And things will NEVER be the same (except they were)

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aka Universe-changing ideas that were discreetly ignored by everybody.

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 26 September 2005 09:28 (twenty years ago)

- the DC Earth has four elementals - Swamp Thing, the RED TORNADO, Firestorm and NAIAD!!11!!? - oh yes and Captain Atom is a QUANTUM ELEMENTAL whatever that is.

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 26 September 2005 09:29 (twenty years ago)

- Some of Marvel's mutants are an immortal super race of mutants and if they get killed they come back and one of them is SAM GUTHRIE AKA CANNONBALL!!!!!!!!

(what were these called again?)

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 26 September 2005 09:30 (twenty years ago)

(also feel free to strike these from the record by pointing out where they HAVE been used again)

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 26 September 2005 09:30 (twenty years ago)

- All of Spider-Man's villains ever, in fact all super-villains ever, were funded by Norman Osborn as part of a Sekrit Plan.

(This is quite recent but I bet will never be mentioned again)

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 26 September 2005 09:31 (twenty years ago)

I thought all the fallout of the Manhunter event had been happily buried, but no, it seems an integral part of the whole OMAC Crisis on never ending crossovers.

― Pete (Pete), Monday, 26 September 2005 09:33 (twenty years ago)

It is? I've missed that.

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 26 September 2005 09:36 (twenty years ago)

Also "if they get killed they come back" is I realise not a particularly distinctive mutant attribute.

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 26 September 2005 09:37 (twenty years ago)

The Floronic Man was part of the most powerful team ever, created by the Guardians Of Oa to replace the Green Lanterns once they had destroyed the power battery.

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Monday, 26 September 2005 09:41 (twenty years ago)

weren't those mutants just called something like "The twelve" or something. I imagine that there were 12 of them!

― Mark C (Markco), Monday, 26 September 2005 09:48 (twenty years ago)

No the twelve was ANOTHER shit mutant idea about the 12 most powerful mutants EVAR who Apocalypse wanted to kill. That doesn't actually count for the purposes of this thread because I think it was actually resolved in some way rather than being swept under the carpet.

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 26 September 2005 09:49 (twenty years ago)

They were called, inevitably, the Externals. Eternals + X to make a WORD THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH BEING ETERNAL.

― Flyboy (Flyboy), Monday, 26 September 2005 10:03 (twenty years ago)

doh, I am getting my shit mutant ideas mixed up...

― Mark C (Markco), Monday, 26 September 2005 10:13 (twenty years ago)

It looks like Grant Morrisons mutants go mainstream idea is about to be obliterated with the House Of M.

― Pete (Pete), Monday, 26 September 2005 10:59 (twenty years ago)

"The Floronic Man was part of the most powerful team ever, created by the Guardians Of Oa to replace the Green Lanterns once they had destroyed the power battery."

They were called the New Guardians! and Pieface and Harbinger were part of that team too (not so sure about Harbinger, but I remember her being on some cover)

― iodine (iodine), Monday, 26 September 2005 12:18 (twenty years ago)

Has there actually ever been a worse team ever than the New Guardians?

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 26 September 2005 12:19 (twenty years ago)

I suspect not.

For readers too young to remember, the New Guardians were the group that span out of the Millennium x-o event. 9 new heroes were chosen, but were betrayed by the boo-hiss-nasty South African one. The team were an equal opportunities wet dream, the worst example being the gay Puerto Rican guy whose power was, I dunno, being good with colours or something.

Read all about it here.

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Monday, 26 September 2005 12:27 (twenty years ago)

Haha

On Steve Engleheart's own website he says the original title was supposed to be TRUMPS, but Donald objected. It's hard to imagine how New Guardians might have sucked more, but as RUMPS it's just about possible.

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Monday, 26 September 2005 12:31 (twenty years ago)

Actually, just slightly worse than the gay Puerto Rican was the Anti-Thatcherite West Indies -patois slingin' Brit.

― Huk-L (Huk-L), Monday, 26 September 2005 13:45 (twenty years ago)

Not quite Universe-shattering, but during the Green Lantern's abominable residency in the otherwise pretty cool Action Comics Weekly, it seemed like every storyline was supposed to completely revamp the character and CHANGE THINGS FOREVER.
First arc: Star Sapphire slices & dices Katma Tui, GL goes on Oprah, learns that to be totally fearless (as he's been told he is) probably means he's borderline retarded, uses his ring to fix his brain.
Second arc: Totally ignores the first arc. GL goes to space and takes up with the intergalactic Fonz (aka the character Priest, created by the writer who later became Priest!), and then fought Lord Malvolio, who was basically Alan (golden age GL) Scott plus Venom. At the end of that story, Malvolio destroy's Hal's ring, and Hal "kills" Malvolio and takes his ring. GL's ACW solo adventures end with Malvolio rising from the floor, removing shrapnel from his chest, and collapsing reality around him, declaring that everything was going accoring to plan.
Lord Malvolio has not even been mentioned since.

― Huk-L (Huk-L), Monday, 26 September 2005 14:02 (twenty years ago)

Similarly there is an issue in John Ostrander's Firestorm run where he meets the 'Flying Dutchman of Time' who is basically a hippie. He recognises Firestorm who does not recognise him, aha, says the Flying Dutchman, all our meetings are still in YOUR future, Firestorm. "We have met many times, as friends and enemies".

For 'many times' read 'no more times ever'.

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 26 September 2005 15:25 (twenty years ago)

There's the whole Science Spire affair from the Superman shizznit recently. The Question mini, the Lex Luthor: Man of Steel mini, and the upcoming Vigilante mini were all, at one point supposed to be part of some UNIVERSE-SHATTERING Superman event, but things got delayed and now Infinite Crisis is here, but they've been releasing the stuff anyway, even though it doesn't really fit in.

― Huk-L (Huk-L), Monday, 26 September 2005 15:37 (twenty years ago)

No Man's Land.

Except they never said things will never be the same again. They just said things will be different for a year, and then panicked.

― Pete (Pete), Monday, 26 September 2005 17:42 (twenty years ago)

I had totally forgotten about the Vigilante mini! Will all these stuff ever see the light? I mean, that belongs to the Superman revamp from 2004 (azzarello/lee, austen, Rucka) ,now we are in the middle of a different revamp (simone, byrne, verheiden, benes, still rucka), and who knows what kind of revamp will 2006 and Infinite crisis bring

― i0dine, Monday, 26 September 2005 18:50 (twenty years ago)

The Vigilante mini is supposed to drop in October, I think.

― Huk-L (Huk-L), Monday, 26 September 2005 18:52 (twenty years ago)

Holy shit, that New Guardians thing!!!!!

― The Ghost of Black Elegance (Dan Perry), Monday, 26 September 2005 19:01 (twenty years ago)

The Vigilante mini was originally gonna be written by Micah Ian Wright, a guy that gained acclaim for his (pretty damn good) work on Stormwatch: Team Achilles and his (unseen by me) war propoganda poster parodies, and gained notoriety for passing himself off as a former Army Ranger. After it was revealed that he wasn't an Army Ranger, DC shitcanned him quick-like and gave the mini to Bruce Jones. And the internet went to town on his ass. Wright's, not Jones'.

― David R. (popshots75`), Monday, 26 September 2005 19:12 (twenty years ago)

The Propaganda Remix Project: http://homepage.mac.com/leperous/PhotoAlbum1.html

― Amadeo (Amadeo G.), Monday, 26 September 2005 22:32 (twenty years ago)

I thought Animal Man became a critter elemental or some shit, too.

― Austin Still (Austin, Still), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 01:55 (twenty years ago)

yeah, I think the entire 50-70 issues that followed Morrison's run got ignored out of continuity as soon as they hit the stands...

― kit brash (kit brash), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 06:13 (twenty years ago)

Animal Man became a giant bird, his wife a lesbian, and they all lived on some massive hippy commune having free love until they brought down Amerikkka. Or something.

Maxine was revealed as the true elemental that would save the world at one point - the Children's Crusade crossover annuals Vertigo did? Cliff became a Republican, I think. I have a lot of these, read them once and consigned them to a long box.

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 07:24 (twenty years ago)

I am not sure what the Universe changing thing was in Genesis (death of teh Highfather) but it certainly barely affected anything.

― Pete (Pete), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 12:30 (twenty years ago)

BUT Highfather is still dead, which is something.

― Tom (Groke), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 12:33 (twenty years ago)

(Highfather was always rubbish and did nothing. The death of the wizard Shazam could easily come in under this, all he ever seemed to do was play poker with the Guardians of OA in crossovers).

― Pete (Pete), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 13:02 (twenty years ago)

I had Cosmic Odyssey going through my head, so g00gl3d it and found this description:

Cosmic Odyssey (4-issue mini; w Jim Starlin; a Mike Mignola & Carlos Garzon). [From DC Comics: He is one of the most powerful and feared beings in the universe…but now Darkseid the schemer faces a menace beyond even his great abilities. Now the towering New God must find aid from beyond the boundaries of his realm—forced to seek it in the camp of his enemies. What Darkseid needs…is heroes. COSMIC ODYSSEY—NEW EDITION is a 200-page trade paperback collecting for the first time in eight years the universe-spanning 1988 epic that rocked the DC Universe. Written by the acclaimed Jim Starlin (BATMAN, Captain Marvel) and featuring art by Mike Mignola (Hellboy) & Carlos Garzon (Star Wars) with a cover by Mignola, COSMIC ODYSSEY finds Superman, Batman, Green Lantern John Stewart, Martian Manhunter, Starfire, the Demon, plus Orion, Lightray and Forager of the New Gods working together with one of the deadliest beings known to man. This eclectic group of heroes must race against time to stop a cosmic entity hell-bent on destroying the galaxy. Do they have what it takes? Or will one hero’s brashness spell cataclysmic destruction for an entire world? COSMIC ODYSSEY is a thrilling, non-stop adventure filled with unrelenting action, intense drama and, ultimately, terrible tragedy—with repercussions that had major lasting impact on the DC universe!]

Except... um... it didn't.

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 13:10 (twenty years ago)

I think you'll find Aldo that it had a big impact on GREEN LANTERN: MOSAIC!!

― Tom (Groke), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 13:16 (twenty years ago)

Woohoo. An enabler for a John Stewart maxiseries.

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 13:22 (twenty years ago)

And the GL villain who is a space lady, but not the space lady who used to date Hal Jordan, is a repurcussion.
Cosmis Odyssey wasn't pushed very hard at the time of its publication, but it's pretty cool. Plus Batman goes to Moose Jaw...Arizona!!!

― Huk-L (Huk-L), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 13:51 (twenty years ago)

Didn't that space lady turn up during Action Comics Weekly? (And kill Katma Tui Stewart?)

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 14:00 (twenty years ago)

I think the space lady was called Fatality, as was not the kind to go undercover with a name like that.

So proff that Cosmic Odyssey had repercussions.

So what exactly were the repercussions of the Spider Clone Saga? It strikes me that in trying to forget it SOOO much, Marvel have completely ignorerated it.

― Pete (Pete), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 14:10 (twenty years ago)

Fatality was the villainness in THE FINAL KYLE RAYNER GREEN LANTERN arc (written by Ron "Stick It In The Fridge" Marz), yes?

Repurcussions of the SCS = lots of fans bailed on Spidey when he needed them most.

― David R. (popshots75`), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 14:14 (twenty years ago)

Fatality is on the cover of GLC: Recharge #4!

― Huk-L (Huk-L), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 14:16 (twenty years ago)

Man, remember when that one guy died? But then he came back?

― Austin Still (Austin, Still), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 14:52 (twenty years ago)

Red Tornado?

― Huk-L (Huk-L), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 14:54 (twenty years ago)

Green Arrows?

― Pete (Pete), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 15:10 (twenty years ago)

The Death Of Superman!

The Death Of Clark Kent!

Superman Gets Energy Powers!

Superman Abandons his Clark Kent identity to fight crime over the world non stop!

― Amadeo (Amadeo G.), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 15:35 (twenty years ago)

None of those were advertised as permanent though, DC were quite cunning about how they actually phrased things.

― Tom (Groke), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 15:38 (twenty years ago)

Knightfall

― Jordan (Jordan), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 15:39 (twenty years ago)

Oh, like they were really gonna keep Bats in a wheelchair! Dude took a long nap, ate a Powerbar, and came back WITH AN EBONY VENGEANCE!

― David R. (popshots75`), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 15:49 (twenty years ago)

There was great issue of Green Lantern in the 70s (I think it was actually #90, the first new issue after the O'Neill/Adams cancellation), where the GLs were called to Oa, and got new and improved power rings. Highlighted among the ring's new functions was their ability to morph into cool-ass GREEN sunglasses. That the rings were new, and that they double as shades, has not been mentioned since!

― Huk-L (Huk-L), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 15:57 (twenty years ago)

Didn't the Green Goblin come back (and Aunt May, come to think of it) because of the Spider-Clone stuff?

― The Yellow Kid, Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:28 (twenty years ago)

NOOOO! Wulf is DEAD!!

NOOOOOO!! Johnny Alpha IS DEAD!!

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO Feral is ALIVE and teh all new all different Strontium Dog!!

Oh thank god it was all the dream of a faulty archiving computer or something.

― Vic Fluro, Tuesday, 27 September 2005 16:56 (twenty years ago)

hahahahaha Feral

― Tom (Groke), Tuesday, 27 September 2005 22:08 (twenty years ago)

Peter Hogan put the ten best years of his life into Feral.

― Vic Fluro, Tuesday, 27 September 2005 23:09 (twenty years ago)

I thought they advertised the energy powers Supes as something permanent. It was obvious that he wasn't going to stay dead, though, that's true.

Hal Jordan is...The Spectre!!!. "We assure you it's permanent, we found a way to use Hal Jordan and a completely different take on The Spectre. Now it's a spirit of redemption!".

Big aliens come to earth and suck the marrow out of people, some of them survive and become THE NEXT WAVE OF DC'S SUPERHEROES!. Bloodlines: the crossover that gave us Gunfire and Anima! (guess they didn't learn anything from Millenium).

― Amadeo (Amadeo G.), Wednesday, 28 September 2005 05:23 (twenty years ago)

(and Hitman, in fairness)

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 28 September 2005 05:54 (twenty years ago)

Yeah, that's right. Hitman was the only good thing to come out of that.

― Amadeo (Amadeo G.), Wednesday, 28 September 2005 15:04 (twenty years ago)

ihttp://superherouniverse.com/articles/ronald_reagan/reagan_superman.jpg

― Huk-L (Huk-L), Wednesday, 28 September 2005 18:10 (twenty years ago)

Superman vs. Mount Rushmore! Drawn by Jim Lee!
http://www.comicon.com/pulse/images_05a/1jimlee4.jpg

― Huk-L (Huk-L), Wednesday, 28 September 2005 19:36 (twenty years ago)

I love that Supes is giving the gipper a kungfu salute there. Man, Superman is no joke: he can lift a billion tons, fly at the speed of light, shoot heat beams from his eyes, AND he knows tiger-crane style!

― Austin Still (Austin, Still), Wednesday, 28 September 2005 21:50 (twenty years ago)

The Hulk. All of the Peter David run - the grey Hulk, the smart Banner-Hulk etc - do they ever make any reference to any of that anymore?

― David N (David N.), Wednesday, 28 September 2005 23:37 (twenty years ago)

Isn't Hulk articulate now? He seems that way in Defenders.

― Huk-L (Huk-L), Thursday, 29 September 2005 13:39 (twenty years ago)

Also, as of this week: A WORLD WITHOUT A JUSTICE LEAGUE!!! (considering JLA has two ongoing titles, plus a TV show with a comic of its own--which is generally superior to the DCU version)

― Huk-L (Huk-L), Thursday, 29 September 2005 13:42 (twenty years ago)

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