Terrorist Action 11/9/2001 - Thread 4

Use now! Use now!

did you guys get the bush video tape fuckup? so much for liveness...and tom brokaw, about half an hour earlier, sqwawking where's the president, we need some leadership.

Shout out to NYC, DC, Pittsburgh and Chicago from London. Keep it together.

Isn't today the same day the Oklahoma bombing took place?
Brussels - where the NATO is located - seems to be a ghost town because a lot of people are afraid of an attack.

No, the Oklahoma bombing was in mid April.

Thanks. We're fine in Chicago. People are a little nervous since we're an air traffic hub. I think most of downtown has been evacuated - they sent us home from work, and when I left the building, I saw traffic jams and people on cell phones everywhere. They locked down our water purification plants, like it's war or something.

I had to call my mother because she worries, and she's giving me all this info I haven't heard on the networks - I don't have cable. She said an estimated 10,000 deaths in the WTC. She also said about two planes coming in from Europe that haven't been accounted for?? Keep in mind I haven't confirmed any of this. She has cable and I don't.

I want to follow the details, but I can't watch that building coming down anymore. NYC sent some of their best fire and rescue people to the WTC when the planes hit, and CBS said they lost contact with them after the buildings came down.

George Pataki, governor of New York State, just made an announcement - - National Guard being mobilized, will send emergency workers from all over NY State.

Rudy G. said people should walk out of south Manhattan if they can. Also the hospitals badly need blood, so people all over the US should donate, especially in NYC area.

My friend is an bureaucrat at the NYC fire department. He e-mailed a few hours ago, saying that scores of firefighters were lost at the WTC. Very dire indeed.

A Delta flight's made an emergency landing at Cleveland, they're searching it for a bomb, but all the passengers got out OK.

Yes, blood supplies have been low in the U.S. as it is -- please donate if possible!

FWIW, the full texts of Bush's speeches, from Salon.com:

President Bush's statement from Barksdale Air Force Base in Louisiana: Freedom itself was attacked this morning by a faceless coward, and freedom will be defended.

I want to reassure the American people that the full resources of the federal government are working to assist local authorities to save lives and to help the victims of these attacks.

Make no mistake: The United States will hunt down and punish those responsible for these cowardly acts. I've been in regular contact with the vice president, secretary of defense, the national security team and my Cabinet. We have taken all appropriate security precautions to protect the American people. Our military at home and around the world is on high-alert status and we have taken the necessary security precautions to continue the functions of your government. We have been in touch with the leaders of Congress and with world leaders to assure them that we will do whatever is necessary to protect America and Americans.

I ask the American people to join me in saying a thanks for all the folks who have been fighting hard to rescue our fellow citizens and to join me in saying a prayer for the victims and their families.

The resolve of our great nation is being tested. But make no mistake: We will show the world that we will pass this test. God bless.

-- -- --

President Bush's first statement on the terrorist attacks made in Sarasota, Fla., Tuesday morning, before attacks spread to Washington:

Ladies and gentlemen, this is a difficult moment for America. I unfortunately will be going back to Washington after my remarks. Secretary Rod Paige and the lieutenant governor will take the podium and discuss education.

I do want to thank the folks here at the Booker Elementary School for their hospitality.

Today we've had a national tragedy. Two airplanes have crashed into the World Trade Center in an apparent terrorist attack on our country. I have spoken to the vice president, to the governor of New York, to the director of the FBI, and I've ordered that the full resources of the federal government go to help the victims and their families and to conduct a full-scale investigation to hunt down and to find those folks who committed this act.

Terrorism against our nation will not stand.

And now if you join me in a moment of silence.

May God bless the victims, their families and America. Thank you very much.

Here is a dreadful irony for you.

I dont know if its Emma Hamilton = Hogan or not but Lollies list just got word that her plane was delayed as per normal and as a result didnt get up before shit went down and shes grounded in Newark.

Red Cross # : 1-800-498-3543

Cripes! I caught the tail of a news break on the radio in the barber shop. I'm just getting the full story now through these threads. I feel bad for posting about disco now. I really hope everyone and their loved ones are all right. This is surreal. I really liked the World Trade Centre.

escape from new york: took the last path train from 33rd st. was to go to hoboken and journal square. ended up going to journal square. our conductor passed out. co-worker and i were left in journal square, a long way from hoboken. we walked for an hour. we took a cab until our money ran out. we took directions from people who didn't know better. we neared our destination and were told that train weren't even LEAVING from hoboken. a guy, a saint (john, God bless you), offered to take us home, said we needed to be with our families. john's brother and cousin were in the wtc and he hadn't heard from them. he just needed to get out, to talk to people. he dropped us off at my co-worker's, wished him the best. co-worker drove me home. trip took 3.5 hours. but we're alive. and so is mike, i'm glad to see.

started this morning when a co-worker said she'd seen a plane hit the wtc. i thought it was just a little cessna, an accident. and then it all happened, so quickly too. we stepped out of our building, about 6 miles from the wtc, and all we saw was smoke, like an angry storm cloud descended upon new york. i'm just NOW seeing the destruction and i can't believe it. i just can't believe it. people crawling out of windows and jumping. heartrending. to all who know anyone in any of the areas under attack, all of my thoughts and prayers are with you.

Two US warships being sent to NYC Harbor.

uk has just banned all air flight, fuck.

The Los Angeles Times site is running and providing reasonably up to date info if you need another source of info.

New Jersey has also declared a State of Emergency. Acting Gov. DiFrancesco will be calling up State troopers and NJ National Guard, as well as sending over police investigators to Lower Manhattan.

Apparently, Mayor Giuliani claims he barely escaped before WTC collapsed.

dave: from another thread, new york life building is across the street from me (on 27th street). i left early, prior to either of the towers collapsing. i hear that the soot and smoke got worse later, but nothing was really damaged up by us.

ally: thank you for the offer of shelter, despite everything that has happened. it is quite appreciated.

i can't believe it's just gone. thank God for the construction on the n/r line otherwise i would've continued taking the path to wtc everyday (and given my penchant for arriving right on time for work, it could've been disastrous.)

i can't believe it's just gone.

Interesting that I don't think there's a comparable location in LA where its loss would be so dramatic and immediate -- maybe the Hollywood sign, but LA is so spread out.

The very, very cold part of me is perversely, astoundingly impressed by all the planning for this. An equally cold part of me thinks about all the celebrations reported in Nablus and just thinks about all that's happened there over the decades and beyond. Can one be surprised, really?

Let's see... Borders closed, air traffic suspended, police departments on tactical alert, several banking headquarters in the WTC destroyed. Seems like this sequence of events would send the survivalist/Y2K cult/retreatist groups into a spindizzy.

I fear that the reaction/possible over-reaction in the ensuing fallout might be even worse than today's events.

Hi there. I am fine. I saw it all from my roof in Brooklyn. Everyone is out on the streets. Everything smells like spent fireworks, even here in Brooklyn. People are walking around with masks on.

A few hours ago I was watching the WTC burn and now there's no WTC. TV continues to show LIVE aerial footage of NOTHING.

I hope everyone and their loved ones are safe and sound --

Shout out to blood donors: don't go to St. Vincent's or Bellevue they cannot handle you - call 1-800-933-BLOOD

I live in a very Muslim nabe and am very skeery of the consequences of this shit.

Let's keep it together.

Pretty much my thoughts as well. Somebody's going to make something out of all this...

God, this is scary.
Heard the news breaking at work, listening to radio 4 and 5. I couldn't believe what I was hearing, as you would expect. One thing after another complete with vox pops of panicking NYers, my blood ran cold.
Since then there's already been a lot of jaw-jaw about war-war from Bush and Blair. And lot's of Pearl Harbor comparisons: "Another day of infamy"
The news programmes are just re-showing the shot of the plane hitting thw WTC over and over again.
How could the US be so lax with it's internal flight security? Four hijacked planes??
I dread to think how many lives have been lost. Good to know all ILE New Yorkers are a-OK, for what it's worth.
What will the fall-out from this be I wonder?

Shit.

Just to tie up two loose ends, it appears the plane that crashed in Pittsburgh was meant for Camp David, although fortunately nothing ever got there.

How could the US be so lax with it's internal flight security? Four hijacked planes??

Clearly the key questions above and beyond the identity of whoever was behind it. How did they get whatever they got on the plane? How were they able to ensure that all flights reached intended targets (in otherwards, could there/would there have been a chance for the planes to ditch somewhere, as apparently the one flight near Pittsburgh did)? What happened in Boston and Newark? Who was on the flight anyway?

Lots to know. Little will be forthcoming.

Hi Tracer birthday buddy: I was beginning to worry. But no sound yet from Nude Spock...? Who else has not beeped in?

the bombing, i'm hearing, was planned today because it marked the anniversary of the camp david accord (which would explain why the plane that crashed in western pa. was heading there).

If anyone has the QuickTime player installed, the BBC World television channel is broadcasting live.

I'm normally pretty jaded about things, but the Momus picture and this one have kinda knocked the wind out of me.

Hey Tracer, glad you're OK.

Given the high casualty counts, I'm almost certain that I know someone who has lost their life in this. In fact, there's a very good chance that the CEO of the company I left in May lost her father in all of this.

We were supposed to go to New York this weekend to celebrate the birthday of one of our friends. Looks like that's not happening... Maybe we should go to Montreal.

Sorry, the URL for that picture was http://www.jibbajabba.net/ temp/wtcboom.jpg

On a personal note I just talked with my sister who was flying back from Spain today. She's in Atlanta and is taking the train the rest of the way.

Official PUBLIC ANNOUNCEMENT - U.S. DEPARTMENT OF STATE - Worldwide Caution dated 7th September.

We are also concerned about information we received in May 2001 that American citizens may be the target of a terrorist threat from extremist groups with links to Usama Bin Ladin's Al-Qaida organization.

Why was this not disseminated more?

A vague anniversary, Fred, in that the key date is the 17th and not the 11th. I also note for the conspiracy crowd that it's the twenty-third year since the accords.

Washington DC police radio is online at http:// www.penguinradio.com/nontraditional/scanners/

John McCain on NBC says "this is an act of war and we should respond in kind".

Back to monitoring the news.

Some thoughts of Chairman DG:
1) As has been mentioned before, how on Earth were the means to hijack FOUR airliners sneaked through airport security? Do they just say "Are you a terrorist?" "No." "Well, that's alright then."?
2) People are seemingly well impressed with the planning of this, but I'm not. Consider this: perhaps the organisers had little faith in being able to carry out one successful operation, so decided to run many simultaneously in the hope of perhaps one or two working. In the end, probably due to someone not doing their job properly, all but one was a success.
3) This had better kill that STUPID missile defence system idea, today has just proved what I've been saying all along, it's just a pity I've had to be vindicated in this way.
4) The Urban75 forum has some interesting nonsense being posted currently, especially on pages 8 and 9 of the 'world trade centre' thread in the general forum.
5) Most harrowing footage so far - the image of someone waving from a window for help, probably toally futilely. Eeew *shivers*.

you can't give blood if you're foriegn or have been abroad recently.

so decided to run many simultaneously in the hope of perhaps one or two working

Hm, a good point. In which case those behind it prepared for the worst and found that they got the 'best' -- and what does that say about our set-up to prevent such nonsense?

What could have happened is that the airlines were infiltrated? Unlikely but who knows?

Holy shit! Check out photo on front page of Drudge Report

You can't give blood at all if you've been in the UK in the past few years either because of possible CJD transmission.

They've got CNN on in the cafeteria here and pretty much everyone is spending their lunch break in there. I couldn't bear to eat and watch it, apparently others can.

I watched the second plane hit the building from my roof.

The scariest thing I've heard all day was some doctor on TV saying he thought there might be a chemical element, anthrax possibly. In which case anyone who inhaled in the vicinity has about 36 hours after the first flu-like symptoms. Pretty alarmist.

There's a photo of the view from my roof on www.demon.co.uk/momus

Momus -- thank you.

that worries the fuck out of me since i have a headache and a stuffed nose

The thank you was intended for the photo; I just realized it could be taken as sarcasm about the chemical element.

ABC-TV quotes gov. sources -- although not official -- as saying that a flight attendant on the first plane to strike WTC managed to contact AA and say that two flight attendants had been stabbed and that the perps had entered the cockpit area.

Same source and report: a passenger on the United flight that crashed outside of Pitt placed a 911 call to report that the plane was, indeed, being hijacked.

I think the doctor had a personal agenda about germ warfare. No other sources have said anything about this. The last thing the terrorists would have done boarding those flights was take anything toxic. So I wouldn't worry. But I did close my windows and seal them as tight as I could after that report.

My girlfreind told me on the phone that some planes had crashed and I was like oh too bad. Then I click on CNN.com and my fucking jaw fell to the floor. I can't belive this.

another building 47 storey high next to WTC has collapsed.

Yes, it isn't just the hijackers who were on suicide missions: if this was planned and executed by a known and above-ground political org, then the whole public wing of that org is embarked on a suicide mission, vis-a-vis America's reply (as well as pronouncing likely death sentences to unwitting friends neighbours and bystanders).

Endless cries of "innocent civilians!" are beginning to grate, here. This is a distinction we Americans do not typically make when the civilians being killed are residents of "problem areas" like Palestine, Rwanda, the Balkans ... our moral high ground is not always as firm as we'd like it to be.

Pretty much my thought, too. I've been worried for years that our endlessly ridiculous policy in Iraq would produce something horrible in return. Do I think this is Iraqi-sponsored? In light of absolutely no evidence, not immediately, but that's the type of thing that made me figure that something eventually could happen, like a nagging at the back of my head, a slow ache that suddenly flares up out of nowhere.

Grim. No matter how you slice it, grim. But divorcing emotion from all this and looking at it as dispassionately as possible, ultimately neither a surprise nor, horribly, unique.

"Judge of nations, spare us yet/Lest we forget, lest we forget."

CNN reports that Building 7 at World Trade Center is on fire and reportedly near collapse. CNN is also showing air-traffic control tapes of the flight paths

The media has pretty much gone into meta-reporting mode now, the only new information being what the potential death toll is and bringing out the retired national security/policy talking heads.

I would both love and hate to be a fly on the wall at the CIA/NSA right now - I can't can't begin to imagine the collective reaming that's going on. I suspect that when all this plays out the intelligence puzzle pieces that led up to this will have been pretty obvious, but lacking the "big picture" we simply could not have turned the discreet pieces of data into usuable information.

Even if there was prior knowledge the sheer scale of the attack may have not caused it to be taken seriously. If you told me that four separate airliners were going to be simultaneously hijacked and then crashed into symbolic targets with massive loss of life, I'd say you had the script from the next Jerry Bruckheimer movie.

Probably the most interesting news here on out is going to be what's in between the lines and what the govt. over-reaction and consequental loss of liberty/privacy is going to be. I'm hoping for the best, but I fear the worst.

Very soon after the first attacks the BBC were reporting "6 dead, 1000 injured", which is the death toll from the previous WTC attack in 1992. How much of the world's media made this mistake?

I suppose it's just a testament to how safe and efficient our country is that we should be surprised when civilians are killed for larger political reasons. The concept is pretty run of the mill elsewhere.

By the way, Ned, you friend is apparently living in the same neighborhood where I work.

Someone just told me that tomorrow was the date of sentencing for two of the people convicted for the embassy bombings in Tanzania 2 years ago. They were to be convicted in the U.S. Southern District of N.Y. Court, downtown.

Oh how neat! (Sorry to briefly hijack the thread.) Hope you'll all be able to meet up soon.

I got too bitch too soon, I think; see the bin Laden thread, above. The finger is officially swerving in that direction.

And bad choice of words, Ned. :)

Yeouch! I didn't even think of it. My deep apologies.

Ran across a business directory of the World Trade Center at http:// janitor61.home.mindspring.com/list/bdir.htm

Tom Clancy on CNN now.

My head hurts after all of this. too much. . . i need cold, mind- numbing alcohol. jesus.

Doesn't work, Chris, can you double check?

I can't help but wonder if this wasn't done by Americans.

Salomon Brothers (a big investment bank) was at 7 World Trade Center. Apparently they couldn't stop it from collapsing, because it was too dangerous to do anything. It's down, but it has been evacuated.

They've just shown footage, wow.

Mayor Giuliani just announced that there are people alive under the rubble. Apparently in the subway/PATH station.

My gut feeling is this can't have been done by Americans, simply because whoever hijacked the planes knew they were on suicide missions. One madman might kill himself after going on a rampage, but these were calculated kamakaze missions organised by several people. Of course, I may be wrong. I suppose it's still far too early to work out who is responsible.

While I'm here, I'd just like to say thanks for keeping this thread updated. I've been unable to get into news websites for most of the day - ILE has been the only site that's kept moving.

I can't help but wonder if this wasn't done by Americans.

If the evidence of calls being reported is true, then there was definitely a takeover of the cockpit in each case. Of course, who took over the cockpit is the question.

Democratic and Republican Congressional leaders will address the nation tonight at 7 PM. Bush will also address the nation, though they aren't giving the time yet.

As much as I've criticized Mayor Giuliani in the past, he (and Governor George Pataki) deserve nothing but praise for their actions today. I heard them both over the radio, it sounded like they were about to break down at several points.

They're broadcasting that asswipe Steve Emerson on CBS Radio now. He's the guy that was blaming the Arabs in 1995. This is real bad, folks. I can't bear to listen to this Israel-ueber-Alles racist shill blather on about this.

Is there anything else that can come down? Are the emergency services even safe down there at the moment?
BBC just showed pictures of people jumping...it's just heart-rending. How on earth are people meant to put up with this? The tears have been there all day and I'm god knows how many thousands of miles away. it's impossible.
I know I'm just posting so I can ramble to make myself figure this all out, but I suspect many will be doing the same.
The one thing I have found out: I have never particularly been impressed by Blair but that TUC speech was so genuine and you could hear him almost bursting into tears. Bush was also good, at least he's showing solidarity...

Watch CNN -- they're reporting explosions and bombings in Kabul, Afghanistan right now.

How on earth are people meant to put up with this?

Same way people were meant to deal with having their land seized for Jewish-only settlements; same way people were meant to deal with having their families slaughtered in Lebanese refugee camps. Same way people are expected to deal in Sudan or Rwanda; same way I'm expected to deal with my cousin and dozens of others being throw off of a cliff in Ethiopian ethnic clashes. If this is as bad as it gets, we're still lucky.

Shit, they've started bombing Afghanistan. This is insane.

Missiles launched.. attack on Kabul, Taliban centres being targeted.

we're all fucked now

News of explosions in Kabul have just come through on Newsnight. Richard Perle (US Assistant Defence Secretary 1980-87) saying 'if it is retaliation, it's about time. State sponsors of terrorism have had it too easy for too long'. Jesus.

BBC world service TV is on live stream on the website if anyone needs it. They haven't mentioned the attacks on Kabul yet...

This is potentially very serious indeed. Smacks of leaping to conclusions and you can't help but wonder what the countries retaliated against will do to respond. I really don't want nukes to start flying around...

More talking heads on Newsnight. Goddamnit, tell me what's going on in Afghanistan.

So far - news correspondents think this may or may not be related to a civil war that has been raging... no confirmations yet...

my partner called me this morning telling me to turn on the tv. in new york, a blue clear autumn day. here, a blue clear spring day. probably the same chill in the air on the other side of the world. makes me feel sick, the pictures of people jumping from 100 stories up, the shots from the basement escalators taken by firefighters who are now almost certainly dead. the shot of the plane crashing into tower 2, again and again and again. reminds me of something, this television tragedy. reminds me of the gulf war, missiles slamming into another building somewhere far from america. a terrible terrible thing, makes me feel sick for all involved, but makes me afraid too, of america's big angry fist smashing down again. a new zealand woman who had just got off an aborted flight to la was holding her baby daughter and crying for those killed, but also she said "i hope this doesn't start world war 3". later news bulletins just show her crying.

"confirmed...not a US strike"

Meanwhile, here it's a perfectly sunny day, mild temperatures, birds chirping, kids playing in the street. I'm used to hearing planes fly overhead each hour -- since late this morning, I've heard one very loud jet.

My brother is a sophomore in high school. They wheeled out a TV set during his English class to watch the coverage this morning. Upon the collapse of the second building, one student said to another, "Ha! I told you it would fall -- now pay up!!"

eBay. Yuk.

THERE IS NOTHING THAT ANYONE WANT TO SEE ON THIS WEB SIT SO CAN YOU PLESE GO AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT PLESE IT'S JUST NOT GOOD OK IF YOU COULD COME UP WITH SOME BETTER STUFF ON 9/11 E-MAIL ME TO SEE IF IT'S GOOD TALK TO YOU LATER BYE BYE

!!

just two exclamation marks??

Not THE Kim Harris, surely?

Maybe these thread should be locked.

Agree.

Me, too, and the revival part deleted - this is an historical document (that sounds "cold" but I mean it in, umm, the most living sense that one can mean "historical document")

I'm torn about whether or not I would have wanted to be here for this (not "because ILE sucks / no it doesn't" but because I wasn't active anywhere with almost-fast-as-a-chatroom response at the time. And I'm torn about whether or not I would have wanted to be.) I agree about the locking, fwiw. (And for the other three implied threads too, then?)

There were a slew of threads, actually. I'll go through and lock the others right now, then come back to this one. Keeping the revival posts here, though, do provide a bit of interesting context. I too have been thinking about these threads lately. It was a nervous and strange day here, for obvious reasons.

I miss DG, he was a very good influence on this place.

He was indeed.

Jumping the gun on this, perhaps, but I figure that it might be good to act a bit more forwardly now than to wait to see if other random googlers start posting on the other threads. I have locked down all the other threads and will now lock down this one. There are ten specific threads in this sequence. Any questions or discussions to change this -- there might be some good reasons to keep them unlocked, after all -- should be directed to the SHOUTING FOR THE MODERATOR thread. My decision is not meant to be a final word on this subject, merely something temporary that, if there are no problems with it, can become permanent. I will leave the revived posts here for now to provide a bit of explanatory context unless there is a specific objection.