NBA FINALS 2024 BOSTON CELTICS DALLAS MAVERICKS I LOVE HOOPS THREAD

Not sure who to root for here

boston celtics

MAVERKICKS*

boston in 6 prob

can someone please tell me anything good about the Dallas mavericks?

no

the matchup favors boston but luka-kyrie could go nuts and win the series is how i break it down to an extent

those guys are lames though so i don't want to see that

all of the celtics non center starters can credibly guard luka, hes called jrue the best perimeter defender in the league, but can anyone really guard luka kinda no but you can make him work, which is why imo the celtics advantage re luka lies more on the other side of the ball theres just nowhere for him to hide on defense and theyll def make it a major point go after him, which with most teams you have to get yr main guy the ball bring luka over in a pick and roll and if everything goes well youre making him play defense, but the celtics since all their guys are good at offense can just have whoever hes guarding attack him, the mavs are the ones left having to try to scheme their way out of it, i think as far as defending him theyll prob play him straight up let him get his as part of the wear luka down strategy, and thats just their typical star defense anyway, then late once hes worn down theyll mix in more doubles stunts and whatnot, think well prob see jaylen and jrue guard him and then maybe tatum late, thats how i see them addressing the luka issue

tho tbf its not as easy to wear luka down as it used to be since the mavs have kyrie now and luka sometimes lets him dribble the ball, particularly in the 4th quarter the mavs go to a kyrie based offense so luka can rest up for crunch time, which just points even more to how important its going to be to make him work on defense, and making him play d is just good offense too which is nice

Luka Doncic was chilling with his dad while drinking a beer, and Michael Finley just took it away 😭

(via @GrantAfseth)pic.twitter.com/5yjKYsstq3

— ClutchPoints (@ClutchPoints) May 31, 2024

can’t even drink beer now thanks biden

Luka’s reaction was like when your dad catches 16 year old you drinking a beer at your older cousins wedding

lmao

the matchup favors boston but luka-kyrie could go nuts and win the series is how i break it down to an extent

this pretty much sums it up

my finals wishlist in order

1- good series with close games
2- no injuries
3- lots of drama
4- celtics win

celtics in 6, mavs win a big one at home and luka/kyrie steal a close one, but the c’s are too much. my other prediction: tatum plays well but does not win mvp and the series somehow still doesn’t answer anyone’s questions about him

Mavs in 7. Kyrie wins it at the buzzer in Boston with a left handed runner that rolls around the rim approximately 42 times before dropping in.

prob not gonna happen but i hope the celtics crowd doesnt get too preoccupied with booing kyrie i know he purposely provoked it with his silly bitchy stunts but its just tedious at this point you gotta stay focused on the positive in life, like making fun of luka for being a crybaby

if it gets in his head they should keep doing it obvs

tatum plays well but does not win mvp and the series somehow still doesn’t answer anyone’s questions about him

― the defenestration of prog (voodoo chili), Friday, May 31, 2024 12:23 PM (seventeen minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

prob true and also very funny that the answer has been staring them right in the face the entire time but they just refuse to accept it for whatever reason

I think the series hinges on how much KP can give Boston. If the Mavs played Boston last week, I think Dallas would've won.

i think the celtics could beat the mavs without kp, if they 90% kp thats a pretty clear advantage

one very interesting question about this series is does dallas according to podcasters "elite defense" hold up, celtics are the perfect team to stress test it theres nowhere to hide luka or kyrie, theres no one really even for kyrie to guard every celtics starter is well bigger and stronger than him and all of them can do all of the offensive things

even derrick jones jr who by all accounts is a very good defender is at a major strength disadvantage to the jays, so what if he moves his feat well and stays in front but then jaylen just drives right through him, how does lively protect the rim with kp or horf camped out at the 3pt line, mavs havent had to answer these type of questions, theoretically okc presented some of the same issues but they just werent ready to force the issue, where the celtics have been playing a force the issue style all year

i guess kyrie guards white and luka takes jrue jones on jaylen and washington on tatum, wonder if they just let jrue and white cook or they try to get luka and kyrie switched onto the jays, guess you can do both but you have to make an effort to get the switches where they already have an advantage with the standard matchups, tho jrue shoots the least out of the starters and luka might be able to guard him a lil since a lot of jrues game is based on strength and luka is strong and its not like hes an amazing one on one player anyway so im not sure hes exactly the guy you want to be like just attack this matchup, tho he can, getting the switches will prob be a big part of the mix and its not like they have to hunt one particular match up more like just get them moving around and back on their heals then attack

pulling lively and gafford away from the basket seems pretty key too and not necessarily as easy as the other stuff celtics are gonna have to hoist and hit before the mavs make changes

my finals wishlist in order

1- good series with close games
2- no injuries
3- lots of drama
4- celtics win

― I Chet the Holmgren (Spottie), Friday, May 31, 2024 12:21 PM (forty-seven minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

1 celtics win
2 kyrie does a slapstick turnover where he falls into the crowd and gets nacho cheese all over himself

whats the word on zinger?

no ones saying anything but all signs point towards hes gonna be good to go

no ones saying anything in english at least

https://i.imgur.com/o1dcgvU.png

seems like simmons knows something

Bill Simmons says the Porzingis will be back for the finals and that the Celtics “threw him in the cooler” pic.twitter.com/9gnmviWyCH

— Micah Sharon (@MicahSharon2013) May 27, 2024

Porzingis is on the floor as practice ends. pic.twitter.com/pdQeXhjqDK

— Bobby Manning (@RealBobManning) May 31, 2024

Joe Mazzulla on Kristaps Porzingis:

“I’m confident in where he’s at right now.” pic.twitter.com/DgWNWO0WU4

— Jack Simone (@JackSimoneNBA) May 31, 2024

.@F1 @yukitsunoda07 pic.twitter.com/AY0kGlskcT

— Kristaps Porzingis (@kporzee) June 4, 2023

Tsunoda is a great shooter but with his lack of size it's going to be hard for him to defend on the perimeter

thanks for the zinger updates. i believe bill

they threw him in the cooler

the cooler king

luka should go back to the headband

JAYLEN BROWN DROPS LUKA.

pic.twitter.com/8TMXJupPND

— Hoop Central (@TheHoopCentral) January 23, 2024

i knew tsunoda was a little dude but that picture is staggering

jfc an entire week off????

it’s inhumane

calling amnesty international

should have saved the 'in-season tournament' for this

not even joking; imagine it as like the big east tourney

16 teams, four days, play it at rucker park

I saw someone today wearing an NBA In-Season Tournament T-shirt. no team logos or anything, just the tournament. if he paid money for that he might be the weirdest hoops fan I've ever seen

lol pretty cool

gotta rep the ist irl

he's getting in on the ground floor

it can be yours

https://fanatics.frgimages.com/nba-events/unisex-nike-black-2023-nba-in-season-tournament-semifinals-t-shirt_ss5_p-200952135+pv-1+u-zun0bruncserkayjiwuw+v-35xccsw4ivemiqedgtyj.jpg?_hv=2&w=900

https://store.nba.com/nba-events/unisex-nike-black-2023-nba-in-season-tournament-semifinals-t-shirt/t-1256478211+p-46559976383673+z-9-4019884821

yeah one problem with using this series as a referendum on luka is this mavs team just isnt that good

i think there is stuff that luka improved about his playoff game btw -- the thing he used to do where he scored 35 points in the first half then was wasted by the fourth quarter stopped happening. his usage rate in the playoffs the last two seasons was 40% which led the league in each occasion, this year it was down to 33% which ended up being fifth. he actually didn't play as well as he has in the playoffs previously, but i do think he showed some of the 'sustainability' aspects that ppl used to ding him on. bcuz it ended terribly in the finals and he was out of gas (and hurt) the narrative is getting a bit distorted

there were a number of possessions last night & in this series where boston was just straight double teaming him off a pick and roll being like "go ahead and pass it bcuz we don't care what happens after that"

kyrie is nearly as bad on defense and provided little to nothing on offense.

when you top load a team like that you need both of them to be dropping 30 to even have a shot vs the celtics

there was a good mic'd up jaylen brown quote last night where he said to someone on boston "if luka wants the ball he has to take it up. if he gives it up he's not getting it back" and i think a good challenge for dallas' coaching staff and luka would be to figure out some ways to get the ball in the half court that aren't just isoing at the top of the key. can he conserve energy over the course of the playoffs by having more possessions where he can jog up the floor and get the ball entered to him in the mid post where he can play from there? little stuff like that that might add up over time of course luka has to want to be doing other stuff than micromanaging the game. but again he showed this playoffs that he's willing to do that to some degree

one problem with the theory of this mavs team is kyrie isnt as good as most people think

xp re: dallas non-star players, feel like we got some fool's gold production from pj washington and djj that buoyed the supporting cast in the first three rounds, and thj and kleiber were chicken fried ass when it mattered.

kyrie was bad but boston's strategy on defense was basically: we can put 2 on luka, have one of our all nba guards on kyrie, and then play 2 on 3 w/ the rest of these guys bcuz none of them can do anything

but then also luka couldn't beat one on one defense all series either

pj was killing teams from the corner, lively and gafford we catching a million lobs and the celtics just took that stuff away it was totally gone

kyrie still has his holy shit moments and he's still very productive, you just cant hide his weaknesses when luka has some of those same weaknesses

kyrie is nearly as bad on defense and provided little to nothing on offense.

― I Chet the Holmgren (Spottie), Tuesday, June 18, 2024 1:15 PM (five minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

i do think luka was clearly worse as evidenced by kyrie repeatedly telling him where he was supposed to be

i was actually more impressed w/ PJ in this series than the others bcuz he couldn't shoot but i still thought he was willing to bang down low, he used his size and physicality to get some buckets and rebounds, he wasn't rattled by his bad shooting to the point that the rest of his game cratered. that said if you're depending on him to make a lot of threes in the playoffs that might not be the best idea

the mavs need to find a real stretch 5, i mean good luck bcuz who wouldn't want one but the rigidity of their roster got exposed in this series bcuz maxi is not actually a reliable shooter

was for sure interesting seeing bostons increasing comfort doubling luka over the course of the series once they realized the mavs supporting cast was cooked

they have to be happy with the lively pick and his continued improvement could be huge for their future. PJJ is a fine piece. Gafford is a good situational guy to have, and could be a trade chip. everyone else is expendable

luka has got to consider taking the summer off. hard to do with the olympics tho

they still need to beat greece to qualify

thanasis achilles tear looming large there

he said in the post game presser that he wasnt sure if he was going to play

the mav's late acquisitions and their lucky drafting of lively put enough good pieces around luka and kyrie that one could squint hard and almost see a title contender there, but the luka & kyrie combo is still a terrible idea that stumbled into a finals and won't be getting there again

euro guys do value the world cup over the olympics fwiw

one thing with pj and gafford is its a lot to ask for a guys whove been on shit teams their whole careers to come over midseason and play big roles in the finals

they looked good up until the finals

the celtics are just a really good team lol

they looked great but then the celtics turned the water off

euro guys do value the world cup over the olympics fwiw

I wonder if Euro teams start winning Olympic gold more often if that perspective would change.

i think theyre just very world cup pilled

when luka can shake off his defenders to make plays the mavs look good. the c's defenders kept gumming up his space over and over

zooming out the thing that stood out most to me in the series was the shot quality disparity, celtics just got tons of great looks and the mavs got none

Kyrie: 19.8 PPG / 19.8 FGA. Stunk in Boston.

PJ vs OKC: 17 + 8 / 23-49 3s // Other 3 rounds: 11 + 6 / 24-86 3s

Lively: 6 pts 16 rebs in Boston

Jones: 21-53 3s Rd 1-3 / 3-12 3s Finals

THJ/Kleber = stunk.

Kidd buried Exum.

Luka taking shit for the Finals loss is just stupid.

— Bill Simmons (@BillSimmons) June 18, 2024

plenty for everyone

So what y'all are saying is Luka is the new Harden.

Def think he's more likely to follow that path than the Steph path of physical reinvention but time will tell. It was quite telling how significantly his game changed in '22 on both the offensive, but especially the defensive side of the ball.

It's all about mentality and personality, and Steph's has been consistent from the get go. I'm not confident Luka can get past his own mental/emotional weaknesses.

yeah if this were just a basketball skills situation id feel pretty confident in luka figuring it out but the conditioning and attitude problems complicate things

showing up in great shape next season would go a long way

james harden playoff career totals

23/5.5/6.5 on 42.5/34/87 shooting

luka doncic playoff career totals

31/9/8 on 46/35/72 shooting

you guys w/ this comparison need to be like that meme of the woman leaving her baggage behind and stepping up unburdened into the new year

its difficult to compare anyone to Harden I mean he's not exactly an archetype

one of the worst playoff performers of all time vs a guy who has been consistently amazing in the playoffs his whole career i'm having trouble seeing where this comparison breaks down

31 is a lot more than 23

harden is too weird luka is only kind of weird

thinking about the finals and the only highlights i can think of is the two halfcourt shots by pritchard. maybe the back-to-back steals last night too

yeah pretty methodical domination by the celtics no one really went nuts jaylen had some nice dunks celtics had some good two way runs

big difference is Harden's game revolves around drawing contact, he led the league in FTA 7 years I think, including 5 in a row. he's also a really good free throw shooter while Luka is kind of average. but I can imagine that's why his playoff numbers are so much worse, kind of hard for your body to withstand that much punishment over seven months, also it probably led to him being perpetually injured now, which is what everyone said was gonna happen

both have excellent off season training regimens

Okay the Harden comp is perhaps a stretch, Luka has more raw talent and Harden took advantage of looser foul calls during his time (and was better at it in general), but both have hit walls in the post season, arguably both getting gassed, and both have been criticized for being out of shape and defensive liabilities. Luka's got more "dog" in him than Harden, but those playoff shooting splits posted above actually looked pretty similar tbh.

I just think there's a future where Luka wins MVP and just never goes as deep as he did this year in the post season, continually disappointing, and eventually asking for a trade or leaving Dallas to ring chase and failing to do even that a la Harden.

He also has the potential to get ripped, improve his mental focus, and with some luck (i.e. Dallas building a better team around him) back in the finals and as a winner.

But I absolutely am betting on the former, rather than the latter.

i'm very curious to see the mavs next season because i suspect the roster may still be vaporware. there was reasonable skepticism at the time about gafford and pj washington being the big acquisitions and then they got a few awesome months out of those guys, but i can't shake the feeling that they're 7th men, along with derrick jones and josh green and etc. etc. these guys are pure role players and if someone's 3-pointer stops going in all of a sudden they're unplayable.

we've done luka to death but the problem isn't how he plays, it's the fact that he needs to be better conditioned and desperately needs a better mental approach. he tries to talent his way through things and if he takes anything away from losing to tatum and brown it should be that winning at this level is a grind no matter how talented you are.

i believe in PJ and gafford in dallas bcuz it’s easy to understand why they’re succeeding in their roles

i guess i said this earlier but to me dallas’ biggest issue is that they’re gonna be extremely match up dependent if they don’t have a defensive counter for teams who can drag lively & gafford away from the rim

and they’re gonna need some more shooting. but i also think luka will have that lebron kinda effect where he gets guys so many good open shots that you’re gonna see a lot of derrick jones jr types who come thru there on minimum deals and feast on practice level threes before another team pays the bill. a real tell for me on whether this mavs front office is for real is if they pay jones jr or realize they’re sitting on a minimum contract three point factory

pretty curious how many years like that Kyrie has in him