Marvel comics that are as much fun as 1602: recommendations sought

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I'm midway through the 1602 trade paperback at the moment and am extremely impressed. I've only ever read the odd Marvel title over the years, and now I'm wondering what else of comparable quality I might have missed.
(I took the Jack Kirby-related Marvel boycott proposed in Mr Skidmore's FA many years ago to heart, you see).

Anyway, all recommendations gratefully received...

― M Carty (mj_c), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 11:23 (twenty-one years ago)

And why not make this a 1602 classic or dud, too, while we're about it?

― M Carty (mj_c), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 12:29 (twenty-one years ago)

I didn't like it at all. The storyline was convoluted, any sympathy I felt for any of the characters was out of pure familiarity, and the whole thing had the air of Gaiman setting himself an amusing intellectual excersize. Dud.

― Wooden (Wooden), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 12:43 (twenty-one years ago)

So, yeah, M Carty, if you're looking for dud Marvel comics, there are PLENTY to choose from!

(Serious response to soon follow.)

― David R. (popshots75`), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 12:44 (twenty-one years ago)

It might do more to ask what you found fun about it. I enjoyed it more than I imagined, but more as something impressively constructed than fun.

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 12:47 (twenty-one years ago)

Also, there's really not much out there in Marvelville that's quite like 1602.

― David R. (popshots75`), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 12:51 (twenty-one years ago)

Oh the whole thing was total fanwank, both for Marvel AND Gaiman fans but once I'd realised that I enjoyed it plenty - an eight issue "What If?"* story, no problem with that at all.

Good penultimate issue reveal, too.

*not so much "What if the Marvel U happened in 1602?" but "What If Neil Gaiman applied his fol-de-rol stuff to superheroes?" and the answer turns out to be "it irritates Tom a lot less than when he feels he has to take it seriously".

― Tom (Groke), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 12:57 (twenty-one years ago)

(The answer is Astonishing X-Men anyway)

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 12:58 (twenty-one years ago)

Wow, not a popular title for the ILC massive then, eh?
At the midway point I've reached so far, I suppose it's the impressiveness of the construction alluded to by Mr Farrell that I'm finding most entertaining - the pacing, the inventiveness and the gradual revelation of just where the story is really going.

The only Neil Gaiman stuff I've ever read previously was some of the first few issues of Sandman, which I really, really disliked, so this seems very much of an improvement on those.

I'm also very fond of the artwork and particularly the woodcut-style covers.

― M Carty (mj_c), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 13:17 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, the covers are lovely.

I'm sure you've been told this before, but Sandman improved immeasureably from the second trade onwards. It's still not as good as some people make out, though.

― Wooden (Wooden), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 13:20 (twenty-one years ago)

the pacing, the inventiveness and the gradual revelation of just where the story is really going.

Ah right, I was wondering whether it was the "like comics, but classy" aspect. Anyway, in that case the answer might be Grant Morrison's New X-Men run instead. It has better long-term plotting.

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 13:25 (twenty-one years ago)

I like 1602! It could have been horrible, but it has a lot of good moments. Yeah, it's fanwank, but I don't consider someone myself who's actually read a whole lot of Marvel Universe stuff besides X-Men and I was able to keep up and get most of the references.

The actual ending was kind of crap, but I love the end of the penultimate issue where Reed realizes that they [SPOILER REMOVED].

― Meta-Jordan (Jordan), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 13:45 (twenty-one years ago)

One one hand, steady on - M Carty hasn't finished the book yet.

On the other hand, that is the moral of every Neil Gaiman story ever.

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 13:47 (twenty-one years ago)

Sorry Jordan, I de-spoilered (it wasn't much of a spoiler but let's let the thread-starter finish :))

― Tom (Groke), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 13:49 (twenty-one years ago)

Oh, sorry!

That wacky Reed, always realizing shit.

― Jordan (Jordan), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 13:52 (twenty-one years ago)

1602's covers were great. The rest of it a bit less so.

I hear that the She-Hulk book is a lot of fun, but I'm waiting to pick up the trades, so I can't comment directly on it.

Dave Gibbons' run on Captain America was a lot of fun. Can't remember the issue numbers, but it came out about a year ago or so. Cap punches out alternate world Nazis with the help of Jack Kirby. Big fun. Robert Kirkman's run, which I had high hopes for, just didn't pan out, sadly.

― Matt Maxwell (Matt M.), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 14:01 (twenty-one years ago)

Let us not talk of the Avengers Disassembled "crossover" event, yes?

― David R. (popshots75`), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 14:12 (twenty-one years ago)

crossover "event"

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Tuesday, 19 October 2004 14:14 (twenty-one years ago)

"She Hulk" is utterly utterly GRATE - Waiting For The Trades might not be such a hot idea tho, as apparently it is rapidly mutating into a Limited Series due to low Actual Sales... it's wonderful tho, Proper Plots! Really Funny Jokes! Character Development! LOVELY pictures! BRANES, Beauty AND Laffs!

1602, meanwhile, i found BORING and RUBBISH. Whoo. The whole Marvel Universe happens again, but earlier, and much much much less excitingly. For FANWANK that ROCKS, i recommend Avengers/JLA instead!

― MJ Hibbett, Wednesday, 20 October 2004 08:41 (twenty-one years ago)

That She-Hulk issue where Spidey accuses Johan J.Jameson being down on him all the time because he is black was a solid bit of fun certainly.

― Pete (Pete), Wednesday, 20 October 2004 08:52 (twenty-one years ago)

I will die for She-Hulk. Read #5 online RIGHT NOW!

― David R. (popshots75`), Wednesday, 20 October 2004 12:56 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, She-Hulk is very, very clever, judging from the two issues I've read. If it's in jeopardy, I'm going to talk it up to my comic shop guys, get them to recommend it to people.

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 20 October 2004 14:38 (twenty-one years ago)

(Speaking of smart Marvel comics that were also funny, was Deadpool ever collected? I don't want to draw a direct comparison, because I think it would give people the wrong idea, but...)

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 20 October 2004 14:46 (twenty-one years ago)

two months pass...

Revive! So, 1602. Meh. Read the entire work this weekend. It should have been much better than it was, it should have had a better "Assembling the samurai" part, which tends to be my favorite part of books/movies, they all seemed over familiar with each other and there was not enough tension between people who have supposedly just met. The covers were gorgeous, I liked the artwork, but the whole endeavor just fell a bit flat. I wanted more Virginia Dare/Roanake colony, and I wanted Gaiman to work the "Croatan" thing in there somewhere. Yes, as a "what if?" story it was quite good, but oversimplified compared with Sandman. I wanted more doublecrossing derring-do, this is set in 1602 after all, and less how can I fit this Marvel character into a certain slot?

― jocelyn (Jocelyn), Tuesday, 21 December 2004 18:04 (twenty-one years ago)

three months pass...

Through the first several issues, I felt that I'd been too harsh on him recently. But then it got ridiculously stupid/convoluted and I felt the smug satisfaction of being right after all.

― Organized Crime (Leee), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 21:07 (twenty years ago)

In the words of M. Night Shyamalan (via Adult Swim's Robot Chicken): "It's a twist!"

― David R. (popshots75`), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 21:25 (twenty years ago)

one month passes...

I started a new 1602, called 1064 or something like that, it featured Iron Man (coz, like duh, he's a knight) and Hawkeye (coz, like duh, he's an archery dude). They were fighting Doctor Doom he was a Norman, I never got round to drawing more than a page.

― jel -- (jel), Tuesday, 31 May 2005 18:52 (twenty years ago)

I started a new one called 2016, where everything's pretty much the same, only cars can fly.

― Huk-L, Tuesday, 31 May 2005 19:01 (twenty years ago)

Which makes the Fantastic Four feel a little inadequate.

― Huk-L, Tuesday, 31 May 2005 19:07 (twenty years ago)

Huk Presents: Marvel 2016 vs. http://wellredpress.com/Comics/Comics%20-%20Images/sep_04/marvel_2099_04.jpg

― Jordan (Jordan), Tuesday, 31 May 2005 19:36 (twenty years ago)

Oh and Forge, was like the village Blacksmith.

― jel -- (jel), Wednesday, 1 June 2005 06:17 (twenty years ago)

nine months pass...

Borrowed this from the library recently - enjoyed all the Blackaddery-type bits ("why yon blind minstrel matt of the murdock you verily do appear to be a man without fear" etc etc) and was relieved to find it was all pretty comic booky rather than sandman-esque portentious, but it's super-GROAN time when, in the penultimate issue, Sir Reed of the Richards tells us it's all abt stories innit - get one new idea, ffs!

also the artwork was a bit unpleasant, looked like someone had scribbled over it in supergarish coloured pencils, fugly

― Ward Fowler (Ward Fowler), Tuesday, 14 March 2006 13:36 (nineteen years ago)

i found this, like most of you, surprisingly enjoyable. i like what ifs!

tom otm:

Oh the whole thing was total fanwank, both for Marvel AND Gaiman fans but once I'd realised that I enjoyed it plenty - an eight issue "What If?"* story, no problem with that at all.

― s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 14 March 2006 15:35 (nineteen years ago)

I thought the best part of 1602 was the covers.

― The Yellow Kid, Tuesday, 14 March 2006 21:45 (nineteen years ago)

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