OFFICIAL THREAD FOR 2004 ALBUMS & SONGS POLL

ELIGIBILITY:

Albums:

Album elligibility will be treated very leniently--albums from late last year that didn't get their due until this year, or weren't released in your country until this year, or have leaked but won't be technically released until later this year, will all count. The only thing I ask is that you don't include any albums that already made their rounds on a good number of year-end polls last year--check Acclaimed Music if you have any questions and see if an album is featured prominently on the 2003 lists.

Songs:

If a song appeared for the first time this year on any format (a/b-side, album track, comp track), it is eligible. If it was released on an album last year but not as a single until this year (i.e. Jay-Z's "99 Problems), it is eligible. If it was released as a single last year but did not chart in your home country until this year (i.e. Yeah Yeah Yeahs' "Maps" in the U.S. or Khia's "My Neck, My Back" in the U.K.), it is eligible. A song is not eligible, however, if it appeared on a compilation for the first time this year but was already available previously (i.e. LCD Soundsystem's "Beat Connection," which was already widely known before being on DFA Comp #2).

Compilations:

Any sort of band compilation, best-of or miscellaneous (i.e. This is Music or Beehives) is elligible, as are label comps (Kompakt 100), genre comps (Left of the Dial) and DJ mixes, of both old and new (Unclassics and Daddy G's DJ Kicks). Re-issues are eligible as well, but only if they substantially expand upon the original album, so the two-disc re-issue of Pavement's Crooked Rain, Crooked Rain would be elligible, but not the unchanged re-issue of Disco Inferno's D.I. Go Pop.

Votes/Scoring:

You'll be voting for a maximum of 20 albums, 20 songs, and 10 compilations. You can also submit lists for 10 albums, 10 songs or 5 compilations, but they will be scored on a lower scale. The compilations, for instance, will be as such for a list of 10:

#1--25 votes
#2--19 votes
#3--16 votes
#4--14 votes
#5--12 votes
...
#10--2 votes

but for a list of five, it'd be like:

#1--25 votes
#2--16 votes
#3--12 Votes
#4--8 Votes
#5--4 Votes

Lists must be of either 20 or 10 (or 5, in the case of the comps). Lists of 13 will have the bottom three chopped, etc. Too difficult to score.

This part is subject to change if people don't like it. I think it works well.

BLURBS:

I'd like to get a substantial number of blurbs for this, even if not every album is covered--I think it'd be a lot more enjoyable to read or whatever. So what I'd like you all to do is that when you vote, put a star or something next to albums you'd be willing to write a small blurb for (or a large one, if you feel like getting all deep). If you're cool with writing a blurb for anything, you godlike human being, just make a note of that somewhere. If you don't want to write blurbs, then that's fine, your list won't count for less or anything. Then, after the list is tabulated, I'll ask the people who volunteered to write blurbs about albums that made the list. They'll have a week to do so.

DEADLINES:

Deadline for lists: December 15
Deadline for blurbs: December 20

That's about three weeks to put your list together, I think that's enough time. If you all need more time, I can give you some, but not too much lest the list run into the new year.

IN THIS THREAD:

I'd appreciate it if people didn't post their lists in this, or any other thread. If people disagree with me than OK, but I think that the exit polling that took place with the 90s polls sorta killed some of the mystery about the poll, and I think it'd be better going in without knowing exactly what everyone voted for.

However, what I do encourage in this thread, is some serious pimping. Three weeks is a long time, and I know that I at least would love some suggestions of albums or songs that I might have missed that I can download before sending in my list. Don't post too many as to not overwhelm people with suggestions, but if there are a couple songs, comps or albums that people feel have gone underrecognized, then by all means, recommend away--bonus points for Yousendit links!

Also in this thread, if you have any questions regarding eligibility or any suggestions regarding eligibility or voting, I'd be happy to take them.

That's all (ha!). Hope you managed to get through all of this and hope you guys are going to enjoy this poll as much as I will.

http://s13.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=D4C15CA766225109E253774947D44A37

Also, DJ's post reminds me of another point: All votes for remixes on the songs poll will just go towards the original song. So if someone votes for "What You Waiting For?" and someone else votes for the Lu Cont remix, they'll be counted towards the same song. And if it makes the poll, I'll note how many of the votes were for the remix. So, you can't vote for two versions of the same song, just choose the one you like best and vote for that.

What's the scoring system for a list of 20?

#1=25
#2=20
#3=18
#4=17
#5=16
...
#20=1

But yes.

I will have to think of some things people actually know!

I wanted to make it clear to remind people that they can (and should) vote for it. Will be released only two weeks before the deadline, but it's leaked already. Check the Tracklist.

It's also available on their excellent, not limited at all CD.

This is 'obv.'?

this is a completely formulaic lu cont remix (ie. it's great), but the lyrics to the song are pretty bad.

I don't see why not. There were a real good number of two-disc re-issues of classic 10th anniversary albums this year.

This is 'obv.'?

I thought so. Neil Young's new one-disc hits album, for example, would obviously be great just taken as the songs alone, but when considering the breadth of his career, his previous history of comps, inclusions and exclusions, etc., then it might not be so classic.

I don't know whether I should vote for "What You Waiting For" original or remix. They're both great, but I don't want votes to be split.

This, Sanjay and others, is exactly why remixes and originals are going to be counted as the same song. So don't worry which one you vote for, it's all going to the same place. No vote-splitting.

Uh, hello, TAKE A CHANCE YOU STUPID HO. That is the lyrical pinnacle of "What You Waiting For?", obv.

My brain is teh drunk but I have reread this thread several times and am still not sure I understand. Can someone confirm that the MIA vs Diplo mix is an album not a compilation?

Another question I hope hasn't already been answered: can we vote for "compilations" in the general album category, too? (Like pitchers who get votes for MVP?)

If people vote strategically, doesn't that mean ten filler tracks will receive votes just to bump up the ones they actually care about? (This is all much more applicable to albums)

Then, after the list is tabulated, I'll ask the people who volunteered to write blurbs about albums that made the list. They'll have a week to do so.
....
Deadline for lists: December 15
Deadline for blurbs: December 20

Just to clarify one more thing ... I assume the list will need to be tabulated right away, so we'll likely get the blurb requests on the 16th, giving us four days to complete them, yes?

Or how about how the Andreas Churchill remix of "What You Waiting For" is stupid and boring, even though the original song and the LuCont remix are both great!

People who vote for fewer albums get the same number of points at 10 as they would have at 20 - so it absolutely hurts the last album they vote for by eight points no matter what. Your reward is pure chance - one, that the points awarded at 15 would be a difference-maker and that the voter's bottom 10 would be popular enough to be relevant. The chances of both happening are slim, so any reward is unlikely.

I still don't see the value in encouraging people to vote for more albums/tracks than they would otherwise choose to vote for.

I really like "kill your radio", especially the second half, when suddenly the albums turns into an EBM frenzy and leaves you with a "hey, weren't nitzer ebb great?" feeling.

I haven't even got 20 full albums released in 2004, let alone 20 I love. The idea that my vote should count for less because I only vote for ten seems like highly dubious acquisition-obsessive record collector nonsense to me.

Bruner's "Ah, but if we didn't have this new rule then people's lower choices would be effectively fighting against their higher ones" seems highly specious. As milo says, people are voting for these albums. If you're of the opinion that higher placings are all, and we musn't allow albums that lots of people quite like to do well, then fine, argue for proportionately more points being given to the higher end of people's polls.

I mean, wow - in the last poll people were asking whether by voting for fewer than the maximum, their votes would be worth propotionately more (ie. whether a system of everyone having a certain number of points to allocate however they wished was in operation). I wouldn't argue for that, but that would be easier to argue for than swinging it in completely the other direction.

I suppose it doesn't really matter - I'll just bulk out my albums with ones that I think I'd like, based on what I've heard, but it seems a bit daft that I have to do this.

Look, if enough people agree with you about this I'm more than willing to change. I've never done a comps poll before, so I'm fairly inexperienced with it. I personally think it'd be cool to see the Crooked Rain, Crooked Rain re-issue rubbing elbows with Erlend Oye and M.I.A., but if everyone else disagrees, then we'll change. Like I said, it's all flexible.

Another question I hope hasn't already been answered: can we vote for "compilations" in the general album category, too?

No, I don't think that'd make too much sense. Like a wise man once said, you gotta keep 'em separated.

Can someone confirm that the MIA vs Diplo mix is an album not a compilation?

I don't know what this is, exactly.

If people vote strategically, doesn't that mean ten filler tracks will receive votes just to bump up the ones they actually care about?

I find it very, very hard to believe that anyone on ILM hasn't heard 20 songs this year worth voting for--even albums, it's fairly doubtful. Most of the people that will submit lists of 10 just won't want to figure it out beyond that, and I think that there should be incentive for more interesting lists of 20. It's not like it's that big a deal, anyway--the max and min. are still the same. If you care enough about your #9 album getting 12 votes instead of 4, you should also probably care enough to make a list of 20.

This is beyond confusing. Or maybe I'm just stupid.
But I honestly don't see how a remix and the original can count as the same vote! There are so many remixes where the remix absolutely destroys the original...or where they might as well be entirely different songs.

It's not as confusing as it all seems--I just put a lot of rules and regulations up as a pre-emptive measure (although I guess it's not working, so mayhbe it is confusing). Really just vote for 20 albums 20 songs and 10 comps and you should be cool.

If you can make a good case for a remix being linked to its original essentially in name only, I'd consider it being counted separately, but ultimately I think it's fairly silly and results in pointless vote splitting and such.

Just to clarify one more thing ... I assume the list will need to be tabulated right away, so we'll likely get the blurb requests on the 16th, giving us four days to complete them, yes?

Oh, my mistake--that should have said the 22nd for when the blurbs are due. I'll get the list out on the 15th. You'll have a week to write blurbs.

this system resmbles the electoral college

Not really.

This part is subject to change if people don't like it. I think it works well.

So I think it's fair enough to say when we don't like it.

x-post

Well, seriously - I just find buying (or copying) and taking in a whole album quite an undertaking. I can't do it for more than one a week, and the majority of albums I get are not single artist ones from 2004. I'm often catching up with 2002 and 2003, let alone all the older stuff. Plus I buy a lot of compilations. So, err - believe me!

If it was released on an album last year but not as a single until this year (i.e. Jay-Z's "99 Problems), it is eligible. If it was released as a single last year but did not chart in your home country until this year (i.e. Yeah Yeah Yeahs' "Maps" in the U.S. or Khia's "My Neck, My Back" in the U.K.), it is eligible.

So "Trick Me" counts just the same as its remixes.

Oh, and in answer to your comps question, well personally, yeah, I think that combinesd I'd have almost as many v/a and mix cds to vote for as I would single artist ones. I'm probably atypical in that regard, but as before, people don't have to use up all their votes. Offering 10 for this rather than 20 seems fine to me.

I don't see how I can rank one song against another in any way that would make any sense to me. But I might give it a whirl, for shits and giggles.

i'm sure they're still nice people though.

xpost

So have we agreed that it's just 20 albums and 20 songs and go to it? Or is twenty albums, twenty songs, 5 comps, 5 mixes, 5 reissues?

Oh, I am!

Beef Terminal -- The Isolationist. Despite the title, this isn't nearly as claustrophobic as his past albums. The title track and "January Sun" sound wistful to my ears, and overall this is easily his most melodic effort. He's lost a lot of the floaty ambient moments too, so you found yourself skipping over those tracks in the past, I think you'll find more to chew on here.

Oren Ambarchi -- Grapes From the Estates. Those who gave Keith Fullerton Whitman a chance last year should throw in their hat with Ambarchi this year.

It still doesn't make it (the harming) any less true, though.

Right, I'm actually going to stop talking about this now. You can have the last word.

Technically yes but I still really wish you wouldn't.

"Galang" is eligible as fuck.

So have we agreed that it's just 20 albums and 20 songs and go to it? Or is twenty albums, twenty songs, 5 comps, 5 mixes, 5 reissues?

No, Alex, it's still 20 albums, 20 songs and 10 (at the moment still all-inclusive) comps. Don't vote for it if you don't want to.

Holly Golightly - Slowly But Surely
It seems as if this album is being overlooked, despite it being better than the excellent Truly She Is None Other. This is like "No Expectations"-style Stones crossed with organ-based blues and it's pretty amazing.

Giant Sand - Is All Over the Map
First GS release of new songs since Chore of Enchantment, and it's great! I'm always dubious about Howe Gelb projects, since they tend to have a fair amount of filler, but this one is pretty much filler-free, Howe is "on" throughout this album.

Kylie Minogue - Body Language
'04 release stateside! Don't forget it! I don't know what placing I'll give "Chocolate", but it's a top 5 track at least. The more I listen to this, the more I like it.

"Slow", "Promises", "Secret", "Red Blooded Woman", etc...these are all fantastic tracks.

Daddy G's DJ Kicks compilation should also be noted, it's a fantastic addition to the series, one of the best.

I will investigate, thanks!

Top two compilations have got to be Tiefschwarz and DFA #2, BTW.

After you have displayed the top 100? results of the 2004 albums poll on ILM, you could make use of Rate Your Music to provide a pictorial summary list.

see an indicative example:

Uncut New Albums Of The Year 2004
A list by dfcook
http://rateyourmusic.com/lists/list_view/list_id_is_12509
The top 70 albums of 2004 as voted for by the writers of Uncut magazine (Dec 2004 issue)

Rate Your Music is easy to set up for lists, each album has a numbered code which includes the front cover of the album.

also my gmail address works, yep!

I assume that with that, the 20/10/5 rule was dropped, as it was only there because otherwise his penalty points system was too complicated.

Bill? Can you confirm?

David Banner is a go.

And yes, I'm not happy about it, but I suppose the 20/10/5 rule has been dropped.

You guys really can't have it both ways with this. Do you want the comp section or not?

Fuck it, I'll make a thread.

Vote in the other thread, Deej.

That sounds like Reissues and Best ofs, not that MIA record.

I am more inclined to bother with voting than I might be normally since at least one CD I'm picking may get one other vote, and another one will probably have several other people voting for it--so there's a chance of my vote mattering.

No.

But you really should.

But you really should.

I don't hear as much as most ILMers. (Of course I could disqualify myself in that case.) I will try to go for ten.

Aside from Galang (and one or two others?) none of the acapellas were. Many of the beats were never released outside of the mixtape circuit from their respective homes (Rio, Baltimore) and some beats (i.e. Big Pimpin) were previously released.

The entire comps business has been dropped. Vote everything as albums.

Turns the weighty melodrama of the original into one of the bounciest and most heartbreaking songs of the year. Fabulous stuff.

2Raumwohnung - 'Spiel Mit (Alter Ego Remix)'
Andreas Dorau & Justus Köhncke - 'Durch Die Nacht (Wasserman Remix)'
Annie - 'My Heartbeat'
The Arcade Fire - 'Neighborhood #3 (Power Out)'
Belle & Sebastian - 'Your Cover's Blown'
Black Strobe - 'The Abwehr Disco'
Britney Spears - 'Toxic'
Radio Dept - 'Why Won't You Talk About It?'
Rachel Stevens - 'Some Girls'
The Concretes - 'Chico (Avalanches' 'Wernham Hogg' Remix)'
Dani Siciliano - 'Walk The Line'
Destiny's Child - 'Lose My Breath'
Electrelane - 'The Valleys'
Freiland - 'Frei/Hot Love (Justus Köhncke Remix feat. Meloboy)'
Ghost Cauldron - 'Are You Conscious? (Superpitcher Remix)'
Jon Brion - 'Phone Call'
Justus Köhncke - 'Timecode'
Kelis - 'Trick Me (Basement Jaxx Remix)
Kelis - 'Get Along With You (FakeID mix)
The Knife - 'Heartbeats (Rex The Dog Remix)'
MIA - 'Galang'
The Magnetic Fields - 'I'm Tongue-Tied'
Multiplies - 'Everything Is Everyone's Fault'
Mylo - 'Drop The Pressure'
Nathan Fake - 'The Sky Was Pink' (Holden Remix)
Scissor Sisters - 'Comfortably Numb' (I know this is really old, but it wasn't a hit till January so I think it's eligible)
Shapeshifters - 'Lola's Theme'
Soulwax - 'NY Excuse (Club Version)'
The Strokes - 'Modern Girls And Old Fashioned Men (feat. Regina Spektor)'
The Streets - 'Could Well Be In'
Superpitcher - 'The Long Way'
Ulf Lohmann - 'Because Before (The Orb Remix)'
Vitalic - 'Fanfares'
The Wedding Present - 'Interstate 5'

Was the remix on the single? I haven't found it anywhere, and I've looked.

Yeah, go for it, but just don't put "Good Vibrations" as #1 just 'coz it's "Good Vibrations," y'know?

The board's back, people start voting.

Keep it up, people.

Keep 'em coming.

tell us who is currently winning and maybe then more people will vote

Switchfoot (albums) and J-Kwon (singles), but it's anybody's game, really.

Keep it up.

(As for the 20 albums, I mean. I am an albums guy and have trouble thinking of tracks)