You babies about your coffee...

(Has anyone ordererd the ice tea at Waffle House? Sweet, southern style! God, it's nauseatingly sweet.)

Is there some consensus as to what is a proper roast for coffee beans of various types? If Starbucks espresso roast is "overroasted" (compared to what?) then why has it been successful for so long? Where are its more gourmandizing competitors?

This is a fairly recent phenomenon, you know... only about 13 years since the Seattle coffee explosion.

We should think this is bad because it's new? Only about 25 years since the Chez Panisse/New American explosion. And not much further back since Julia Child. Starbucks and Peet's started I think in the late 70s; their spread from Seattle and SF coincided with the malling and internetting of the country.

But beer people have gone through the same split thanks to microbrews. Which I'm not complaining about, mind you. I like good beer. One of my friends quit microbrews for Bud and PBR back during the indie-trucker-cap thing and tried to convince me that there was something "unelitist" about drinking cheap beer. What-ev-er. Hey, I'm down with workingclass beer: English workingclass beer. What kind of country makes its poor people drink shitty beer?

compared to beans that aren't burnt when they are roasted and still have some flavor left in them. i don't know why people like it. why do people like anything? maybe they think it's stronger or more authentic or something. but you shouldn't burn beans if you like the natural taste of coffee.in my opinion. but what do i know? like i said, i'll drink anything. dunkin donuts is fine by me.

huh? They do serve coffee or espresso alone, and even in china.

They choose to drink Coors, Bud Light, and that ilk. DC's Big Hunt stocks all sorts of import and craft brews...and Bud Light, because so many people asked for it.

The Italian shop next door does an amazing espresso for 80p with all sorts of lovely crema on top. It's standard Lavazza red but they know how to do their barista stuff. If they didn't the Sunday grannies who come to shop there after church would KILL. Or just moan a lot.

What's wrong with not going to a place because the coffee sucks? Some people enjoy their coffee as much as if not more than their breakfast/dessert that accompanies it, so why should they pay for something they hate? I can understand complaining that people are overly anal (which I am definitely guilty of sometimes), but still...

This obliquely reminds me of the story of how Elvis Telecom spotted the worthwhile deli near Terrastock V because it was the one that the old Italian guys were getting their coffee in.

What's wrong with not going to a place because the coffee sucks?

Because in America, we're all winners!

Same here as well. It's just up the road near a Trader Joe's and a reasonable Indian fast food place = handy.

I dont think I'm snobby about my coffee - I just honestly thnk that once you've had a good well made espresso you just find things like instant really bland and/or bitter in comparison.

I guess we're spoiled here though with our large Italian migrant population.

This needs to be rectified ASAP!

I wish there was a shop with Krispy Kreme donuts and Dunkin' Donuts coffee. Not that I won't drink KK coffee or eat DD, but I think each store has its own weakness.

Hm. I think I'd go for the reverse, mainly because I think KK's donuts (er, or doughnuts... whatevah) are mostly too sweet for my tastes, whereas I like a lot of DD's (*snort* OMG, DD... fangirl moment?) donuts, and well, you know already about the coffee situation. Not that I'm actually CLOSE to a DD -- the closest one to me is about eight miles away. I'm much closer to a KK -- two of them, I think, though I'd still have to drive four miles to get to one. There is a local donut place that sells amazing cake donuts that is SO much closer than either of these two chains, but I wouldn't try their coffee, so they don't really fit into this whole discussion.

This is insane- 128 Starbucks retails stores within 10 miles of my zip.

Um, yeah, you can say that again. 12 Starbucks retail stores reside within 5 miles of *my* zip. You know, I didn't even START hearing about Starbucks locations opening up locally until about ten years ago. And I'm quite shocked to find out that the location of the record shop where I bought my vinyl copy of Rio is now a Starbucks. *mind boggle*

(Not that I necessarily mind the proximity of Starbucks to my happy abode. Not at all. Starbucks does provide me with the lovely goodness that is the pumpkin scone, so that's a good thing.)

I went to an independant coffee shop in Annapolis one time and ordered a macchiato -- the young counter person immediately responded with, "ok, sir, but have you ever had our macchiato before? It might not be what you're used to. It's just espresso with a little foamed milk." Right, a macchiato. "no, I mean there's no caramel or anything, and it's just a little milk." Right, a macchiato. "OK, as long as you understand that we don't do it like Starbuck's." Well, I said, Starbuck's should have to apologize and explain, not you folks. The counter person said nothing, and seemed surprised that I didn't send my drink back.

The second time I went there and ordered a macchiato, it was the boss behind the counter. He started into the same spiel, I interrupted him with assurances that I knew what a macchiato was, and he smiled and said "I suppose you'll be wanting a real ceramic cup as well." And I got one.

I had a bunch of palpitation events back in November, and they've by and large disappeared once I cut the caffeine, de-stressed, starting exercising regularly, and went on a low-cholesterol diet. (I suspect the first two were really the major culprits, as the week I felt the worse, I was slamming down the Snapple ice teas like nobody's business during an unusually high-stress work moment.) The funny thing is that in a couple hours I'm finally going to get fitted for an event recorder which is supposed to monitor these palpitations I'm no longer having.

I suspect that society's mad tosh for Stabucks in recent years has less to do with the coffee and more to do with the fact that it's a place where you can SIT DOWN without having a full meal or an alcoholic beverage.

Normally I would be happy about an oasis of civilisation but I bitched out and told her that I should be the one vetting her as this was Naples, FL and not Naples, Italy.

Naples is a town in Florida; it's very chi-chi and near my mom's place in Fort Myers Beach.