BATMAN'S SCI FI CLOSET

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HE HAS A DALEK IN THE BATCAVE.

THIS IS THE BIG ONE.

I've already read two reviews condemning this LACK OF RESPECT for such a dark moody character - he's got a bat-flying-saucer and a boom-tube glove for space missions, not to mention the red glowing hotline phone under a glass dome. And he's built a legion of SUPER ROBOTS. And he makes loads of jokes. It's all in JLA CLASSIFIED #1 if you don't believe me, along with SUPER GORILLA GRODD!

Is this the first chink in the Yawn Wall? I'd read Batman every month if he was like this all the time.

― Vic Fluro, Sunday, 7 November 2004 02:25 (twenty-one years ago)

The problem was that Batman WAS like that all the time, and no one actually did read him, they just liked the idea of it after the fact.

(I haven't read the issue, I'm just commenting on the goofy Batman in general.)

― Tep (ktepi), Sunday, 7 November 2004 02:43 (twenty-one years ago)

Admittedly, the what-shall-we-do-to-him-this-month bizarreness of the fifties nearly caused the death of the character. Still, it's past time for another reinvention of the character - and that's what this is, rather than a return to old goofy form.

― Vic Fluro, Sunday, 7 November 2004 03:00 (twenty-one years ago)

(A reinvention that probably won't be allowed to infect the main titles unless sales of these issues are phenomenal... but still.)

― Vic Fluro, Sunday, 7 November 2004 03:04 (twenty-one years ago)

It could still be a step towards a "real" reinvention, though -- I don't think the DKR reinvention was originally meant to set a new blueprint for the titles, either. (I was about to correct "reinvention" there, but I don't know, potentially Miller's quasi-nostalgic-but-not-really Batman is parallel to Morrison's super-robot-but-not-50s one.)

And yeah, it's definitely time for a new take, especially if it's a resilient one that multiple writers could play with and get mileage out of for a few years. Half of the time, I'm convinced Batman -- and Superman -- should just be supporting characters, because you can portray them differently than you'd have to when they're your main guy month in and month out. But that's pretty much because they worked so well in Morrison's JLA while being so dull in their own books at the same time.

― Tep (ktepi), Sunday, 7 November 2004 03:11 (twenty-one years ago)

If I were writing Superman I'd definately have him as a distant Godlike figure who only showed up every so often, even in his own title - a bit like Dream in The Sandman.

― Wooden (Wooden), Sunday, 7 November 2004 03:14 (twenty-one years ago)

It seemed like they were going to try that for a while during the Super-Soap years, when you tuned in once a week for the adventures of Supes' massive supporting cast and about five pages of Supes himself...

― Vic Fluro, Sunday, 7 November 2004 03:20 (twenty-one years ago)

If I were writing Superman I'd definately have him as a distant Godlike figure who only showed up every so often, even in his own title - a bit like Dream in The Sandman.

See, yeah, exactly! Huh, I wonder if someone could get away with that if they pitched it with the Sandman comparison. I hadn't thought of that. I think the fact that there are so many Superman titles every month (four still?) could be problematic, but practically speaking, that's a problem for any pitch.

xpost -- I'm not sure the journalist supporting cast would be the best cast, because every time they become the focus they seem to become boring. But I'm prejudiced -- I've never liked Lois and can't remember outright loving any of the others.

I was just thinking back on the more ... fun-loving stuff, goofiness of various flavors ... and if Morrison does any Marvel stuff again, he should do the Defenders. I know the recent run on that, and Secret Defenders, and whatnot, have probably tainted the title for good -- but anything he might not get away with as the dominant take on Batman, he could do for Nighthawk and no one would complain. Plus, other than Moore or Gerber, who would you rather see writing about the Headmen and the Zodiac?

― Tep (ktepi), Sunday, 7 November 2004 03:22 (twenty-one years ago)

It's not really the same if it's Nighthawk. I mean, who actually is Nighthawk?

― Vic Fluro, Sunday, 7 November 2004 03:29 (twenty-one years ago)

Batman! Well, kind of. At least, you can legitimately tell most Batman stories with Nighthawk instead, as long as they don't involve Robin.

― Tep (ktepi), Sunday, 7 November 2004 04:57 (twenty-one years ago)

No fucker buys the four superman titles though (well, people buy the AWFUL Jim Lee one, but in ever decreasing numbers) - I agree with Wooden, bin the lot, ride a big wave of 'omg they cancelled superman' press, have it matter when he appears in other titles then use the year or so of no Superman comic to get the best writers in the world to pitch for an ongoing single title.

― Tom (Groke), Sunday, 7 November 2004 09:00 (twenty-one years ago)

Great idea! Never happen.

(btw, I LOVE the sci-fi closet, not to mention the robo-JLA that he keeps around "just in case")

― Jordan (Jordan), Sunday, 7 November 2004 15:37 (twenty-one years ago)

That's also classic Morrison Batman, his first scene in JLA#1 is the one where he turns out to have been hiding in the meeting room.

Batman: "I've been here for half an hour."
Superman: "Strange, I didn't hear a heartbeat."
Batman: "Hh! It worked."

I don't know whether it's explicitly re-established in GM's run that Batman has a kryptonite ring from Superman, but I like to think it's made clear that if he wasn't given one, he had one made :)

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Sunday, 7 November 2004 21:42 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't know if it's the same ring (maybe he's lost it and gotten a new one?), but Supes gave him Lex Luthor's old ring (the one that gave Lex the cancer that cost him his hand and eventually his body) "just in case...I don't approve of your methods, but there's no one I'd trust more to bring me down if I go kooky," in a storyline way back in like 1989/90 or something, back when there were only 3 Super-Titles.
Batman was all sci-fi sorta in the Supergirl story in Superman/Batman, but that was somehow NO FUN AT ALL.
I think there's room for the sci-fi Batman as well as the Batman of his own comics (none of which I really read), just as there was Batman in the Giffen/DeMatteis Justice League at the same time as he was being all Dark Knightified in his own books and, to me, it worked. I think that Morrison's Batman definitely takes his cues from that version. He's condescending and arrogant, but he actually is better than everyone, so you like him for it. But he's making jokes! But he's making mean-spirited jokes at his teammates' expense, he's every bit the guy who could eventually grow into the FM Bat-fascist, sneering with contempt at the very world he's sworn to protect.

― Huk-L, Monday, 8 November 2004 02:21 (twenty-one years ago)

Yikes!

This thread makes me want to buy JLA: Want Ads #1, if only because I love 50s/60s sci-fi Batman

David A

― David Simpson (David Simpson), Monday, 8 November 2004 14:32 (twenty-one years ago)

Batscist.

― Jordan (Jordan), Monday, 8 November 2004 15:48 (twenty-one years ago)

I want Batman to apply a cage of bats to somebody's face while shouting "The purpose of power is... BAT-POWER!!"

― Vic Fluro, Monday, 8 November 2004 18:24 (twenty-one years ago)

Huk OTM. Batman can be and should be all things to all men. He's a great character who can be used in lots of different ways. Its just that in recent (post DKR) years we've only really seen one Batman consistently.
But I loved GM's portrayal of him in JLA, where he was by far the best and coolest character. And this new series looks to be picking up where that left off....

And if GM did write any Marvel Bats analogue, it should really be Moon Knight, who is far superior to Nighthawk....

― David N (David N.), Monday, 8 November 2004 21:54 (twenty-one years ago)

But Nighthawk is like Batman wearing a Superman-y costume! That can't be topped. Unless someone like the Vision can fuse the two together and make MOON HAWK or something. Then everyone can be happy.

― David R. (popshots75`), Monday, 8 November 2004 22:01 (twenty-one years ago)

Nighthawk is explicitly a Batman double, is the thing, so even though he's had plenty of development since then, any "Batmanizing" of the character is just a return to his roots. Moon Knight's a similar character, but his mystical origins and multiple personalities make him different enough that I don't think you could literally take a proposal for a Batman story, get rejected at DC, and then go over to Marvel and use the same proposal for Moon Knight (which I'd argue you could do with Nighthawk, if the project was big enough to justify resetting his mystical vision and so on).

― Tep (ktepi), Monday, 8 November 2004 22:05 (twenty-one years ago)

I just find it worrisome that Batman would say the word "closet" in his secret underground club house, to his man-servant.

― Huk-L, Tuesday, 9 November 2004 02:19 (twenty-one years ago)

OMG HE HAS GOT THE BAT GAY

That's probably a better reading than you know - Batman's secret closet of shame, where he keeps all his mad shit so his 'realistic' friends don't find out about it.

― Vic Fluro, Tuesday, 9 November 2004 18:07 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/87/400/87_4_0281.jpg
http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/87/400/87_4_0380.jpg

― Huk-L, Tuesday, 9 November 2004 18:15 (twenty-one years ago)

"Yes, Robin, I was wearing a special robot vest designed to disguise my internal organs on an X-Ray and make me seem a robot! It was the only way I could get Boss Weevil to admit his guilt - as he was sure he'd get away with it!"

I have no idea what the plot of the other one might be, but it looks less good.

― Vic Fluro, Tuesday, 9 November 2004 18:23 (twenty-one years ago)

It's Batman & Robin, hiding in their Sci-Fi closet, trembling in terror at WOMAN-WOMAN, who threatens to break up their Man-Boy love.

― Huk-L, Tuesday, 9 November 2004 18:30 (twenty-one years ago)

Either that or it's a prelude to Attack of the Shenis.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 18:34 (twenty-one years ago)

http://scoop.diamondgalleries.com/news_images/3388_9160_1.jpg

― Huk-L, Tuesday, 9 November 2004 18:37 (twenty-one years ago)

"Batman - A ROBOT??? But he seems so ALIVE!"

― Vic Fluro, Tuesday, 9 November 2004 18:39 (twenty-one years ago)

Batman's secret closet of shame, where he keeps all his mad shit so his 'realistic' friends don't find out about it.

I wish I had both realistic friends and campy, postmodernist friends. Oh wait, Momus!

― Jordan (Jordan), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 18:42 (twenty-one years ago)

Sligthly off topic, but one of the advantages of writing Batman in the JLA rather than in his own comic (I suspect) is that you never have to present things from his point of view - you get to treat him like Black Panther: mysterious, possibly playing everyone around him, always got a plan or two.

This revelation comes from his overhyping in Identity Crisis, and the reminders that The Worlds Greatest Detective is on the case. He figures out what's going on at the same time as everyone else, and I was thinking "There's bound to be a twist, he'll keep his bype by having figured that out ahead of time as well OH WAIT we've been reading his thought balloons so we know that he won't".

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Friday, 12 November 2004 14:10 (twenty-one years ago)

Great point. That's what I like about Gotham Central, Batman's a presence but we get to see him as Gotham sees him: rarely, mostly unhappy, and not entirely the benevolent vigilante he fancies himself to be in his own mags.

― Huk-L, Friday, 12 November 2004 14:48 (twenty-one years ago)

Haha, I love the idea of the Batman comics as image propaganda for the 'real' Batman.

― Jordan (Jordan), Friday, 12 November 2004 14:52 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, I hadn't thought of the Black Panther comparison, which is weird because I think Priest himself made it in a different context. I wonder if you could do a Batman solo book similarly to BP -- use the supporting characters, and one in particular (Robin, I guess), as the viewpoint characters who both complicate things and try to keep up. BP's cast was designed exactly for that purpose, though, whereas Batman's has been ... accumulated.

― Tep (ktepi), Friday, 12 November 2004 14:52 (twenty-one years ago)

Batman's supporting cast (except Gordon, classically) seems more to serve the opposite purpose, to humanize Batman and show his sympathetic side (this, I think, was the primary function of Robin, originally).

― Huk-L, Friday, 12 November 2004 14:54 (twenty-one years ago)

It's so true, reading Batman's thoughts generally turns into a big dud (unless you're using telepathy, then it's classic).

I can't remember, were there even thought captions in Arkham Asylum?

― Jordan (Jordan), Friday, 12 November 2004 15:01 (twenty-one years ago)

There some for at least some of the villains (the electric guy, what, Maxie Zeus?), not sure about for Batman.

― Tep (ktepi), Friday, 12 November 2004 15:05 (twenty-one years ago)

It would be great if all Batman thought balloons/captions were just instant reactions, never articulated statements:

Superman goes nuts, starts tearing apart Metropolis:

"Hnh."

Dick Grayson goes nuts, kills a bunch of 1980s supporting characters:

"Hnh. Boyyyy!" (this only works if Batman has recently watched Phantasm and not listened to Public Enemy)

The Joker is dancing naked on the rubble of Coast City, juggling Jason Todd's remains while whistling "I fucked the shit out of your dead dead mother, Bruce Wayne"

"Joker."

― Tep (ktepi), Friday, 12 November 2004 15:09 (twenty-one years ago)

It would sure make Superman/Batman more palatable. And if every other Superman thought-balloon was "Wheeeeee!"

― Huk-L, Friday, 12 November 2004 15:12 (twenty-one years ago)

Haha.

Yeah, I can't stand the mid-fight monologues - "He's got me off-balance, but I'm faster...if I could only reach my etc. etc."

In this day and age, honestly.

― Jordan (Jordan), Friday, 12 November 2004 15:14 (twenty-one years ago)

We need to find the grimmest Superman story out there -- yeah, yeah, I know -- and remove all the Superman dialogue (keep the Clark stuff) and replace all the thought balloons with "Wheeee, I'm flying!" even if what he's doing is knocking the flaming meteors out of the air so they can't kill the convent full of pregnant orphans.

― Tep (ktepi), Friday, 12 November 2004 15:15 (twenty-one years ago)

Superman's thought balloons in The Man Who Has Everything are pretty much "Wheeee! Wheeee! Uh - Oh!"

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Friday, 12 November 2004 15:22 (twenty-one years ago)

Is that the Alan Moore story that was adapted for the JLU cartoon?

― Huk-L, Friday, 12 November 2004 15:24 (twenty-one years ago)

Now, if Morrison can find a way to make this story work with contemporary sensibilities, I'll gladly eat my hat!
http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/141/400/141_4_0000097.jpg

― Huk-L, Friday, 12 November 2004 17:48 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/141/400/141_4_0000108.jpg

― Huk-L, Friday, 12 November 2004 17:51 (twenty-one years ago)

Huk, are these for real or more of those made-up concept covers?

― Jordan (Jordan), Friday, 12 November 2004 17:52 (twenty-one years ago)

Comics.org online gallery of EVERY COMIC COVER EVER (nearly).

― Huk-L, Friday, 12 November 2004 17:56 (twenty-one years ago)

Okay, Batman Jones isn't black? SHENANIGANS!

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Friday, 12 November 2004 18:09 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm going to address the topic of Batman's Sci-Fi Closet in tomorrow's Invisible Crutch.

― Huk-L, Tuesday, 16 November 2004 04:50 (twenty-one years ago)

i love gorilla grodd, and am delighted that he is now here. i want more mr grood.

― anthony, Tuesday, 16 November 2004 06:50 (twenty-one years ago)

Post a link up here when you do, please Huk.

― Vic Fluro, Tuesday, 16 November 2004 23:52 (twenty-one years ago)

I just realized this wasn't in the store when I was there -- another Morrison project selling out quickly at my local store! I need to remember to ask if that's because of under-ordering or over-buying.

― Tep (ktepi), Tuesday, 16 November 2004 23:59 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/87/400/87_4_0309.jpg

Interesting use of speechmarks:

"Hmm. "Dinosaurs.""

― Chuck Tatum (Chuck Tatum), Wednesday, 17 November 2004 00:12 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/87/400/87_4_0324.jpg
http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/87/400/87_4_0241.jpg
http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/87/400/87_4_0243.jpg

― Chuck Tatum (Chuck Tatum), Wednesday, 17 November 2004 00:14 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/87/400/87_4_0290.jpg

http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/87/400/87_4_0291.jpg

http://www.comics.org/graphics/covers/87/400/87_4_0288.jpg

― Chuck Tatum (Chuck Tatum), Wednesday, 17 November 2004 00:15 (twenty-one years ago)

I've GOT to start buying old Batman issues.

― Jordan (Jordan), Wednesday, 17 November 2004 00:39 (twenty-one years ago)

The Greatest Batman Stories Ever Told, if I'm remembering the collection right, is worth getting for some of the wacky what-the-fuck stuff (as well as other eras) -- I just read a blog post about some of the stories in it, let me find it.

Here we go.

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 17 November 2004 00:46 (twenty-one years ago)

i finally read this issue - too cool

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 17 November 2004 10:15 (twenty-one years ago)

I read somewhere, damn, I can't remember where, that the "Rainbow Batman" story was largely responsible for most of the Batman action figure variants in the mid 90s. Apparantly the licensing dept. at DC had told who ever was making the toys that they could only use colours that had been used in the comics.

― Huk-L, Wednesday, 17 November 2004 14:42 (twenty-one years ago)

I understand Ed Brubaker is writing a 100-page special on why and how Batman must, yes MUST wear a different bat-costume each night in post-crisis continuity.

― Vic Fluro, Wednesday, 17 November 2004 23:34 (twenty-one years ago)

Because it would get a little smelly otherwise?

― Matt Maxwell (Matt M.), Thursday, 18 November 2004 03:02 (twenty-one years ago)

This issue: "The Smelly Batman!" "If Deodorant Be My Destiny!" "Secrets Of Robin's Nose Plugs!"

― Vic Fluro, Thursday, 18 November 2004 22:08 (twenty-one years ago)

[IMG]http://img102.exs.cx/img102/4008/E80-Bateve.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://img102.exs.cx/img102/3715/E80-Batsquid.jpg[/IMG]

― Patomanso, Saturday, 20 November 2004 10:34 (twenty-one years ago)

six months pass...

ihttp://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y298/hukl/sleepybats.jpg

― Huk-L, Wednesday, 25 May 2005 04:46 (twenty years ago)

awww

― j blount (papa la bas), Wednesday, 25 May 2005 05:22 (twenty years ago)

hmmm, i need to figure out sizing...

― Huk-L, Wednesday, 25 May 2005 06:06 (twenty years ago)

one year passes...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v292/aldo_cowpat/KxKa1p.jpg

― I don't know whether to play the trumpet, read a book or be a lesbian. (aldo_cow, Friday, 9 February 2007 14:14 (nineteen years ago)

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