One often hears the complaint that ______ is "difficult"

do tell

stop being difficult

'Still not convinced? "There are lots of myths around live art," complains Tanuja. "One is that it is challenging and difficult. I'd say that at its core it's about finding new ways of engaging with an audience. Much of it is about changing expectations of what performance might be and trying some of those things out."

'One often hears the complaint that Derek Walcott's poetry is "difficult". Though the note of resentment is seldom justified (it usually masks laziness or a kind of defiant philistinism on the plaintiff's part), still, it adheres to the truth: many of Walcott's poems aredifficult.'

One often hears the complaint that Derek Walcott's poetry is "difficult".

ya I get this one all the time

Found within half an hour of each other yesterday. Neither of them are actually the central variation, though, which sort of goes: one often hears the complaint that _____ is difficult, but the people who make that complaint only do so because they fundamentally misunderstand (because they're thick.)

xpost haha yes that is totally also a problem with this

derek walcott's kind of awesome tho! (n.b. i say this after reading the bit of the one about the sailor which junot diaz used as epigram to oscar wao.) (other epigram to oscar wao: "of what impact are brief human lives .... TO GALACTUS!!!") (opinion on oscar wao: i wish i'd spend the time reading more derek walcott. or early marvel.)

i have used this in like all of my art papers

you should stop!

agreed its just a way to fill out the word count

My guess is that people who give a shit don't generally complain about things being "difficult" and people who don't would be like "who hell he?" anyway.

it's a strawman argument

My guess is that people who give a shit don't generally complain about things being "difficult" and people who don't would be like "who hell he?" anyway.

-- Noodle Vague, Sunday, April 20, 2008 9:20 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

yeah, it only makes sense if yr writing to that audience; i think its totally worth it as a 'you know what, this is difficult, but here's why its worth it' kind of device

although duh 'one often hears the complaint that' negates that audience so nm

What if you cite it? "Mary Higgins, in her 1935 review of _Mrs. Teazedale's Parade_, referred to the play as 'difficult'."

"Many people think", "it is widely believed", "despite the contention", "I have heard it said"... are all manifestations of the Phantom Opponent.

lol sermon on the mount some strawman bullshit

:D

I actually just met this guy who is writing his thesis on rhetorical techniques of (poetry) critics, how they create constructs like "the average reader" or "common sense", and how these constructs relate to one another and reinforce each other.

was he hot

i think the bit that really requires elucidation (okay, the bit i give a shit about anyway) is when 'difficult' became popular as a slur: i'm pretty sure also that this clich� enables that which it's on the face of it against

i was actually hoping to run into more examples so i could spam the thread with them mainly though

george steiner's ON DIFFICULTY to thread <-- i totally bought this book as a student bcz i am a showoffy ponce

it's actually good tho (not by ANY means true of everything he wrote)

He was, you know, straight, and a bit bearish for my tastes. But he immediately won me over with his poetry. I was like, phew, there's a few poems I no longer have to write.

Also, I think Aristotle says something against difficulty, but even though I have the Poetics in my bag I'm not going to bother looking at it. Because, meh.

What the hell. I will chime in with some thoughts, although it is a dead certainty they will not be especially original ones.

Some poetry is difficult to understand. Some poems can be so occult as to defy meaning entirely. But I don't think that difficulty has the first thing to do with a poem being good or bad. After all, some very worthwhile thoughts are inherently difficult, such as the 'fact' that a beam of light is simultaneously made of both particles and waves. Other worthwhile thoughts are very simple, such as "The name for this feeling is awe."

The converse of each of these truths is equally true. Some difficult thoughts are not quite worth a plugged nickel, for example, phrenology. Same goes for simplicity, although to a lesser degree, since it is much easier to detect mere triviality when it is expressed very simply, such as "I am wearing shoes."

In sum, difficulty is a purely neutral quality, and making much of it either way is a distraction from more important qualities. The only reason I can think of why critics would talk about it is that it is so bloody easy to talk about and it presents an easy way to spin out a lot of pages that look impressive.

Music critics don't dismiss Mahler's symphonies because they are intricate and difficult, or complain about Schubert's lieder because they are too simple.

Eh?

He was, you know, straight, and a bit bearish for my tastes.

-- Casuistry, Friday, April 25, 2008 1:13 AM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Link

At first I thought you were talking about George Steiner here and that you meant very different things by "straight" and "bearish".

"I'm havin to go up to Mass...Masstoosits, or however they say that difficult state name"

a customer just said this to me over the phone

agreed its just a way to fill out the word count

-- BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Sunday, April 20, 2008 4:18 PM (4 days ago) Bookmark Link

bad hoos

lol did you SEE my most recent revive of the "hoos solicits ideas for contemp art" thread

link

Aimless this is totally not a trope that's restricted to poetry.

I had not heard of that George Steiner book and I feel it sounds like I would enjoy it.

One often hears the complaint that ______ is "difficult"... in bed.