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What's the difference between a successful rock critic and a failed one?

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prompted by this --

punchlines, please!!

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:23 (twenty-one years ago)

tracer you're above this.

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:25 (twenty-one years ago)

but i suppose the responses it will engender will be punishment enough.

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:25 (twenty-one years ago)

an editor

― cinniblount (James Blount), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:25 (twenty-one years ago)

any editor?

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:26 (twenty-one years ago)

one who isn't capable of offering their critique of rock I guess.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:27 (twenty-one years ago)

Technotronic

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:28 (twenty-one years ago)

Negro talk

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:28 (twenty-one years ago)

A knitted uterus

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:28 (twenty-one years ago)

when come back bring pie

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:29 (twenty-one years ago)

rock is back, brought pie

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:29 (twenty-one years ago)

Blount is so so very OTM.

― Keith Harris (kharris1128), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:29 (twenty-one years ago)

ANY editor??

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:30 (twenty-one years ago)

nearly every daily paper in the country to thread.

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:30 (twenty-one years ago)

the stranger to thread.

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:30 (twenty-one years ago)

most glossies, weeklies, zines, and webzines to thread.

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:31 (twenty-one years ago)

"When I read the editorial bit at the start of Careless Talk Costs Lives, all I can think is... "you need an editor""

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:32 (twenty-one years ago)

By "an editor" I of course mean "me," tee hee.

OK, change my answer to "a good editor." That better?

― Keith Harris (kharris1128), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:33 (twenty-one years ago)

yes.

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:34 (twenty-one years ago)

do you still mean "you"?

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:35 (twenty-one years ago)

(kidding, kidding)

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:35 (twenty-one years ago)

Keith Harris

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:36 (twenty-one years ago)

And Orville.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:36 (twenty-one years ago)

keith is a ballbuster.

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:37 (twenty-one years ago)

he gets the job done, however.

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:38 (twenty-one years ago)

But there are plenty of successful hacks out there, so the best answer is, sadly enough, "Shameless persistence and a willingness to say anything that you're asked to about any music that's passed your way."

― Keith Harris (kharris1128), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:41 (twenty-one years ago)

i've said it before and i'll say it again: if you're going to sell out, pick another field. worst move ever.

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:42 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, selling out cheap is never pretty. If you're gonna write ad copy, then dammit, get paid for it.

― Keith Harris (kharris1128), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:44 (twenty-one years ago)

I rarely put myself in a position to review shit I don't like, but I still get the willies at the prospect of being a shillomatic CD-sticker-blurb drone who likes everything.

― nate detritus (natedetritus), Saturday, 15 November 2003 19:48 (twenty-one years ago)

Health insurance.

― Nom De Plume (Nom De Plume), Saturday, 15 November 2003 20:00 (twenty-one years ago)

Baboon Dooley to thread.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 15 November 2003 20:01 (twenty-one years ago)

tsk...I do wish they'd used the word "aspiring" rather than "failed."

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 15 November 2003 20:02 (twenty-one years ago)

but think of all the idiots who will be scared off of the site by the idea of a swarm of failed rock critics, anthony. geez, that sentence is tortured. no wonder i'm a failed rock critic.
failed rock critics probably end up writing ad copy so i guess the difference is the failed ones make a lot more money.

― scott seward, Saturday, 15 November 2003 20:09 (twenty-one years ago)

Is Hip-Hop the only popular music with the best music also the most popular music?


i think it was a typo. they just meant failed thread titles.

― scott seward, Saturday, 15 November 2003 20:12 (twenty-one years ago)

(x-post)

good point, Scott (though since I'm nu-ILX - I think - I can't get too snippy about the fresh-faced upstarts who would flock to a board for "aspiring" critics).

I still stand by the statement that if you can critique rock you haven't failed. Though saying that makes me feel like Robert Fulghum.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 15 November 2003 20:14 (twenty-one years ago)

Everything I ever needed to know I learned from The Stooges.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Saturday, 15 November 2003 20:17 (twenty-one years ago)

i'm pretty sure that 99 percent of the people who would be attracted to a place like ilm will find it sooner or later. i don't know of a more entertaining crit-friendly place out there, but i probably stopped looking.

― scott seward, Saturday, 15 November 2003 20:19 (twenty-one years ago)

Everything I ever needed to know I learned from The Stooges.

Lesson #1: Anytime I want I got a right to move, no matter what they say.

― nate detritus (natedetritus), Saturday, 15 November 2003 20:36 (twenty-one years ago)

Lesson #2: I'm dirt, and I don't care.

Lesson #3: I'll stick it deep inside, cuz I'm loose.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 15 November 2003 20:40 (twenty-one years ago)

uh...

"What's the difference between a successful rock critic and a failed one?"

one has a wife that works.

― BurmaKitty (BurmaKitty), Saturday, 15 November 2003 20:42 (twenty-one years ago)

Rimshot for BurmaKitty!

― Nom De Plume (Nom De Plume), Saturday, 15 November 2003 21:02 (twenty-one years ago)

Burma, which is which?

― HuckleberryMann, Saturday, 15 November 2003 21:04 (twenty-one years ago)

Horace are you serious??

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Saturday, 15 November 2003 21:13 (twenty-one years ago)

Perhaps "failed" ones write obsessive shite for zilch. Said obsessive shite is, more often than not, concerned solely with the projected ego of "failed" writer in question. Think Momus and most blog operators. "Successful" ones demand payment, although they may or may not keep blogs and useless websites out of noblese oblige, as if the world will bow down to their self-deluded "superior" insight. Think Simon Reynolds.

The actual quality level of "successful writer" writing is really no better than that of the "failed" ones. Posh rock writers spivs receive payment via a series of music industry hijinks: giving blowjobs to British , music weekly editors, rolling the tokes at the Wire editorial office, giving blowjobs to Derek Bailey's publicist, administering warm enemas to Mark Sinker, accepting pissant payola from junior-level record industry grifters, and so forth.

On a related note, the slogan of Andrew Loog Oldham's Immediate label happened to be "happy to be part of the industry of human happiness". Oh, the humanity!

― Greil Marcus, Saturday, 15 November 2003 21:35 (twenty-one years ago)

*wipes eyes, drops jaw*

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 15 November 2003 21:38 (twenty-one years ago)

derek bailey has a publicist?

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Saturday, 15 November 2003 21:39 (twenty-one years ago)

if you're not really Greil Marcus I hate you. hate you hate you hate you.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 15 November 2003 21:40 (twenty-one years ago)

Don't worry I'm doing

EVERYTHING

I can to

DISCOURAGE

AsiaKitty from being a rock journalist.

Hey, AsiaKitty!

PUT DOWN THE THESAURUS

AND SLOWLY STEP AWAY

― BurmaKitty (BurmaKitty), Saturday, 15 November 2003 21:40 (twenty-one years ago)

a tasty one, according to the Wire staff and sundry contributors.

not sure if he's circumcised or not.

― Jann Wenner, Saturday, 15 November 2003 21:42 (twenty-one years ago)

tht's not GM. bt if only it was.

tht is GM. i wish it wasn't.

tht could be GM. he cd say more postive things.

thr's no way tht's GM. he'd be better thn tht.

― x. y. z. (Cozen), Saturday, 15 November 2003 21:43 (twenty-one years ago)

Skipping 13 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.
(you were throwing cups on the floor after using them ("i've rented this place from a good friend") and wr really welcoming to my dad (and then to me: "OHHHHH! CO-ZEN!...") it ws really weird.)

― athos magnani (Cozen), Saturday, 15 November 2003 21:54 (twenty-one years ago)

My landlady must know about your dream because she said I couldn't use any of her wine glasses. I'm gonna move to Brixton I think. She's making me feel like a prisoner here. hmmm the place in brixton i will be "renting from a friend!!" NEENY NEENER NEENY NEENER

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Saturday, 15 November 2003 21:59 (twenty-one years ago)

Seward, I stand by my '"successful writer" writing' sentence.

Swot.

― Greil M., Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:01 (twenty-one years ago)

And um, Greil Marcus isn't British!

― Keith Harris (kharris1128), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:02 (twenty-one years ago)

Suddenly that sentence looks a lot better with you standing next to it, "Greil"!

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:07 (twenty-one years ago)

Haha thanks to the focus of Ranters & Crowd Pleasers I totally thought Greil was a Brit too til a year ago!

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:08 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm an American Studies patriot with irritatingly cultivated patina of "cosmopolitan" grad student shuck and jive. Or maybe that's just my Hebrew heritage at work?

(Seriosuly, though, I semi-stole (paraphrased, anyway) '"succesful writer" writing' from Richard Meltzer, so go tell it to HIM.)

― Greil M, Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:12 (twenty-one years ago)

Suddenly that guardian dude is looking like nostradamus.

― scott seward, Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:13 (twenty-one years ago)

who is GM when he's not GM cs he's alright, cd be better but alright

― athos magnani (Cozen), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:13 (twenty-one years ago)

Perhaps "failed" ones write obsessive shite for zilch. Said obsessive shite is, more often than not, concerned solely with the projected ego of "failed" writer in question. Think Momus and most blog operators

I'm not a good example of writing obsessive shite for zilch, since I charge 50c a word and get it. This month alone my 'failed projected ego' has earned me about $1500, Greil. It must be of use to someone, somewhere.

― Momus (Momus), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:26 (twenty-one years ago)

and get it

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:29 (twenty-one years ago)

All the girls love a successful rock critic!

― Momus (Momus), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:30 (twenty-one years ago)

$1500! wow momus, you could apply for food stamps!

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:32 (twenty-one years ago)

surely the only difference worth bragging abt is the no of free CDs you get thought the post ;)

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:33 (twenty-one years ago)

It's not my only source of income, naturellement. There's Mummy music.

Are you back from 'the real world' now, Fiddo, or posting from an internet cafe on the way to your interview?

― Momus (Momus), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:35 (twenty-one years ago)

momus i have some magic beans here you may be interested in. only .50 a bean.

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:35 (twenty-one years ago)

hey, anyone who can afford a sweet little igloo like the one momus has is doing alright.(i gotta get one of those things)

― scott seward, Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:36 (twenty-one years ago)

Magic beans! Yum!

Best keep them to throw at squirrels, though.

― Momus (Momus), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:36 (twenty-one years ago)

squirrels dont eat beans, you big silly.

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:37 (twenty-one years ago)

The ones who write rock reviews have no other choice.

― Momus (Momus), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:38 (twenty-one years ago)

you're not earning your .50 today.

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:39 (twenty-one years ago)

Anyway, we shouldn't be squabbling like this. Greil Marcus is amongst us!

― Momus (Momus), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:41 (twenty-one years ago)

And he reads my blog and hates me!

― Momus (Momus), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:42 (twenty-one years ago)

i'm not familiar.

― fiddo centington (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:42 (twenty-one years ago)

I make a BUCK a word yo. And with an average of 100 words a month I always get extra cheese on MY pizza.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:42 (twenty-one years ago)

greil marcus makes my head hurt. um, the real one, that is.

― scott seward, Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:44 (twenty-one years ago)

A dollar a word is what they're getting up the road at Vogue. Let's piss through the letterbox.

― Momus (Momus), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:44 (twenty-one years ago)

This tomorrow's-headline-telegram just in!

REUTERS - PSEUD-GREIL MARCUS GOBSMACKED BY NEWLY "SUCCESSFUL" RENAISSANCE SCOTSMAN. STOP.

Now do "successful" writers post at ILM? I guess so! Now the way I see it, Momus, you just posted 74 words. That is - at 50c per word, if you are to be believed (RE: your going rate), you just *got* $37 for your post. But since 33 of those words were merely a quotation from my post, you owe me $16.50. Maybe even more, 'cause you also (doubly) quote "failed projected ego" in the body of your authored text. Do redundant quotations pay twice or not? If yes, you owe me $18.00.

Contrary to Tracer Hand's own projection, I have no desire to be part of the hype machine. But I wouldn't mind getting my fair share of what's rightfully owed to me.

"Successful writer" writing = plagiarism! (And keeping the profits!)
NOW you can write your successful writer writing writer's guidebook, Seward.

― Greil M, Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:45 (twenty-one years ago)

Like all guilty businessmen, I do charity work too, Greil.

Liked your book 'Lipstick Traces' by the way!

― Momus (Momus), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:46 (twenty-one years ago)

hey greil I liked yr punk book but you were wrong abt the Clash. they suck.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:47 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.denverpost.com/Stories/0,1413,36~78~1768127,00.html

nf

― notfazed (notfazed), Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:57 (twenty-one years ago)

You're going to hold it against Greil Marcus just because he wrote that the Clash's "Complete Control", some Adverts record (I forget which, and who cares) and some silly X-Ray Spex single "can still sound like the greatest thing you ever heard"?

[And to think he probably got more than $1500 for that.]

Well I don't blame you, Julio!

Shit! I don't wanna be GM anymore.

― Greil M - the last time, Saturday, 15 November 2003 22:59 (twenty-one years ago)

Hey, don't knock X Ray Spex, Greil you turncoat!

― Momus (Momus), Saturday, 15 November 2003 23:02 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, lord knows a lot of us probably identify with Oh Bondage! Up Yours!' Or, more accurately, its b-side.

― nate detritus (natedetritus), Saturday, 15 November 2003 23:05 (twenty-one years ago)

Greil was totally right about "Complete Control"

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 15 November 2003 23:05 (twenty-one years ago)

YER MY GUITAR HERO!

Meaning ... Mick Jones??

Don't get me wrong. I mean, it sounds like the greatest thing I've ever heard and all. Lord knows why.

Momus, didn't you say you were giving up music in favor of writing as full time occupation? And while I'm at it, just how in the hell does Lawrence of Felt-fame make a living? (Don't say "Cherry Red" residual cheques, 'cause I don't believe a word of THAT.)

― Joe Strummer, Saturday, 15 November 2003 23:09 (twenty-one years ago)

I never said that, Joe. I am currently making my best album, the first of my Berlin Trilogy. I live on publishing from my Japhits, and commercials and film soundtracks and live shows. Come play guitar with me at the Strange Fruit Festival, that should raise some hair!

Lawrence signs on.

― Momus (Momus), Saturday, 15 November 2003 23:13 (twenty-one years ago)

Here are some X-Ray Spex lyrics:

From 'I Am A Poseur':

My facade is just a fake
Shock horror no escape
Sensationalism for the feed
Caricatures are what you breed

Anti-art was the start
Establishments like a laugh
Yes we're very entertaining
Overtones can be betraying

From 'Identity':

IDENTITY IS THE CRISIS CAN'T YOU SEE
IDENTITY IDENTITY

WHEN YOU LOOK IN THE MIRROR
DO YOU SEE YOURSELF
DO YOU SEE YOURSELF
ON THE T.V. SCREEN
DO YOU SEE YOURSELF IN THE MAGAZINE
WHEN YOU SEE YOURSELF
DOES IT MAKE YOU SCREAM?

― Momus (Momus), Saturday, 15 November 2003 23:39 (twenty-one years ago)

Maybe I Should entertain
The very fact that I'm insane
I wasn't fooling when I said
All the people I like are those that are dead
I've been around this town and I've seen what god has done
I've been around and it's no fun
I've been a two-timer/tearaway god has told me so
But I don't believe in him you know
Don't make me a martyr for our causes
'Cause I don't believe a word that you said
All the people I like are those are dead
Maybe I shoud take a gun
And put it to the head of everyone
All the people I like are in the ground
It's better to be lost than to be found
I should listen hard to the voices from within
They are telling me that I'll never win
I should save myself I shoud save myself from sin
But I wouldn't know where to begin
You are trying to tell me what you believe in
But I ain't got a clue what you are talking about
It's better to be a man than to be a mouse
All the people I like are those that are dead
All the people I like are those that are dead
All the people I like are those that are dead
All the people I like are those that are dead
I've been around this town and I've seen what God has done
I've been around and it's no fun
I've been a two-timer/tearaway god has told me so
But I don't believe in him you know
Don't make me a martyr for our causes
'Cause I don't believe a word that you said
All the people I like are those that are
All the people I like are those that are
All the people I like are those that are dead.

― scott seward, Sunday, 16 November 2003 00:06 (twenty-one years ago)


THE QUEEN MUM SHE IS GREAT – THE QUEEN MUM SHE IS TOP -
& NOW SHE’S OUT OF HOSPITAL SHE’S THE QUEEN OF THE OLD
HIP OP – IT JUST AIN’T FAIR A LADY OF SUCH GRACE SHOULD
END UP WITH A PLASTIC HIP – SHE’S SEEN IT ALL FROM THE
FIRST WORLD WAR TO THE SINKING OF THE TITANIC SHIP -
THE QUEEN MUM SHE IS GREAT – THE QUEEN MUM SHE IS TOP -
& NOW SHE’S OUT OF HOSPITAL SHE’S THE QUEEN OF THE OLD
HIP OP – THE TIME WILL COME WHEN THE QUEEN MUM’S GONE –
BUT WHO KNOWS WHEN THAT’LL BE – AT LEAST I’LL HAVE A
FRONT SEAT AT THE MAKING OF HISTORY - THE QUEEN MUM
SHE IS GREAT – THE QUEEN MUM SHE IS TOP - & NOW SHE’S
OUT OF HOSPITAL SHE’S THE QUEEN OF THE OLD HIP OP - &
NOW SHE’S OUT OF HOSPITAL SHE’S THE QUEEN OF THE OLD
HIP OP - AH SHE’S THE QUEEN OF THE OLD HIP OP – YEAH!
SHE’S THE QUEEN OF THE OLD HIP OP – CRASH AT THE END
DENOTES GOLF BUGGY COLLISION DURING PROVINCIAL
WALKABOUT

― scott seward, Sunday, 16 November 2003 00:08 (twenty-one years ago)

- Momus.

― athos magnani (Cozen), Sunday, 16 November 2003 00:10 (twenty-one years ago)

Poor Lawrence would have been a major pop star if Diana hadn't died a few days before his 'Summer Smash' single was due to be released. And then of course the Queen Mum died just days before 'Queen Mum Hip Op' was due out, ruining its chances of romping home to the top spot. Some guys have all the luck.

― Momus (Momus), Sunday, 16 November 2003 00:12 (twenty-one years ago)

Summer Smash

― Momus (Momus), Sunday, 16 November 2003 00:38 (twenty-one years ago)

It's tragic that Lawrence fell from the genius grace of Felt to no-mark, 3rd rate Momus-like crapola, ala GoKart Mozart.

If this is all that he can offer, he ought to pack it in, keep signing on and bury the dream of stardom (at any rate, an infantile dream at his advanced age) once and for all.

Dead princess or not, I seriously doubt he would've been a popstar.

― Maurice Deebank, Sunday, 16 November 2003 01:03 (twenty-one years ago)

(Hey! Can we start a write-in campaign to get Frank Kogan appointed to that Denver Post position Not Fazed linked to?)

― Jerry the Nipper (Jerrynipper), Sunday, 16 November 2003 01:05 (twenty-one years ago)

What do you mean, 'Momus-like crapola?' Go-Kart Mozart is great! Oh, wait...

― Momus (Momus), Sunday, 16 November 2003 04:06 (twenty-one years ago)

yes, any editor

― cinniblount (James Blount), Sunday, 16 November 2003 06:32 (twenty-one years ago)

Ah, but, see, erm, well, well, we don't do this for the money.

Because we can't.

I prefer thinking of myself as a failed rock journalist rather than a successful skate shop sales assistant.

― Jim Robinson (Original Miscreant), Monday, 17 November 2003 01:18 (twenty-one years ago)

A failed rock critic doesn't agree with other critics. For instance, a failed critic loves hip-hop and Justin Timberlake while a successful one is into "the canon" :-)

― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Monday, 17 November 2003 01:28 (twenty-one years ago)

three months pass...
Oh my God. I'd never heard 'Summer Smash' before clicking Momus' link up there. I have to say, it's a bit of a let down. Maybe I picked the wrong season to suddenly find it.

It is great, but it sounds like Dweeb, for pity's sake.

― James Mitchell (James Mitchell), Sunday, 22 February 2004 01:22 (twenty-one years ago)


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