What kind of teacher says this to a 16 year old boy?

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A local teacher's trial has just collapsed; she was accused of sending sexually-explicit text messages to some of her pupils.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/allnews/tm_objectid=14599003&method=full&siteid=50143&headline=-sex-txt--teacher-name_page.html

(no, I can't find any more reputable sources at the moment)

I read the story, and thought: hang on a minute! that name rings a bell. She went to the same school as me, and was a friend-of-a-friend.

― caitlin (caitlin), Saturday, 4 September 2004 18:19 (twenty years ago)

One the one hand, of course this is an innapropriate abuse of the teacher's position of authority; on the other hand, "16-year-old boy"? Last I heard, 16yos are considered to be of consenting age in England. "Boy" doesn't really seem like an appropriate term for a 16-year-old.

― Casuistry (Chris P), Saturday, 4 September 2004 19:27 (twenty years ago)

What then? "16 year old man" hardly seems appropriate.

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Sunday, 5 September 2004 00:56 (twenty years ago)

a sexy sexy teacher!

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Sunday, 5 September 2004 00:59 (twenty years ago)

16 year olds are very much boys in England. Till they're 22 usually.

― Bumfluff, Sunday, 5 September 2004 01:02 (twenty years ago)

The lesson today is love.

― the music mole (colin s barrow), Sunday, 5 September 2004 01:04 (twenty years ago)

A YOUNG teacher allegedly sent a text message inviting two teenage pupils for an end-of-term threesome in a stationery cupboard, a court heard yesterday.

Paul Redfern, 25, was accused of sending other explicit texts to the girls as they sat home with their parents with questions such as "What turns you on?" and "How big is your vagina?".

But the case against him was dropped when a judge declared he could not get a fair trial because prosecutors delayed handing over vital evidence to his defence team.

The girls, aged 15 and 16, were pupils in his English class at a comprehensive school in Lincolnshire when the texts were allegedly sent between January and July 2002.

Prosecutor Allan Armbrister told the court: "The allegations in respect of one girl was that, 'He wanted sex with me and another girl in a cupboard on the last day of term'."

― supercub, Sunday, 5 September 2004 02:10 (twenty years ago)

how big is your vagina? thank goodness for those self examination sessions & compare and contrast. how do you answer that question?

― Menelaus Darcy (Menelaus Darcy), Sunday, 5 September 2004 02:37 (twenty years ago)

roomy?

― Menelaus Darcy (Menelaus Darcy), Sunday, 5 September 2004 02:38 (twenty years ago)

http://www.playboy.com/on-campus/features/hotforteacher/imx/teacher10.jpg

― Harold Media (kenan), Sunday, 5 September 2004 02:40 (twenty years ago)

Also:

http://community-1.webtv.net/robmbr/RobsReviewHomePage/media/captureD41.jpg

― Harold Media (kenan), Sunday, 5 September 2004 02:43 (twenty years ago)

haha

― Curt1s St3ph3ns, Sunday, 5 September 2004 02:46 (twenty years ago)

mmm wrinkly stockings

― Menelaus Darcy (Menelaus Darcy), Sunday, 5 September 2004 02:47 (twenty years ago)

What then? "16 year old man" hardly seems appropriate.

It seems a bit closer to the truth. And, historically, it has generally been the case that sixteen year olds were treated like young men rather than overgrown boys. (And probably behaved more like young men because of this.)

― Casuistry (Chris P), Sunday, 5 September 2004 08:17 (twenty years ago)

i forget 'cupboard' is different over there.

― g--ff (gcannon), Sunday, 5 September 2004 08:30 (twenty years ago)

"We have gone through sheer hell for the last 20 months and for what? Nothing. The boys have been under an enormous amount of stress for a considerable period of time..."

well, who's fault is that? Did the boys insist on prosecuting their teacher or was it the Righteous Indignation of the parents that led to the last 20 months of hell?
They could have just said "no" and left it. Nancy Regan taught us to Just Say No!

― Catty (Catty), Sunday, 5 September 2004 09:53 (twenty years ago)

http://www.swr3.de/__pix/cover/500x435/9487.jpg

― jess (dubplatestyle), Sunday, 5 September 2004 10:32 (twenty years ago)

No one says '16 year-old man'.

― Alba (Alba), Sunday, 5 September 2004 11:35 (twenty years ago)

if the news were reporting a crime or injury or whatever they'd probably say "a young man".

― Ronan (Ronan), Sunday, 5 September 2004 11:37 (twenty years ago)

"A 16 year-old young man"? That sounds even more ridiculous.

― Alba (Alba), Sunday, 5 September 2004 11:39 (twenty years ago)

no no they'd describe a 16 year old as "a young man". you fool.

― Ronan (Ronan), Sunday, 5 September 2004 11:40 (twenty years ago)

I don't think they would. I think you're thinking of your auntie.

― Alba (Alba), Sunday, 5 September 2004 11:41 (twenty years ago)

ronan sounds right.

― cºzen (Cozen), Sunday, 5 September 2004 11:43 (twenty years ago)

"A 16-year-old Ronan" ?

― Alba (Alba), Sunday, 5 September 2004 11:45 (twenty years ago)

A 16 year old is not 18 yet, so they are not an adult. Thus 'boy'. I don't know why this is so complicated for some people.

Is a 16 year old girl, a woman? At what age does a boy become a man, and a girl becomes a woman (if not when they become a legal adult)? Is it when they get text messages from his their teacher asking about their pen;s size?

― supercub, Sunday, 5 September 2004 11:46 (twenty years ago)

old man.

― cºzen (Cozen), Sunday, 5 September 2004 11:47 (twenty years ago)

I would enjoy it if the media started saying "A 70-year-old old man".

― Alba (Alba), Sunday, 5 September 2004 11:49 (twenty years ago)

I would prefer if they said "a gnarled fag end"

― Ronan (Ronan), Sunday, 5 September 2004 12:08 (twenty years ago)

i thought there was a pretty obvious biological process that determined when a girl becomes a woman.

― Catty (Catty), Sunday, 5 September 2004 13:13 (twenty years ago)

But what about that moment that is theirs while they're in between?

― edward o (edwardo), Sunday, 5 September 2004 13:14 (twenty years ago)

She's a slave 4 u.

― Catty (Catty), Sunday, 5 September 2004 13:17 (twenty years ago)

That 'how big is your vagina?' question is a really bizarre one, aside from its creepiness when addressed to a pupil of yours.

― Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Sunday, 5 September 2004 14:39 (twenty years ago)

sounds like a chris morris-ism

― cutty (mcutt), Sunday, 5 September 2004 14:46 (twenty years ago)

Martin, you realise it wasn't real?

― Alba (Alba), Sunday, 5 September 2004 15:02 (twenty years ago)

the vagina wasn't real?

― Ronan (Ronan), Sunday, 5 September 2004 15:06 (twenty years ago)

too big.

― cºzen (Cozen), Sunday, 5 September 2004 15:08 (twenty years ago)

I hate when that happens.

― Ronan (Ronan), Sunday, 5 September 2004 15:10 (twenty years ago)

I think, more than the ages of the boys, the fact that this was their TEACHER, who is in a position of authority over them, makes this wrong. Surely she should know better! Do they have to spell out in teachers' school "do not make moves on your students"?

― Layna Andersen (Layna Andersen), Sunday, 5 September 2004 17:53 (twenty years ago)

We've done this before, it's "OK" on ILX if they're boys cos, like, the guys on here think it'd be really hot to have their teacher (who in their mind is undoubtably that girl up above) hit on them. But, like, vice versa that would be totally gross and disgusting and wrong.

Etc.

― Allyzay Science Explosion (allyzay), Sunday, 5 September 2004 18:06 (twenty years ago)

Whay Layna and Ally said, with the addition of They Do Spell It Out In Teachers' School.

― Madchen (Madchen), Sunday, 5 September 2004 19:53 (twenty years ago)

hands up who's hit on your teacher in school....

― Catty (Catty), Sunday, 5 September 2004 20:16 (twenty years ago)

Ally's got a big fat fucking point.

what kind of teacher says this to a 13 year old girl?

― Harold Media (kenan), Monday, 6 September 2004 06:49 (twenty years ago)

how did the teacher get the boys mobile phone numbers in the first place?

― ken c (ken c), Monday, 6 September 2004 07:38 (twenty years ago)

The difference here being the ages of the pupils involved and the fact that this is a news article which has a certain amount of detachedness about it, while the other thread is a direct solicitation of advice. I'm sure if someone made a thread asking what to do about their 13-year-old nephew being complimented in such a way by their female PE teacher they'd react just as in that thread.

― Andrew (enneff), Monday, 6 September 2004 08:50 (twenty years ago)

except for all the winking comments hinting at how if "i was that 13 yr old lad, i'd quite enjoy it" hardy har har

― Vic (Vic), Monday, 6 September 2004 09:09 (twenty years ago)

my english teacher told me i had a nice smile when i was 14.. i guess i was rather flattered. (no sex invites, though.)

― ken c (ken c), Monday, 6 September 2004 09:55 (twenty years ago)

what bugs me about these situations is that they're so one-sided. how do we know that these students didn't say something just as lewd back to her? How do we know they didn't start it? Don't teachers, both male and female, have the right to work in a harassment-free environment? At 15 or 16, teenagers are old enough to know what they're doing, there's no exploitation in that.

― Catty (Catty), Monday, 6 September 2004 14:05 (twenty years ago)

you won't be able to tell from that story alone, obv.

I mean, i did immediately think of ways to try and get slightly pervy teachers sacked, like if you (as a 14 yr old pupil) can somehow find this teacher's number, and then text him/her anonymously saying "hey fancy some steamy hott sex?". And then, if they think it's a random person and reply "cor yeah how big's yer cock??", even sarcastically. you can go "HEY THAT TEACHER'S A PERV!!!!"

or even just when you see your teacher's phone unattended, pick it up, send a few txts and you're well away.

but anything like that would be pure speculation in this story, not that there's all that much information from the article to start with.

― ken c (ken c), Monday, 6 September 2004 14:15 (twenty years ago)

e.g. if the pupils did send things back/before, then it should be traceable?

― ken c (ken c), Monday, 6 September 2004 14:17 (twenty years ago)

Maybe. But there's a big difference between children having crushes on pop stars and pop stars having crushes on children (obv). It is just a straightforward abuse of power though, as well as just generally being a bad idea.

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Monday, 6 September 2004 14:18 (twenty years ago)

I'm just failing to understand what power here is being abused. the power over one's mobile phone to send a text message? since those kids reported the text messages and weren't coerced into anything they didn't want to do, she didn't actually have any power over them.

Her behaviour is straight-up unprofessional though and she clearly has no concept of what is acceptable behavior. I think I find her utter stupidity offensive more than what she did.

― Catty (Catty), Monday, 6 September 2004 16:56 (twenty years ago)

Yeah, probably. I guess the point is that we don't allow teachers to interact sexually, or attempt to do so, with their pupils for obvious reasons (coercion\threats, favouritism), and the fact that the children didn't respond was down to their good sense rather than her intentions. It may well be the case that some teachers and puils could have relationships without it haveing any undesired affect, but the risk of abuse is too great for us as a society to take that risk. So we forbid all such contact. Recieving sexual advances like that is no doubt very intimidating, especially as the person making the advances can mark your exams, discipline you etc. It's that disparity of power that makes the behaviour unacceptable to me.

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Monday, 6 September 2004 17:08 (twenty years ago)

-- Allyzay Science Explosion (allyza...), September 5th, 2004 3:06 PM. (allyzay) (later)

And like I said before I am a high schooler and I think it would be terrible and disgusting if any of my teachers hit on me, even the "hott onez"

― Curt1s St3ph3ns, Monday, 6 September 2004 17:18 (twenty years ago)

i'll be pisces-man then from now on.

second thoughts...

― piscesboy, Monday, 6 September 2004 17:36 (twenty years ago)

anyone read "Doing It" by Melvin Burgess (?) -- interesting subplot of pupil shagging teacher and desperately trying to get out of it.

― Catty (Catty), Monday, 6 September 2004 22:32 (twenty years ago)

It sounds more Melvyn than Burgess.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 6 September 2004 22:39 (twenty years ago)

That 'how big is your vagina?' question is a really bizarre one, aside from its creepiness when addressed to a pupil of yours.

What kind of things did bully girls yell at the less athletic girls in the locker room back in high school, anyway?

― Dan Perry '08 (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 7 September 2004 00:54 (twenty years ago)

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