Everything is Illuminated

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Just finished it. Wasn't sure whether to reread certain sections and try and map things together or to throw it out the window into the river.

I've noticed Safran Foer gets a kicking on these boards. Why? Smuggness? For trying to be clever? For writing an ambitious multi-layered novel? Or because you come out of it thinking what exactly was that about?

I'm curious what people think, not least because we're doing it for bookclub.

― MikeyG (MikeyG), Tuesday, 17 February 2004 10:22 (twenty-two years ago)

Foer's funny for five-six pages, infuriating at novel-length. The magic realism elements seemed more like Marquez rip-offs than spins on those crazy old Yiddisher folk tales.

― Chuck Tatum (Chuck Tatum), Tuesday, 17 February 2004 17:52 (twenty-two years ago)

I started it a while back but wasn't able to get into it. I'd like to go back to it when the mood is right. Maybe I couldn't get into it specifically because the writing was a little off...

― Vermont Girl (Vermont Girl), Tuesday, 17 February 2004 17:59 (twenty-two years ago)

Chuck hit the nail on the head. When I started it, I thought "Wow! Great talent" but 20 pages later, I started to dislike it. By the end I was like --- ugh.

He's too immature, IMO, for such a tale.

For a similar theme that is MUCH more moving/disturbing check out The Painted Bird by Jerzy Kosinski.

― BabyBuddha (BabyBuddha), Tuesday, 17 February 2004 21:36 (twenty-two years ago)

There are occasions in the book where the writing is terrific. The scene where Alex's grandfather identifies Herschel as a jew in front of the Nazis is both shocking and absorbing.

The punctuation and text games seemed like an afterthought. "I've written this multi-textured, modernist novel with interwoven stories. I guess I ought to insert two pages of one word repitition."

The most frustrating thing, however (and this applies to all books), is the feeling that I didn't get it.

― MikeyG (MikeyG), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 10:57 (twenty-two years ago)

You all are a little off! The book was really pretty good. The shtetl storyline wasn't always carried off, especially at first, but i thought it eventually worked okay.

― linn d., Thursday, 19 February 2004 04:31 (twenty-two years ago)

This was one of last year's let-downs for me (the other being The Russian Debuante's Handbook). There'd been so much hype about the darn thing that by the time I was able to get around to reading it, there was no way it could live-up to my expectations. I do think that it was excellent at the beginning and then went downhill and became forced and pathetic (and annoying, at some points, too). Bummer.

― I'm Passing Open Windows (Ms Laura), Thursday, 19 February 2004 07:24 (twenty-two years ago)

Awww you guys -- I unabashedly loved it. I don't remember any magical realism, heck I'm not exactly sure what that is. Maybe I'm a more unsophisticated reader than I thought. My attention never flagged for a second, at turns touching and hilarious etc all the praise it's garnered. The pomo meta-tricks that turn people off, I thought that Foer kept it muted.

― Leee Majors (Leee), Saturday, 21 February 2004 00:57 (twenty-two years ago)

To be more positive, there's a kind of show-offy story about punctuation he wrote for the New Yorker that I rather liked. And he's certainly good at jokes. I expect he'll get better with age.

― Chuck Tatum (Chuck Tatum), Saturday, 21 February 2004 23:22 (twenty-two years ago)

I loved it from beginning to end. I guess I'm a chump.

― Phastbuck, Sunday, 22 February 2004 16:00 (twenty-two years ago)

I gave it up in irritation a third of the way through. One man's rich, comic voice is another's one trick pony, I suppose.

― Matt (Matt), Sunday, 22 February 2004 18:43 (twenty-two years ago)

I liked it. It was good, especially the very end. I am clearly too uncool to see through the hype the way you smart people do!

― Begs2Differ (Begs2Differ), Monday, 23 February 2004 20:50 (twenty-two years ago)

two years pass...

I think it's mostly the little things about this book that are kind of bugging me, even though, I also found it, at times, a moving read. But here are some of the problems I had...

1. Especially early on the book relies on cursing for humor. The f-bomb just isn't that amazing a source of humor - it's too facile.

2. I didn't buy the "hollywood" moment, when they return to the restaurant after meeting "Augustine" and the grandfather, who'd been calling Foer "the Jew," now suddenly objects when the waitress does the same and makes her apologize - and even now is pro-vegetarian food. This sudden change of heart (after all, he had learned nothing new that day) played false & forced.

3. It was unnecessary to have Alex confess in his letter that he wasn't really the stud he made himself out to be. It was obvious earlier on that he was lying and/or exaggerating (re: nightclubs, girlfriends, etc), and it would have been more amusing and interesting if he had continued along that path. No need to lead the reader by the nose here...

4. I don't exactly buy Alex's ignorance re: the events of WWII. Often, despite he garbled translations (which seem to disappear the longer the book goes on) he usually comes across as a pretty smart guy. Suddenly he hears the testimony of one holocaust survivor and his whole attitude changes. I guess maybe.

5. Thinking of a book as an object one holds - I really do hate books that feel the need to run what, a hundred pull quotes from reviews on the opening pages! This is just a pet peeve of mine...

― Jeff LeVine (Jeff LeVine), Monday, 11 September 2006 18:27 (nineteen years ago)

It's juvenile I know, but everytime someone mentions 'the f-bomb', I'm compelled to point out that the word is 'fuck' (or possibly 'fucking'). I've known priests who were less prudish.

― Ray (Ray), Monday, 11 September 2006 19:21 (nineteen years ago)

oh Ray - give it a fucking break. It's just an expression too.

― Jeff LeVine (Jeff LeVine), Monday, 11 September 2006 19:35 (nineteen years ago)

"The F-bomb: explosively facile!" -- One Hundred Broadsheet Newspapers

― nabisco (nabisco), Monday, 11 September 2006 19:35 (nineteen years ago)

Yes, just a childish and/or prudish expression.

― Ray (Ray), Monday, 11 September 2006 19:48 (nineteen years ago)

"That Ray, he ain't no cunting childish prude! He's a man. All man." -- Madonna

― Aimless (Aimless), Monday, 11 September 2006 19:50 (nineteen years ago)

It's true, I like to fuck cunts with my big cock.

― Ray (Ray), Monday, 11 September 2006 19:55 (nineteen years ago)

Proof indisputable.

― Aimless (Aimless), Monday, 11 September 2006 20:04 (nineteen years ago)

i thought "f-bomb" referred to particular deployments of the word "fuck", for marked effect. like in uh like one song in every teenage fanclub album for example. referring to someone deploying "the f-bomb" has an impied comment on the fronting aspect of the deployer's deployment. i thought.

― tom west (thomp), Monday, 11 September 2006 20:47 (nineteen years ago)

I think the primary meaning is "shock listeners by saying 'fuck'", and "saying 'fuck' to claim a more shocking persona than you're really entitled to" is secondary.

― Ray (Ray), Tuesday, 12 September 2006 06:32 (nineteen years ago)

This is all... very illuminating.

― Aimless (Aimless), Tuesday, 12 September 2006 13:30 (nineteen years ago)

everyone's entitled to front!

anyway tho surely if it means "shock listeners by saying f. - " then it's a pretty useful expression?

― tom west (thomp), Tuesday, 12 September 2006 16:01 (nineteen years ago)

Yeah, an expression that means do-something-shocking-that-doesn't-actually-shock-anyone-because-they-don't-take-you-seriously-and-think-you're-just-doing-it-to-be-shocking" would be very useful in this oh so jaded age.

― Ray (Ray), Tuesday, 12 September 2006 20:02 (nineteen years ago)

Extremely Fucking Loud and Incredibly Fucking Close

― A-ron Hubbard (Hurting), Wednesday, 13 September 2006 01:15 (nineteen years ago)

Now that is a title.

― Ray (Ray), Wednesday, 13 September 2006 06:39 (nineteen years ago)

And works for so many books... Oliver Fucking Twist...Fucking Disgrace...The Time Traveler's fucking Wife...The Line of fucking Beauty...

― Matt (Matt), Wednesday, 13 September 2006 13:11 (nineteen years ago)

Also works for popular nonfiction:

Guns, Germs, and Fucking Steel, Bitch

Freakafuckinomics

177fucking6

― A-ron Hubbard (Hurting), Thursday, 14 September 2006 01:32 (nineteen years ago)

The Sound and the Fucking Fury
http://www.infoaomori.ne.jp/~khosoda/picture/charisma/yngwie.jpg

― Marmot (marmotwolof), Thursday, 14 September 2006 02:08 (nineteen years ago)

Crime and Fucking Punishment

The Fucking Color Purple

Good Fucking Night, Moon

― Vermont Girl (Vermont Girl), Wednesday, 20 September 2006 14:54 (nineteen years ago)

Cyrano de-fucking-Bergerac

The Vulgate Fucking Bible

― tom west (thomp), Wednesday, 20 September 2006 15:37 (nineteen years ago)

More previous winners of the Man Fucking Booker Prize:

How Late It Was, How Fucking Late
Paddy Clarke Ha Ha Fucking Ha
The Fucking Sea
The Sea, the Fucking Sea
Possession: A Fucking Romance
The Old Fucking Devils
The Remains of the Fucking Day

― nabisco (nabisco), Wednesday, 20 September 2006 19:11 (nineteen years ago)

And some winners of the National Book-Fucking Award:

The Collected Stories of Katherine Anne Motherfucking Porter
Rabbit is Fucking Rich as Fuck
That Fuck with the Golden Arm
Fuck Off, Columbus
From Here to Fucking Eternity
The Complete Stories of Flannery O'Fucking Connor
Fucking in America

― nabisco (nabisco), Wednesday, 20 September 2006 19:16 (nineteen years ago)

King Ottokar's Fucking Sceptre
Explorers on the Fucking Moon
The Fucking Secret of That Fucking Unicorn
Prisoners of the Motherfucking Sun
The Crab with the Fucking Golden Claws
The Seven Crystal Balls
Tintin in the Fucking Congo
Tintin in Fucking Tibet
Tintin in the Land of the Fucking Reds
Red Rackham's Fucking Treasure, You Cunt

― tom west (thomp), Wednesday, 20 September 2006 19:26 (nineteen years ago)

How Late It Was, How Late and Paddy Clarke Ha Fucking Ha actually work.
Asterix in Some Fucking Place, What Am I, A Fucking Tour Guide?

― Ray (Ray), Wednesday, 20 September 2006 19:30 (nineteen years ago)

er, How Late It Was, How Fucking Late, obv

― Ray (Ray), Wednesday, 20 September 2006 19:31 (nineteen years ago)

Much Fucking Ado about Fuck-all

― Matt (Matt), Thursday, 21 September 2006 13:23 (nineteen years ago)

The Complete Fucking Idiot's Guide To Personal Finance

The Stock Market for Fucking Dumbasses

― A-ron Hubbard (Hurting), Thursday, 21 September 2006 16:39 (nineteen years ago)

Some bestsellers of the 90s and 00s, real quick, before this gets completely unfunny:

The Five Motherfuckers You Meet in Heaven
Fucking Cold-as-Shit Mountain
All Through the Fucking Night
The Nanny-Fucking Diaries
Star Wars: Episode 1, The Phantom Fucking Menace
Rose Are Fucking Red
The Lovely Boner

― nabisco (nabisco), Thursday, 21 September 2006 17:36 (nineteen years ago)

Fucking Fucking Amal
Fucking Fucking and Fucking Shopping

okay, i swear off this too.

― tom west (thomp), Thursday, 21 September 2006 18:39 (nineteen years ago)

So, Everything is Illuminated. I own this book but have no desire to read it.

― Marmot (marmotwolof), Thursday, 21 September 2006 22:18 (nineteen years ago)

Yeah, the joke was dead a long time ago but it's just so easy that it's hard to stop.

The Rough Fucking Guide to Jazz

― A-ron Hubbard (Hurting), Thursday, 21 September 2006 22:52 (nineteen years ago)

The Ticket That Fucking Exploded

― Marmot (marmotwolof), Thursday, 21 September 2006 22:58 (nineteen years ago)

good god you people

― Josh (Josh), Friday, 22 September 2006 00:22 (nineteen years ago)

Get it, Rough Fucking!

― A-ron Hubbard (Hurting), Friday, 22 September 2006 01:48 (nineteen years ago)

The Soft Fucking Machine

― Marmot (marmotwolof), Friday, 22 September 2006 02:09 (nineteen years ago)

This thread's derailing may actually be an apt commentary on the book in question -- I have zip to say about it, good or bad.

― nabisco (nabisco), Friday, 22 September 2006 21:21 (nineteen years ago)

This thread has me popeyed and slackjawed at the stark contrast between the postings of 04 and those of 06.

― sandy mc (sandy mc), Sunday, 24 September 2006 06:05 (nineteen years ago)

See also: stark contrast in people-caring-about-Foer '04 and people-caring-about-Foer '06.

― nabisco (nabisco), Sunday, 24 September 2006 23:54 (nineteen years ago)

i actually like foer. if he did a book of stuff like that The Punctuation of Heart Disease story or whatever it's called i'd be all over it. possibly.

― tom west (thomp), Monday, 25 September 2006 01:01 (nineteen years ago)

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