Love & Rockets - classic or dud

ie, if you stick to those, you can ignore any and all books in other formats.

this 'how to read love and rockets' page on the fantagraphics site is reasonably clear:

http://www.fantagraphics.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=76&Itemid=135

Everything from MAGGIE AND HOPEY COLOR FUN (you're right, no WHOA NELLIE) through LOVE AND ROCKETS VOL. II #19 (i.e. short of the NYT Rena story). Or in book terms, LOCAS IN LOVE, DICKS AND DEEDEES, GHOST OF HOPPERS, DICKS AND DEEDEES.

Also I'm pretty sure he meant Education of Hopey Glass instead Dicks and Deedees a second time.

OCD Alert: the upcoming second Fantagraphics Locas HC will be 8" x 5", according to Amazon (who do make mistakes), while the first one was 11" x 9". Maybe Kim can clear this up?

The stories were all drawn for comic size/proportions, not magazine, so it's actually entirely probable.

how is the new luba hardcover? does it leave a bunch of stuff out, as per what seems to be the norm?

bought the Luba hardcover recently as hadn't read any of the stuff in it before. bit puzzled by the order of things - loads on fritz, petra and venus before you get to luba (who seems pretty boring by comparison now ha).

anyway i re-read the Human Diastrophism and Beyond Palomar/Poison River stuff again but was wondering about various characters attitudes to English esp. Pipo's - living in Cali but refusing to speak it - to what extent is Beto making a political point here? An odd thing I noticed (tho may be mistaken) is that whenever the bitching about English comes up it always seems to come from women (Luba, Pipo, Carmen, Tonantzin iirc, uh...that girl who ends up marrying Petra and Fritz's Dad?) and wondered if this was intentional and why (maybe just suggesting the women are more defiant and proud i guess).

New issue was out as of San Diego. Super-intense and great Jaime story; Gilbert's "Fritz's movies/Killer" business getting weirder and weirder. Furry sex, etc.

Furry Sex!

Ape Sex?

hah! I'm holding off on reading New Adventures until I finish Volume II which I can't be bothered to track down all 20 issues of separately at the moment. Should have gotten them all from Fantagraphics when they were $40 a few years ago.

I'm convinced I'm going to wind up with a L&R tattoo one day.

Just read "Locas II," "Luba" and "High Soft Lisp." Throw in "La Maggie La Loca" from #20/The Art of Jaime Hernandez/the NYT Magazine Sunday Funnies, and you're basically up to speed.

Just finished reading issue 3 of New Adventures. Xaime is on FIRE lately.

Ape sex is also proper good.

I don't know if it was mentioned anywhere on ilx, but The Daily Cross Hatch did a good interview with Xaime recently. Here's pt. 4, which has links to the first three:
http://thedailycrosshatch.com/2010/11/23/interview-jaime-hernandez-pt-4-of-4/

Xaime is on FIRE lately.

Xaime has never, ever been better than the new New Stories, but I feel he's been on a cold streak lately otherwise - the NYT story really dragged and I don't think worked for a new audience, and the Ti-Girls story that took up the first TWO YEARS of this bold new format could not have been a worse introduction for new bookstore-based readers to his style, his world, and L&R in general. (Would have been PERFECT for when they went to comic-book format and colour in the 90s though!)

i wasn't crazy about ti-girls... i still haven't gotten around to his story in L&RNS 3, but i haven't heard anyone say it was anything else than the best he's ever done, so i suppose i should get on it. speaking of recent xaime, though, i did really like his story in kramers ergot 7 about the time machine.

Seriously, I haven't been paying as much attention to Jaime for years. Of course Gilbert's stuff had me totally lost, too big, I got confused, but I've been loving all his weird Fritz movie stuff and his weird stuff. But the two Xaime stories in number 3 just blew me away. Part of my problem has just been to not really keep up. I've read it all, but it's been so long since I've gone back and read stuff that I've lost sense of both of them> I think I've been pissed by all the various reissue formats and have gotten confused about what I've read or haven't read.

But the Xaime stuff with her younger brother, the flashback, Ray etc. Awesome stuff.

30th Anniversary panel at SDCC - 1 hour 24. All three Bros, Gary Groth interviewing and powerpointing, other surprises.

thanks!

I have ordered what I need to get up to date with the reprints.

I could just never get into Beto. Jaime was always more my speed. It's inspiring how he's aging his characters.

i had the opposite reaction to most people, oddly enough. i found it easy to become completely immersed in the palomar stories, while the locas stuff took me a few readings and rereadings before i felt the same way. i think part of it has to do with how locas transformed in its early years, whereas palomar is what it is from the earliest stories.

They were guests on the NPR music program Alt.Latino this past week -- can listen here, posted yesterday: http://www.npr.org/2012/09/27/160936447/love-and-rockets-and-music-comic-book-pioneers-gil-jaime-hernandez
Pretty good interview, nothing new for anyone who knows any of their bio.

I've gone back and forth. I mentioned a bit about it above but with more detail...When I got into them, it was all about Jaime. The punk rock lesbians, the gangs, the sci-fi action in the early stuff. Gilbert's stuff I didn't really appreciate. As I got older and the series progessed and evolved, there was a period where I suddenly started to really get into Gilbert, I loved the magical realism element and the stories in general. At a certain point I felt like Jaime's stuff was losing me, like he was just doing these slice of life things with these characters and I was losing sense of any overal story arc, while Gilbert was just getting bigger and better. Stuff like Poison River really killed me. And Gilbert's many non-Palomar stuff and different series and side-projects and the New Love stuff, the really twisted Jim Woodring-esque craziness.

But I totally lost track, just couldn't keep up with all the different series and Gilbert's Palomar family tree got too big for me to follow. And more recently I fell back in love with Jaime.

I mean, I'm splitting hairs, I love them both for similar and different reasons. Much of it is my own fault, it's been a long time since I've stepped back and read a lot in order, but I blame them...all the different series, it got so complicated! And they wouldn't come out for ages then suddenly there'd be a bunch and I'd forget if I had one already and I'd buy the same one again. Then they'd come out with the book and they've edited the story and added 50 pages. It's really frustrating!

If I had the money I'd go back and buy all the books of everything since the first series, because I'm just lost.

I mean, read this:

http://www.fantagraphics.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=76&Itemid=135

and tell me it doesn't piss you off!

Which reminds me, why didn't they include Poison River in the Palomar hardcover? I don't know how you can read that without realizing that in the middle of those stories Gilbert wrote an epic history that relates to current story.

The hardcovers are ridiculous. It seems like the new reprint 'digests' are gonna be pretty all-encompassing, so I think you can stick with those if you're patient. But, yeah, the numerous collection projects are pretty irritating, but I have all of the original series collections and all of the v.2 issues and I'm slowly amassing the 'digests' and the New Stories annuals, so I feel like I don't have to worry about much else.

I do agree with you re: the scattershot nature of Beto's latter day output. I gave up trying to get it all (or even keep up with however many books he puts out in a year), but that's due in large part to the fact that the stuff he's done lately doesn't interest or engage me as much as the Palomar proper stuff does. Hopefully he recollects it into 'digests' at some point down the line.

Oh, in keeping with milking the cash cow, Fantagraphics are releasing a collection of covers, a Reader, and a Companion (what's the difference between a Reader and a Companion, and why do they have to be two separate books?) in celebration of L&R's 30th anniversary.

it's not super hard, at least for Jaime: Mechanic, HOPPERS, Perla, Penny Century, Esperanza

Yeah, Jaime's concise like that. Beto, though, has something like 9 or 10 or more collections (Luba, Book of Ofelia, Three Sisters [all collected in the Luba HC...I think?], High Soft Lisp, Adventures of Venus, Birdland, Love From The Shadows, Troublemakers, New Tales Of Old Palomar, etc.) beyond his three Palomar 'digests' that are varying degrees of Palomar-related.

i think i have pretty much everything but it's in multiple different formats: first run tpb, current reissues, individual floppies, hardbacks...

Aside from the recent-ish slew of Beto books I couldn't keep up with, I'm thankfully just a few issues of Luba and Measles away from having everything in one format (and/)or another.

It's been 9 years since I picked up L&R ( La Perdida, Peter Bagge's stuff and Minimum Wage).
This rings true:
But I totally lost track, just couldn't keep up with all the different series and Gilbert's Palomar family tree got too big for me to follow. And more recently I fell back in love with Jaime.

Feel like I have missed a lot in but I have a mental block not knowing where to pick up, what I'd even purchase..... Last I read was Luba in America. I do prefer Jaime.

Primary Gilbert works, a continuing story of sorts:
Heartbreak Soup, Human Diastrophism, Beyond Palomar, the Luba collection (contains Luba in America, Book of Ofelia, Three Daughters), High Soft Lisp.

Secondary, mostly stand-alone stories: the three Fritz "film adaptations" (Chance in Hell, The Troublemakers, Love from the Shadows), various one-shots (Birdland, Speak of the Devil, Sloth), everything else...

The line about "losing track" reminds me of why I finally have up on the X-Books back in 1994 or so and never looked back.

TBF, this isn't a remotely comparable situation. Although I have mostly kept up with the X-stuff so I don't really have a leg to stand on re: Beto.

I would probably add New Tales Of Old Palomar to the essential Beto list, as well.

My stuff is in storage. I wish I could see what I have and don't have. Been forgetting a lot lately, so if I had my stuff, I'd probably have to read it all again.

Okay, so I've read this stuff over the years but never got around to buying much of it beyond a signed Titan Books edition of Heartbreak Soup and the Palomar hardcover. I bought one of those $50 now for $100 gift certificate to Fantagraphics a little while ago and thought I'd finally buy some for my collection. Since I have the Palomar book, I think it makes more sense to buy the Locas collection and Amor y Cohetes than to buy the complete volume 1 box. Am I wrong in thinking that?

If you have the palomar book, you should make sure get Poison River in some form. I think they left it out of Palomar but it's great and essential back-story.

Okay, so I need Beyond Palomar to go with Amor y Cohetes. Those plus The Locas Collection is roughly $99. Consider it done.

So, Locas ordered from Fanta, the other two from Amazon (if anyone needs Amor y Cohetes it's $6.80 from Amazon right now). Thanks for the feedback, Dan.

The whole thing is so confusing and really pisses me off. So many different versions, and some of the books add pages, or scramble pages. Even the Poison River book scrambled pages around and added a ton of pages that weren't in the original comic!

I don't know what is what and am totally lost.

In any case, Poison River is great and Love and Rockets X is much less related to the Palomar storyline (though it has a bit of crossover) but is still good reading.

Far too confusing. I think the big hardcovers were a good idea but they only muddied the waters further.

At least los bros are consistent - TI Girls has new stuff not in the annual comics. Frustrating.

poison river in the comics skipped back-and-forth in time and hard to follow which iirc is why it was rearranged (chronologically) when collected.

*was* hard to follow.

also just that Beto adds pages and panels and stuff all the time, ever since the X collection

Ti-Girls is the first time Xaime has reworked for the collection afair

I thought he had for the two Locas hardcovers but not to the extent Beto had. Could be totally mistaken.

Locals HC 1 doesn't include stories about non-Maggie & Hopey characters (eg Flies On The Ceiling), no actual new pages or rewriting though afaik