Who else finds Bob Dylan rather dull?

Is Bob Dylan overrated?

Defend the indefensible - Bob Dylan.

Why don't I like Bob Dylan?

I (heart) Dylan, myself. I don't, however, (heart) statements like "I'm sorry, but if you can't see the genius in Dylan's songwriting and singing, you're a bonehead, and fur5ther I suspect your low opinion of Dylan has to do with (erronious) associations with what you think he represents rather than the music itself." Tons of inteligent ppl don't think Dylan's a genius, and many of those are well versed in his work.

(xpost there's also tons of inteligent ppl who don't like Shakespeare, shookout!)

I wish that for just one time
You could stand inside my shoes
And just for that one moment
I could be you

Yes, I wish that for just one time
You could stand inside my shoes
You'd know what a drag it is
To see you"

Don't try it with me, though. Dylan's bollox.

Ah, nobly and perfectly summed up. Said before and will say again that Dylan is best covered.

Oh, I was as much at fault, fret not.

There were actually two late sixties Dylan photo postcards I saw on vacation that actually really worked for me in terms of image, in that he was clearly laughing and having fun. As Tom notes, it's this kind of humor which is so missing in the Hilburnesque encomiums of the world towards Dylan, or else treated with such solemnity as to defuse said humor in any event.

Well, wasn't it Smokey robinson who, when asked who he thought was the greatest comedian in America, replied Bob Dylan?

As Tom notes, it's this kind of humor which is so missing in the Hilburnesque encomiums of the world towards Dylan, or else treated with such solemnity as to defuse said humor in any event.

I think this comment is very OTM - I've always found Dylan VERY funny, more often than I've ever found him, you know, "moving" and "profound" and all that stuff (though he is sometimes that as well). I remember hearing an album for the first time and expecting to hear some po-faced geezer like Leonard Cohen - while some of the early "Times They Are A-Changin'" (always my least favorite "major" Dylan song) era stuff did come off like that, most of it was delightfully playful and inventive and exciting - more akin to Wire and The Fall than Donovan. Speaking as someone who doesn't much care for the whole acoustic singer-songwriter thing OR any of the "new Dylans" (Cohen, Young, Springsteen, etc), Dylan is the only canonical '60s artist I can't see myself ever getting sick of, as long as I don't read another one of those MOJO cover stories.

Leonard Cohen is REALLY funny!

"Dress Rehearsal Rag"

Four o'clock in the afternoon
and I didn't feel like very much.
I said to myself, "Where are you golden boy,
where is your famous golden touch?"
I thought you knew where
all of the elephants lie down,
I thought you were the crown prince
of all the wheels in Ivory Town.
Just take a look at your body now,
there's nothing much to save
and a bitter voice in the mirror cries,
"Hey, Prince, you need a shave."
Now if you can manage to get
your trembling fingers to behave,
why don't you try unwrapping
a stainless steel razor blade?
That's right, it's come to this,
yes it's come to this,
and wasn't it a long way down,
wasn't it a strange way down?
There's no hot water
and the cold is running thin.
Well, what do you expect from
the kind of places you've been living in?
Don't drink from that cup,
it's all caked and cracked along the rim.
That's not the electric light, my friend,
that is your vision growing dim.
Cover up your face with soap, there,
now you're Santa Claus.
And you've got a gift for anyone
who will give you his applaus e.
I thought you were a racing man,
ah, but you couldn't take the pace.
That's a funeral in the mirror
and it's stopping at your face.
That's right, it's come to this,
yes it's come to this,
and wasn't it a long way down,
ah wasn't it a strange way down?

Once there was a path
and a girl with chestnut hair,
and you passed the summers
picking all of the berries that grew there;
there were times she was a woman,
oh, there were times she was just a child,
and you held her in the shadows
where the raspberries grow wild.
And you climbed the twilight mountains
and you sang about the view,
and everywhere that you wandered
love seemed to go along with you.
That's a hard one to remember,
yes it makes you clench your fist.
And then the veins stand out like highways,
all along your wrist.
And yes it's come to this,
it's come to this,
and wasn't it a long way down,
wasn't it a strange way down?

You can still find a job,
go out and talk to a friend.
On the back of every magazine
there are those coupons you can send.
Why don't you join the Rosicrucians,
they can give you back your hope,
you can find your love with diagrams
on a plain brown envelope.
But you've used up all your coupons
except the one that seems
to be written on your wrist
along with several thousand dreams.
Now Santa Claus comes forward,
that's a razor in his mit;
and he puts on his dark glasses
and he shows you where to hit;
and then the cameras pan,
the stand in stunt man,
dress rehearsal rag,
it's just the dress rehearsal rag,
you know this dress rehearsal rag,
it's just a dress rehearsal rag.

"Proto-retrospective vision of all the gears and all the metaphoric functional gears never capable of concretion. Woo-wee! Surely, Dylan's greatest, bar none."

Well to be fair he's been a lot of things.

xp

For me, that excitement isn't primarily located in his music (maybe more in his words), so as I wasn't around to witness his emergence and having mainly his records to refer to, I do not particularly thrill to him.

I still don't get why this would only apply to Dylan, though. Or perhaps it doesn't. You might feel the same way about the Beatles, or punk or disco or old school rap, etc. But this would take the sting (or the pointedness or -- ohgodamireallygoingtousethisword? -- the relevance) out of most anything different or groundbreaking in the past, wouldn't it? It seems insulting to younger audiences, somehow: "well, you could never really get this stuff as it happened before your time!" But really, what Mordechai Shinefield said...

As to "bullying", well this forum isn't any different to any internet forum in that respect.

True. Here, though, it can be an especially fine, if annoying, art. I'm not really talking about insults and flames, just the piling on that sometimes happens (or appears to happen if an opinion is particularly unpopular).

CHESS WAS AN INDIE LABEL

Prince covered one at the Superbowl a couple days ago.

I still haven't quite gotten a grip on why his past three albums are considered so fantastic. On the other hand, I do have a soft spot for "Infidels", which may be his only underrated album (and which would have been better with "Blind Willie McTell" included)

-- senator second p. newcastle (a|e...), Today 4:28 PM. (a_p) (later) (link)

Um, yes they are.

Well to be fair he's been a lot of things.

-- Alex in SF (clobberthesauru...), February 8th, 2007.

Dylan's the original David Bowie!

Well, David, it just seems to me that there was a kind of "messianic" aura around Dylan in the 60s and 70s, that was subtley different to that around any other artist/band. I think Dylan himself has been dismissive of this, but I sense that people "believed" in him in a way they didn't with other artists. I've seen Don't Look Back(sic?) and it is interesting how everyone seems to be hanging on to his every word, no matter how commonplace.

Personally, as I don't buy into Dylan the visionary, I can only judge the music on its own merits. And to me it seems it bit dull. This may be my loss etc., but there you go.

Marmite is a British savoury spread made from yeast extract, a by-product of beer brewing. It is a sticky, dark brown paste with a distinctive, powerful taste that polarises consumer opinion.

I have his greatest hits on one side of a c90. it's...ok, I suppose. haven't fancied listening to it for many years. high praise indeed.

but I'm not that much into lyrics, which may be a substantial barrier to my enjoyment of bob.

I think Phil is assuming that Dylan's supposed cultural importance during the late 60s must validate the value of his music to contemporary listeners. But this is misguided and unrealistic. It doesn't have to and it often won't. At the same time, he's looking to the music to convince him of this hallowed socio-cultural significance, and obviously he's not finding the same parallels he would have 40 years ago. This is expected. But assuming that you have to buy into the cult of Dylan to appreciate the depth of his songwriting and the brilliance of his simplicity is doing a disservice to art. Don't get too caught up in context. It's not about listening more closely, it's about widening your perspective.

CHESS WAS AN INDIE LABEL

Umm, what does this have to do with anything?

yes!

Mark's post makes me want to give Dylan another listen. Especially "those words are more sound than meaning."
-- jaymc (jmcunnin...), February 8th, 2007

I've been saying this for a day now! HIs lyrics are only one element. I mean, Bernard Sumner is one of my favorite lyricists, if that's an indication.

I can't answer your question directly, Marcello, but the following links may help.

show credits:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theme_Time_Radio_Hour#Theme_Time_Radio_Hour_show_credits

part of a production diary:
http://leeabrams.blogspot.com/2006/04/dylan-diary-part-two.html

These programmes deserve their own ILM thread, if there isn't one already.

Baader - I have heard "Blood On The Tracks". I love "Tangled Up In Blue" but after that, errrrrr.....

That's the thing. If the majority of Dylan's output was as purely enjoyable as "Tangled", "Visions of Johanna", "As I Went Out One Morning", I'd have no problem with him. But the majority of his work just doesn't seem to swing like those songs too.

I suppose if I was to unfairly single out a song that (to me) emphasises the worst aspects of Dylan, it would be something like "The Ballad of Frankie Lee and Judas Priest". Now it may be that this song is as many-layered as an onion, but to my ears it sounds like a bit of a shaggy-dog story set to a jaunty but by no means exemplary tune that doesn't really go anywhere.

Of course, that may be where I'm missing the essence of Dylan; that, as with Sterne, where he doesn't go is just as important (if not more so) as where he does go. But doesn't that make a true appreciation of Dylan somewhat rareified? (Think Mark is hinting at this?)

So if you like sound you must like instrumentals? Or an instrumental fan appreciates sound? Anyway, I have no idea what "instrumental" means in this context, since I own tons of jazz.

That's the thing. If the majority of Dylan's output was as purely enjoyable as "Tangled", "Visions of Johanna", "As I Went Out One Morning", I'd have no problem with him. But the majority of his work just doesn't seem to swing like those songs too.

You really need to listen to John Wesley Harding and Blood on the Tracks in their entirety. The minor works, filled with failed mainstream accomodations and grotesque sellouts, have their charms too (I recommended Empire Burlesque), in large part because there's no aura with which to suffocate the listener.

My Lou Reed fandom is a lot like my Dylan: their throwaways are often more revealing than their classics.