No Doubt covers Talk Talk

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In a shocking development, the song chosen is not "Ascension Day!"

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 01:37 (twenty-two years ago)

does anyone else
feel their stomach hurt at this:
"it's a feel good song"?

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 01:43 (twenty-two years ago)

Reasons to hate No Doubt, number 11354134

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 01:43 (twenty-two years ago)

I have always hated No Doubt, because of Gwen's annoying Betty Boop voice and schtick. At least Talk Talk will get royalties?

― Nicolars (Nicole), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 01:49 (twenty-two years ago)

I don't hate No Doubt,
nor do I love them much. but
"it's a feel good song"?????????

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 02:01 (twenty-two years ago)

the best part of breaking up is folger's in your cup

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 02:09 (twenty-two years ago)

i can just imagine no doubt's version in my head. somehow it sounds vaguely similar to 'spiderwebs.'

this makes me sad.

― Grell (Grell), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 02:29 (twenty-two years ago)

No Doubt covers Talk Talk

Such a shame! ;-)

― Aaron Grossman (aajjgg), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 02:30 (twenty-two years ago)

being mediocre = far worse than being bad? (we can find pleasure in Lionel Ritchie but not No Doubt?)

― Dave M. (rotten03), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 02:32 (twenty-two years ago)

That's great news! Seriously. What it means is:
1) Royalties for Mark Hollis.
2) Which perhaps will allow him to be able to make another record...
3) Which means we all win, right?

― Jay Babcock (Jay Babcock), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:04 (twenty-two years ago)

gwen stefani is the most annoying person of the past 10 years.

― kerry getz (kgetz), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:09 (twenty-two years ago)

Mark's essentially retired from music at this point, and while I figure he might not mind the cash, he's got other things on his mind these days...

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:12 (twenty-two years ago)

A band I don't like is covering a song by a band I do like? Outrageous.

― David Allen, Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:15 (twenty-two years ago)

nobody wet their pants when Hole covered Young Marble Giants, what's the freakin difference?

― the surface noise (electricsound), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:15 (twenty-two years ago)

Uh, because Hole's a better band than No Doubt?

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:19 (twenty-two years ago)

they'd have an equal amount of haters though i'd have thought?

― the surface noise (electricsound), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:21 (twenty-two years ago)

Gwen has dressed to beam me up a Betty Crocker man-sized dinner. That smile and that dress smells like fresh cupcakes.

Ned, "Hella Good" alone has easily trumped Hole's entire career, minus one of their singles. Shush.

― donut bitch (donut), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:21 (twenty-two years ago)

DB, you are insane. THAT song especially. Fuck do I hate Rock Steady and every puling thing about it.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:29 (twenty-two years ago)

Thank you, donut bitch. For "Hello Good" alone, No Doubt have value..

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:30 (twenty-two years ago)

ARGH. I know we've had this argument before too. Bombs are not enough.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:32 (twenty-two years ago)

no doubt are great!

― gabbo giftington (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:33 (twenty-two years ago)

"Hella Good", obv.

x-post

see, Ned this is the difference between you and me. I can't believe all the crap you approve of, and yet you can't enjoy the fundamental ass-shaking groove of "Hella Good". I was at a club where Kenny Dixon, Jr. was DJing last year, and he threw "Hella Good" on in the middle of a set of mostly house stuff and the place went NUTS.

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:35 (twenty-two years ago)

Ned, i thought if you were going to have a turnaround on No Doubt, Rock Steady would be it... what is it about the record you find so repulsive? I mean, I can't stand any No Doubt before this one.

― donut bitch (donut), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:37 (twenty-two years ago)

Mr. Diamond, if you're going to play the stupid goddamn 'you hate fun' card, fuck off. I don't CARE what you felt, I don't CARE what that crowd felt, because I sure as hell don't happen to think that is fun in the goddamn slightest.

DB, it's the equivalent of a Mick Jagger or Santana record pulling in a bunch of people to associate with and somehow seem wonderful. And it fails just as badly.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:39 (twenty-two years ago)

Well, maybe missing the context is what makes me like "Hella Good" then, because i blissfully ignored any history of the band (i.e. the "Mick Jagger or Santana" context you brought up), and I'm just approaching this song and some other tracks from the album I heard as a fresh new band.

― donut bitch (donut), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:42 (twenty-two years ago)

as much as I don't want to see No Doubt cover Talk Talk....and trust me I don't...they don't even deserve to listen to talk talk let alone cover them...it has to be said, No Doubt are better than fucking Hole

― geeg, Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:42 (twenty-two years ago)

Maybe if they remixed Gwen's voice out of existence for a start I could consider all the songs anonymous fodder.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:43 (twenty-two years ago)

not the best placement of an expletive i've ever seen ;)

(xp)

― the surface noise (electricsound), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:43 (twenty-two years ago)

Woohoo, Rock Steady in-strum-mentals!

― donut bitch (donut), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:44 (twenty-two years ago)

(This is also the reason I kinda don't mind Blur's "Blur" or "13" that much. I just treated them like a brand new band, and ignored all my feelings about what a twunt Albarn is)

― donut bitch (donut), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:46 (twenty-two years ago)

I can see what you're trying to get at, but that's another bad example because even if that was Blur's first album I would still think it was anonymous indie rock crud. Which describes my feelings for that album somewhat politely. As for 13, I'm not going there.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:48 (twenty-two years ago)

How come most everybody seems to hate No Doubt? I love 'em (though to be fair I only really know that last album, but who cares, I love it! I can't get enough of it!)

― s1utsky (slutsky), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 03:58 (twenty-two years ago)

I don't CARE what you felt, I don't CARE what that crowd felt, because I sure as hell don't happen to think that is fun in the goddamn slightest

Ned, I can't really parse this sentence. What is the antecedent to "that"; my anecdote isn't fun? or the fundamental experience of being in a club? Anyway my comment really had nothing to do with "hating fun" at all (not sure where that even came from), but about personal aesthetics. I just think it's a good song because it's a wonderful groove with a good vocal hook to boot. The anecdote was offered to note how well the song translated from MTV to a room of often snobby house mavens. I'd rather dance to that than the Rapture or whatever the dance punk stuff the indie kids are into. And yeah, like DB, I honestly know nothing of the history of the band. I probably assumed they sucked before I ever heard them! So I'm not holding them up as amazing or anything, but allowing for the possibility of pure pop pleasure to hit me unexpectedly (that's how pop works, right). I couldn't name you a single other track of theirs. Well ok, wait, I also know that "Joy to the World" Xmas song they did. But that's it!

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 04:02 (twenty-two years ago)

I finally read what was right above what I first posted in this thread (I had sorta skimmed it, I admit) and now I feel like a guy who walks in on an intense family argument wearing a party hat and blowing one of those New Year's noisemakers.

― s1utsky (slutsky), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 04:06 (twenty-two years ago)

my joke is funny.

― Aaron Grossman (aajjgg), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 04:09 (twenty-two years ago)

I admit I was unclear (and somewhat annoyed), but 'that' referred to the song itself rather than being in a club, etc. I can't exactly be rapturous over something I don't like and expecting me to change my mind by telling me about a great time you had involving the song is a bit like me telling you about the 'crap' I apparently listen to and how I had a great time at a show or whatever and expecting you to suddenly say, "Wow, clearly I was wrong and now I will love all this stuff!" (I also admit that if you hadn't included that particular preface about what I do like I probably would have simply if slightly grouchily acknowledged your experience rather than going ballistic.)

The 'hating fun' meme in particular has been around the boards now for a year plus and is hateful bullshit because it assumes that there's only one standard for 'fun' or enjoyment or whatever. It's true you didn't specifically mention it but unfortunately your story slotted into that context and I saw red. Fun is where you find it in whatever situation and is ultimately an individual thing, and your story as described is like telling me you had a fun time seeing Rage Against the Machine at Lollapalooza 1993 or any number of other things I could name involving something I have a violent antipathy for -- I won't deny YOU had fun, but I couldn't imagine me being entertained (and having suffered through Rage twice live for my sins, that one in particular comes from the heart).

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 04:16 (twenty-two years ago)

And while I'm at it:

allowing for the possibility of pure pop pleasure to hit me unexpectedly

Always important to keep, I agree. I note in turn that it's also important to acknowledge the possibility of pure pop horror to hit you unexpectedly, as well as to have one's previous preconceptions reconfirmed rather than exploded. These are just as valid reactions to music (or whatever) and always have been.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 04:20 (twenty-two years ago)

No Doubt are great!

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 04:28 (twenty-two years ago)

Welcome to the O.C. bitch!

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 04:28 (twenty-two years ago)

Hey, I'm glad they finally moved out from OC, it's a blessing.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 04:55 (twenty-two years ago)

I got a very rude awakening to No Doubt's breed of 2nd-wave ska (seeing as Madness invented it) as a young college student in san diego (very close to the OC, too close some might say) when an album that I do not see in their AMG discography was played somewhat regularly by my dormmate. over the next 10 years i heard a few of their songs ("just a girl" for one) and when the band was attributed to the track it always reminded me of my dorky dormmate from the OC.

and then earlier this year, at a crowded club a friend's bday party was held at, i heard this song.... it sounded like a considerable improvement on madonna's "music"... i had no idea who sang it so i asked my date and she said "oh this is no doubt"... i smiled but was kinda disbelieving at first, but since dj-ing it at JasonD's wedding this summer and seeing all the kids absolutely loving it, i'm more than convinced that it's a great song (although i could do without like the "reelin' in the years"-feel of the chorus).

so to ned: SIT ON IT POTSY.

― gygax! (gygax!), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 05:03 (twenty-two years ago)

Ned how do you feel about Madonna's "Crazy for You" or the Yeah Yeah Yeah's "Pin"?

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 05:07 (twenty-two years ago)

Gygax, remind me again about how the reverse of the 'if your friends all jumped off a bridge, would you?' argument is equally valid. The whole damn world could love the song and I couldn't care less.

Cinni: love the former, haven't heard the latter.

As I am about to sleep, I will let Neil Tennant do part of my arguing for me (he's not talking about No Doubt specifically, I should note).

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 05:09 (twenty-two years ago)

< / alex in nyc>

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 05:20 (twenty-two years ago)

I want to join the chorus of No Doubt love.

I hated "Don't Speak," when it first came out (I fear I might have used "sellout"), but damn that's a great song.

― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 05:21 (twenty-two years ago)

Mm, Mr. Blount, don't think I haven't thought of the comparison already. Mind going beyond the obvious or is accepting the fact that JUST MAYBE one can have very specifically idiosyncratic tastes that hard?

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 05:22 (twenty-two years ago)

Ned, I honestly have no gripe with your tastes, I just wanted to say SIT ON IT POTSY.

Today is the greatest day I've ever known,
gygax!

― gygax! (gygax!), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 05:29 (twenty-two years ago)

I just wanted to say SIT ON IT POTSY

Heavens, you don't have to have any reason for that, say it whenever. :-)

Real last thought for the evening before sleep -- after the exchanges on the OutKast thread I would think it was (again) obvious that trying to achieve or assume consensus on something that we supposedly all like or should like (or dislike) here will never happen. Being surprised at that seems pretty darn pointless to me.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 05:38 (twenty-two years ago)

no, it's just that blind...wait for it...hate is never very interesting coming from anybody (and I'm hardly excusing myself from that). this thread also reminds me a bit too much of the michael & janet one where it's all alex going 'hate hate hate' and everyone chiming in 'how how how' - I mean that conversation should be three posts long tops but instead it's an entire thread. I mean I hated hated hated skacore, hated "spiderwebs" with a passion, but loved "don't speak" as a good madonna ballad (using madonna as a genre rather than an artist), at a time when "you must love me" was what the originator was offering up.

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 05:44 (twenty-two years ago)

x-post

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 05:46 (twenty-two years ago)

but is it that blind? not having heard the song but knowing some of No Doubt's music can give you at least *some* insight into the possibility that you might like the track or not..

― the surface noise (electricsound), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 05:52 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah, maybe erase 'blind', though maybe don't cuz it's not like he's saying 'I hate hate hate "Spiderwebs"'(or "Ex-Girlfriend" or "Hey Baby" etc), he's saying 'I hate hate hate No Doubt' and pretty much making it clear that it's unwavering (the key - I hate hate hate a few acts also - Conor Oberst, Don Henley, the Eagles - but even with these acts I like one song - "A Perfect Sonnet", "The Boys of Summer", two or three Eagles songs (!!!) - so I haven't let my 'hatred' (which is more groan than bile) clog my ears or rule out any possibilities (and to make it clear I'm not accusing Ned of this exactly). Listen to the song not the singer, blah blah blah.

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 06:15 (twenty-two years ago)

and people hate hate hating a certain act is probably better than the flipside fanboy devotees types who are more likely to go missionary on you and feel the need to convert you to their taste. mind you a person who tries to convince someone they shouldn't enjoy a certain piece of music is incredibly worse than a person who tries to convince someone to enjoy a piece of music but the former aren't nearly as common as the latter (although the latter usually are partly the former)(eg. conversation I overheard at the library, sorority girl on the phone to her friend: 'you need to stop listening to the beat (atl top 40 station - great great great with a big sweettooth for freaknasty/ghosttown dj's/inoj/kp & envyi) and open your mind to some real music (= jimmy buffett in this case)')(my whole problem with corny indie fuxx is the notion that listening to this kind of music makes you better/cooler/smarter than people who listen to that kind of music, it disgusts me when I encounter it in hip-hop fans towards indie, or whatever towards whatever, but it's such a common attitude amongst indie fans (and undie and alt-country) that my guard gets raised (fwiw I find the mainstream rejoinder 'you only listen to indie cuz you're trying to be cool' as lame as 'you only listen to pop cuz you're trying to be populist/ironic'). anyhow, blah blah, redundancies ahoy, I am tired and incoherent and off to bed.

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 06:39 (twenty-two years ago)

Blount, re yr anecdote above - substitute 'technoheads' for 'parrotheads' and you'll know why I found London such a FUCKING ORDEAL in the latter half of the 90s

― dave q, Wednesday, 17 September 2003 08:58 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah, this is better than talk talk covering no doubt though surely?

― geeta, Wednesday, 17 September 2003 09:17 (twenty-two years ago)

I don't really have any feelings about No Doubt one way or the other, but the concept of "It's My Life" being a 'feel good' songs is rather puzzling.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 13:21 (twenty-two years ago)

it makes me feel good to know the song was written. ;-)

― Aaron Grossman (aajjgg), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 13:43 (twenty-two years ago)

"Mark's essentially retired from music at this point, and while I figure he might not mind the cash, he's got other things on his mind these days..."

I know he's said stuff like that, but... I always thought that had more to do with his not really having a place in the 'industry," although i guess it could be down to probably personal stuff that none of us (or at least not me) knows. Maybe the extra cash will enable him to un-retire at some point... Weird cash like this can be like a grant for an out-there artist. Think of No Doubt as patrons to the arts. There, that's better, isn't it?

― Jay Babcock (Jay Babcock), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 16:53 (twenty-two years ago)

man you ARE all corny!

― gabbo giftington (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 17:06 (twenty-two years ago)

haha!

(at least, thankfully, there are no links to writing this time)

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 17:09 (twenty-two years ago)

in any event, i can't wait to hear this.

― gabbo giftington (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 17 September 2003 17:12 (twenty-two years ago)

My reaction is that No Doubt won't capture the emotion of the song that Talk Talk performed with colours of isolation and frustration... which, although human, are things a bubblegum band have never, ever done with any legitimacy other than pure cringeworthyness. How many shitty covers of How Soon Is Now do there have to be before the lesson is learned? If Cat Power wants to try to add to a song by slowing it down and adding angst, that's one thing. But intentionally robbing a song of its angst is criminal.

― Michael G, Friday, 19 September 2003 02:11 (twenty-two years ago)

some might say adding angst ain't great either

― the surface noise (electricsound), Friday, 19 September 2003 02:13 (twenty-two years ago)

michael g what's so great about angst?

― minna (minna), Friday, 19 September 2003 02:24 (twenty-two years ago)

Having just played the song about 5 ties in a row, I'd say that people are definitely projecting a vast amount of personal angst onto this song. I mean, it's kind of melancholy but waving the angst and isolation flag over a song that sounds like bouncy synth-pop implies to me that you're making an association that isn't implicit within the song itself.

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Friday, 19 September 2003 12:30 (twenty-two years ago)

dan I thought this song
was sad glad ambiguous
back in my high school

that was way before
I understood how to make
angsty projections

music: "bouncy," sure,
but listen to the dude's voice--
how is that not angst?

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Friday, 19 September 2003 13:49 (twenty-two years ago)

Is there a Talk Talk song where he doesn't sing like that?

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Friday, 19 September 2003 14:00 (twenty-two years ago)

haha - for a sec I thought I had clicked on the "hey ya" thread and was all "HOW is that angsty?"

― cinniblount (James Blount), Friday, 19 September 2003 18:15 (twenty-two years ago)

I liked their first album. They were like Fishbone-meets-Ranma 1/2 playing concerts at the mall back then.

― nickalicious (nickalicious), Friday, 19 September 2003 18:57 (twenty-two years ago)

68 messages about a recording that no one has heard. Funny.

― flightsatdusk (flightsatdusk), Friday, 19 September 2003 19:38 (twenty-two years ago)

Some of the messages are about the original though. Which people have heard.

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Friday, 19 September 2003 19:40 (twenty-two years ago)

Yeah, but that makes it a lot less funny. What's more important: humor or accuracy?

― flightsatdusk (flightsatdusk), Friday, 19 September 2003 20:02 (twenty-two years ago)

First off, Hole are fucking ABYSMAL. And second, anything that gets people to hear the almighty godlike genius that is Talk Talk is OK by me.

he's got other things on his mind these days

Like what? The hell does he DO nowadays?

Royalties for Mark Hollis

Have you forgotten that "Talk Talk" was used in a cingular wireless TV commercial a few months ago? Fucking sellout! :-)

― Mr. Snrub, Friday, 19 September 2003 20:37 (twenty-two years ago)

Like what? The hell does he DO nowadays?

By all accounts, he has turned his attention very specifically towards contemplation and Christian mysticism. What he might do for a day to day living I don't know -- given how often EMI rerelease his material maybe he just lives quietly and comfortably. A couple of years back I was talking with Robert Rich, also a big fan, and he was noting that philosophical element as it could be seen in his later lyrics was thoroughly clear.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 19 September 2003 20:46 (twenty-two years ago)

if jeff mangum can afford that kind of existence I have no doubt mark hollis can

― cinniblount (James Blount), Friday, 19 September 2003 21:02 (twenty-two years ago)

contemplation and Christian mysticism.

Shhhhhhhh.....Ned, my friend, please don't ruin their music for me. Let's just chalk it up that he went insane and no longer records. If we could posibly leave the Church out of this, I think we'd all be better off.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Friday, 19 September 2003 21:03 (twenty-two years ago)

I don't really think you can. There's such a strong religious element running through the last two Talk Talk albums and his solo album that ignoring it is nigh on impossible.

― Ricardo (RickyT), Friday, 19 September 2003 21:53 (twenty-two years ago)

Yeah really. "Ascension Day"? "I Believe in You"? WHo do you think he's believing in there, Alex? It ain't his girlfriend...

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Friday, 19 September 2003 23:15 (twenty-two years ago)

Nah, I know, I know....I'm not in complete denial about it, but there's a difference between expressing your spiritual convictions and putting your life/career/art on hold in order to concentrate on them.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Saturday, 20 September 2003 01:32 (twenty-two years ago)

Maybe he doesn't consider it putting his life on hold!

― s1utsky (slutsky), Saturday, 20 September 2003 16:29 (twenty-two years ago)

Did anyone else notice that the picture in the MTV report is the worst picture of Gwen Stefani EVAH?!

― Andrew Frye (paul cox), Saturday, 20 September 2003 20:23 (twenty-two years ago)

five months pass...

This is a great song, it's good they covered it. Now young kids can enjoy it!

― Alice Keymer, Tuesday, 2 March 2004 19:28 (twenty-one years ago)

Last night I heard the tail end of the damn thing while having dinner. My feelings as detailed above remain unchanged.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 2 March 2004 19:45 (twenty-one years ago)

Geeta's comment OTM.

― Matos W.K. (M Matos), Tuesday, 2 March 2004 19:54 (twenty-one years ago)

I finally heard it about a week ago. It's not horrible, but it is completely unnecessary.

I'm no fan of No Doubt, but I saw a video for one of their songs last weekend - something about a wedding. Gwen had pink hair. I'm sure you know the one. Anyway, I thought it was a bit of alright as far as pop songs go these days.

― dave225 (Dave225), Tuesday, 2 March 2004 20:26 (twenty-one years ago)

five years pass...

Just heard the comeback single that coincides with their summer tour/appearance on Gossip Girl. Once again they're covering a song, and this time it's Adam & The Ants' "Stand and Deliver."

I don't have any real attachment to the original, other than familiarity. I sez it's not a bad cover, but I'm sure peoples gonna hate.

― Johnny Fever, Wednesday, 8 April 2009 09:42 (sixteen years ago)

Now I can imagine our Alice having issues with this!

― Mark G, Wednesday, 8 April 2009 09:46 (sixteen years ago)

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