mississippi screwed and chopped vs. corny ilm fuxx

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alright, checking the pazz+jop ballots coyote patrin-style of people who voted for mississippi s+c... why do corny ilm fuxx like that shit so much?? it was a good business move to shift a couple thousand more units to a smallish group of screw fans-- or, invention of a bold new artform, slowing down music to appeal to black drug addicts and bark psychosis fans. (check for all pre-d banner references to screw on ilm. it's all "oh, i heard he died of a syrup overdose and the music is slow and i once heard an eminem song that was slow and it was totally fucked up.") (it's been around for ten years, several nationwide major label screw albums have been released. knock off the faux-naif shit.)

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:00 (twenty-two years ago)

all ilm criticism (i mean, americans and shit, not the english livejournal/dr. who thing ["Responding to William Wiggins' points re: Hawkwind, Kelis, Mary Tamm as the first incarnation of Romana, Jack Straw, Wiley, and grime's Zone of Fruitless Intensification, I would just like to say, you've got to be taking the piss, mate!"]. even though the only differences seem to be that americans are more likely to claim some kind of emotional connection to rap [see: unassuming white guys explaining to me why kung fu movies are more hip-hop than barbershop.], make fewer dr. who references, and can usually cloak their racism pretty well, rather than flat out saying that they hate black people with big lips and such) involving rap records starts with:

manufacturing some kind of ilm rockist credibility, why it isn't just pop music but something to take really seriously. ie. he invented screw music and he even trumpets his obscurity (he's from the state yall don't scream on yalls records) and his reform-minded liberalism matches our own (or: all the reasons why dizzee rascal is the aesop rock it's okay to like). and then comparing them to 20 year old punk records and mentioning that they sample gary numan, which is the best way to write about music. everything else is just treated as a questionable novelty.

new question: why does ilm (and all of you failed hipster music writers composing your latest village voice pitch in the other browser window) suck so bad at writing about anything other than cure boxsets, pitchfork music, and their stable of acceptable rappers?

and if you want to answer: don't forget to tell me how many rap records you have, how long you've been listening to rap, and how many black friends you have. or you can try the "i just like skrewdriver better than hip-hop. don't ask me why. i just do, okay. its a taste thing" thing, if you want.

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:00 (twenty-two years ago)

I only care about disco, so leave me out of this.

― Matos W.K. (M Matos), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:02 (twenty-two years ago)

dk for fucks sake the kogan piece on banner was grand.

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:05 (twenty-two years ago)

unassuming white guys explaining to me why kung fu movies are more
hip-hop than barbershop.]

there is nothing unassuming about me. you shouldn't assume that i am.

― scott seward (scott seward), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:07 (twenty-two years ago)

is this going to turn into a 'splitting the vote' conspiracy like blaming people who voted for Nader for Bush being prez?

d k, can you answer your own questions in your last paragraph first? especially the 2nd one?

― Al (sitcom), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:08 (twenty-two years ago)

on the other hand there IS an urge to make "screw" some sort of deep thing that i don't think it is, but that's more an urge than a trend coz nobody's come up with an even mildly convincing way to do so that's caught on.

also a few p&j voters chose *both* -- i chose the orig. mainly coz i figured it would get more votes and also because i liked the fast stuff staying fast.

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:13 (twenty-two years ago)

poor hip hop -- it's so unloved and unrecognized.

― jack cole (jackcole), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:14 (twenty-two years ago)

several
forever
a few

have you checked out the baltimore breakbeat thread? it's pretty tough to say anything interesting about chopped music.

― vahid (vahid), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:17 (twenty-two years ago)

actually someone on this thread wrote a really nice piece on it (baltimore club) if memory serves. though as i recall it was mostly an extended attempt to capture the sound sort of onomatapeically.

― vahid (vahid), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:20 (twenty-two years ago)

i don't know how to answer, Al. because they're in love with their race and class. because they're still ripping off old, racist-ass creem writers (or whoever they're ripping off). because "love of bling killed hip-hop. like, six years ago." because onyx did it better ten years ago. because "white audiences tend to buy a combination of various musical styles, while there are very few African American buyers more into song-oriented music than groove-oriented music." because there are too many rappers with "oversized lips."

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:25 (twenty-two years ago)

So wait. It's bad to like hip-hop and it's bad to not like hip-hop?

― Phil Freeman (Phil Freeman), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:28 (twenty-two years ago)

Where did this "oversized lips" thing come from? None of the Dr.Who-loving blogs I read has said anything like that, I'm sure!

I like screwed music because it's pop music, DK. That's also why I wasn't listening to it six months ago and probably won't be in another twelve months. I've not heard the s/c Banner though.

― Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:30 (twenty-two years ago)

I like it because it sounds cool. I listen to other stuff too. Some of the music I like isn't hip-hop, and some of it is. I didn't know a lot about S&C before Banner's record brought it to the foreground, or rather my foreground. Now I know more. I won't be trying to cite the most obscure stuff just to sound cooler than anyone else, but I voted for Banner's record because it was one of the ten best I heard in 2003.

I'm not sure why you are trying so hard to piss people off.

― Begs2Differ (Begs2Differ), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:35 (twenty-two years ago)

it's okay, you're english. i can't say one way or the other what you should be listening to.

and we aren't talking about screw music anymore, guys.

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:36 (twenty-two years ago)

so ilm = geir?

― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:37 (twenty-two years ago)

(he's not english)

(x-post)

― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:38 (twenty-two years ago)

(he might have been talking to tom)

― Begs2Differ (Begs2Differ), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:39 (twenty-two years ago)

(but if he was talking to me that's different. I've been listening to rap music since 1980. Why the hell would that matter anyway. Etc. Damn.)

― Begs2Differ (Begs2Differ), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:41 (twenty-two years ago)

geir likes pac! and he's capable of explaining his likes and dislikes.

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:41 (twenty-two years ago)

without referencing 20 year old punk records, even.

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:42 (twenty-two years ago)

(oh)

So wait, you're criticizing people for liking something you like, for not being aware of it before it broke?

― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:44 (twenty-two years ago)

no. is this aja??

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:45 (twenty-two years ago)

Okay, fuck it. I'm not a music writer and I didn't really check out the pazz & jop stuff anyway, so I'll leave the criticism of the critics alone. If the ILM/Voice etc. crowd isn't doing it though, is there anyone who is doing good writing about that scene?

― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:50 (twenty-two years ago)

You're irritating and hopeless. I don't feel like you have any understanding of race at all, and your constantly making it an issue is starting to seem fucking pathological. I just wish you'd say something positive. Look at this question. It's framed so there can be no right answers. You make everything else seem as hopeless as you.

― Sonny A. (Keiko), Thursday, 12 February 2004 18:57 (twenty-two years ago)

So who are you talking about? If you're going to talk shit, be specific.

Where does this alternate-reality ILM exist? I've been reading ILM for most of a year, and I've seen a helluva lot more Beyoncé/Jay-Z/Nas/Britney/David Banner/crunk/pop-in-general/dance music/etc. threads than "I Luv Aesop Rock" or "I Luv Death Cab For Cutie."

― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:02 (twenty-two years ago)

dk your time might be better spent getting more handjobs from prostitutes listening to freeway than posting yet another "dk vs. all other white people" thread.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:04 (twenty-two years ago)

(your time, not necessarily your money. you might want to pick up that cure boxset instead.)

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:05 (twenty-two years ago)

anyway, i give this thread a 3/10.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:05 (twenty-two years ago)

(thx to milo & sonny for articulating what I did not)

― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:07 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah, i guess i should have a go at all the non-white, non-middle class people that ilm attracts.

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:07 (twenty-two years ago)

Is this about cred? I can't tell what this is about if it's not about cred.

― mike h. (mike h.), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:08 (twenty-two years ago)

it's odd how no brits have started any threads lambasting all the american voters who included the soundmurderer comp instead of the new ed rush & optical cd.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:10 (twenty-two years ago)

i am confused by the dr who references.

i havent heard many screwed records, i have heard the banner one. i prefer the original, i didnt get the big ILM love for the screwed version, perhaps i need to give it another go. it might be one of those things where i heard the original first, so then didnt like different versions of it.

i dont really understand the majority of your question, although it made good reading. the kung fu vs barbershop thing was interesting though, could you expand on that a little more (i think i am in agreement with you on this point)

― Stringent Stepper (Stringent), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:10 (twenty-two years ago)

And if it is about cred, isn't dk, like, Canadian?

― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:11 (twenty-two years ago)

i guess if (like dk and neuvo-trife) i filtered my enjoyment of music more through what i DONT listen to/like than what i do i'd be even more depressed than i usually am. which makes me glad i voted fot the version of the banner record i actually spent the most time listening to. (personal top 10 list in not being manifesto for a free world shocker.)

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:12 (twenty-two years ago)

jordan, i heard he's white too!

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:14 (twenty-two years ago)

dk you'll never be anything more than a tourist

― cinniblount (James Blount), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:14 (twenty-two years ago)

now go listen to your malkmus flexidisc some more you poseur corny indie canuck

― cinniblount (James Blount), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:15 (twenty-two years ago)

damn. i guess it's over, then. can you recommend a slint album?

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:16 (twenty-two years ago)

haha I'm so glad I came back to ILX!

― Begs2Differ (Begs2Differ), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:19 (twenty-two years ago)

dk = 33 1/3% doomie, 33 1/3% old 'i'm confused' trife, 33 1/3% new '21st century alex in nyc' trife = 0% original, 100% bullshit * cue bryan adams * (or dream warriors even)

― cinniblount (James Blount), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:19 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah, slint's still to southern for your frostback ass so pack it up and FINALLY get a new (repeat - NEW) schtick. your own maybe, for once.

― cinniblount (James Blount), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:19 (twenty-two years ago)

you've forgot to list how many rap records you own and how many black friends you have. i can't take you seriously until you do that.

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:22 (twenty-two years ago)

thanx again mc conrad black

― cinniblount (James Blount), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:24 (twenty-two years ago)

what did tom green's rap album sound like? has anyone ever heard it?

― scott seward (scott seward), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:24 (twenty-two years ago)

okay. we've established that rich, white people shouldn't like rap records. anything else?

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:25 (twenty-two years ago)

i mean that's quite a flipflop from leonard jeffries to bill o'reilly there celine - but i understand you're conflicted

― cinniblount (James Blount), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:26 (twenty-two years ago)

this is pure comedy gold at this point.

― Begs2Differ (Begs2Differ), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:26 (twenty-two years ago)

i mean do you actually need me (or anyone else with a memory) to repost all the cryptoracist bile you used to spew dk?

― cinniblount (James Blount), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:27 (twenty-two years ago)

Skipping 13 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.

cloverandthug, could you expand a little on the kung fu/barbershop thing, that sounded potentially interesting.

Is it being suggested that there is a disproportionate amount of coverage for the screwed version of the banner album compared to other screwed records? if so, why do we think this is? I have seen a lot of Banner coverage on this forum recently, and unsurprisingly, its a very good album. is the attention given to the screwed version, a fall out from general interest in Banner, or is it more arbitrary than that?

i have never heard Bark Psychosis, is that the guy that became Boymerang?

― Stringent Stepper (Stringent), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:38 (twenty-two years ago)

why are you so hung up on crediblity?

1. the ilm school of writing style leads to some shitty writing on hip-hop.

2. the only time i mentioned pitchfork was 'pitchfork music,' i think. they've published lots of okay writing on hip-hop. i didn't mention any thinly veiled reasons why they have.

3. make up less things.

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:39 (twenty-two years ago)

Scott, I think it was MC Face!

― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:39 (twenty-two years ago)

who was that dude on ilm who would post racist shit and then later he said he was writing a book about the internet or something? i might have that wrong. i only caught part of that.

― scott seward (scott seward), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:39 (twenty-two years ago)

potential comic goldmine: suggesting that i live in an igloo.

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:39 (twenty-two years ago)

i have never heard Bark Psychosis, is that the guy that became Boymerang?

Wasn't a one man act like Boymerang but yes there is a connection, and they were, simply put, incredible.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:40 (twenty-two years ago)

dk "used to" post bile shit and then claim he was just doing a 'social experiment' with the internet and haha you didn't get it and i'm a clever canuck and usually by then his mom would tell him to finish shoveling the snow off the driveway.

― cinniblount (James Blount), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:42 (twenty-two years ago)

cloverandthug, could you expand a little on the kung fu/barbershop thing, that sounded potentially interesting.

The hip-hop aesthetic

― scott seward (scott seward), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:43 (twenty-two years ago)

i've never claimed i was doing a 'social experiment.'

why are you insulting me?

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:44 (twenty-two years ago)

so is this still for the book? this thread.

― scott seward (scott seward), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:44 (twenty-two years ago)

there's no need to be nasty when you have an army of music critics and the high theoreticians of ilm backing you up.

― cloverlandthug, Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:44 (twenty-two years ago)

I'm trying to remember some of those old threads/posts.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:44 (twenty-two years ago)

there's no need to be nasty when you have an army of music critics and the high theoreticians of ilm backing you up.

Hmm...

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:45 (twenty-two years ago)

maybe he's writing The Dummy's Guide To Trolls

― scott seward (scott seward), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:46 (twenty-two years ago)

haha - poor dk! slap a bully and you'll find a punk! or a corny indie canuck even!

lesson learned: come correct or don't come at all

― cinniblount (James Blount), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:47 (twenty-two years ago)

oh i see, internet fighting, it felt like there was some previous i didnt know about on here. i'll only get in the way, i best leave you guys to it.

― Stringent Stepper (Stringent), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:47 (twenty-two years ago)

now kung-fu movies screwed and chopped, that's something i'd pay to see. except it probably end up being some matrix-type crapfest.

― vahid (vahid), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:48 (twenty-two years ago)

scott i still don't see how "escape from new york" is a hip-hop movie.

― vahid (vahid), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:48 (twenty-two years ago)

If he wrote better the trolling might be interesting but as it is it is really dull and feels like it has been done before.

― El Diablo Robotico (Nicole), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:49 (twenty-two years ago)

why do i like 'Get Low' (nobody else at the FT Focus Group did except Tico)?

― stevem (blueski), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:49 (twenty-two years ago)

cuz it's really good?

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:50 (twenty-two years ago)

because it's dope as fuck x/post agreement with Miccio

― Begs2Differ (Begs2Differ), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:50 (twenty-two years ago)

cos it's amazing

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:51 (twenty-two years ago)

Scott the guy you were thinking of was Nude Spock aka Neuromancer aka a couple of other things. He didn't post the racist stuff as Nude Spock. He's not the same as DK.

xpost I was disappointed at "Get Low"'s reception Stevem but sitting around drinking Belgian beer and quipping may not be the best circumstances in which to hear crunk for the first time.

― Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:52 (twenty-two years ago)

my god if drinking beer and quipping ISN'T the best time to hear crunk, when is?

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:53 (twenty-two years ago)

ah, okay, Nude Spock, right.

― scott seward (scott seward), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:53 (twenty-two years ago)

AM: "quipping" no, "getting so drunk you fuck the floor" yes

― Begs2Differ (Begs2Differ), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:54 (twenty-two years ago)

what racist stuff did Nude Spock post? you mean all the 9-11 Elders of Zion shit?

― Fritz Wollner (Fritz), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:54 (twenty-two years ago)

Also for me at least it was a song I needed to hear a lot, it really improves with familiarity, the chants stopped sounding aggressive or just shouty and started sounding like a great party instead. It suits the radio or cars more than an iPod or PC playlist in that respect.

― Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:55 (twenty-two years ago)

AM: "quipping" no, "getting so drunk you fuck the floor" yes

granted.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:55 (twenty-two years ago)

Fritz it was back when he was Neuromancer - the Nude Spock / I am writing a book persona was later.

xpost yeah Anthony it was played when everyone was on their first beer. If it had come over the speakers at the Dog Track a bit later I'm sure it might have got a better reception.

― Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Thursday, 12 February 2004 19:56 (twenty-two years ago)

Though I'm definitely behind the bandwagon on here, I've been Lil' Johnny Applecrunk around my friends lately. Most usually are down with the sound by the first grunt. State College folx are soooo hungry for absurd bravado.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:01 (twenty-two years ago)

plus they've all tussined plenty in their past and are happy that there's music actually celebrating the pink shit now.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:01 (twenty-two years ago)

Chugging Robotussin was always a weird thought to me. I didn't even realize anyone did that as a matter of course until I was 23 or so.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:02 (twenty-two years ago)

Ironically the guy that introduced me to the stuff is named Ned!

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:03 (twenty-two years ago)

and he was 16 or 17.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:04 (twenty-two years ago)

A paragon, doubtless.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:04 (twenty-two years ago)

and though none of us have done it in ages, my copy of Screwed & Chopped is totally pressuring us to start mixing it with our drinks (that Voice article awhile back about Swisha was very popular here). Actually, I need to start a thread about something that the State College crew was discussing awhile back...

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:05 (twenty-two years ago)

A friend loaned her copy of *S&C* to somebody at the New York Times who knows next to nothing about rap music, and he really really liked it. He said it reminded him of Donovan and the Butthole Surfers!!!

― chuck, Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:07 (twenty-two years ago)

somebody wrote about the screwed and chopped version at the times. i can't remember who. maybe kelefa.

― scott seward (scott seward), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:09 (twenty-two years ago)

http://www.doheth.co.uk/screenshots/s03/8f08_025.jpg

― Gear! (Gear!), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:15 (twenty-two years ago)

HOLY SHIT I FORGOT ABOUT THE FLAMING MOE!

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:19 (twenty-two years ago)

God Bless you, Gear!

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:19 (twenty-two years ago)

I think it's funny that someone condemning someone else's ostensible racism has to stoop to cultural stereotypes to make his point.

― Christian Rawk (Christian Rawk), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:19 (twenty-two years ago)

http://www.doheth.co.uk/screenshots/s03/8f08_024.jpg

"fire made it good...."

― Gear! (Gear!), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:23 (twenty-two years ago)

Fritz it was back when he was Neuromancer - the Nude Spock / I am writing a book persona was later.

I think he went under the Scaredy Cat name as well

― lawrence kansas (lawrence kansas), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:28 (twenty-two years ago)

Screw doesn't have anything to do with robitussin though, does it?

Chug Robitussin and you get a DXM high, which is a disassociative.
Screw, as I've heard it, refers to codeine cough syrup, a big difference.

― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:28 (twenty-two years ago)

well, fuck. Ruin my day.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:30 (twenty-two years ago)

QOTSA sound more like robo-drinkers.

― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Thursday, 12 February 2004 20:34 (twenty-two years ago)

it's not as if they're drinking it straight, either.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 12 February 2004 22:29 (twenty-two years ago)

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