nytimes.com/2023/05/10/books/review/paved-paradise-henry-grabar.html, which is great. i'm sympathetic, but the book is very persuasive and surprisingly well written and funny.

𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Sunday, 31 December 2023 03:33 (ten months ago) link

the ebook of the new Natalie Haynes, Divine Might, which is Pandora's Jar but featuring goddesses, is 99p on Amazon.co.uk today

koogs, Sunday, 31 December 2023 10:10 (ten months ago) link

just finished paul murray's "the bee sting". next up "the leopard"

LaMDA barry-stanners (||||||||), Tuesday, 2 January 2024 15:40 (ten months ago) link

Finished How High We Go in the Dark. I can't say I would strongly recommend it. It reads like a collection of loosely connected short stories, which it was originally, and the final chapter relies on a deus ex machina that rings a little hollow. In the interview at the end, the author seems super nice and earnest, and he obviously put a lot of thought and work into the book, but in the end it just wasn't as great as it might have been.

immodesty blaise (jimbeaux), Tuesday, 2 January 2024 15:42 (ten months ago) link

Just got started on another Ross Macdonald 'Lew Archer' novel, The Underground Man (published 1971). The early set-up of the story is economical, effortlessly engaging, and damn near perfectly paced. The man could write a story.

more difficult than I look (Aimless), Tuesday, 2 January 2024 20:32 (ten months ago) link

I'm going to try reading The Tale of Genji, the Tyler translation.

So far I'm finding that it's a book that must be taken slowly, 5 minutes a page if not more. So probably over 100 hours in total.

jmm, Wednesday, 3 January 2024 13:41 (ten months ago) link

Lucas Hilderbrand - The Bars Are Ours: Histories and Cultures of Gay Bars in America, 1960 and After
Harry Crews - The Gospel Singer

poppers fueled buttsex crescendo (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 3 January 2024 13:44 (ten months ago) link

as I said re 2023 reading:

Truman Capote:
The Early Stories of Truman Capote (half good, promising)
Other Voices, Other Rooms (maybe half good, disappointing)

I just finished novella The Grass Harp. which didn't have the sense of personal concerns as generator of characters' situations, but sweet, bittersweet, twilight memoir of early autumn in a small place, Mayberry Southern Gothic, with a gentle intensity and momentum via just about every line: catnip for the Sentence Police, I should think. Seems like that early journalism has paid off, since the earlier fiction (although OVOR was published only three years earlier, in 1948.)

dow, Wednesday, 3 January 2024 18:09 (ten months ago) link

sense of personal concerns as generator of characters' situations
frequently apparent in the apprentice stories and debut novel, I meant.

dow, Wednesday, 3 January 2024 18:11 (ten months ago) link

Read Atlantic Island by Tony Duvert. A friend had told me this book was actually quite an astonishing indictment of bourgeois adult values and attitudes toward children, and in fact, she was correct, tho sometimes the means by which Duvert got there— depicting sex between teenage boys— was obviously icky. Like a more French and less hallucinatory Burroughs in this way, the book held some sentences that bowled me over, such as: “When you fall into the grip of those who have the right to be virtuous at your expense, you can never get out.”

Now I am reading Anne F. Garréta’s Sphinx, a pretty engaging short novel about a love affair between two characters who remain genderless and utterly ambiguous throughout the book. Digging it so far!

butt dumb tight my boners got boners (the table is the table), Wednesday, 3 January 2024 23:36 (ten months ago) link

im seong-sun - the consultant
korean thriller about the restructuring consultant of an all pervasive company referred throughout as simply 'the company' whose job is to plan the deaths of anyone in need of 'restructuring'. v good flow and world creation but somehow slight in the end.

oscar bravo, Friday, 5 January 2024 08:59 (ten months ago) link

I just finished Mike Davis' City of Quartz. Amazing, amazing book, I didn't want it to end.

I thought the chapter on the Catholic church was going to be boring, but it was incredible. I would be curious about the church's legacy/impact/power since 1990. I would presume it has declined due to the fallout from the church molestation scandals and as most church attendance has declined.

il lavoro mi rovina la giornata (PBKR), Friday, 5 January 2024 12:24 (ten months ago) link

The Urantia Book. Curious if there are other readers lurking around ilx

calstars, Friday, 5 January 2024 17:41 (ten months ago) link

I finished the Ross Macdonald book, The Underground Man. In order to create an increasingly dense series of plot twists in the last twenty pages of the book he incrementally revealed that an improbably large number of the characters had converged at the scene of a murder that took place 15 years earlier, while at the same time most of them were unaware of each others proximity.

Surprisingly, this scarcely believable level of improbability didn't detract from the story at all for me, because the real interest wasn't generated by the mystery of whodunnit, but by the complexities of the characters as humans.

more difficult than I look (Aimless), Friday, 5 January 2024 19:13 (ten months ago) link

It's my turn to host book club, and I have picked a book recommended by my brother: Chain-Gang All-Stars, by Nana Kwame Adjei-Brenyah. It looks to be a near-future dystopia in which inmates of the private prison system fight to the death for a chance at release. Very solid reviews.

immodesty blaise (jimbeaux), Friday, 5 January 2024 19:15 (ten months ago) link

boy, Harry Crews thinks he's Flannery O'Connor, eh

poppers fueled buttsex crescendo (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 5 January 2024 19:27 (ten months ago) link

I have to confess to enjoying A Feast of Snakes. It definitely sits in the guilty pleasures bin.

immodesty blaise (jimbeaux), Friday, 5 January 2024 19:34 (ten months ago) link

I don't like to dismiss Major Novelists out of hand, so I'm picking that one up on Sunday.

poppers fueled buttsex crescendo (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 5 January 2024 19:37 (ten months ago) link

It's my turn to host book club, and I have picked a book recommended by my brother: _Chain-Gang All-Stars_, by Nana Kwame Adjei-Brenyah. It looks to be a near-future dystopia in which inmates of the private prison system fight to the death for a chance at release. Very solid reviews.


His book of stories, Friday Black, has some excellent moments.

butt dumb tight my boners got boners (the table is the table), Friday, 5 January 2024 22:52 (ten months ago) link

I barely get time to read but just finished Babel by RF Kuang - anyone read it? Think I was expecting more from it and it began to seriously annoy me. But, guess it kept me reading.

kinder, Friday, 5 January 2024 23:06 (ten months ago) link

I barely get time to read but just finished Babel by RF Kuang - anyone read it? Think I was expecting more from it and it began to seriously annoy me. But, guess it kept me reading.

I was really disappointed by it (it had been highly recommended to me), for roughly the reasons here: https://ttdlabyrinth.wordpress.com/2023/07/02/the-fall-of-the-tower/

toby, Saturday, 6 January 2024 07:57 (ten months ago) link

i quit it after like 100 pages

mookieproof, Saturday, 6 January 2024 08:13 (ten months ago) link

It was like someone has tried to crowbar 2020s online discourse into the mouths of 1800s Oxford students and it felt so off even though I appreciate the actual positions of the characters. (The most minor, yet most jarring to me in some ways, was one of them declaring a dessert was supposed to be "sticky toffee pudding" which might sound like a jolly old traditional English pudding but is far more recent! like if they'd talked about Cheesecake Factory!). For a book about language, the way they spoke was bizarre.

I really loved the idea of how the magic 'works' but it had hardly changed the world apart from making existing things more efficient.

kinder, Saturday, 6 January 2024 09:13 (ten months ago) link

I should say a friend of mine who is not white found it really nailed some of his experiences of talking about nations of "Brown" people with white people.

kinder, Saturday, 6 January 2024 09:19 (ten months ago) link

I finished *The Age of Innocence*. Obviously the word 'perfect' is overused but well, sometimes it's the only thing that will do. It left me sobbing my poor ragged heart out.

I would prefer not to. (Chinaski), Saturday, 6 January 2024 10:31 (ten months ago) link

Oh that sounds exactly my thing. Will see if we have it

mojo dojo casas house (gyac), Saturday, 6 January 2024 12:02 (ten months ago) link

It's quite well done

poppers fueled buttsex crescendo (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 6 January 2024 12:03 (ten months ago) link

A model of decorum there, Alfred.

There's that feeling that you only really get with novels that you're in the presence of an intelligence so vast and refined that it's like being known.

I would prefer not to. (Chinaski), Saturday, 6 January 2024 12:07 (ten months ago) link

It's 'how many 'thats' can you fit into a sentence', Saturday.

I would prefer not to. (Chinaski), Saturday, 6 January 2024 12:08 (ten months ago) link

Wharton's one of my favorite novelists.

poppers fueled buttsex crescendo (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 6 January 2024 12:11 (ten months ago) link

1) What should I read next? and 2) do I dare watch the Scorcese film?

I would prefer not to. (Chinaski), Saturday, 6 January 2024 12:15 (ten months ago) link

The House of Mirth. You'll feel the noose tightening around your neck.

The Scorsese film is one of his best.

poppers fueled buttsex crescendo (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 6 January 2024 12:16 (ten months ago) link

I haven't tried any xxxp Harry Crews novels yet, but his memoir A Childhood: The Biography of a Place is amazingly good. Tough-minded teacher Mary Karr, in The Art of Memoir, says she's partial to it, while noting how it breaks some of her rules, and greatly prefers it to his fiction, likewise Casey Cep, in an astute New Yorker presentation. Those who do like the novels usually mention A Feast of Snakes first.

dow, Saturday, 6 January 2024 18:44 (ten months ago) link

xp I thought the film version of The House of Mirth was quite good as well. Gillian Anderson is underappreciated as an actor.

immodesty blaise (jimbeaux), Saturday, 6 January 2024 18:51 (ten months ago) link

Yeah, I thought it was good when first released, haven't seen it since, would like to.
Here's what I said about xp AC on a WAYR? thread last year:

In A Childhood: The Biography of a Place, the earliest memory of Harry Crews is of waking up under a tree with his excellent dog Sam, both of them in early morning sunlight: he's a sleepwalker who's hit it lucky, in and out of place. The place, into which he now centered by tobacco farming, is late 30s Bacon County, Georgia, sometimes extending across the St. Mary's River into Jacksonville, Florida's Springfield Section of tiny shotgun row houses and cigar factories, with the youngest children, like himself, left to their own devices.
In Bacon and the Section, he's the mostly the audience, including that of the glossy people in the Sears Roebuck catalog, so fantastically intact, unlike almost every one else he sees, that they must have wounds under their clothes: he and his friend Willalee and Willalee's grandmother, Auntie.a self-proclaimed conjure woman and ex-slave, tell each other stories about the Sears people: the audience continuing through the creative process.
Little Crews also responds and is responded and susceptible to an increasing number of people, becoming "a parade" of vistors to his bedroom, when he's confined with "infantile paralysis" (nice work, Dr. Colombo). Many of these are people he knows or recognizes---though not the faith healer from the next county---in a new context, with him more an audience than ever, but for their attentions. Scary, especially when Auntie
s dropping knowledge, though things were already disturbing enough, hence the sleepwalking, and now he feels in place (for one thing, he can't wake up in a dark field, because he can't get there).
The second session is even better: almost boiled alive, he now qualifies for actual treatment, by drying light and soothing spray (which becomes a protective coating) while he's under a protective shell, which he compares to the top of a carriage, with his Sears Roebuck Catalog and a tablet for his detective novel, about a boy detective who carries fireworks for protection. He's also allowed to keep an attentive baby goat in there---all things for the twice-struck child---
Before, in between, and after these confinements, he can disappear like a tiny Ishmael, one whose reappearances become more self-revealing, traced in and out of place, for keeps---spoiler of sorts: a mind-fuck evangelist appears, an alibi of sorts for very bad child Crews deed, but a plausible one, as far as he goes, which is pretty far, in a professional way. Even I, Boomer suburbanite, was singed by one during a brief primary school encounter, while preschool Crews and his crew get the extended treatment, as isolation's captive audience.
There are what I take to be fictional outcroppings, but not much to stumble over. He learns from the stories of men (character-driven, funny) and women (action, cutting the surface)--the former told while taking a break, the latter not so much.

dow, Saturday, 6 January 2024 18:54 (ten months ago) link

“the house of mirth” is extraordinary

“the leopard”, which I finished today, was also extraordinary

LaMDA barry-stanners (||||||||), Saturday, 6 January 2024 19:59 (ten months ago) link

^^ otm

I'm about halfway into A Lost Lady, Willa Cather. There's still time for a change of direction, but so far it tilts toward romantic sentimentality in a way that is uncharacteristic of Cather.

My suspicion is that this is partly due to a technical issue, where she fails to adequately disentangle and distinguish between her own omniscient/objective narrative voice and a narrative perspective strongly tethered to one of her central character's point of view. Cather is usually very intentional about such technical nuances, so this apparent leakage of romance into the 'omniscient voice' passages is puzzling to me.

more difficult than I look (Aimless), Saturday, 6 January 2024 20:04 (ten months ago) link

The Leopard is amazing. Whole scenes whirl in dusty corridors of my mind.

I would prefer not to. (Chinaski), Saturday, 6 January 2024 20:20 (ten months ago) link

I read (or, rather, listened to) Steven Price's novel about Lampedusa's writing of The Leopard, called (not surprisingly) Lampedusa. Now I have to read the source material.

immodesty blaise (jimbeaux), Saturday, 6 January 2024 20:22 (ten months ago) link

I'm about halfway into A Lost Lady, Willa Cather. There's still time for a change of direction, but so far it tilts toward romantic sentimentality in a way that is uncharacteristic of Cather.

My suspicion is that this is partly due to a technical issue, where she fails to adequately disentangle and distinguish between her own omniscient/objective narrative voice and a narrative perspective strongly tethered to one of her central character's point of view. Cather is usually very intentional about such technical nuances, so this apparent leakage of romance into the 'omniscient voice' passages is puzzling to me.

Oh, wow, interesting. The narrative framing reminded me of The Great Gatsby's, where the distance b/w us and Gatsby works in the novel's favor; it deepens his mystery.

poppers fueled buttsex crescendo (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 6 January 2024 22:32 (ten months ago) link

Here's a recent piece on Crews: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2022/04/04/a-childhood-is-one-of-the-finest-memoirs-ever-written

I should note that Penguin Classics has reissued some of those hard-to-find novels.

poppers fueled buttsex crescendo (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 6 January 2024 22:34 (ten months ago) link

Yeah, that's the Cep coverage I xxxposted, glad to see it's not paywalled, thanks!
Late last night, wanting to be done it with it, I finished my first Portis, The Dog of the South. I can see how his deadpan, constantly active, funky panoramas suited the Coens, who declared their True Grit straight from the book, w/o bothering to watch the John Wayne version. And this might be a good movie too, though on the page it gets monotonous to me, with the same affects, especially via the motormouth monologues of self-justifying seekers, finders, who just keep a-goin', frequently on the shady side---I admit it's also a tad close to home, coming from several directions, but mainly drone-y, despite all the bumps, breakdowns and more turns ahead. Good choice of narrator,though: a determined driver and straight man for others, also naive, relatively innocent, conservative, if a bit crazed/compulsive, and can see maybe why his wife took off, somewhut starved,
I will read True Grit at some point, but how does A Dog... compare to his others? Should I keep-a goin' with any of them?

dow, Sunday, 7 January 2024 00:54 (ten months ago) link

Yes, "affects," not "effects": in this case, the way I read it and feel about it: downtempo, despite the pace of the predictably colorful, crinkled road reports.

dow, Sunday, 7 January 2024 01:07 (ten months ago) link

The poem "To Elsie" by Wm. Carlos Williams is my touchstone for understanding the characters and stories Portis wanted to get down on paper. It's online here:

https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/46485/to-elsie

more difficult than I look (Aimless), Sunday, 7 January 2024 02:11 (ten months ago) link

totally ripped off beethoven imo

mookieproof, Sunday, 7 January 2024 02:23 (ten months ago) link

doesn't everyone sooner or later?

more difficult than I look (Aimless), Sunday, 7 January 2024 02:27 (ten months ago) link

Water Closet Williams shoulda stopped after the first line, which is classick quote-bait, but after all who among us is that pure, and I don't think peasant traditions would help Portis characters, who are more decent (at least in the sense that a meal or an overcoat can be decent) than the rest of that, as are some Williams (he wrote better fiction than poetry, I now think). Portis seems closer to Sherwood Anderson (on the road, not in Winesburg, as far as they'd care to know).

dow, Sunday, 7 January 2024 05:48 (ten months ago) link

i'm experimenting with a new method of reading while at the gym. audiobook playing in my earphones, tablet placed across the screen with ebook of same book. for the latter i use an app called BookFusion that has an "autoscroll" feature which i calibrate to match the speed of the reader. i am aware it sounds insane but it actually works. i'm too adhd to listen to audiobooks, and pure reading while running doesn't work. i also zone out super hard and find i can run for much longer, do a few extra laps to finish a chapter, etc. i find exercise insanely boring but cardio helps me with stress/anxiety so i'm hoping it sticks. finished "say nothing" by patrick radden keefe (which was excellent) in a little over a week

flopson, Saturday, 16 March 2024 18:27 (eight months ago) link

Jones, Loaded

alimosina, Saturday, 16 March 2024 23:44 (eight months ago) link

Getting some non fiction in - an immense world by ed yong (life is bonkers, evolution is insane) and fermat's last theorem by simon singh.

gene besserit (ledge), Monday, 18 March 2024 09:32 (eight months ago) link

Jones, Loaded

― alimosina, Saturday, March 16, 2024 7:44 PM

I leafed through it at the bookshop yesterday.

poppers fueled buttsex crescendo (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 18 March 2024 10:09 (eight months ago) link

Priestdaddy, Patricia Lockwood - Difficult to talk about because, here and elsewhere, fawning over Lockwood is a) an obvious move and b) already somewhat passé; also difficult because reviewing, even in this informal setting, is about finding a way to pinpoint exactly what a writer's deal is, and her deal to a large extent is pinpointing exactly what lots of other things in life's deals are, so my insight looks pale. Suffice to say I totally loved this and laughed out loud many times.

Daniel_Rf, Monday, 18 March 2024 10:13 (eight months ago) link

One I've actually read! It's great, isn't it? I was googling to remember the name of the other book, and found this about her meeting the Pope, which I will now sit down to read
https://www.lrb.co.uk/the-paper/v45/n23/patricia-lockwood/diary

kinder, Monday, 18 March 2024 10:41 (eight months ago) link

Thanks, I was meaning to look that up!

Daniel_Rf, Monday, 18 March 2024 10:53 (eight months ago) link

Ted Gioia History of Jazz
pretty in depth history of jazz over 400 pages. Goes into the 21st century a bit.
I'm still on Modern Jazz, thought I'd be through this faster. But it is pretty good.

What is Modern Israel? Yakov Rabkin
History of the creation and results of setting up Israel. Looking at Zionism, its ties to the Nazi Party, the drive to secularism in Zionism. I've come across a lot of this before in Pappe, Masalha , Sand and elsewhere. So it's not as shocking as coming across the information contained absolutely freshly. But there is some dodgy behaviour looked at here. & it has confirmed the links between Zionism and the extreme right wing including the Nazi Party.
Interesting book and quite short,

Strangest genius : the stained glass of Harry Clarke Lucy Costigan
picture book on the stained glass artwork of Harry Clarke the Irish artist. I need to get into this. Still kicking myself for missing a cheap personal copy at the start of the first lockdown by not ringing a bookshop that had a few.
Great artist anyway. Seemed to have some influence from Aubrey Beardsley.

Sonic Life Thurston Moore
Sonic Youth ,mainstay's memoir. So far I'm still in the late 70s with him driving to events with his friend Harold. They're getting to a lot of gigs at CBGBs and Max's and discovering a lot of music.
Pretty great book but I'm reading a lot of other stuff at the same time so its being backburnered.

Andrew Heywood Political Theory
good primer on the subject. My current bathroom book,

Stevo, Monday, 18 March 2024 12:55 (eight months ago) link

fermat's last theorem by simon singh.

apparently this is called fermat's enigma, in large letters on the cover.

gene besserit (ledge), Monday, 18 March 2024 14:46 (eight months ago) link

I started Morning and Evening, my first Jon Fosse.

poppers fueled buttsex crescendo (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 18 March 2024 19:29 (eight months ago) link

"Good Morning, Midnight" was great. Haven't read a bad Rhys yet, so will definitely keep going. Currently reading a biography of Teddy Roosevelt focusing on his youth: "Mornings on Horseback" by David McCullough. Covers a similar time period and American upper class social stratum as the William James bio I read last year.

o. nate, Monday, 18 March 2024 20:06 (eight months ago) link

fermat's last theorem by simon singh.

apparently this is called fermat's enigma, in large letters on the cover.

no, my copy is indeed called fermat's last theorem. enigma is the american edition. is "theorem" too scary a word for americans, like "philosopher's"?

gene besserit (ledge), Tuesday, 19 March 2024 14:34 (seven months ago) link

Enigma I associate with Turing, maybe that’s why?

Don’t Want to Say Goodbye Jumbo (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 19 March 2024 14:52 (seven months ago) link

Oh wait

Don’t Want to Say Goodbye Jumbo (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 19 March 2024 14:54 (seven months ago) link

Finished a re-read of Lyn Hejinian's Oxota: A Short Russian Novel, which is, of course, none of those things. It consists of 270 free sonnets that interweave elements of Hejinian's visits to the USSR during perestroika alongside the plot of Pushkin's Eugene Onegin. It's a great book, much more funny and joyous than I remember it being. That said, I first read it more than a decade ago, so my memory of it might have been a little blurry.

Hejinian is well worth reading, for anyone interested in contemporary poetry. She will be missed.

Today I need to finish my fifth or sixth re-reading of Etel Adnan's The Arab Apocalypse to prep for my poetry workshop students tomorrow, but I also am spending stray moments with a short Michael Palmer book, First Figures, which I picked up over the weekend. Palmer is an interesting poet, for while his first five or six books are quite mesmerizing in their focus on how and why we read and place signification the way the we do, his later works veer into a very French sort of abstraction that is deeply boring. This is one of his final "interesting" books.

butt dumb tight my boners got boners (the table is the table), Tuesday, 19 March 2024 15:41 (seven months ago) link

It's officially Spring! Things have been a bit slack in the WAYR thread compared to days of yore, but maybe the pace will pick up a bit in a new thread. Either way, it's time for a new beginning.

Any takers for starting a Spring 2024 thread?

more difficult than I look (Aimless), Tuesday, 19 March 2024 15:48 (seven months ago) link

a very French sort of abstraction that is deeply boring.

My grad school experience in the early 90s in a nutshell.

immodesty blaise (jimbeaux), Tuesday, 19 March 2024 16:03 (seven months ago) link

lol— did you get hit with too much Lacan and Derrida?

butt dumb tight my boners got boners (the table is the table), Tuesday, 19 March 2024 16:09 (seven months ago) link

As filtered through professors like Perry Meisel, yes.

immodesty blaise (jimbeaux), Tuesday, 19 March 2024 16:12 (seven months ago) link

a very French sort of abstraction that is deeply boring.

You mean like Paul Auster stuff?

Don’t Want to Say Goodbye Jumbo (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 19 March 2024 16:43 (seven months ago) link

I gone done and made a new one: I have coveted everything and enjoyed nothing: what are you reading in Spring 2024?

I would prefer not to. (Chinaski), Tuesday, 19 March 2024 17:05 (seven months ago) link

I wonder if some of the French reputation for abstraction may have to do with translation difficulties. Just guessing it would be easier to make a long sentence with many abstract terms cohere in a language like French, with its wealth of inflections. I think many English translations try to keep the long sentences but without the inflections as hints they become rather frustrating to parse.

o. nate, Tuesday, 19 March 2024 17:06 (seven months ago) link

Thanks, Chinaski!

more difficult than I look (Aimless), Tuesday, 19 March 2024 17:08 (seven months ago) link

I mean that he utilizes a lot of abstract rather than concrete images, and this lends his poems a sort of French theoretical quality mixed with a strange messianism that I think of as rooted in “the mythic.” Part of my disinterest might be that this style is deeply dated; the other part of me believes that the poems are so hermetic that it takes a certain mindset to find a way into them. I enjoy a lot of “difficult” poetry, though— Palmer’s work simply feels like one sheer surface, whereas many of his compatriots write in multiple modes and in ways that betray surfaces of language and signification rubbing against one another. That kind of friction is ultimately absent from Palmer’s work after the mid 80s, to my mind.

butt dumb tight my boners got boners (the table is the table), Tuesday, 19 March 2024 17:12 (seven months ago) link


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