TS: Transformers vs. Thundercats

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http://www.snapbag.com/~flux/tf/cards/optimus.jpg

http://www.thundercatsonline.hpg.ig.com.br/imagens/imagens_lion/imagens_lion_16.jpg

― Johnney B (Johnney B), Sunday, 29 February 2004 10:58 (twenty-two years ago)

Oh please, it's a non-contest! 5 extras from Cats vs a planet of robots? Transformers!!!!!!

― jel -- (jel), Sunday, 29 February 2004 11:01 (twenty-two years ago)

Transformers in the hiz-ouse!

― Speedy (Speedy Gonzalas), Sunday, 29 February 2004 11:09 (twenty-two years ago)

Thundercats is what you did when Transformers wasn't on tele / the toys got broken.

― Sick Nouthall (Nick Southall), Sunday, 29 February 2004 11:28 (twenty-two years ago)

I remember this one episode of Thundercats where Tigra went into this old cave and started aging really quickly. I can remember they spent around 10 mins on Tigra turning into an old man and musing on death. Really dark stuff. It all tunred out okay in the end (Cheetara ran in and got him out quick) but it was still super scary - the most scared I remember being as I kid. So Thunderacts for getting the emotional reaction.

Oh, also, Cheetara! Hubba hubba!

http://www.thundercatsonline.hpg.ig.com.br/imagens/imagens/imagem_cheetara_1.jpg

― Johnney B (Johnney B), Sunday, 29 February 2004 11:35 (twenty-two years ago)

Thundercats hasn't yet been *reclaimed* by post-teen ironic clothing companies, so score one to them.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Sunday, 29 February 2004 11:41 (twenty-two years ago)

I saw someone with a Thundercats t-shirt the other day, Dom. he must've been my age.

― Sick Nouthall (Nick Southall), Sunday, 29 February 2004 11:43 (twenty-two years ago)

In fairness, I only started this thread because I couldn't take the tweeness.

― Johnney B (Johnney B), Sunday, 29 February 2004 12:05 (twenty-two years ago)

Thing is, though, I watched a Transformers cartoon last year. It was fucking shit. I reckon our memories have all played bad tricks on us, to be honest.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Sunday, 29 February 2004 12:08 (twenty-two years ago)

I think the love I have for Thundercats is down to the empathy with Lion-O - a grown-up before his time, trying to make his way through the world, with all this responsibility that he's not really ready for, and doesn't reckon he's up to scratch until he's tested. I would say more about this, but my thoughts are not the most organised or coherent of things on a Sunday morning.

― Johnney B (Johnney B), Sunday, 29 February 2004 12:17 (twenty-two years ago)

Wasn't Transformers a metaphor for puberty, anyway? Like Pokemon in later years.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Sunday, 29 February 2004 12:23 (twenty-two years ago)

I never got that. I always thought it was goodie robots vs baddie robots in a cool inter-plantery space battle.

And look at the Transformers movie. Thats as poor as poor can be.

― Johnney B (Johnney B), Sunday, 29 February 2004 12:28 (twenty-two years ago)

I was always rather suspicious of Thundercats, because they listed "child psychologist" in the credits. There's something definitely a bit dodgy about that.

― caitlin (caitlin), Sunday, 29 February 2004 12:36 (twenty-two years ago)

Presumably they were checking to see if they were being too violent and nasty, and so asked an "expert" to make sure that the scary bits wern't too scary. (As I mentioned upthread, it didn't work - the guy should have been out on his earhole)

― Johnney B (Johnney B), Sunday, 29 February 2004 14:27 (twenty-two years ago)

'And look at the Transformers movie. Thats as poor as poor can be.'

WHHHHHAAAAAAAAAA??????????????

― pete s, Sunday, 29 February 2004 14:31 (twenty-two years ago)

The movie's RUBBISH! It's a barely coherent, poorly animated mess, with layers of fight scenes punctuated with badly produced 80's power rock. "You got the touch! You got the power!" et al. It's absolutly shocking.

If I were being cynical and detached, I would say that Transformers:Hair Metal::Thundercats:Indie

― Johnney B (Johnney B), Sunday, 29 February 2004 14:41 (twenty-two years ago)

There is no way that movie could be any better.
The music's fantastic, the story's great.

― pete s, Sunday, 29 February 2004 14:44 (twenty-two years ago)

Plus, it has Orson Welles.

― caitlin (caitlin), Sunday, 29 February 2004 14:48 (twenty-two years ago)

Plus, the first half-hour of the film delivers the robot carnage that the cartoon lacked. AND OPTIMUS PRIME DIED! *sob*

(but the comic was way better)

― carson dial (carson dial), Sunday, 29 February 2004 17:58 (twenty-two years ago)

Transformers was a key element of my youth. And the only Thundercat I had was MUMMMMM-RAAAAAAA.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Sunday, 29 February 2004 18:01 (twenty-two years ago)

Transformers comic >>>>>>>>>> Transformers cartoon (movie excluded)

But on the other hand, I still use Mumm-ra as a euphemism for 'really really good', and no Transformer's name has entered my everyday lexicon. Although I have resolved to name my first child Powerglide.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Sunday, 29 February 2004 18:27 (twenty-two years ago)

What about Linvoy Primus.

― pete s, Sunday, 29 February 2004 18:32 (twenty-two years ago)

What about I just sideswiped my arse?

― jel -- (jel), Sunday, 29 February 2004 18:41 (twenty-two years ago)

It's all about:

http://wellredpress.com/Comics/Comics%20-%20Images/2003/03%20Images%202/thundercats_bop.jpg

― Tep (ktepi), Sunday, 29 February 2004 18:48 (twenty-two years ago)

(Minus Lion-o's Demon Jedi impression and Cheetara's six inch waist.)

― Tep (ktepi), Sunday, 29 February 2004 18:49 (twenty-two years ago)

CYBERTRON—Following an intense battle with Megatron and his evil Decepticons Monday, former robot-in-disguise Bumblebee refused to revert to his natural state as a yellow Volkswagen Beetle. "I hid my existence in this world by taking the form of a vehicle! I revealed my true nature when I was called upon to protect earth!" said Bumblebee, a member of Optimus Prime's heroic Autobots force. "I refuse to change back into a humiliating bubble-shaped compact car!" Bumblebee added that Megatron arrived on earth with one goal: Destruction!

― ferg (Ferg), Sunday, 29 February 2004 18:52 (twenty-two years ago)

i own the transformers movie and don't think in my lifetime i will be able to watch it enough times. they had the robo-balls so swear in the movie too¡ not like those thunderpussies¡

― dyson (dyson), Sunday, 29 February 2004 19:33 (twenty-two years ago)

I haven't seen the Transformers Movie since the theather.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Sunday, 29 February 2004 19:38 (twenty-two years ago)

The Thundercats movie was great though! I haven't seen it since I was 10 or so, mind...

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Sunday, 29 February 2004 20:24 (twenty-two years ago)

big robots > cat people innit

― stevem (blueski), Sunday, 29 February 2004 21:20 (twenty-two years ago)

thundercats being absolutely fucking awful when i saw it again aged 18 was the day i became soulless

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Sunday, 29 February 2004 21:32 (twenty-two years ago)

i watched the Berbils one on video about a year ago and it was still cool

― stevem (blueski), Sunday, 29 February 2004 21:34 (twenty-two years ago)

though "michaelangelo mum-ra" still makes me giggle

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Sunday, 29 February 2004 21:35 (twenty-two years ago)

Transformers! I saw the movie in theaters when I was 4 or 5. Classic, especially that "Touch" song.

― latebloomer (latebloomer), Monday, 1 March 2004 07:04 (twenty-two years ago)

i saw it in the theater as a kid too. seeing them actually die blew my fucking mind¡

― dyson (dyson), Monday, 1 March 2004 07:10 (twenty-two years ago)

Yeah, it was almost traumatizing, especially seeing Optimus Prime die.

― latebloomer (latebloomer), Monday, 1 March 2004 07:12 (twenty-two years ago)

We've got a load of Thundercats vocal outtakes knocking about somewhere. They're funny/ "Thunder! Thundr! Fuck, what am I saying?"

― Matt (Matt), Monday, 1 March 2004 09:45 (twenty-two years ago)

The Thundercats had the Thundertank, thus they win.

Also there were the political overtones of the Cats fleeing their stricken planet and facing a sour welcome from the locals on Third Earth.

I also liked the way at the end of every episode Snarf did something daft and the Cats all laughed solidly for about 20 seconds before the end credits rolled.

― Nick H (Nick H), Monday, 1 March 2004 13:42 (twenty-two years ago)

No! This is what ruined the Thundercats. There is no place for shite gags, cutsy characters (God-fucking-zooki my arse) and moralising ala Inspector Gadget (today we stopped Dr Claw because we hadn't been freebasing).

― Dave B (daveb), Monday, 1 March 2004 13:47 (twenty-two years ago)

I think Snarf may beat that sodding unicorn off Dungeons & Dragons in the annoying stakes. I'd like to have a big stew made of the both of them, little tinkers.

― Liz :x (Liz :x), Monday, 1 March 2004 14:43 (twenty-two years ago)

Add Godzooki and that's an alltime greatest stew (cross thread with Spaced)

― Dave B (daveb), Monday, 1 March 2004 14:52 (twenty-two years ago)

Twee-est stew EVAH!

― Liz :x (Liz :x), Monday, 1 March 2004 14:53 (twenty-two years ago)

Also there were the political overtones of the Cats fleeing their stricken planet and facing a sour welcome from the locals on Third Earth.

effectively ripping off Transformers here

― stevem (blueski), Monday, 1 March 2004 15:00 (twenty-two years ago)

Transformers the Movie has a fucking KILLER soundtrack ("you've got the touch!"..."DARE! dare to believe you can survive!"..."dare to be stupid!" it's like EXCLAMATION-POINT ROCK!), Orson Welles last performance in any movie ever, Leonard Nimoy as the voice of Galvatron, perfect(ly corny) dialogue, etc, etc. That's probably my favorite thing about it anymore (also the carnage & whatnot).

― nickalicious (nickalicious), Monday, 1 March 2004 15:07 (twenty-two years ago)

(OMG ew why are there hand drawings of nude Cheetara's on the internet!?! Pervertalists!)

― nickalicious (nickalicious), Monday, 1 March 2004 15:09 (twenty-two years ago)

Are they entitled 'Thundercats Ho'? (boom boom)

The best thing about Transformers the Movie is the bit at the beginning when Ironhide begs for mercy and Megatron shoots him in the face. It is the greatest dramatisation of pure evil in cinematic history.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Monday, 1 March 2004 15:10 (twenty-two years ago)

"Such heroic nonsense."

― nickalicious (nickalicious), Monday, 1 March 2004 15:11 (twenty-two years ago)

effectively ripping off Transformers here

Too young too properly remember the Transformers TV show, but I did have some toys I think.

What are people's feelings on Matt Trakker and MASK?

― Nick H (Nick H), Monday, 1 March 2004 15:17 (twenty-two years ago)

transformers pwns thundercats. please.

mask - more like crochet bobble hat. lame.

― g-kit (g-kit), Monday, 1 March 2004 16:44 (twenty-two years ago)

g.i. joe was best.

― g--ff (gcannon), Monday, 1 March 2004 16:49 (twenty-two years ago)

Skipping 18 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.

MASK WAS FUCKING EXCELLENT
-- Dan Perry

dude i know you're a Cher fan but come on!

― stevem (blueski), Tuesday, 2 March 2004 14:27 (twenty-two years ago)

Yeah, Rodimus Prime got off okay in the Simon Furman stories (actually, he was rarely in them IIRC). Magnus got the shit kicked out of him on so many occasions it was pretty comical.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Tuesday, 2 March 2004 15:44 (twenty-two years ago)

http://www.liamnet.demon.co.uk/TFcomics/113-Wanted/113-cover.jpg

good ol Geoff...

― stevem (blueski), Tuesday, 2 March 2004 15:47 (twenty-two years ago)

I can't decide what to think about Transformers being Orson Welles' last credit. One the one hand, it's kinda depressing (no matter how big or important we are, we end up wanking for coins) or liberating (what class the dude had). Either way, it's a magnificent quiz question.

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 2 March 2004 15:53 (twenty-two years ago)

You all forget:

http://webusers.xula.edu/mbullock/silverlogo.jpg

http://webusers.xula.edu/mbullock/silverbluegrass.gif

http://members.tripod.com/~fjmccloud/silverhawks/commercial.html

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Tuesday, 2 March 2004 17:16 (twenty-two years ago)

I had a bunch of Silverhawks. I even had a Silverhawks t-shirt.

― latebloomer (latebloomer), Tuesday, 2 March 2004 20:53 (twenty-two years ago)

funny how transfromers are claimed as "toys of my youth" by people under 30 yo. funny thing

― kephm, Tuesday, 2 March 2004 21:09 (twenty-two years ago)

& starblazers ownz the thread

― kephm, Tuesday, 2 March 2004 21:10 (twenty-two years ago)

GOBOTS GET OFF TRANSFORMERS DICKS!

― nickalicious (nickalicious), Tuesday, 2 March 2004 21:15 (twenty-two years ago)

Hindsight tells me that the parenthetical "(cue Cher/Jim Carey jokes)" that I deleted from my post should have been left in.

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 2 March 2004 21:44 (twenty-two years ago)

and spoil our fun? why i oughta

― stevem (blueski), Tuesday, 2 March 2004 21:55 (twenty-two years ago)

oh man yeah that galaxy rangers was relly good too. however i can only picture captain simian and the space monkeys. also i am confusing battle beasts with boglins i think

― prima_fassy (mwah), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 00:06 (twenty-two years ago)

it always really angered me when orson goes

"AND NOTHING! you belong to me... *mumbles* ... now"

dont try and mask forgetting to turn yr script page with deep artistry dude! also its fun to reimagine orson as floating megatron vs the studio unicron cos the convo mustve been the same! "nobody summons orson" "then it pleases me to be the first!" "yr bargaining posture is highly dubious"... he was in a wheelchair by then right?

― prima fassy (mwah), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 00:12 (twenty-two years ago)

magnus's ambivalence was fascinating tho. what does he represent, that some ppl just arent cut out for life no matter how noble?

― prima fassy (mwah), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 00:15 (twenty-two years ago)

fave magnus story was probly... was it called 'ladies night'? with the forest fire reflected in galvatron's eyes

― prima_fassy (mwah), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 00:18 (twenty-two years ago)

funny how transfromers are claimed as "toys of my youth" by people under 30 yo. funny thing

I am under 30 - I watched TF and TC in my youth, and had the toys. Therefor, toys of my youth. Why a funny thing, hmm?

― Johnney B (Johnney B), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 08:31 (twenty-two years ago)

I was *definitely* thinking of Rodimus. See, Furman treated Magnus like a hero (the movie treated him like a dick, hence he's been disrespected in the TF canon for years). He made Galvatron nigh-on invincible and had Magnus scramble like fuck to beat/stop him (which he just about did). By himself. Outside of this, he got a pretty good portrayal - ever read the stories where he and Prime teamed up on Cybertron and eventually faced down Megatron, where Optimus stands back and lets Magnus bitchslap him?

In Furman's stories, Rodimus:
* briefly lost the Matrix through his Achilles' Heel (Arcee).
* Got one-hand slapped by Galvatron in the last Galvy story (Time Wars). Optimus then stepped in and saved the day.
* Causes the downfall of Cybertron in the future by absorbing Unicron into the Matrix and then having the evil influence corrupt him.
* Didn't get a tenth of the capable leadership treatment Prime, Grimlock, Megatron and hell, Magnus got.

He was rarely in them because Furman thought he was a lame-ass for real.

― Barima (Barima), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 16:40 (twenty-two years ago)

And c'mon, the only thing Defenders had over Galaxy Rangers was camp. I mean, League of Extraordinary Gentlemen (the comic) >>>>> Defeneders of the Earth (may my 6 year old self forgive me). Also, Bravestarr was great for having 30-30 as his ride/partner and sharing He-Man's voice.

Dungeons and Dragons and Jayce and the Wheeled Warriors, anyone?

― Barima (Barima), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 16:44 (twenty-two years ago)

http://www.claws-and-paws.com/thundercats/index.php

Is your place for the Thundercats outtakes. I urge you all to listen.

― Lynskey (Lynskey), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 16:56 (twenty-two years ago)

Dungeons & Dragons was a big steaming pile of poo. I have no idea what Jayce & the Wheeled Warriors was.

On the original question: Transformers wins by the distance from Earth to Cybertron. Mostly cos of Shockwave who was the coolest cyclopean one-handed robot/giant laser gun EVAH. Also, he didn't lose his shit like Megatron did all the time.

Mumm-Ra seemed like the least effective villain in the world. He was DEAD half the time.

― robster (robster), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:09 (twenty-two years ago)

I am under 30 - I watched TF and TC in my youth, and had the toys. Therefor, toys of my youth. Why a funny thing, hmm?

it is an indie revivalism worse than trucker hats.

― kephm, Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:19 (twenty-two years ago)

ha ha "revivalism"

― nickalicious (nickalicious), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:29 (twenty-two years ago)

i liked D&D

thanks for the info Barima, i can't remember when i stopped reading the comic but it wasn't long after Time Wards...the Underbase? Starscream becoming the size of Unicron! there were three Decepticon dudes running CYbertron by then - all the stuff you describe is totally unknown to me tho (but the Matrix absorbing Unicron et al sounds cool, when exactly did all this happen?)

― stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:29 (twenty-two years ago)

Wars no Wards (Ratchet wasn't still around by then was he?)

― stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:30 (twenty-two years ago)

I like how the concept of Transformers as "indie revivalism" akin to trucker hats implies that A) there was ever a time in my life I wasn't into Transformers, and B) that there was a time in our youths that we were into trucker hats and the recent trend was a throwback to our youth.

― nickalicious (nickalicious), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:33 (twenty-two years ago)

dude, Buster Witwicky OWNED the trucker hat - it's no coincidence

― stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:34 (twenty-two years ago)

Has Transformers ever even gone off the air (I'm including all the weird spinoff shows with like the computer animation and shit, stuff I haven't seen but seems to be on all the time)? You can't revive what won't die!

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:37 (twenty-two years ago)

Beast Wars was the fucking SHEEYITE. For the whole span of that series being on the air my son was always at his mom's house on Saturday mornings and thus I would wake & bake & watch Beast Wars. It was killer.

― nickalicious (nickalicious), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:38 (twenty-two years ago)

The leanest years were the early to mid 90's, but even that had the half hearted Generation 2.

― jel -- (jel), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:40 (twenty-two years ago)

This is not really apropos of anything except the total lack of comment on my Thundercats vs Battle of the Planets post, but if they go crossover-crazy with the Transformers comic, I'd love to see a Transformers vs Aliens comic. Not because it would be good, but because it wouldn't have to be.

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:42 (twenty-two years ago)

Transformers Vs Aliens would all be Prime trying to reason with them, and Megatron trying to harness their power. Ending with a big messy explosion.

― jel -- (jel), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:46 (twenty-two years ago)

the Transformers would simply crush them underfoot

― stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:50 (twenty-two years ago)

Transformers Vs Aliens would all be Prime trying to reason with them, and Megatron trying to harness their power. Ending with a big messy explosion.

See? How great would that be? Starscream plugs something into one to suck energon out of them; Soundwave has one infect him only to "hatch" out of his tape deck, leaving him unharmed; greatness and explosions ensue.

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:51 (twenty-two years ago)

are new Transformers not as gigantic as their predecessors then?

― stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:53 (twenty-two years ago)

nickal, i am just bored of 80's revivalism in general. interpol, transformers, reaganomics, etc. there was a time when it(insert just about any 80's pop culture item here) wasnt worn as a badge of cool by the hipsters. maybe im just stuck in the early 90's.

― kephm, Wednesday, 3 March 2004 17:55 (twenty-two years ago)

This time in the 90s, the 80s revivalism was getting underway with the multi-volume New Wave hits collections, reclaiming of Breakin 2 as classic of electric boogaloo-ism, etc., so we're about due for I Love The 90s, I think.

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 18:02 (twenty-two years ago)

Transformers never died for me, so it's not revivalism.

― jel -- (jel), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 18:24 (twenty-two years ago)

Steve, I was mainly referring to the Marvel UK TFs, which is where Furman got his start and rep. I heard he did abuse Rodimus in the series you were reading by having Galvatron repeatedly shoot an alternate Rodimus' long-dead body while screaming at it.

Comparing the renewed TF mania to trucker caps is loony tune-ness. Thanks to Beast Wars, they never really went away.

Oh, and where's the Soundwave love?

http://www.plumed-serpent.com/myst6SOUNDWAVECARTOON.JPG

― Barima (Barima), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 18:55 (twenty-two years ago)

I'm sure I downloaded some crazy old school hip hop tracks 'featuring' Soundwave a year back.

― Barima (Barima), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 18:57 (twenty-two years ago)

generation z will come up with something original someday

― kephm, Wednesday, 3 March 2004 19:25 (twenty-two years ago)

In the shower this korning, the thought struck me that since Mumm-ra was dead most of the time, calling himself the ever-living was a bit of a breach of the Trades Descriptions Act. I never noticed this at the time. University education has given me something, then.

― Dave B (daveb), Thursday, 4 March 2004 09:01 (twenty-two years ago)

Barima, i can barely recall Rodimus in the UK comic that's the problem - i remember the drawn out but still glorious rebuilding and return of Optimus but can't place these things into the right order - i'll have to see if there's a chronology for the UK comic online as i can't remember who was in charge during things like Underbase and whether that was after Time Wars or not

― stevem (blueski), Thursday, 4 March 2004 12:57 (twenty-two years ago)

University education has given me something, then.

The ability to think of Mumm-Ra in the shower, apparently.

― Barima (Barima), Thursday, 4 March 2004 13:05 (twenty-two years ago)

Oh yeah, Steve, head to Forbidden Planet or Amazon sometime, Titan have been colecting some of the old UK stories. I can't remember the site that published them online, but I bet you can easily Google dat.

― Barima (Barima), Thursday, 4 March 2004 13:07 (twenty-two years ago)

The chronology and continuity of the UK comic totally fucked up towards the end, when the UK and US stories just plain didn't correspond - characters who were dead in one country were walking around alive and well in the other and so forth.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 4 March 2004 14:19 (twenty-two years ago)

what is this stalinist revisionism, shockwave saved time wars. (technically not the last galvatron story either)

stevem underbase was from the us comic anyway no? for rodimus try remember the post target 2006 stories death's head was in, like the brilliant one where they r all chasing each other in the sewers. and the one where a surprisingly philosphical soundwave as decep leader almost ends the war and calls a truce but sez something like "no, things have gone on too long now" and doesnt. bah my memory is wasted

― prima fassy (mwah), Thursday, 4 March 2004 16:53 (twenty-two years ago)

furman had a great thing for hugely expanding the most rote cash-in toy characters like galvatron, or ones who were typecast like soundwave and grimlock. all became mavericks of a sort. likewise i think he struggled with optimus' saintlyness, but realised his favourite things must revolve around optimus axis

― prima fassy (mwah), Thursday, 4 March 2004 17:00 (twenty-two years ago)

The later stories involving Scorponok's defection were great as well.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 4 March 2004 17:18 (twenty-two years ago)

Furman finished the American series. Scorponok dies.

― jel -- (jel), Thursday, 4 March 2004 18:04 (twenty-two years ago)

I resent that Stalinist remark, pedant.

― Barima (Barima), Thursday, 4 March 2004 18:53 (twenty-two years ago)

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