stories in which GOOD superheroes are EVIL

Message Bookmarked

Bookmark Removed

Mainly inspired by the latest issue of some Superman/Batman comic, which has them growing up to be EVIL instead of GOOD, with disastrous consequences.

Is this kind of thing really worth pursuing? And is it just the equivalent of the way every second Star Trek episode had Kirk meeting his evil self?

― DV (dirtyvicar), Tuesday, 23 November 2004 21:58 (twenty-one years ago)

threads where you hit send before typing the full title, classic or du

― DV (dirtyvicar), Tuesday, 23 November 2004 22:23 (twenty-one years ago)

It's a du classic!

― David R. (popshots75`), Tuesday, 23 November 2004 22:27 (twenty-one years ago)

I think it's mostly worth pursuing if they FITE... is this the Crime Syndicate you're talking about? Or maybe - the REVERSE FLASH?? (Which reminds me - Reverse Aquaman!) Not to mention the fact that Judge Dredd's always fighting evil versions of himself, and Batman's had at least three. He could have a whole Batman Revenge Squad made out of Reverse Batmen, especially if Dick Grayson's evil now too! He'd be the perfect leader for The Reverse Batman Squad!!

― Vic Fluro, Tuesday, 23 November 2004 22:48 (twenty-one years ago)

Dick Grayson is evil now? Are you making this up?*

* A question I have directed at friends countless times when they tell me what is going on in comics, since I lost touch - Wanda's children were a fucking what? Peter Parker is actually his own clone? Superman's an energy being now? That kind of thing.

― Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Tuesday, 23 November 2004 22:54 (twenty-one years ago)

Pah, next thing you will be asking about the twist ending in DK2.

― DV (dirtyvicar), Tuesday, 23 November 2004 23:14 (twenty-one years ago)

AND

I'm so bitter abt what they have done to poor Wanda? one of my favorite characters abused for cheap sales boost! (note, i have not read the actual stories but I'm still (deservedly so) bitter)

― H (Heruy), Tuesday, 23 November 2004 23:17 (twenty-one years ago)

The was a terrible, terrible arc. It's Bendis actually writing something that's bad, and my god does he fall hard. Meanwhile his Daredevil seems to be improving by leaps and bounds. Some kind of Yin-Yang kinda thing-thang evidently.

Why are the Scarlet Witch's powers so complicated? She points at stuff and things happen! The trouble starts when some chump thinks up a dodgy pseudoscientific name for that, and then another chump decides to take a serious 'realistic' look into what that would actually meeeeeean, if you were to POINT at something and THINGS would happen, how that would AFFECT both science and you, the REAL you inside. DEEP!! I think I'll call this story - "POINTY POINT!! THINGS!! HAPPENING!! WHYYYYY!! PART ONE OF TWELVE!!!?!!"

― Vic Fluro, Tuesday, 23 November 2004 23:28 (twenty-one years ago)

I really like the Bendis Avengers cull, personally. I'd not read the comic for years, so can't say how it compared to preceding issues, but I thought it was spectacular and exciting, and it seemed a reasonable thing to do with Wanda, and a way of tidying her up for the future (and a way of killing people off that makes them easy to revive - who knows how much of what happened was 'real'?). He doesn't seem great at BIG superhero stuff yet - nothing very interesting in the fights, everything stops for long explanations and conversations - but it hooked me, and I will stick with the new title.

― Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Tuesday, 23 November 2004 23:32 (twenty-one years ago)

aargh, Martin Martin Martn how can you say that?

to corect myself, I have read tho not the entire series, a bunch in scans and it was a horrible way of dealing with characters that threw out in some cases 10 years, in other cases 20 years of characterizationwith no real reason, lots of gaps and it looks like any explanation given will be - well it was Wanda. lazy lazy and bad writing.

Vic, yes the Scarlet Witch's powers have been badly written but there have been a few handlings that made sense and even though Busiek's take pushed it futher than I wantd it was a decent explanartion ofall that had gone before and then bendis has to come around and change everything again for no good reason -- aaargh. Plus, I have much love for the Avengers and what I've seen/read/heard has just depressed me.

― H (Heruy), Tuesday, 23 November 2004 23:50 (twenty-one years ago)

Speaking of Bendis, a huge theme of Powers seems to be the relationship between the normal citizens of a superpowered world and the unimaginably powerful beings who could destroy them all at a moment's notice, but won't because they're GOOD. Until they decide not to be.

While it is all a bit Grim n' Gritty, it's also a more drawn-out and enjoyable version of the old "WHAT IF?" superhero stories.

― Jordan (Jordan), Wednesday, 24 November 2004 00:13 (twenty-one years ago)

SPOILERS START HERE

That Avengers arc is probably the least satisfying thing I've read from BMB - it seemed both ridiculously dense (in terms of Stuff Happening) and horrifically skint (in terms of letting the Stuff Happen). And also oddly perfunctory - "OK, Dr. Strange said it was so, and so it is, let us go avenging; mental note: talk to Strange more than once every 4 years." That said, it was refreshing to have a deck-clearing exercise that A) didn't dwell so much on its own importance (within the story; let's not talk about hype) and B) defied a nice & tidy explanation. It doesn't do the wounded characters (Ant-Man, Vision, Hawkeye, Scarlet Witch) any justice, but there's no real reason to DO the characters any justice (other than to appease fans & "do right" by the character). In a lot of ways, this could be Marvel's response to Identity Crisis - feel free to draw your own parallels.

SPOILERS END HERE

TS: POINTY POINT! v. I GO STABBY!

― David R. (popshots75`), Wednesday, 24 November 2004 01:10 (twenty-one years ago)

Hal Jordan was never so dynamic a character as when he went nutsoid and TRIED to KILL TIME. Except maybe that time when he was exiled to outer space for a year and the Guardians put him through all sorts of mind-fucks.
What about when Superman III fought Clark Kent in the junkyard?

Having not read the last issue of S/B nor the brand new one (is it out already?) I don't really get what's going on in that title. But bad Superman is always sorta lame (unless it's in the super-wonderful JSA: The Unholy Three or JSA: The Libery Files or whatever that was called, where Superman really was evil) because he's never as nasty as he really should be, because then there would be no story. He would just be like, "Guess what world, I own you now, so give me all the money or I'll eat North Dakota."
Or am I thinking of the time Matter-Eater Lad went beserker?

― Huk-L, Wednesday, 24 November 2004 05:48 (twenty-one years ago)

You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.

stories in which GOOD superheroes are EVIL - classic or du